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(1148460)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Joe V on Tue Apr 3 17:01:50 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by gp38/r42 chris on Mon Apr 2 20:23:43 2012.

Get off your ass and research the patronage of the Kenosha trains by time of day.

Only railfans cannot deal with hard facts.

(1148461)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Joe V on Tue Apr 3 17:02:55 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by gp38/r42 chris on Mon Apr 2 20:44:39 2012.

I have yet to see ONE FACT from you, just RAILFAN CONJECTURE.

(1148462)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Joe V on Tue Apr 3 17:05:27 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by gp38/r42 chris on Mon Apr 2 20:56:39 2012.

You have yet to make a case for shutting HPA when the trains could well run past it to get to a useless station at LIC.

You seem more interested in playing train that dealing with riders.

(1148463)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Joe V on Tue Apr 3 17:07:15 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon Apr 2 20:23:58 2012.

Of course passengers just get in the way, typical railfan resposne.
We in fact run trains for passengers, not for the convenience of dispatchers.

(1148464)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Joe V on Tue Apr 3 17:07:49 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by gp38/r42 chris on Mon Apr 2 20:12:41 2012.

SO WHAT ?

What are getting from closing HPA ? NOTHING

(1148465)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Joe V on Tue Apr 3 17:09:05 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by gp38/r42 chris on Mon Apr 2 20:59:08 2012.

Do you want to stand on a train for 5 minutes or 25 ???

(1148466)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Joe V on Tue Apr 3 17:16:13 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Andrew Saucci on Mon Apr 2 21:16:38 2012.

You are talking to a railfan with no facts and interestsed only in moving equipment.

People are not going to neatly sort themselves out at their home station to board on ESA trains if headed to the GCT area.

How will they divide up the Port Wash and Babylon line with zone trains ?
It takes of set of 2 or 3 trains to cover all stations. Do they all go to the same Manhattan terminal ?

If not, do people start driving to an adjacent station to get to the terminal they want ?
Does this cause load imbalance issues causing further rescheduling. ?

All this is beyond the comprehension of the foamers.

(1148486)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Olog-hai on Tue Apr 3 18:35:45 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue Apr 3 11:11:16 2012.

Ever been on one of these trains? They crawl west of Woodside and have lower priority at the Sunnyside interlocking(s)

So LIRR's trying to push the ridership off them via selective dispatching?

(1148527)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Andrew Saucci on Tue Apr 3 21:18:57 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue Apr 3 10:53:09 2012.

"Richmond Hill already exists, with a high level platform and would cost nothing to re-open."

It might need a working elevator to make it ADA-compliant.



(1148548)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 00:56:12 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue Apr 3 10:53:09 2012.

Fresh Pond would really only serve NY&A workers.

???????? Fresh Pond station was no where near the LIRR Fresh Pond Yard. It would be a mile walk down the tracks.

(1148549)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 00:59:38 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Andrew Saucci on Mon Apr 2 22:39:11 2012.

I am only being half facetious here. I have driven through no small number of rural areas that have immaculate, brand-new, empty four-lane divided highways that are clearly overkill while congested areas get nothing useful.

That's how government operates. This reminds me of many of the road rebuilds they had done in Suffolk back in the 70's where they removed grade crossings over many county roads. Why am I complaining? Most of them were on the Mainline....east of Ronkonkoma, which gets only 2 or 3 trains a day, while most were left in on the Montauk and Port Jeff line which has normal service.

(1148550)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 01:02:00 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Tue Apr 3 17:09:05 2012.

The GSA trains will be no more crowded than current Penn trains.

(1148551)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 01:03:58 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Tue Apr 3 17:16:13 2012.

You are the one who is a foamer. I hate taking the LIRR and drive to the city any chance I can. You are also the one that thinks that people on Long Island will give up taking their cars to instead take a bus to a train to another bus in order to get to work. Talk about "foamer".

(1148552)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 01:05:15 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue Apr 3 10:47:14 2012.

He is the foamer attacking other's ideas and that is calling other people a "foamer" because they don't agree with his ideas.

(1148553)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 01:06:57 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Tue Apr 3 17:00:07 2012.

LOL. The PM Montauk trains are stored at Long Island City yard, so instead of deadheading them from there to Jamaica, they use HPA because it's currently also convenient for people heading out from the East Side. With ESA that will no longer be necessary.

(1148554)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 01:09:15 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Tue Apr 3 17:01:50 2012.

Fuck you. It's you that can't handle any opposing idea to YOUR foamer ideas. And I am far from your "typical" railfan. And "Kenosha" is not on Long Island.
Talk about an uptight asshole that I haven't seen someone line since Ron in Bayside.

