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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Joe V on Fri Nov 2 17:56:18 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Thu Nov 1 22:04:39 2018.

6 car R46's on the C would not be acceptable. That like 7.5 60' cars. There are only 14 2 car sets of R46's anyway, with shop margin, less, and they need 18 train sets.

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(1491663)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Fri Nov 2 18:16:56 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Fri Nov 2 17:56:18 2018.

Yes, only 30 less feet of train, partially counteracted by 15 less feet of between-car useless space. The lack of cab at the #2 end of the A cars counters the full width cab, and the lack of cabs at all in the B cars is also a net gain in space.
So the only negative about the shorter train is the longer walk for people who didn't wait near the center of the platform, and the longer dwell time caused by this + the fewer doors.

As for needing 18 trainsets, back when the G was short R46 pairs they would run full length trains (usually R32s). Some days there would be 3 on the line. So a mix of 6 car R46 and 8 car R44s on the line would be the result.

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(1491664)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 18:19:31 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Edwards! on Thu Nov 1 18:17:03 2018.

Where?

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(1491666)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 18:29:37 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 09:14:40 2018.

The R-442 were scrapped because they had major structural issues which the R-32s did not. I believe that the SI R-44s needed a bit of structural reenforcement in order to keep them running in addition to their having been built a bit stronger to meet the FRA requirements which applied at the time.

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(1491667)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 18:31:20 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 18:29:37 2018.

That should red R-44s. How the 2 got in there instead of an S, I don’t know since the keys aren’t anywhere near each other.

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(1491668)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 18:31:59 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Avid Reader on Thu Nov 1 16:58:30 2018.

Wouldn’t have fit in the Eastern.

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(1491669)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 18:48:57 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 08:58:18 2018.

Even with the pans down, it’s doubtful that the M-8s would clear 63 St.

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(1491670)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 18:52:41 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 08:47:12 2018.

Now that I think about it, if it was designed for the current LIRR rolling stock of the day which included double deckers, why wouldn’t it clear the M-8s and M-9s? I can’t imagine they would be taller than the double deckers.

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(1491673)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 19:04:05 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Oct 31 20:06:15 2018.

Even within the NYCTA, Manhattan, Bronx and Bkln bus employees (including MABSTOA) are represented by TWU while Queens and Staten Island bus employees are ATU and 2 different locals at that.

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(1491677)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 19:30:12 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Wed Oct 31 19:51:15 2018.

If the LIRR and M/N were completely merged as MTA Commuter Rail then the administration of the new entity could force the former LIRR to maintain its equipment and infrastructure according to the higher standard as established by M/N. When the city of NY took over the bMT and IRT the B of T now had 3 separate divisions with 3 different sets of work rules and while it took a bit longer than it should have, almost true unification was eventually achieved with identical work rules for all divisions and the only thing preventing absolute unification is the difference in infrastructure and rolling stock dimensions between the merged BMT/IND Division and the iRT but other than that employees can now pick between the respective divisions without any loss of seniority or other benefits..

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(1491679)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Joe V on Fri Nov 2 19:36:30 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 18:31:20 2018.

You can see where the SIR R44's got reinforced. There's an L shaped bracket at the two top corners of each door set. They sides of the cars are also wrinkly looking, which tells me the frames are deteriorating. Then there is a longitudinal strip along the edge of the roof to prevent water infiltration. St Louis car was not good at building great bodies. ACF was better.

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(1491680)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Joe V on Fri Nov 2 19:38:02 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 18:52:41 2018.

63rd Street was built for M-1's, not MP-72's, the latter were off MU service right about now in October 1973.

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(1491681)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Joe V on Fri Nov 2 19:38:41 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 19:04:05 2018.

Staten Island local buses can't do local Brooklyn work either.

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(1491682)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Joe V on Fri Nov 2 19:39:37 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 19:30:12 2018.

They could do that without such a merger. MTA management and Board was sound asleep.

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(1491683)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Nov 2 19:50:44 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 19:30:12 2018.

If the LIRR and M/N were completely merged as MTA Commuter Rail then the administration of the new entity could force the former LIRR to maintain its equipment and infrastructure according to the higher standard as established by M/N

"Could" is one thing, but "would" is another.

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(1491690)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Fri Nov 2 21:41:52 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 19:30:12 2018.

"If the LIRR and M/N were completely merged as MTA Commuter Rail..."

This may seem trivial, but its out there. The folks on Long Island insist that The LIRR maintain its original name " The Long Island Rail Road".
The "MTA Commuter Rail" name will never exist, espicially on LOng Island. On Metro North, about 25 yrs ago they spent (wasted) millions of dollars with logo & stationary changes eliminating "Commuter" from their name.
Bottom line: the name "MTA Commuter Rail" is DOA.

