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| Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... (1147409) | |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 10:39:20 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 31 10:28:33 2012. I wonder if the LIRR ran a shuttle between Jamaica and Fresh Pond, and have an intermodal station with the M train, stop at Richmond Hill & Glendale, if anyone would ride it ? Could beat the J train. |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 10:41:07 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by LuchAAA on Sat Mar 31 10:30:13 2012. Kew Gardens is just as close, but if just 1 train a day stopped at Kew Gardens, no one would use it either. That's how Woodhaven died too. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sat Mar 31 10:42:43 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Dan on Sat Mar 31 10:06:10 2012. DD`1`S were removed from service in 1950[lirr]the 3rd rail was removed sometime after that. |
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(Sponsored) |
iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Sat Mar 31 10:43:10 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 10:39:20 2012. NOPE.The (J) train runs every 10 minutes, the LIRR runs once a day. ☺ |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 10:45:35 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Broadway Lion on Sat Mar 31 10:43:10 2012. I said a shuttle, not once a day. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Avid Reader on Sat Mar 31 11:08:23 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 10:45:35 2012. I'd use it , just for the scenic tour! |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 11:11:27 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Avid Reader on Sat Mar 31 11:08:23 2012. It's at least worth thinking about, now that the M is an uptown service. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Sat Mar 31 11:31:52 2012, in response to Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Mar 30 18:11:20 2012. That's looking westbound towards LIC/Manhattan. Right?I'm trying to guess the buildings in the background. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Sat Mar 31 11:39:45 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 10:45:35 2012. Same Difference as far as LIRR is concerned.ROAR |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 12:59:05 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 10:39:20 2012. Nope. Just like nobody would ride a Raritan-High Bridge shuttle . . . |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 13:00:37 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by Peter Rosa on Fri Mar 30 19:35:27 2012. At least Richmond Hill was an actual stationBy what definition? |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat Mar 31 13:05:31 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Broadway Lion on Sat Mar 31 10:43:10 2012. If they ran all the diesels out of LIC via the lower Montauk, the service could work. Problem with that is that it would rob HPA from significant service. When ESA is ready, this station will probably be closed. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 13:10:56 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat Mar 31 13:05:31 2012. Why? ESA can't handle diesels. |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Think twice on Sat Mar 31 13:56:32 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by J trainloco on Fri Mar 30 22:27:43 2012. Agreed. The line is almost equidistant from some of the most congested lines in Brooklyn and Queens. It would definitely help relieve that. Plus, the businesses and real estate interests along it would be creaming over at the prospect of their neighborhood becoming the next Greenpoint, Bushwick, Astoria, or Sunnyside. However, to preserve the vital freight operations, perhaps double-deck grade separations or elevated viaducts would be necessary.View Lower Montauk Line: World Trade Center - Jamaica in a larger map The Ego Trip Express: egotripexpress.tumblr.com |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 14:00:07 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by Think twice on Sat Mar 31 13:56:32 2012. That's absurd. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 14:06:14 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat Mar 31 13:05:31 2012. I was only talking about running Jamaica - Fresh Pond shuttle with transfer station to M. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 14:07:18 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat Mar 31 13:05:31 2012. All the HPA diesels would have to be aborted to Jamaica or made Suffolk shuttles. I doubt it will close, just deminished. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 14:07:37 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 12:59:05 2012. Proof ? |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 14:08:59 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 14:07:37 2012. Does time flow backwards for you or something? |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 14:15:54 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 14:08:59 2012. Still no proof, just foamer wise-cracks.Got news for you: nobody rides the mid-day THRU trains either, all 6 68 ton cars with 140 seats - empty. Rush hour: all of 395 people board west of Raritan on your beloved THRU trains. 