(1148555)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 01:10:49 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Tue Apr 3 17:02:55 2012.

And where are your facts about Long Island travel patterns Ronin Bayside? What's next, calling people Aspergers patients? What a....

(1148556)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 01:18:06 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 01:09:15 2012.

I am sorry, I take back the first sentence, but you should really reread your posts to see how you insult people that don't agree with your views. You really need to get off your high horse.

(1148566)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Apr 4 02:12:32 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Tue Apr 3 17:01:50 2012.

Kenosha? That's in Wisconsin, not New York or New Jersey. And there is still an effort underway to re-extend that line to Milwaukee.

(1148567)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by LuchAAA on Wed Apr 4 02:13:48 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Mon Apr 2 17:20:22 2012.

There is no cost advantage to closing HPA. It is an unstaffed station.

There must be costs associated with maintaining an unstaffed station.



(1148568)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by LuchAAA on Wed Apr 4 02:18:09 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 01:06:57 2012.

The PM Montauk trains are stored at Long Island City yard, so instead of deadheading them from there to Jamaica,

With all due respect, based on my last visit to NY, which included lots of three-four mile walks around Forest Park I saw quite a few trains going westbound between 3-4 pm and got the impression that they were laid up in Jamaica and going to LIC to go in service.

Maybe LIRR gave in to complaints in LIC? Just a guess.

(1148570)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Apr 4 02:43:03 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by LuchAAA on Wed Apr 4 02:18:09 2012.

Ah, don't remind me of this thread . . . heh heh.

(1148576)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by merrick1 on Wed Apr 4 06:51:04 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Tue Apr 3 17:16:13 2012.

Won't people adjust their work times to get the most convenient train? It's not like most people punch a clock these days.

(1148578)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 07:26:18 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by merrick1 on Wed Apr 4 06:51:04 2012.

Yup, of course they will. Especially at rush hour when a few trains an hour run. I know people that adjust their schedule around a direct Ronkonkoma Branch super express train that even skips Jamaica. They literally arrange their schedule around that train because it's direct and faster than some of the others that perhaps would get them into Penn at a "better" time for them, yet they take the specific train.

(1148579)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 07:27:56 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Tue Apr 3 17:07:49 2012.

Why does your railfan self have such a fetish with that station having to stay open when it will become quite useless once ESA opens? They don't need both LIC and HPA once ESA happens.

(1148580)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 07:29:47 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by LuchAAA on Wed Apr 4 02:18:09 2012.

Don't know, but they still store a lot of trains in LIC yard during the day, and most of them originate there on the diesel branches, even if they deadhead to Jamaica from there.

(1148581)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 07:30:59 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by LuchAAA on Wed Apr 4 02:13:48 2012.

Yes, the station still has to be maintained. And LIC station, once the easier subway connection at HPA will no longer be needed, is a much easier station to maintain.

(1148582)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 07:34:21 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Olog-hai on Wed Apr 4 02:12:32 2012.

He has some railfan fantasy that the LIRR, which is built (unfortunatly) for mainly east-west traffic, not north south, or intra island traffic, will somehow be attractive to people if they had buses that went through neighborhoods to bring people to other stations on Long Island, that will take them to trains that go to other stations, whre they will have to take another bus to take them to the parking lot of some office somewhere on Long Island (of which there are thousands upon thousands of locations where they could be), and that they will give up getting into the car in their driveway and driving direct to work to the parking lot of their office.

(1148599)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Wado MP73 on Wed Apr 4 08:47:13 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Sun Apr 1 17:29:43 2012.

None of the diesels will go to GCT and they will need connecting trains with available seats.

(1148612)

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Re: LOWER MONTAUK was Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Avid Reader on Wed Apr 4 09:25:09 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Wado MP73 on Sun Apr 1 17:24:23 2012.

The Lower Montauk would give greater value if it, and Bushwick, were given over and developed with the Rockaway Branch.
All to fill that BLACK HOLE on the map.

Extend and expand the Bushwick to two tracks and merge with the "L".
A real express service from Manhattan to Jamaica.

A single seat to Aqueduct Racino and Convention Center.

Think outside of the BOX.

(1148614)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Wed Apr 4 09:37:00 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Wado MP73 on Wed Apr 4 08:47:13 2012.

Just as now....for diesel people that want to go to Penn station. Dont know how some of the people think they were willing to do it for Penn trains but somehow they would be too lazy to do it for GC. lol.
And this for what amounts to only about 2 to 3 full trainloads (if you took all the people from all the trains that run there and put them together) that currently use HPA station.....which is relatively nothing in the scheme of lirr passenger counts.

(1148625)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Avid Reader on Wed Apr 4 10:38:57 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Wado MP73 on Wed Apr 4 08:47:13 2012.

