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| (898795) | |
Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Andy on Fri Feb 12 18:52:24 2010 LIRR East Side Access will no doubt create opportunities for New Haven Line service into Penn as some LIRR trains switch to GCT. A question for the mechanical experts out there - New Haven Line MU equipment should be able to operate into Penn via the Amtrak Hell Gate Route under wire the whole trip, but what happens to the third rail shoes on those cars? Would the underrunning shoes be able to clear the LIRR style third rail? If the answer is no, would the answer be a dedicated set of New Haven MU cars with the contact shoes removed, or adjusted for LIRR third rail? Then again, the absence of any layup tracks in Penn would suggest that some of these cars would have to be turned or inspected in West Side Yard, which only has LIRR type third rail. Interesting set of challenges to say the least - but of course not an immediate issue. |
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Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by fisk ave jim on Fri Feb 12 19:05:56 2010, in response to Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Andy on Fri Feb 12 18:52:24 2010. Not being a mechanical expert here, but from my expierence in the field & eavesdropping, the only equiptment that the New Haven line could use goin into Penn Sta would be the M-8 class currently in the inital phases of delivery. Voltage/phase wire issues forbid the current M series cars in service to use the Hell Gate line for Penn Sta Service.As for third rail issues, maybe they could use a retractible 3d rail shoe that Amtrak used on their turbos when they had to leave MN territory & go to Penn Sta. Just a guess... |
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Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Andy on Fri Feb 12 19:16:12 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by fisk ave jim on Fri Feb 12 19:05:56 2010. Thanks for sharing the info. Besides M8 cars the current MNR Genesis locos could (theoretically) have their third rail shoes outiftted for LIRR third rail and run as diesels east (north) of Harold. Those trains would no doubt need a loco at both ends because of the East River Tunnel grades - much like the LIRR DM30 trains. |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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| (898819) | |
Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by fisk ave jim on Fri Feb 12 19:30:18 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Andy on Fri Feb 12 19:16:12 2010. Not neccessarily, Amtrak feeds some heavy trains thru the East River tunnel with one engine to go up the Hudson Line. For example, their Lake Shore Limited, If its still called that, has one Genny & about 8-10 cars in the consist. Also those grades, were not talkin Steinway tunnel here... |
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Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by trainsarefun on Fri Feb 12 19:40:05 2010, in response to Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Andy on Fri Feb 12 18:52:24 2010. Proposal was for M8s to operate from GATE to NYP on third rail DC power using a new shoe design. I don't know whether that's still the plan, or whether it will work. |
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| (898833) | |
Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 19:50:55 2010, in response to Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Andy on Fri Feb 12 18:52:24 2010. The M-8, as I understand it, is being equipped with a type of third rail shoe that will allow it to run on both MNR and LIRR-style third rails. The understanding, as I been informed, is that a stretch of LIRR-type third rail will be extended up the Hell Gate Line to Gate Interlocking, just north of Northern Blvd and Broadway, on both Tracks 1 and 2, and from there westward to Penn, the M-8 will NOT run on the overhead catenary, but actually run on the LIRR third rail all the way to Penn Station. This third rail shoe which the M-8 has been equipped with allowing that capability, as I understand it, has been tested on a set of M-7As, and as I understand it, the test was successful, where as it can run on both the MNR and LIRR third rail. From east of Gate to CP 216 (Shell Interlocking, New Rochelle), the M-8 will run on the overhead catenary. As in things are always subject to change, the plan for the mentioned operation is what is slated to occurr should this service ever be implemented.Do remember that even if the LIRR moves some trains from out of Penn, capacity at Penn Station is already very high, and the issue of available slots for any NH Line trains will be few at best, if any available at all. It is mainly a capacity issue that will affect what does and does not run to Penn from the NH Line. Also take into account if and when the ARC is completed will undoubtedly bring more NJT trains into Penn, making for, again, tight, at best, space for any NH Line service, not to mention any other changes the LIRR could make to what else they can run into Penn. There are a lot of factors to consider. |
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Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by arnine on Fri Feb 12 20:02:03 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 19:50:55 2010. Paul a little addition, I was told by planning officials that they are also thinking of getting the hudson line down to NYP with an agreemnet to be made with Amtrak for the use of the west side line but who knows what the future will bring |
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| (898839) | |
Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by andy on Fri Feb 12 20:13:21 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 19:50:55 2010. Good points. Thanks for sharing. With regard to the ARC tunnel into Penn, those tunnels and the "new Penn" under 34th Street will be completely independent of the current Penn, much like the LIRR GCT operation will be completely independent of the current station. So any New Haven trains traveling to/from NY Penn will have to use the current station and effectively become LIRR trains between Harold and Penn. With their LIRR type third rail also means that such equipment could be stored/serviced/turned in West Side Yard. Such moves open up many territorial issues that will have to be ironed out - such as will LIRR personnel clean and inspect MNR trains? |
