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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Wed Oct 31 15:39:22 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Wed Oct 31 15:29:03 2018. certainly pissed off many Brooklynites at the time. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Joe V on Wed Oct 31 17:33:32 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Oct 31 01:35:22 2018. How does Inflation calculator compute for NJT zone bus fares in general ? |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Joe V on Wed Oct 31 17:34:56 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Wed Oct 31 01:11:26 2018. MN M7A's and M-8's would not fit through the 63rd Street tunnels. |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Wed Oct 31 17:51:24 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Wed Oct 31 17:34:56 2018. well, that is criminally stupid. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Oct 31 17:54:37 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Wed Oct 31 17:51:24 2018. M-1 and M-3 would fit question remains why a M-2 or M-8 would go to ESA ????? as foer Metro North M-7a's they have a scoop on roof for HVAC but again why would tey go to ESA to go to GCT ???so your Criminally is just insane on your part. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Oct 31 17:56:37 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Wed Oct 31 17:33:32 2018. Intrastate, first zone fare is $1.70 when converting the 75¢ fare from 1987. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Oct 31 18:06:13 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Wed Oct 31 17:51:24 2018. The M8s wouldn't because of that catenary equipment anyhow.And when those tunnels were built, why would the city bother to presume any Penn Central (or successors) trains using them?? Criminally stupid to call it "criminally stupid", really. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Oct 31 18:07:26 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Wed Oct 31 15:29:03 2018. Sure did, eventually. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Oct 31 18:11:42 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by LA Scott on Wed Oct 31 09:55:36 2018. As far as time, it was supposed to have been open nine years ago; as far as money, it was supposed to have cost a third of what it costs now. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by pragmatist on Wed Oct 31 18:16:41 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Oct 31 18:06:13 2018. The 63rd street tunnel was designed to bring the LIRR into a new East Side terminal that never got built, CGT was not in play when it was built so you are correct.... |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Oct 31 18:29:59 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Oct 30 15:59:01 2018. "A merged seniority list with full rights to move laterally between operating divisions without prejudice should be possible".Its been done. When Penn Central was created, all rosters of all crafts were merged. The operating crafts were awarded by qualification in addition to seniority. For example, if you were qualified (prior rights) on the NE corridor with high seniority, you could not bid on a GCT-Albany job & automatically be awarded it based on seniority alone. You get yourself qualified, then you can bid. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Oct 31 18:36:59 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Oct 31 18:29:59 2018. And PC existed for eight whole years. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by pragmatist on Wed Oct 31 18:38:30 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Oct 31 18:29:59 2018. Private sector and public sector employment doesn't work the same way. Think MABSTOA, SIRTOA, MTA-BC.... the public authorities that were created to accomplish acquiring or controlling certain properties as well as NYS Civil Service Law is a very different legal and political landscape than dealing with Federal railroad labor laws alone.... |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Oct 31 19:11:07 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Oct 31 18:36:59 2018. AFAIK, the biggest corporate failure (at the time)in the history of capitalism. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Oct 31 19:20:02 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Oct 31 19:11:07 2018. Not an example of capitalism; rather the result of the government's draconian implementation of regulation and taxation designed to force private companies into bankruptcy to facilitate government takeover. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Wed Oct 31 19:51:15 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Tue Oct 30 17:05:00 2018. From a customer service standpoint it's justifiable to keep them operationally separate. MNRR (at least East of Hudson) has well maintained, clean equipment and stations as well as very good off peak scheduling. I also appreciate the vending machines and easy to find trash/recycling bins at almost every station.LIRR equipment is dirty and has a much shorter shelf life than the MNRR equivalent. Some stations are at least getting a face lift but many of them are still crumbling messes. The off peak schedules are erratic (though at least better than NJT). The only things I prefer about LIRR are their via-ticketing and that they have recently trended towards opening all cars on most trains regardless of time of day (except for 12 car trains, they'll still close the last 2). |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Oct 31 20:06:15 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Oct 31 18:29:59 2018. all crafts were in same unions engineers in BLE, cdr's in UTU etc . these days its not so LIRR stayed with old unions MN people went with ACRE. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Oct 31 20:06:15 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Oct 31 18:29:59 2018. all crafts were in same unions engineers in BLE, cdr's in UTU etc . these days its not so LIRR stayed with old unions MN people went with ACRE. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by AlM on Wed Oct 31 20:21:09 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Wed Oct 31 19:51:15 2018. though at least better than NJTThe weekend trains from EWR to NYP are the worst. x:06, x:15, and x:18, and that's it for the hour. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Wed Oct 31 20:32:01 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by AlM on Wed Oct 31 20:21:09 2018. I find it more annoying that they have weekend "peak" trains to Rahway followed immediately by both an NEC and NJCL train making all local stops to Rahway... then nothing for an hour.I understand those trains sometimes need to be cut. But then only have the other trains make the extra stops on those days. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Oct 31 22:34:00 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Oct 31 19:20:02 2018. Thats a bit of an overstatement. Get a copy of "The Wreck of the Penn Central" by Peter Binzen. It outlines the ongoing mess that caused the contributing railroads to be monumental moneylosers and turn it into a huge moneyloser.Things like high level graft & corruption which led to suicide of a high ranking official. Things like a top heavy labor force which resulted in a bank breaking payroll. Things like antiquated work rules, duplicate lines, incompatable equiptment & money draining commuter operations. It was 10 years in the planning & doomed from the start. Draconian implentation of regulation and taxation had little to to with a corperation that was dying from within at the hands of their prior railroad employees on their own without any gov't help. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Wed Oct 31 23:59:05 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Oct 31 17:54:37 2018. In AAR railroading there are clearance diagrams. The history is that less stupid RRs spent the money to make as much of their mainlines as possible accept "high and wide" double stacks, trilevel autoracks, etc. You will remember the arguments as to whether MTA should ever buy any more 75' cars which DON't fit all parts of the IND/BMT. I side with the "buy only cars that fit all of the x division, not only part". folks. Thus my comment which you so kindly call insane. So insane or not, I think standardization has a great deal of value.Of course, I may be influenced by the fact that BART (I live in the SF Bay Area) was built to a guage not used anywhere else in this hemisphere. As to the potential added expense of providing clearance for catenary in the ESA tunnels, I think history has shown that the corruption/change order/efficiency sabotage on ALL MTA projects is such that the extra cost would be relatively minor. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Thu Nov 1 00:59:21 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Wed Oct 31 23:59:05 2018. I can think of one legitimate reason for M8s to be able to enter ESA: something like that Park Avenue viaduct fire a while back which shuts down all access to Grand Central via the traditional route. The New Haven line at least would still be able to run some semblance of a schedule through the Hellgate and into ESA.As for "buy only cars that fit all of X division", 75' cars fit all of B2 division as well as the routes which cross B1 to B2, with exception to the M. There's real cost savings and passenger comfort increases to be had by using 75'ers. Anyway thanks to linked sets the standardization is irrelevant - you will find 5 car 60' sets in exactly the same places as 4 75'ers can go, and never in the eastern division. So it made not one iota of difference to go with a "standardized" car class of 60'. However the increased maintenance costs of 25% more cars will be felt for decades. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 08:43:14 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by MorningsideHeightsM100 on Wed Oct 31 09:27:58 2018. The 4 on each level merge into 4 on the upper level. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 08:44:58 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Oct 31 17:56:37 2018. The one zone fare, upon which the Newark Subway fares are based, is $1.60. Tunnel trip is half that. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 08:47:12 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Wed Oct 31 17:51:24 2018. It was designed 50 years ago for the M-1 and M-1A, which were basically the same car.M-9's, whether LIRR or MN, will fit. The M-9A notation would be an option order, not a MN version. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 08:57:23 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Thu Nov 1 00:59:21 2018. They M-8's could just as well head into Hunterspoint Avenue, and the people can be in the Grand Central area offices just as fast had the train gone to the ESA terminal.The 75' cars were found to cut capacity on the Queens Blvd line due to poor ingress/egress. It was noticed when the R32's took over the E train when the R46's were sent to Hornell in the late 1980's. So they stayed on the E until the R160 came along. Given how maintenance headcount as been cut drastically over the decades, one cannot make the case anymore that 60' cars cost them a lot more maintenance, and not with their exemplerary MDBF. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 08:58:18 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Oct 31 18:06:13 2018. The pantographs would remain locked down and the over-sliding 3rd rail extended up to Northern Blvd. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 08:59:01 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by pragmatist on Wed Oct 31 18:16:41 2018. They essentially built their 48th and 3rd terminal under GCT, and made it 2 levels. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 09:00:51 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Oct 31 22:34:00 2018. Add to the list child-like fights between the Red and Green men, and forced takeover of the NH. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Thu Nov 1 09:11:21 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 08:57:23 2018. They could have put 5 doors per 75' car to solve the ingress/egress issue. 4 cars with 5 doors = 5 cars with 4 doors.The added benefit is the 4 extra seats (and associated standing space) per half train due to one less bulkhead wasting space. Current setup (one side of car): [cab-6-6-6-2|2-6-6-6-2|2-6-6-6-2|2-6-6-6-2|2-6-6-6-cab] 212 seats per 5 car 60' set. 75' variant: [cab-6-6-6-6-2|2-6-6-6-6-2|2-6-6-6-6-2|2-6-6-6-6-cab] 216 seats per 4 car 75' set. This makes for 8 extra seats per train. Discarded over some weird flexibility fetish which will never be used for the lifetime of the cars. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 09:14:40 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Thu Nov 1 09:11:21 2018. Because of the inflexibility issue, they had to scrap the R44 before the R32 and R42 because of the M/V realignment. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Avid Reader on Thu Nov 1 09:31:38 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Wed Oct 31 23:59:05 2018. So! How come the R-110/B concept was not looked at with a more open mind. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Nov 1 10:50:23 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Oct 31 22:34:00 2018. Thats a bit of an overstatementNo it isn't. And Peter Binzen was a journalist, not a railroad man. It was the regulations that led to the aforementioned work rules, commuter rail expenses, ad nauseam. The PRR in the past could own the LIRR without the "incompatiblity" between two types of MP54 being a problem. BTW, "duplicate lines" is not a problem when it comes to roads, is it. Only government planners think of "duplicate lines" when it comes to railroads. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 11:34:43 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Avid Reader on Thu Nov 1 09:31:38 2018. 67' car ?It meant 6 car trains on the Eastern Division. Not acceptable. They were not going to get a combo of 3 and 4 car sets. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 11:36:38 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Olog-hai on Thu Nov 1 10:50:23 2018. < Only government planners think of "duplicate lines" when it comes to railroads. >Wrong. Railroads have been abandoning rail lines en masse since deregulation in 1979. No government interference there. Just appeasing shareholders for short term gain. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 11:37:59 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Wed Oct 31 20:32:01 2018. They fleet trains deliberately so as to single thread the Hudson River tunnels. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by AlM on Thu Nov 1 12:12:36 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 11:37:59 2018. Ah, that explains it. :( |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Nov 1 16:18:57 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 11:36:38 2018. Railroads have been abandoning rail lines en masse since deregulation in 1979. No government interference thereWhat you call "deregulation" was not. Regulation still increased, especially on the passenger side; that's why SR could no longer run their trains. You really think Carter would deregulate anything? |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Nov 1 16:21:19 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Mon Oct 29 12:15:36 2018. Don't make things up. There is no plan to do so by the MTA Board (presuming they have the power), and there is no money to even execute Penn Station Access besides. Never mind 2021 remaining the tentative opening year for ESA. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Nov 1 16:28:59 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 08:44:58 2018. Second zone jumps to $2.55. That's $1.16 going back to '87.Tunnel zone on NCS today would be 36¢ in 1987 dollars. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Avid Reader on Thu Nov 1 16:58:30 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 11:34:43 2018. What? No Nine car set? |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Thu Nov 1 17:06:11 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Olog-hai on Thu Nov 1 16:18:57 2018. you need to reread the history. Carter brought us deregulated air fares and signed the Staggers 4R act of 1980. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 17:11:53 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Olog-hai on Thu Nov 1 16:21:19 2018. It has been 2023 for several years now |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Edwards! on Thu Nov 1 18:17:03 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by randyo on Wed Oct 31 15:29:03 2018. Certainly did. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Thu Nov 1 18:30:32 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 09:14:40 2018. Nonsense. The C was entirely R32 at the time. The R44s could have been kept with R32s replacing the remaining R42s in the East.They got rid of the R44s because they're idiots, not because they couldn't run on the Eastern division. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Thu Nov 1 18:32:34 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 11:37:59 2018. I know, but it's dumb having the same local stops served by all 3 trains within minutes of each other. Send the Rahway locals, well local to Rahway. Then have the NJCL and NEC trains express to Rahway to pick up any local passengers who want to continue west. Reverse that in the morning. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 20:27:11 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Thu Nov 1 18:30:32 2018. If they kept the R44 instead of the R42, they still needed to retain R32's. They were out to scrap 270 - 300 cars one way or another. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Thu Nov 1 20:46:06 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Olog-hai on Thu Nov 1 10:50:23 2018. "It was the regulations that led to the aforementioned work rules, commuter rail expenses, ad nauseam."What Gov't regulations apply here? These were collective barganing agreements between unions & carriers which the Gov't had nothing to do with. Remember, unions were much stronger back then. Example; They had a work rule that allowed 8 hrs pay for each 100 miles traveled for operating crafts. So say you went one round trip from Penn Sta NYC to Harrisburg which is ballpark 360 mi. you got paid 2 & 1/2 days pay for less than 12 hrs actual work. Don't get me wrong, I'm a union man, but that rule was a big ball & chain around Penn Central's neck. Rule is long gone when MGT smartened up. BTW That rule was a part of the MN 1983 strike. It went to arbitration. The union lost. |
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Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Thu Nov 1 22:04:39 2018, in response to Re: Tour of East Side Abscess New LIRR Terminal Taking Shape Beneath Grand Central Terminal, posted by Joe V on Thu Nov 1 20:27:11 2018. Indeed. But after I posted I realized that they could have also gotten rid of most of the R32s all the same and had the R44s on the C. If they wanted to keep the C with short trains they could have put the R44s on the A and used the R46s on the C (since some are in pairs) to make 450' trains.When the dust settled instead of 5 trains of R42 in the east ~20 trains of R32 on 8th ave, there would have been 5 trains of R32 in the east and the A/C would be all R44/46. |
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