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| Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle (428152) | |
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| (428941) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by Edwards! on Sun May 13 01:00:37 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun May 13 00:51:37 2007. You just a bad as he is...Get a clue. |
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| (428942) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun May 13 01:03:33 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Edwards! on Sun May 13 01:00:37 2007. If by "bad" you mean "understands reality", then yes, you're right, though he may do an even better job than me. |
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| (428944) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by WMATAGMOAGH on Sun May 13 01:14:01 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by TheGreatOne2k7 on Sun May 13 00:35:32 2007. Why does 4th Avenue (or any line for that matter) need express service 24/7? |
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(Sponsored) |
iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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| (428949) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by TheGreatOne2k7 on Sun May 13 01:41:00 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by WMATAGMOAGH on Sun May 13 01:14:01 2007. Well if the (J) runs to Bay Ridge 24/7 (giving it 24/7 Manhattan access) 4 Av would have 3 late night services (like Queens Boulevard), in that case one service might as well run express 24/7 (The (D) being the service, like the (F) on Queens Boulevard). The (N) can run local or express, depending upon ridership. |
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| (428952) | |
Re: Increasing QB capacity |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 02:03:41 2007, in response to Re: Increasing QB capacity, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sat May 12 17:17:04 2007. You post valid examples of things that can hold up the process. These will not affect all instances, however, or even most of them.So you can estimate an average and plan with it in mind. And yes, you can put a time on it, bearing in mind that there will be exceptions. |
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| (428954) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 02:06:30 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat May 12 21:36:56 2007. Does saying that make you feel better?Stop being a doofus. |
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| (428955) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 02:07:23 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Grand concourse on Sat May 12 22:17:57 2007. True |
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| (428956) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 02:08:54 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by David of Broadway on Sat May 12 22:04:02 2007. You really are a little boy, aren't you?There there...mommy will bring you a cookie. Don't cry... |
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| (428957) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 02:10:09 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Edwards! on Sun May 13 00:25:08 2007. David likes to argue for its own sake much of the time. We're used to it. |
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| (428959) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 02:11:44 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Edwards! on Sat May 12 21:26:30 2007. That's entirely possible. He still could not tear the El down by himself. |
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| (428960) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Sun May 13 02:25:21 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 02:08:54 2007. What a killer argument! |
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| (428961) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by Grand concourse on Sun May 13 02:29:25 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by David of Broadway on Sun May 13 02:25:21 2007. Ah so funny how it seems to be 1 or so ppl that will force this thread to be shut down. What a shame. |
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| (428974) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by stephenk on Sun May 13 04:15:03 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by RonInBayside on Fri May 11 16:56:57 2007. I'm sure Jamaica Centre/Archer can handle slightly higher than 12tph. For a reverse in platforms terminus to run at near maximum capacity, trains need to arrive at the crossover on time, and depart the terminus as soon as they have a green light.Many similar termini around the world can operate with 30secs door closing and operating margin time. This leaves 3mins30secs for a train to depart and the next to arrive through the crossover to allow for 15tph. I'm sure it doesn't take as long as 3mins30secs for the latter to happen! |
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| (428977) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by SMAZ on Sun May 13 04:34:31 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 12 12:46:28 2007. I always wondered why they severed the BMT from the Culver after it was connected to the (F) since they could have continued to run the (F) and a BMT service on those tracks. Anybody know the logic of it? |
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| (428978) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by R30A on Sun May 13 04:40:50 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by AMoreira81 on Sat May 12 18:43:09 2007. A. no it doesnt.B. no it doesnt. (A applies to the first part of your statement, B applies to the second.) |
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| (428987) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun May 13 06:14:54 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by AMoreira81 on Sat May 12 18:43:09 2007. No, in this case Ron is correct. Unlike the old 1/9 skip stop, the J/Z works beautifully. |