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Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by ebtmikado on Fri Feb 12 20:20:22 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by fisk ave jim on Fri Feb 12 19:05:56 2010. "As for third rail issues, maybe they could use a retractible 3d rail shoe that Amtrak used on their turbos when they had to leave MN territory & go to Penn Sta. Just a guess..."While they were still operating in the 60s, I was told that the New Haven EP-5 "Jets" had 3rd rail shoes that could be adjusted to run on either 3rd rail. Lee |
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Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 20:25:37 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by arnine on Fri Feb 12 20:02:03 2010. I have heard that too, but right now costs of crew qualification, given the West Side (Empire) Line is NORAC territory and there is a cost issue for training, coverage of job vacancies based on crew member absence to attend classes, any overtime claims and payments for deadheading, etc. are an issue, and that one will be on hold basically indefinitely. |
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No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 20:26:03 2010, in response to Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Andy on Fri Feb 12 18:52:24 2010. LIRR East Side Access will no doubt create opportunities for New Haven Line service into Penn as some LIRR trains switch to GCTFalse. We've been here before. |
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| (898853) | |
Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 20:27:50 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by andy on Fri Feb 12 20:13:21 2010. Territorial as well as union issues (LIRR being UTU, United Transportation Union, and MNR being ACRE, Association Of Commuter Rail Employees, a spin off of the UTU) regarding who does what and when. |
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Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 20:28:52 2010, in response to No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 20:26:03 2010. IAWTP |
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Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 20:29:28 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 20:27:50 2010. Never heard of ACRE being part of UTU.And better not forget BLE at Amtrak. |
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| (898859) | |
Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 20:34:08 2010, in response to Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 20:29:28 2010. The higher membership are all mostly former UTU guys with Conrail-date seniority on MNR, and ACRE was spun off as its own "independent" union sometime in 2000, starting with the Conductors and Assistant Conductors (Trainmen), then going on to representing MNR's Engineers, Signal Maintainers, Yardmasters, RTCs (Rail Traffic Controllers), Assistant Stationmasters and Power Directors between 2000 and 2002.BLET is also at LIRR as well. |
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Re: Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by italianstallion on Fri Feb 12 20:35:36 2010, in response to No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 20:26:03 2010. Wrong again. MTA has consistently said it plans to do this. |
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| (898878) | |
Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by arnine on Fri Feb 12 21:05:22 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by andy on Fri Feb 12 20:13:21 2010. I would imagine MNR will station some of their own people at NYP |
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Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Andrew Saucci on Fri Feb 12 21:06:38 2010, in response to No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 20:26:03 2010. "LIRR East Side Access will no doubt create opportunities for New Haven Line service into Penn as some LIRR trains switch to GCT""False. We've been here before." The opportunities may be scarce, but they will appear. Let's not assume any great growth, either. If ridership remains flat or actually decreases (as has just happened), or the third mainline LIRR track is NOT built to Hicksville (we have to get past the NIMBY's first), trains going into Grand Central will be trains that used to go into either Penn Station New York or Brooklyn. Those slots would then be available for Metro North trains. Again, maybe not too many opportunities, but enough to put to rest this idea that NO trains can ever come from Connecticut. |
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Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by arnine on Fri Feb 12 21:07:53 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 20:25:37 2010. True costs may prohibit it |
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| (898888) | |
Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by fisk ave jim on Fri Feb 12 21:18:49 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by ebtmikado on Fri Feb 12 20:20:22 2010. Why can't they just make a 3d rail shoe thats compatable with both 3'd rail (underiding/overiding) designs. Heck, they put a man on the moon did'nt they?? What type of third rail did NASA use?? :-) |
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| (898893) | |
Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Fri Feb 12 21:34:07 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by fisk ave jim on Fri Feb 12 21:18:49 2010. Why can't they just make a 3d rail shoe thats compatable with both 3'd rail (underiding/overiding) designs.They did. It's called constant tension catenary. :-P |
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Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Fri Feb 12 21:38:46 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Fri Feb 12 21:34:07 2010. nice! Of course catenary also needs to be compatible voltage/frequency. |
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| (898912) | |
Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 22:07:17 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by fisk ave jim on Fri Feb 12 21:18:49 2010. They already have!! The M-8 will be equipped with such a shoe. It was tested successfully on a set of MNR M-7As both here and on LIRR territory a couple of months ago. |
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Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by italianstallion on Fri Feb 12 22:08:47 2010, in response to Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Andrew Saucci on Fri Feb 12 21:06:38 2010. Once Olog latches on to an idee fixe, he never let's go. |