It is time for LIRR to spend an outrageous sum , then cost over runs , for a low profile diesel, low profile multi-level coaches with extremely reclined seating to fit through the 63Rd St. tunnels.

Problem solved, end of topic!

(1148629)

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Re: Long Island City...

Posted by streetcarman1 on Wed Apr 4 11:45:11 2012, in response to Long Island City..., posted by aaron on Thu Mar 29 20:30:28 2012.

What train was that? what time?

(1148639)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Apr 4 13:04:34 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Andrew Saucci on Tue Apr 3 21:18:57 2012.

Would the ADA even apply? This is an existing station that trains operate through.

(1148640)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Apr 4 13:06:08 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 00:56:12 2012.

I am not advocating opening a new Fresh Pond in it's old location. That would serve no one. Putting it closer to the NY&A yard would allow it to be used by their employees, much like the LIRR serves it's employees at LIC.

(1148641)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Apr 4 13:09:44 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 01:05:15 2012.

A Greenport-branch style station serving one car and having no ticket machine would probably cost very little. What the Lower Montauk would really need if passenger service was to return would be major track work. The condition of the track between the junction of the Bushwick Branch and LIC itself is low, and trains (in my experience) don't top 20 MPH over it.

(1148651)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Wed Apr 4 13:43:43 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Apr 4 13:04:34 2012.

It may be physically existing....but it hasnt been operating in 14 years. It would probably fall under new.

(1148653)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Wed Apr 4 13:44:48 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Apr 4 13:06:08 2012.

The old fresh pond station is in a great spot....and was the most used of any of the local stations....even with the dismal serice.

(1148654)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Wed Apr 4 13:46:32 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Apr 4 13:09:44 2012.

Yeah....since the part between bushwick junction (fresh pond station site) and jamaica was much better maintained because it is heavily used for freight.

(1148688)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Joe V on Wed Apr 4 16:57:54 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 01:06:57 2012.

You have been told of scenarios where some on the diesel branches could find it useful.

As a failfan, you are simply too obtuse to grasp potential future customer behavior.

(1148689)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Joe V on Wed Apr 4 16:59:26 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 01:06:57 2012.

You have now officially LOST the argument.

You have no patience for research, facts, customers, or the fact that LIRR and Suffolk County did in fact do some research before they committed $50M to DMU's.

(1148690)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Joe V on Wed Apr 4 17:00:02 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Olog-hai on Wed Apr 4 02:12:32 2012.

I think Walker quietly killed that, sorry.

(1148691)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Joe V on Wed Apr 4 17:02:17 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 01:02:00 2012.

REALLY ? How do you know what percentage of the riders will switch, how many trains get diverted, and many Brooklyn people go to NYPS or Gto CT ?

Again, you're a clueless foamer.

(1148693)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Joe V on Wed Apr 4 17:08:58 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 01:03:58 2012.

You take the LIRR because you have to, not because you like it. There are plenty of low wage workers who can't afford a car or drive a wreck to keep their min wage job.

The nonsense you are giving me are Eisenhower-era cliches with no foundation.

(1148705)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Joe V on Wed Apr 4 17:45:56 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 07:30:59 2012.

Of course it's easier - it has 2 car platform. When they have to do emergency detours into LIC, HPA becomes useful to dump a loaded 10 car trains. LIC is then useless.

(1148707)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by Joe V on Wed Apr 4 17:48:22 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by merrick1 on Wed Apr 4 06:51:04 2012.

The have to arrange that around dropping off their kid at the bus stop, shuffling afternoon appointments, etc. Not everyone is that flexible.

I would not work 9 - 5 if the trains are better then when I in fact rather work 8 -4.

(1148716)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 18:16:28 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Wed Apr 4 17:02:17 2012.

"Foamer", LMAO!!! Hurt me oOOoooooh you so cool!
If the only way you can try and prove a point is to throw insults, you already lost the argument.



(1148717)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 18:18:47 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Wed Apr 4 16:57:54 2012.

LMAO!!!

(1148718)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 18:19:15 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Wed Apr 4 16:59:26 2012.

LOL, let's see your stats FETISH man.

(1148719)

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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City...

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Apr 4 18:23:32 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon Apr 2 17:34:38 2012.

Interstingly, until the very early 90's, the Port Jeff line was the "premier" of the three eastern lines. It took a couple years for the traffic to move over to the Ronkonkoma Branch after the 1987 electrification, but it moved fast once it started. I don't think they realized just how much people wanted that service, as within a couple years, it was clear the original island platform at Ronkonkoma was highly inadequate. Until that time people would never have thought about driving from the north or south shores to Ronkonkoma to get the train.

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