2& of the labor market in Hunterdon County works in Manhattan. Run a relevant service with bus shuttles to office parks. Deal with it. Same is true with eastern Suffolk. |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 14:29:06 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by Think twice on Sat Mar 31 13:56:32 2012. Glendale NIMBY's, helped by Geraldine Ferraro, killed any chances of doing anything useful with it in the 1980's |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 14:32:48 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 14:15:54 2012. Still no proof, just foamer wise-cracksIt's not a wisecrack. Are you able to prove something that hasn't happened yet? Use your brain. nobody rides the mid-day THRU trains either You ride them all, every day? Please tell us what would make a three-seat ride better than a two-seat ride, then. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 14:38:26 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 14:32:48 2012. (Please tell us what would make a three-seat ride better than a two-seat ride, then)Can you get it through your Railfan Republican thick skull that not everyone works in Manhattan ? ? ? Number of seats in a ride is IRRELEVANT. FREQUENCY is what you get - same reason East End Scoots will work on the Montauk and gGreenport lines. I have the quarterly ridership data - YOU DON'T. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 14:57:09 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 14:38:26 2012. Number of seats in a ride is IRRELEVANTHmm. I'm not the biggest fan of Midtown Direct (i.e. in terms of its incredibly poorly-conceived execution), but it does speak for itself, especially with NJT scrambling for seat capacity at its inception and the bus companies jumping out of their collective skins. So it's not irrelevant in any way, shape or form. If number is irrelevant, then terminus is also irrelevant, so long as there is a connecting service—yet Hoboken Terminal and LIC are not as busy as NYP, and that's because of location. FREQUENCY is what you get - same reason East End Scoots will work on the Montauk and Greenport lines No, frequency is not as important as average speed, although it ranks second. And the further out you go from the major city, the more important average speed becomes. (Never say "will work"; again, time does not flow backwards.) I have the quarterly ridership data Sounds like you're not interpreting it correctly. Leads one to bad conclusions, doesn't it? |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by merrick1 on Sat Mar 31 15:11:23 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 14:57:09 2012. I think scoots could work better than "change at Jamaica."I used to occasionally ride MetroNorth's SPV shuttle from Dover Plains to Brewster North. An across the platform transfer to a waiting empty EMU train is better than waiting for and cramming into an already crowded EMU train. But the rule must be that the EMU always waits for the scoot. No missed connections. |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Sat Mar 31 17:05:38 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by J trainloco on Fri Mar 30 22:27:43 2012. that was the plan in in 1980(approx). but it was going to by NYCT trains making the station stops then going through 63rd tunnel. but the communities along the line fought hard against it. |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sat Mar 31 17:43:36 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by LuchAAA on Sat Mar 31 17:05:38 2012. so did the president of the lirr`s engineer`s union. |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:01:05 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 13:00:37 2012. He's right, it's the only station along the line which had an actual station infastructure. Fresh Pond, would be second, but FAR from actual station infastructure. The other three were nothing more than a train stopping on a grade crossing. |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 18:03:10 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:01:05 2012. He's right, it's the only station along the line which had an actual station infrastructureThat doesn't concretely define it as an "actual station", though. There are several definitions for that phrase. |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by J trainloco on Sat Mar 31 18:07:33 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by Think twice on Sat Mar 31 13:56:32 2012. Nice. I think taking over a LIRR line east of Jamaica out to Rosedale would be a good idea too. |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:09:53 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Fri Mar 30 19:50:27 2012. Who said anything about running cab forward?Many Oyster Bay Trains MOST DEFINITELY had one MP15 on either end, and right till the end in the late 90's. It was actually fairly common on the Oyster Bay Branch. Another place you would see it was on the Ronkonkoma to Greenport line. You never or rarely saw it on either the Port Jeff line or the Montauk/Patchogue Branch. Here's a photo of one in 1992 with an MP15 on either end in Medford. Another oddity seen here on the Greenport scoot was two parlor cars (red stripe). While in the summer, they would be on Montauk trains, in winter, they often put them on the Greenport scoot. 