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Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 22:09:24 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by fisk ave jim on Fri Feb 12 21:18:49 2010. The M-8, if the service ever runs, will run via catenary from CP 216 in New Rochelle to Gate Interlocking, and then from there, it will run on LIRR third rail from that point all the way to Penn. Apparently it is in the works to extend third rail on both Tracks 1 and 2 from Harold up the Hell Gate Line to Gate Interlocking, where the changeover for the M-8 westbound (and from third rail to catenary eastbound) will be made. |
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| (898920) | |
Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:11:36 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by fisk ave jim on Fri Feb 12 21:18:49 2010. Why can't they just make a 3d rail shoe thats compatable with both 3'd rail (underiding/overiding) designsNo . . . why don't they just have them with folding third rail shoes, since the M8 has pantographs? |
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Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:12:29 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by fisk ave jim on Fri Feb 12 21:18:49 2010. Why can't they just make a 3(r)d rail shoe thats compatable with both 3(r)d rail (underiding/overiding) designsNo . . . why don't they just have them with folding third rail shoes, since the M8 has pantographs? (Besides, been there, done that and thrown out, with the FL9.) |
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Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:13:39 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 22:07:17 2010. The M-8 will be equipped with such a shoe. It was tested successfully on a set of MNR M-7As both here and on LIRR territory a couple of months agoHmm. How come it failed on the FL9? And what's the use unless you're going to run through onto the LIRR and/or use ESA? The pantographs would be more than enough. |
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Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:14:22 2010, in response to Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Andrew Saucci on Fri Feb 12 21:06:38 2010. The opportunities may be scarce, but they will appearNo they won't. LIRR ain't having it. |
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| (898926) | |
Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 22:14:27 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 22:07:17 2010. See PostSee Post |
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| (898928) | |
Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 22:15:41 2010, in response to Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:13:39 2010. Apparently this one that was tested was a success on the M-7As, so why not would it be successful on the M-8? I knew a couple of people who ran the test, and it had little in the way of problems. |
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| (898929) | |
Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:16:06 2010, in response to Re: Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by italianstallion on Fri Feb 12 20:35:36 2010. MTA has consistently said it plans to do thisNot relevant what MTA claims. Ain't gonna happen. And it certainly wouldn't be due to LIRR opening ESA. (Remember MTA was going to merge LIRR and Metro-North into "MTA Rail Road" as well? That died too.) |
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| (898930) | |
Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:17:25 2010, in response to Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 22:15:41 2010. so why not would it be successful on the M-8?Well, that's not the question, because the M8 still has pantographs and doesn't need it. |
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Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 22:18:33 2010, in response to Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:16:06 2010. "(Remember MTA was going to merge LIRR and Metro-North into "MTA Rail Road" as well? That died too.)"Not true, the plan did not at all die. The union hoopla that arose over it plus concerns about seniority lists and being able to work either "former railroads" territories, simply put it to rest, but it did not kill it at all. Someway, somehow, sometime you best to believe the MTA will work at making that happen. |
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| (898933) | |
Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by italianstallion on Fri Feb 12 22:18:57 2010, in response to Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:14:22 2010. LIRR is owned by MTA. If MTA wants it, it will happen. |
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| (898934) | |
Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 22:19:46 2010, in response to Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:17:25 2010. Well, I do not know all the technical word over that, I do know the plan is, if it should happen with such a service, the M-8 will head into Penn, but not on catenary, but on LIRR third rail. |
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| (898936) | |
Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:21:38 2010, in response to Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 22:19:46 2010. Gotta use the catenary wire to reach the LIRR. Better to have fold-up shoes (like on Amtrak's P32AC-DMs) instead of running redundantly on third rail with catenary overhead. Besides, the overhead's better for the gaps. |
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| (898939) | |
Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 22:23:25 2010, in response to Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:21:38 2010. Not necessarily. Again, there are plans of extending third rail up the Hell Gate to the limits of Gate Interlocking on both Tracks 1 and 2, and that will be the transition point from catenary to third rail and vice versa for M-8 consists that run over the Hell Gate Line. |
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| (898940) | |
Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Feb 12 22:23:48 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 20:25:37 2010. But that solves the issue of what to do with NHRR consists once they get to NYP: Just run them through to the Hudson Lion.ROAR |
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| (898941) | |
Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 22:26:22 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Feb 12 22:23:48 2010. But there is no third rail on the Empire Line between a point just north of Penn and CP 12 (MNR Hudson Line).....can you say "dead in the water!! All dressed up and nowhere to go by no means!!"ROAR!! :-D |
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| (898947) | |
Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Feb 12 22:28:36 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by arnine on Fri Feb 12 21:05:22 2010. Um.... No.NYP is operated by AMTK. When an LIRR consist starts from NYP, they use AMTK carknockers for the brake tests &ct. The West Side Yard was not yet built when LION lived there, it sounds like that *is* all LIRR people, but unless a road crew takes it out of WSY then AMTK will have to do the brake test again when the road crew boards at NYP. Leastwise that is how the LION sees it based on what he saw back in the '80s. ROAR |
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| (898950) | |
Re: Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Feb 12 22:32:57 2010, in response to Re: Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by italianstallion on Fri Feb 12 20:35:36 2010. MTA has constantly had plans to build a Second Avenue Subway.Others have plans to go back to the moon or to Mars. The Second Hand Subway the LION will accept, the others when hell freezes over (sorry Algore). ROAR |
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Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Michael Wares on Fri Feb 12 22:33:17 2010, in response to Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:21:38 2010. Amtrak might not want to supply power; or charge too much for it. |
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| (898954) | |
Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 22:33:54 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Feb 12 22:28:36 2010. "NYP is operated by AMTK. When an LIRR consist starts from NYP, they use AMTK carknockers for the brake tests &ct"I would go to the LIRR forum at RAILROAD.NET, LIRR Forum and confirm that (a good number of LIRR employees post here), because I am not too sure that is the case. "Leastwise that is how the LION sees it based on what he saw back in the '80s." Much has changed since then good buddy.....MUCH has changed!! Again I would go to the forums at RAILROAD.NET to confirm that. |
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| (898959) | |
Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 22:41:10 2010, in response to Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by italianstallion on Fri Feb 12 22:18:57 2010. This I agree. While it may not be very easy, and might take some time, for the most part this is true. |
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| (898965) | |
Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by WillD on Fri Feb 12 22:51:41 2010, in response to Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:12:29 2010. why don't they just have them with folding third rail shoes, since the M8 has pantographs?Because some genius decided it wasn't necessary to have a transformer sized for 25hz power and Amtrak tends to take a dim view of things that are constantly on fire. (Besides, been there, done that and thrown out, with the FL9.) Yes, we heard you the first half dozen times you said that in this thread. But last time I checked it's not 1957 and we got them fancy things called CAD stations that let us work things like that out. It'll probably still be a poor solution since the M8's performance on third rail is likely to be significantly worse than their performance on AC power, but it'll work until Amtrak upgrades the NEC to 60hz. |
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| (898966) | |
Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Michael Wares on Fri Feb 12 22:51:43 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by ebtmikado on Fri Feb 12 20:20:22 2010. From the April 24, 1966 Pennsylvania Railroad employe's timetable, p. 357: "New Haven R.R. Enginemen of electric engines are responsible for knowing that changeover switch is in AC position, DC pantograph locked down and third rail contact shoes in raised position clear of third rail and protection board."Penn Central employe's timetable, April 27, 1969, p. 382: "On the Hell Gate Line on westbound trains hauled by a.c.-d.c electric engines or EDER-5 [FL9] engines, enginemen must know that third rail contact shoes are up before passing rake-off blocks located east of Woodside Avenue Bridge, Long Island City. On EDER-5 engines scheduled for third rail operation, enginemen must lower third rail shoes after engine has cleared the shoe rake-off blocks east of Woodside Avenue and must ascertain that all shoes are in the proper position before reaching the Phase Break." The PRR/PC/Amtrak employee who gave me the timetables told me that the FL9s arced badly on the LIRR third rail. |
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| (898968) | |
Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:56:01 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Michael Wares on Fri Feb 12 22:51:43 2010. From the April 24, 1966 Pennsylvania Railroad employe's timetable, p. 357:
So they designed the EP-series electric motors like that. But they can't design the M8 like that today. (What about the washboard MUs?) |
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| (898972) | |
Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by fisk ave jim on Fri Feb 12 23:02:29 2010, in response to Re: No Future MN New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Feb 12 22:12:29 2010. Lets not forget that Metro-North's overall long range plan is to have the M-8's compatible with all of their third rail turf. As in go to Harmon Or Southeast in a pinch in times where equiptment is short. Like as it is done nowadays when u see the big red stripe on the side heading north on 3'd rail territiory twoards Harmon or Brewster North (sorry, Southeast) Also, Metro Morth spent big $$$'s on their highbridge car maintenance facility to service all their equiptment. So, since there is no wire in the highbridge area, the M-8's will need compatible 3'd rail shoe to get their occcasional South Bronx bath.So any thoughts that the M-8's only need pantographs in a mistake. |
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Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Feb 12 23:11:41 2010, in response to Re: Future MNR New Haven Line Service to Penn Station, posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Feb 12 22:26:22 2010. YAWN...Like how hard can it be to add a third rail? The tunnel has (had?) four tracks in it, AMTK uses ONE of them. LION thinks that MNCR can play with much of that space as much as they like, building yards and through tracks. The choke point will be the bridge. How often would that thing have to open and close, or would they just close it during rush hour and pretend that those boats are not there. ROAR |
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