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| (428988) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun May 13 06:16:00 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by David of Broadway on Sun May 13 02:25:21 2007. Yeah, isn't it just great how people can come here and debate topics like adults! |
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| (428990) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun May 13 06:18:40 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 02:06:30 2007. LOL. Does telling Chris (who is a married man) that he sticks his dick into trains instead of a woman make your sorry sad self feel better? |
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| (428991) | |
Re: The (M) and the (QB) Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun May 13 06:24:34 2007, in response to The (M) and the (QB) Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by E Line Fan on Sun May 13 00:03:13 2007. It wouldn't have been until the 80's when the M was thrown off the Brighton (at which time there was no QB). We are not talking initial service changes when the Culver was severed, we are talking had the shuttle held on for a couple more years, it's usefulness would have been more apparent when they needed to 'do something" with the M train when it needed to be removed from the Brighton when the Manhattan Bridge and Brighton line reconstruction began. |
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| (428994) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by Stephen Bauman on Sun May 13 06:58:08 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by RonInBayside on Sat May 12 19:30:28 2007. Why don't you transcribe the information in the biography link and place it explicitly in the record? What titles did Mr. Yunich hold immediately prior to becoming MTA chairman? |
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| (428997) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by David on Sun May 13 07:59:09 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by TheGreatOne2k7 on Sun May 13 01:41:00 2007. But that's an amplification of the suggestion, not an explanation (which was requested) of why 24-hour express service on Fourth Avenue is needed. Why is 24-hour express service on Fourth Avenue needed? For that matter, why does Fourth Avenue need three services 24 hours a day?David |
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| (429019) | |
Re: Increasing QB capacity |
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Posted by AlM on Sun May 13 09:24:35 2007, in response to Re: Increasing QB capacity, posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 02:03:41 2007. We actually have some halfway decent anecdotal evidence of the time it takes to terminate a train at Continental.Many people have posted that both the R and the V run at 10 tph in the rush hour. I can't prove it's true but it's credible. Many have also posted that locals terminating at Continental back up seriously in the rush hour. So if trains arrive at an average of one every 3 minutes, this implies that they depart Continental at an interval of slightly more than 3 minutes. |
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| (429024) | |
Re: Increasing QB capacity |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Sun May 13 09:34:37 2007, in response to Re: Increasing QB capacity, posted by AlM on Sun May 13 09:24:35 2007. Is fumigation necessary at all times?I can understand that it should happen if the train is going to the yard, but if they just have it so that the train returns to the other platform (relays) in 6 or 7 minutes (apparently how long it takes since there are only 2 relay tracks and trains are 20 tph) does it matter if someone gets left in the train for that time? It is in theory possible for someone to board an empty car of a late night Q train to go over the Manhattan Bridge and be stuck in the car for the 8 minutes it takes from station to station. Is this much different? Again, the exception is when the train is for the yard. |
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| (429026) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun May 13 09:35:04 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun May 13 06:16:00 2007. So great! |
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| (429027) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun May 13 09:35:41 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Grand concourse on Sun May 13 02:29:25 2007. I don't think so. But there are a couple people who are trying to turn this place into a sh*thole, and have already partially succeeded. |
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| (429028) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun May 13 09:37:04 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Edwards! on Sun May 13 00:25:08 2007. David's posts are based on reality. I'm not sure what your posts are based one, but they aren't wholly based on the truth. If you could avoid the personal attacks, your posts would be a lot better. |
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| (429032) | |
Re: M Train in Brooklyn (Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by Bzuck on Sun May 13 09:41:07 2007, in response to Re: M Train in Brooklyn (Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 12 15:47:35 2007. So the only reason they run the M to Bay Parkway and run up extra car milage and have extra trains required is they screwed up by building the crew quarters at Bay Parkway instead of 9th Avenue.That makes perfect sense. |
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| (429035) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 09:50:11 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by stephenk on Sun May 13 04:15:03 2007. Thank you for your comparisons. |
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| (429036) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 09:51:29 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by R30A on Fri May 11 17:07:53 2007. Do they do that all the time? 20% of the time? 80% of the time? 50%of the time?How big is your sample size? |