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(1491694)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Nov 2 22:05:29 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Fri Nov 2 21:41:52 2018.

The name they were trying to push is "MTA Rail Road".

It's enough to make one miss "MTA Central" and "MTA New Haven".

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(1491695)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by pragmatist on Fri Nov 2 23:11:48 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 19:30:12 2018.

They never got it to work with surface....

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(1491700)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Nov 2 23:28:38 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Thu Nov 1 18:32:34 2018.

Time to bring back South Elizabeth and North Rahway stations. Make them true locals.

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(1491702)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sat Nov 3 01:02:22 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by ro_jo on Wed Oct 31 11:08:11 2018.

I documented the occasion:

Arrived on 40 (across from former 5176 WoH Comet II):
gct40

Departed 23 with another train on 24:
gct-23+24

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(1491703)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sat Nov 3 01:06:32 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Fri Nov 2 21:41:52 2018.

The name is another reason I've heard they didn't merge - "The Long Island Railroad" is America's (possibly the world's?) longest running railroad that has never changed its name.

Wasn't the primary reason but could well have been the last straw before they gave up, once that was noticed.

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(1491704)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sat Nov 3 01:22:46 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sat Nov 3 01:06:32 2018.

Correction: longest running *passenger* RR. One of the freight RRs is older, but I can't figure out which (though an interesting tidbit, CSX as a descendant of the B&O hails from 1828, making it the oldest publicly traded railroad according to a list of "oldest companies of the Fortune 500").

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(1491705)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by JayZeeBMT on Sat Nov 3 05:15:49 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Oct 28 12:26:34 2018.

Those "stupid anti-steam laws" were written in blood after two New York Central trains collided in a smoke-filled tunnel, killing scores of passengers and crew.

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(1491706)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Joe V on Sat Nov 3 06:41:26 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Nov 2 23:28:38 2018.

North Rahway was there for Merck, which is gone. Other than that, nobody used them them. Why bring them back now for 4 weekend trains ?
Long Branch, Jersey Av, and Trenton trains are slow enough as it is.

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(1491710)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Nov 3 10:04:37 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by JayZeeBMT on Sat Nov 3 05:15:49 2018.

Which only affected the Park Avenue Tunnel. The anti-steam laws Olog-hai likes it cute are like a lot of what he says: mythical. There is a kernel of truth. There was a steam ban enacted in the 1920s, long after plans to build a cross-Hudson Bridge had been abandoned and it was found unconstitutional regardless and is not in force.

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(1491719)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Nov 3 11:39:19 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sat Nov 3 01:02:22 2018.

The second pic reminds me of the last scene in Carlito's Way.

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(1491720)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Nov 3 11:42:04 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sat Nov 3 01:22:46 2018.

Well, UP dates from 1862, so probably not them.

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(1491721)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Avid Reader on Sat Nov 3 11:51:47 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Fri Nov 2 18:31:59 2018.

Was the total set length too long?
A single "B" car could be pulled from the center 3-car set to shorten the overall length.
Was it the over hang of the 67 ft. cars on the "S" turns thee Issue?
At one time, back in the Day, standards plied those routes.
What happened to change it.


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(1491725)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Sat Nov 3 15:25:31 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Fri Nov 2 19:38:02 2018.

The 63 St tunnel was planned before the MTA was even thought of so I doubt the M-1s were any consideration.

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(1491726)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Sat Nov 3 15:29:15 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Fri Nov 2 19:38:41 2018.

I hadn’t heard about that but what’s even more interesting is that there is a single route, the Q32 that operates not only 2 separate depots, but 2 agencies, NYCTA and MABSTOA represented by 2 different unions.

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(1491727)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Sat Nov 3 15:37:02 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Fri Nov 2 21:41:52 2018.

If Prince Andrew wants it what the folks on Long Island want will be of little consequence and Even if it went as far as a legal action, It’s doubtful that any court would insist that the LIRR name be kept as long as a sufficient quality of service is provided. About the best that could be hoped for is that MTA Commuter rail (or MTA Suburban Rail if you don’t want to use the word “commuter”) would have 2 divisions, M/N Division and LIRR Division much like the NYCTS had its IRT, BMT, and IND Divisions after unification.

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(1491728)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Sat Nov 3 15:40:42 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by pragmatist on Fri Nov 2 23:11:48 2018.

It actually does in a number of ways. NYCTA and MABSTOA managers are transferred back and forth between agencies and Bus operators represented by TWU can also pice the other agency’s routes. As I mentioned in another post, the Q32 route is staffed by operators from 2 different depots and 2 different unions.

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(1491729)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Sat Nov 3 15:44:35 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Fri Nov 2 19:36:30 2018.