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by J trainloco on Sat Mar 31 18:13:16 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 07:14:24 2012. Utilizing it as a rapid transit line doesn't mean it couldn't also be used for freight. Even if we continue to require that freight trains not mix with rapid transit vehicles, and Denton, TX may show us otherwise soon, there's plenty of room on the ROW for both freight and rapid transit. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:13:31 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 13:10:56 2012. They don't need Hunterspoint Ave station once ESA opens, as that station is only really used by people that want the East Side. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:14:06 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 14:07:18 2012. It's whole reason for being would be gone once ESA opens. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:17:36 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by LuchAAA on Sat Mar 31 11:31:52 2012. No. That's looking East from where the grade crossing is at the Glendale station. The cemetery grade crossing would be behind the photographer. The Cooper Ave overpass can be seen off in the distance. The view hasn't changed all that much, aside from buildings being closer to the tracks now. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 18:18:54 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:13:31 2012. They still would have to transfer at Jamaica to ESA-bound trains. I don't see a difference between doing that and transferring at Jamaica for an express subway train. You can't have all diesel trains terminating at Jamaica after all . . . |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:21:32 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 14:29:06 2012. The Glendale aversion was significant through the 90's too. I remember back when they were redoing the Harold Interlocking in the early 90's, for a summer, ALL service was diverted to the MOntauk Branch through Glendale. That was only a summer of diversions, and there were people in Glendale literally lying on the tracks in protest of just that temporary diversion.Although granted, it's 20 years later now, and even them makeup of Glendale has changed a little since, so who knows. |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:22:45 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by J trainloco on Sat Mar 31 18:07:33 2012. The LIRR needs the four tracks through there (two on the line through Rosedale, and two on the line through St Albans). |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:25:23 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 18:18:54 2012. They still would have to transfer at Jamaica to ESA-bound trains. I don't see a difference between doing that and transferring at Jamaica for an express subway train.People will most definitely choose the LIRR train into Grand Central over the current set up of them having to get off at HP Ave and onto the 7 train. You can't have all diesel trains terminating at Jamaica after all . . . No, but they would go to the LIC yard like they do now. They only need the LIC station, they won't need HP Av, and LIC. |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:26:33 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by J trainloco on Sat Mar 31 18:13:16 2012. There's not enough room on the ROW for many portions of the line, and subway and heavy rail aren't allowed to use the same tracks, as per FRA regulation. |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:27:15 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 18:03:10 2012. I think we all knew what he meant. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 18:40:19 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:25:23 2012. People will most definitely choose the LIRR train into Grand Central over the current set up of them having to get off at HP Ave and onto the 7 trainHope there's enough room on the GCT train for 'em, then. |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by J trainloco on Sat Mar 31 19:06:26 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:26:33 2012. There's not enough room on the ROW for many portions of the line,Where? The portions where it's running on the street? A rapid transit line would likely need to be built elevated in those sections anyway. subway and heavy rail aren't allowed to use the same tracks,as per FRA regulation. Hence what I wrote about Denton. |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by J trainloco on Sat Mar 31 19:11:24 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:22:45 2012. Add a third track on one of the ROWs to accommodate peak direction LIRR trips. |
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Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 19:19:38 2012, in response to Re: Long Island City..., posted by J trainloco on Sat Mar 31 18:13:16 2012. Even if we continue to require that freight trains not mix with rapid transit vehicles, and Denton, TX may show us otherwise soonNo it won't, if the Stadler GTWs they bought really are up to FRA crashworthiness standards as they claim, and even have FRA glazing. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 19:33:43 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 14:57:09 2012. I don't know what the hell you are talking about, but it is OFF topic.The purpose of the East End Shuttles are for local travel and bus coordination and Manhattan is not a popular travel destination. Like most railfans, you are Manhattan centric and have no clue there are other needs, the farther out you go. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 19:34:52 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:13:31 2012. They'll always want a safety valve in case the tunnels get backed up. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 19:36:19 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:25:23 2012. Ridership to HPA is down to 3 - 5,000. The stakes are not large one way of another. The subway transfer at LIC sucks anyway. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 31 19:37:52 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 19:33:43 2012. The purpose of the East End Shuttles are for local travel and bus coordination and Manhattan is not a popular travel destinationHilarious. Like most railfans, you are Manhattan centric and have no clue there are other needs, the farther out you go Uh-huh. This was a line that LIRR was once considering shutting down not too long ago. |
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Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City... |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Mar 31 19:38:07 2012, in response to Re: Glendale Re: Long Island City..., posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Mar 31 18:14:06 2012. There are loaded office buildings in LIC (i.e. Citi, Metlife to name a few). Large companies like to kick IT workers out of Manhattan, if not there, then to India. |
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