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| (429037) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 09:53:46 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun May 13 06:18:40 2007. I know he's married. The question is, to what? |
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| (429039) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 09:56:54 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Stephen Bauman on Sun May 13 06:58:08 2007. You obviously read the link, so you know there isn't any more beyond that page.If you're intrerested, you can pay by credit card to get the full text of Randy Kennedy's Sept 21, 2001 column from the Times. But it will get you no more support for your theory than these links did. Nothing you've provided so far or that I've linked to, at your request, supports your crackpot theory. |
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| (429042) | |
Re: Increasing QB capacity |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 10:02:56 2007, in response to Re: Increasing QB capacity, posted by AlM on Sun May 13 09:24:35 2007. OK.But in the case of Continental you have more than just anecdotes. The TA itself tried to run the V,G,E,F,R together in an experiment and found that it could not. That trial produced some turnaround data, which I believe was posted at some point. I don't know where it is, but a TA employee did describe it on Subtalk. |
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| (429043) | |
Re: Increasing QB capacity |
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Posted by Railman718 on Sun May 13 10:08:11 2007, in response to Re: Increasing QB capacity, posted by New Flyer #857 on Sun May 13 09:34:37 2007. Relay tracks, just like yard leads are not "revune" tracks so passengers must be off the trains.So it says in our Blue Bible. Of coruse there are always exceptions... All it takes (and it has happened) for somebody to fall walking thru a relay that was not cleaned out and become hamburger. Or get angry beacuse they was left on the train and assualts a C/R or a T/O. That opens up lawsuits and all kinds of drama that is not called for. So on relays train gets cleaned out... |
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Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by Avid Reader on Sun May 13 10:22:35 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by RonInBayside on Fri May 11 22:32:39 2007. Here's a guess.At stations where the crossover is closer, like Queens Plaza, Northbound. If a "V" train is on the express track in the station, doors open and has the switches in its favor, an approaching "R" train must enter the station on the local track at a snails pace and may possible be stopped before fully entering. With the crossover placed a greater distance from the station, safety, in terms of distance are satisfied and the local can approach at a safer, faster rate, saving TIME! This is repeated through out the system. Canal street, north bound, same thing, "E" and "C". avid |
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| (429060) | |
Re: The (M) and the (QB) on 5/11/75 Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by E Line Fan on Sun May 13 10:37:41 2007, in response to Re: The (M) and the (QB) Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun May 13 06:24:34 2007. I know. That's why I posted my question in a new subthread. It's reported the shuttle was averaging barely a thousand riders a day by 1975. The (QB)became the (Q) in 1985. Thanks, GP42 R38 Chris for your reply. :) |
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| (429061) | |
Re: M Train in Brooklyn (Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by E Line Fan on Sun May 13 10:50:05 2007, in response to Re: M Train in Brooklyn (Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Bzuck on Sun May 13 09:41:07 2007. I might be off on this but isn't another reason for Bay Parkway it's nearness to C.I. Yard (similiar to Bedford Park Boulevard and Concourse Yard)? So that trains could go straight to the yard without having having to travel light from Ninth Avenue? |
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Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by Stephen Bauman on Sun May 13 11:03:09 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Avid Reader on Sun May 13 10:22:35 2007. First, NYCT should not schedule trains so that two are assigned to merge onto a single track at the same time. Second, NYCT should monitor the progress of trains so that they do not arrive at a merge point at the same time. These two obvious principles take care of the problems with the E, V and R at Queens Plaza.Regarding Canal St. First, NYCT should maintain switches in the straight position, when trains enter the station. Two, a diverging switch should be switched when the train is stopped in the station during that train's normal dwell time. Three, schedules should be designed so that an approaching train does not enter a station when another train is making a diverging move onto its track. Neither of these examples are relevant to Jamaica Center. Both the examples you cited are for two tracks with trains going in the same direction. Jamaica Center has two tracks with trains going in opposite directions. The only purpose for such a switch is to reverse directions. |
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Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by E Line Fan on Sun May 13 11:04:22 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 09:56:54 2007. I may be off on this but could Ninth Avenue lower level be restored and used as a terminal? Might it be better to switch the (M)and (J) trains if it could? |
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| (429064) | |
Re: M Train in Brooklyn (Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by Marc A. Rivlin on Sun May 13 11:13:02 2007, in response to Re: M Train in Brooklyn (Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Bzuck on Sun May 13 09:41:07 2007. Back when I was using the West End one or two days a week (2000-2004), there seemed to be a market for the service in the Chinese-American community traveling between Bensonhurst and Chinatown. This was certainly the argument made by the community when Grand Street was closed. Whether the service is justified now, I couldn't say without seeing origin-destination data and ridership counts. |