The problem was with having stainless steel shells over carbon steel frames unlike Budd which was 100% stainless. otherwise St Louis built equipment lasted a good long time on the NYCTA in the form of the R-17s through 22s, the R-27s and 30s and the R-29s, 33s and 36s.

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(1491732)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Sat Nov 3 16:04:41 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Avid Reader on Sat Nov 3 11:51:47 2018.

Apparently, what passes for designers in New Car Engineering, neglected to specify the truck centers to be in the exact same place as they were on the steels so that when the cars actually entered service, the clearances were not the same.

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(1491735)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by TransitChuckG on Sat Nov 3 16:21:40 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Sat Nov 3 16:04:41 2018.

I wonder if they would have had 3-D modeling back then, they could have seen clearance problems?

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(1491737)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by pragmatist on Sat Nov 3 16:26:00 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Sat Nov 3 15:40:42 2018.

I was not aware that TWU 100 can move between TA and BC. Are you referring to TA and MABSTOA? I thought the 32 was just out of CS?

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(1491738)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Nov 3 17:43:20 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Sat Nov 3 15:25:31 2018.

I disagree. Planning for the tunnel to bring the LIRR to the East Side began in 1968, along with M1 cars.

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(1491739)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Joe V on Sat Nov 3 17:43:59 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Sat Nov 3 15:25:31 2018.

The M-1's were planned in 1965 - 1966. I saw the artists renditions in Trains magazine at the time. They had already shrunk the height by 6" for the MP75 of 1963.

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(1491740)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Joe V on Sat Nov 3 17:44:55 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Sat Nov 3 15:29:15 2018.

Originally, wasn't it Fifth Avenue Coach Company M32 ?

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(1491741)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Nov 3 17:55:41 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Sat Nov 3 17:44:55 2018.

It was FACCO 15

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(1491742)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Sat Nov 3 18:51:57 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Sat Nov 3 15:37:02 2018.

"M/N Division and LIRR Division much like the NYCTS had its IRT, BMT, and IND Divisions after unification."

A little "apples/oranges" issue here. When there was unification of the three transit divisions, there was no neighborhood by neighborhood groundswell against unification simply because of the threat of losing the original divisions & line names. (which never really happened anyway). On Long Island, the resistance was real

As for an "LIRR division" that would work, as long as the "Long Island Rail Road" name was kept & shown somewhere, preferably on the equiptment.


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(1491746)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Edwards! on Sat Nov 3 19:46:04 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Avid Reader on Thu Nov 1 09:31:38 2018.

Actually...because of the very tight CLEARANCE issues along the Willie B and other locations..the MTA was thinking about purchasing a smaller car type for the Eastern Division simular to the 142s on order.

As with the original R62 design...the narrow profile WOULD HAVE WORKED if these cars were exclusively assigned to the Eastern Division...
The 9ft wide car would have been slightly smaller than the bellyband to floor of the R 44 46 etc...60.6ft IRT like (ie the R39 NTT).

THE BOTTOM FELL OUT when someone with common sense said its ridiculous to operate cars that would be completly locked into One subdivision for the life of the car...and killing capacity due to the narrower character.






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(1491747)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by K. Trout on Sat Nov 3 20:58:07 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by TransitChuckG on Sat Nov 3 16:21:40 2018.

Pretty sure all you need is some math. :)

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(1491749)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Nov 3 21:29:05 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by K. Trout on Sat Nov 3 20:58:07 2018.

clearly so.

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(1491750)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Nov 3 22:00:25 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Sat Nov 3 18:51:57 2018.

The division names were eradicated. Only old timers and railfans know about them.

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(1491752)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Sat Nov 3 23:11:17 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Nov 3 22:00:25 2018.

The division IDs are mostly history, true. But old school names like "West End" "Sea Beach" & "Culver" are still used even though years ago the MTA tried to eliminate them.

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(1491753)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Sun Nov 4 01:14:20 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Nov 3 17:43:20 2018.

During the fall semester of 1964 I was doing an interview for an urban politics class and it had to do with the 63 St tunnel.

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Sun Nov 4 01:16:41 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Nov 3 17:55:41 2018.

Correct but somewhere along the way, it was decided to split the route between MABSTOA and NYCTA with the MABSTOA routes coming out of 54 St depot and the TA routes coming out of Casey Stengel.

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Sun Nov 4 01:18:09 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by pragmatist on Sat Nov 3 16:26:00 2018.

When I was still working the Q32 was split between CS and 54 St although 54 St has probably been replaced by Quill.

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(1491756)

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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal

Posted by randyo on Sun Nov 4 01:22:59 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Edwards! on Sat Nov 3 19:46:04 2018.

The clearances on the Willy B itself are no closer that the ones on the Manny B if you take a good look.

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