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Re: Summary and Video of November 2015 SBS meeting in Woodhaven

Posted by R30A on Mon Feb 22 14:50:16 2016, in response to Re: Summary and Video of November 2015 SBS meeting in Woodhaven, posted by BrooklynBus on Mon Feb 22 14:10:49 2016.

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"Because it makes sense. To say a high percentage of those passing 157th Avenue and also Elliot Avenue would assume that cumulatively very few cars are turning on and off the roadway at all the intersections between those two points? That would be utterly ridiculous. No assuming 120,000 people in cars does not assume everyone is traveling a short distance. You just made that up. Even if most everyone were traveling long distances, that would be the number."

Simply false. If people are travelling the full distance between the points the counts were taken at the different locations would all be counting the same car. the only way it would be as high as 120K is if they were all counting DIFFERENT cars.


"I am certainly not deflating the number of bus passengers. I am using DOTs numbers. I am also not inflating the number of cars."

You seem to imply MTA ridership is below 30K. That is not true. You then state that non MTA bus ridership is 5K. The total of the known 30K MTA bus riders and your assumed 5K non MTA bus riders is 35K, not the 20K you said. That is a substantial artificial deflation. You reduced the number to slightly over half of what it should be.


"First you claim I said that cars are all riding short distances which I never said."

You didn't say that. You just used numbers which assume that. Assuming you are internally consistent (Granted, a big assumption on my part) such are functionally the same.


"Now you say I am assuming cars stay on the road the entire length. I never said that either. You are just making things up because you can't accept the facts and logic I presented."

I never said you said that. I SAID THAT COULD BE THE CASE, as a hypothetical. My point was that assuming LONGER trip lengths, using the same numbers (with a different set of assumptions), you get a MUCH lower count of car users.


"The "substantial" amount of express bus riders is not "substantial" it is only about 7 percent of total Woodhaven ridership if my math is correct."

I get 8.75%, but regardless, 7% is certainly substantial.


"Even if the average Lmited rider travels for five miles on the limited, adding the locals brings the average down somewhat."

Considering how much higher the Limited ridership is than the local, If the locals will not affect it too much. Assuming the riders on the limited ride 5 miles on average, and the total combined averages 1.8 miles per ride, the local buses would have to be traveling negative distances. That is not possible from the perspective of my perhaps overly traditional understanding of the space time continuum.


"What would you say the average ride on Woodhaven /Cross Bay is "

I don't like to make unsubstantiated assertions.


"and don't forget it is inflated due to the lengthy Cross Bay and Addabbo bridges,where there are no stops so limited or local doesn't make a difference there."

Obviously.


"When you consider the middle class is moving out and lower income people are moving in, it certainly does make a difference on the economy."

Potentially. But since the reverse is what is really happening, your point is absurd.


"When you consider the increased congestion, the amount of time you accelerate to top speed, stop and slow down for traffic lights, a top speed of 15 is not unrealistic for rush hours. At other times it will be your average speed."

Potentially. But there is no basis behind your numbers here. There is also no reason to assume congestion will increase.


"Drivers were using Alderton before when Woodhaven was congested. Now they are using it more because congestion has increased. That's why residents are now callng for a one-way once again. It is certainly related to the exclusive bus lanes. SBS is not yet in effect, so of course it is not related to that."

You claim that the increase is recent. No article seemed to connect the increase to the bus lanes.


"Ten years ago is very relevent unless you assume congestion today is less than what it was then. It is much more."

You just showed why it is not particularly relevant. Thank you for proving my point.


"Eliminating left turns certainly does not reduce traffic. IT INCREASES IT.

You obviously don't understand how traffic works.


"You have to travel a longer distance to make three rights if it is at all possible."

Yes. That is not a big deal.


"In many cases it isn't, You also have to consider traffic on surrounding streets, not only the traffic on Woodhaven. THAT IS WHAT IS MEANT BY A CORRIDOR."

Not that many cases. Yes. It is ok if traffic increases slightly on adjacent streets.


"Okay. I will go to Stop and Shop as you proposed. So I first make a left onto Trotting Course Lane. Is that correct? Oops I just got hit head on because Trotting Course is a one way northbound. What do I do now?"

Trotting course is to become two way.


"DOT changed their proposal to make Trotting Course a two-way, but they no longer show that in their revised proposal. The the routing I specified is correct and is the shortest route to Stop and Shop."

I'll believe it when DOT posts an addendum. You are not an honest person, nor do you have the capacity to read and understand a traffic plan, so forgive me for not taking you at your word.

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