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| (429066) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Sun May 13 11:23:01 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 09:51:29 2007. Bigger than yours, that's clear. |
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| (429067) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by Stephen Bauman on Sun May 13 11:25:59 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 09:56:54 2007. You obviously read the link, so you know there isn't any more beyond that page.So, you are sill reluctant to state that Mr. Yunich had been the president of Macy's New York for 9 years and the Vice-Chairman of its parent company for 2 years, prior to becoming MTA chairman. There was a reason for my asking those two simple factual questions, what was it? Oh yes, Illogical and implausible. Macy's alone asking for it would not have caused the TA to carry it out. |
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| (429070) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by Stephen Bauman on Sun May 13 11:36:39 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 09:56:54 2007. Randy Kennedy's Sept 21, 2001 column from the TimesI generally prefer to work with contemporary documents not those that have been cured for a quarter century. However, go back 30 years when the Times was not a media company but made its money from the City and Late City editions of the New York Times. Answer this question. Which was a major advertiser in the New York Times in the mid 1970's, Macy's or the small businesses along Jamaica Avenue? |
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Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by 33rd Street on Sun May 13 11:50:30 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by TheGreatOne2k7 on Sun May 13 00:27:43 2007. Might as well begin PM Bronx-bound B service 30 minutes earlier. 1438 out of Brighton (currently it is 1508 out of Brighton) and 1528 out of BPB (currently it is 1558 out of BPB). |
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Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by 33rd Street on Sun May 13 11:55:08 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Stephen Bauman on Sun May 13 11:03:09 2007. Jamaica Center is one of the worst terminal stations in the entire system. 21st Street-Queensbridge is more efficient than Jamaica Center. |
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| (429081) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 11:58:16 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Stephen Bauman on Sun May 13 11:25:59 2007. I'm not reluctant to state anything. You were not aware that Mr. Yunich was president of Bamberger until I brought it up.The fact that your reasoning was simple doesn't mean it wasn't wrong. You came to a wrong conclusion because you overestimate Mr. Yunich's power and underestimate the influence of the other merchants. Dave Pirmann, who has a great deal more credibility on political issues than you do, has stated on his site that the TA actually wanted to keep the El operating longer, but the merchants (plural) opposed it. Can you cite any TA memoranda or discussions among Macy's executives that support your point? |
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Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 12:00:53 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by David of Broadway on Sun May 13 11:23:01 2007. And you come to that conclusion through recording R32 subway car serial numbers and dividing them by the number of Passover-kosher chicken legs at the local deli.Very good! |
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| (429084) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 12:01:33 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by Stephen Bauman on Sun May 13 11:36:39 2007. And this has what relevance? |
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| (429085) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun May 13 12:02:06 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by 33rd Street on Sun May 13 11:55:08 2007. Especially since 21 St is no longer a terminal. :0) |
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| (429086) | |
Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun May 13 12:02:31 2007, in response to Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by R30A on Fri May 11 16:31:45 2007. I really doubt that you could run more than 15 TPH from the old 168th St. terminal, since the tracks end at bumper blocks at the edge of the station. No big deal, since it's not the lower level of Archer Ave. which suffers due to the placement of the crossover. |
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| (429087) | |
Re: The (M) and the (QB) Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Sun May 13 12:02:32 2007, in response to Re: The (M) and the (QB) Re: May 11, 1975. . .End of the Culver shuttle, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun May 13 06:24:34 2007. If they *wanted* to clean up the lower level at 9th Avenue, the (M) would have no difficulty terminating there.The LION knows that the (M) and the (QB) both accessed the Brighton Line from the Tunnel, but that is UNNATURAL and cannot be done without a lot of switching and jacking up of the railroad. DeKalb was designed as a 4th Avenue LOCAL station. The LOCAL trains went to the Tunnel, and the EXPRESS trains went to the Bridge. Then when the BMT was awarded the rights to the 4th Avenue Line they built the Flatbush Avenue Extension, and put two more tracks on the other side of the local platform (before the station ever opened to the public) making those into Island platforms. In those days the Brighton line Express trains went to DeKalb and the Bridge, while the Brighton Line Local trains went out Franklin Avenue and thence into downtown Brooklyn via the El. ROARing on the Brighton LION |
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