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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Feb 18 12:05:03 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 18 11:09:32 2019.

You also forgot to mention that the Bolsheviks were originally Russia's Social Democratic Labor Party.

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by Steamdriven on Mon Feb 18 13:13:57 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Joe V on Mon Feb 18 11:30:21 2019.

They were allies before they were opponents. Politically, what they had was a bitter family feud, the International Socialists vs the National Socialists. The former has a better sales pitch: anyone can join our club, only later it is revealed that you can't leave, but you'll wish you could. Either way, it's Everything For the State, Nothing Outside the State. Small government, town meeting, Minutemen and micro-brews have no place in national or international socialism.

National Socialism had a losing pitch: if you're defined as part of part of our nationality, join us and rule the others, also give up any independent thoughts. If you were not part of the mythical Persian race (Iryan-Iran:Aryan, supposed ancestor of the Germanic tribes), you exist to be slaves.* Hitler didn't think that one through. whaddya expect when a art school reject runs your country.

There were more practical, ground level reasons for their rivalry. e.g. Russia had vast oil reserves, Germany has none, and there was that little business of 1914-1918...


*unless you are Japanese, who became defined as neo-Persian.


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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by TransitChuckG on Mon Feb 18 13:23:29 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by AlM on Mon Feb 18 11:52:02 2019.


In Nazi Germany, the government owned some of the means of production like Volkswagen, but most were owned by large corporations like Krupp

I was in the semi-trailer business when I was young, during some of my stay, we were part of Thyssen -Krupp. Budd-Thyssen Krupp

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by randyo on Mon Feb 18 14:32:08 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Joe V on Mon Feb 18 08:36:05 2019.

If the New Deal spending hadnít been cut back, much of the IND second system might have been built.

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Mon Feb 18 16:08:16 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by randyo on Mon Feb 18 14:32:08 2019.

Correct. The $$$ (and materials) that was going to build the second IND system went to the war effort.

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Mon Feb 18 17:46:38 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Feb 18 09:31:17 2019.

The New Deal was far from perfect, no doubt. Thats reality.
Another reality, where would this country be without the New Deal? What were his other options to get the country back to work?.
I'm aware that the Govt is in business to make money. How can they make money if most of its workforce is out of work? Do nothing? I'don't think so.
FDR was such a beloved figure before & during the war that he was reelected to four terms. If his programs & policies were such a failure & bad for the country as you say, how come voters let him keep his job until he died in office?
History has overall backed up FDR & his New Deal as the right medicine for the sickness that the country had at the time.
And thats a reality.

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 18 17:57:55 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Joe V on Mon Feb 18 11:30:21 2019.

But socialism is the same

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by AlM on Mon Feb 18 18:03:21 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 18 17:57:55 2019.

It is really pretty disgusting of you to lump Hitler, Stalin, and Clement Attlee into the same bag.



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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by Joe V on Mon Feb 18 19:00:07 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Mon Feb 18 17:46:38 2019.

The stock market crashed in 1929. We waited until 1933 for the New Deal. Obviously doing nothing for over 4 years was unproductive and unacceptable. Elections have consequences.

Republicans haven't accepted the realities of the hit they took in 2018 in the House and Governor's races. 2020 is coming.

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Mon Feb 18 19:52:42 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Joe V on Mon Feb 18 19:00:07 2019.

Lol!!!

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 18 20:22:23 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Mon Feb 18 17:46:38 2019.

Trying to convince Olog-hai of reality is the OTChat version of squaring the circle.

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Mon Feb 18 20:30:36 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 18 20:22:23 2019.

Understood!

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Feb 18 22:17:45 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Steamdriven on Mon Feb 18 13:13:57 2019.

Good summary, but don't forget that the international socialists also want you to give up your religion.

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by 3-9 on Tue Feb 19 07:11:32 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by TransitChuckG on Mon Feb 18 13:23:29 2019.

I wonder what happened to all of Budd's patents and designs since then.

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by pragmatist on Tue Feb 19 07:54:45 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by 3-9 on Tue Feb 19 07:11:32 2019.

It is likely that most if not all patents are expired.

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by Broadway Lion on Tue Feb 19 09:55:42 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Joe V on Mon Feb 18 19:00:07 2019.

What planet do you live on?

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Re: a reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by Mitch45 on Tue Feb 19 13:50:05 2019, in response to Re: a reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Feb 16 23:53:31 2019.

Robert Moses was against the formation of the TA in 1953 and felt that it would never turn a profit, unlike his bridges and tunnels. He was right.

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Re: a reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Feb 19 14:20:51 2019, in response to Re: a reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Mitch45 on Tue Feb 19 13:50:05 2019.

yes, and as I havbe said at least once before in this thread, ZERO public transit operations turn a profit fully accounted. The Hong Kong exception relies on ownership/lease proceeds from real estate parcels--sort of as if MTA owned acres of midtown office blocks adjacent the various subways.
As an aside, when the Northwest Territory Act was passed over 2 centuries ago, it specified the grid plan for lots in the new states 9west of the Ohio River etc). In each "etownship" lot 16 was to be owned by the local board of education. In Chicago, some of that turned out to be in the Loop.


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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by Steamdriven on Tue Feb 19 14:26:50 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Feb 18 22:17:45 2019.

Both flavors pushed their own version of religion.
NS had a paganized version of Christianity; the guy with the weird mustache expressed regret that Germany was not Islamic, he preferred the ethics of that religion. Not unrelated, he persuaded the Persians to rename themselves Iran, as in his version of history Persia is the origin of the Ayran (Iryan) race. Whaddya expect from an art school reject.
WS -- one could drone on and on about their version of religion, way too far off topic for here. WS does have a religion, it's just not Abrahamic or Pagan and it replaces the supernatural God with other fixed, unquestionable beliefs.

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by 3-9 on Tue Feb 19 17:09:52 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by pragmatist on Tue Feb 19 07:54:45 2019.

So in theory, it should be possible to reproduce stuff that the Budd company did? Not that I want the R-32s to be produced again, but something like Jersey Arrow III's (modified) or Pioneer III trucks woukd be nice.

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by pragmatist on Tue Feb 19 17:17:41 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by 3-9 on Tue Feb 19 17:09:52 2019.

Well, I'm guessing that stainless steel welding technique is no longer proprietary...I'm really not sure exactly what applies to what. I'm tempted to call a friend with an IP and patent law practice, but if I ask about railroad trucks he may file to have me committed....

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by 3-9 on Tue Feb 19 17:48:40 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by pragmatist on Tue Feb 19 17:17:41 2019.

lol :-)

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Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by Joe V on Wed Feb 20 13:19:04 2019, in response to Re: A reminder about what socialism is, was 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by 3-9 on Tue Feb 19 17:09:52 2019.

Pioneer trucks are very durable, but not very smooth riding. I suppose it is OK for 40 MPH subway trains.

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Re: 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over

Posted by Jersey Mike on Mon Feb 25 09:03:57 2019, in response to Re: 10 things NYC should do now that Amazon HQ2 deal is over, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sun Feb 17 15:16:59 2019.

Denver was the only city that matched all of their criteria, one of which being a non-saturated job market. However recent studies have show the importance of agglomeration effects on innovation so basically a tech company's best move is to go to a place with an existing tech culture.

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