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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Fri Feb 22 23:42:54 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by Terrapin Station on Fri Feb 22 06:46:01 2008.

WILL YOU SHUT THE HELL UP ALREADY YOU MORON! YOU WATCH WHO YOU'RE CALLING A LOSER YOU ASS! AND I'M MORE MAN THAN YOU WILL EVER BE! I DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU OR YOUR STUPID ANTICS ABOUT PHOTOGRAPHY! I KNOW WHAT I THINK IS RIGHT AND WHAT IS WRONG!
FYI NILET IS ASKING FOR TROUBLE! HE KEEPS GETTING STOPPED BY POLICE AND AUTHORITIES. AND FOR WHAT? PHOTOGRAPHY! IT IS HIS APPROACH TO PHOTOS! AND IF HE KEEPS GETTING STOPPED AND HE KEEPS ARGUING WITH AUTHORITIES THEN HE WILL GET ARRESTED OR INTO MORE TROUBLE!
SINCE 9-11, YOU HAVE TO BE AWARE OF YOUR SURROUNDINGS. AND THERE ARE THINGS THAT YOU CAN DO AND YOU CAN'T DO. BELIEVE ME OR NOT! YOU TERRAPIN DON'T KNOW WHAT'S RIGHT AND WHAT'S WRONG AND I'M NOT HAVING ANY MORE OF THESE TIRADES WITH YOU! I'M NOT WASTING ANY MORE TIME RESPONDING TO A STUPID SCUMBAG!

(33522)

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LARRY PLEASE REEF THIS THREAD! Was: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by R142 #6666 on Fri Feb 22 23:51:32 2008, in response to ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by Nilet on Wed Feb 20 20:45:31 2008.

When is enough enough? There are people who do agree with Nilet and there are ones that do no agree. There are ones that are certain of the rules and ones who think know the rules and don't and ones that know the rules and don't give a damn. larry, before this escalates any further than it has to, I'm asking you to please reef this thread!
Thank You.

(33523)

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Re: FOAMER LIMITATIONS

Posted by Dan Lawrence on Fri Feb 22 23:51:56 2008, in response to Re: FOAMER LIMITATIONS, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Feb 22 16:30:27 2008.

Look in the mirror. There's the person on this board who has trouble cooperating and communicating appropriately with others.

(33524)

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Re: LARRY PLEASE REEF THIS THREAD! Was: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by RonInBayside on Fri Feb 22 23:53:20 2008, in response to LARRY PLEASE REEF THIS THREAD! Was: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by R142 #6666 on Fri Feb 22 23:51:32 2008.

Darn. We were doing so well...

(33525)

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Re: LARRY PLEASE DO NOT REEF THIS THREAD! Was: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by BMTLines on Sat Feb 23 00:35:46 2008, in response to LARRY PLEASE REEF THIS THREAD! Was: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by R142 #6666 on Fri Feb 22 23:51:32 2008.

Why should he reef it? The war against photography in the transit system and elsewhere needs to be publicly exposed till the MTA capitulates and ceases the harassment!

(33526)

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SHUT UP (Re: LARRY PLEASE REEF THIS THREAD! Was: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!)

Posted by G1Ravage on Sat Feb 23 01:05:02 2008, in response to LARRY PLEASE REEF THIS THREAD! Was: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by R142 #6666 on Fri Feb 22 23:51:32 2008.

Who the hell do you think you are? A soccer mom? Things getting a little too real for you? Can't figure out how to change the channel?

The discussion should continue as is, because it's a hot topic. Even if some of it isn't as civil as you'd like, you have no business calling for a reefing on your own. If you're tired of the thread, stop reading it.

I'm sick of people screaming for reefs out of the blue. Larry reads the board. If he feels a thread needs to be reefed, he'll do it himself. We don't need people crying like babies to get his attention.

Grow up.

(33527)

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Sigh. (Reefing Debate; eons ago, was "Robbed By A Cop.")

Posted by Nilet on Sat Feb 23 01:31:23 2008, in response to SHUT UP (Re: LARRY PLEASE REEF THIS THREAD! Was: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!), posted by G1Ravage on Sat Feb 23 01:05:02 2008.


Quick question for Larry: Is it possible to reef a few posts in a thread while leaving the rest of the thread there? There are some flamewars sparking, burning, or smoldering in various corners and subthreads, but I'd hate to see this entire thing reefed from my OP on down just because some people have "issues." I'm relatively new to SubChat compared to some of the posters here, so I really don't know about any long-standing feuds brought over from SubTalk.

As for everyone else: I have just the usual plea to keep it civil. Some people want me to post updates; I received at least one request to post these details. If you don't like it, or you don't like me, or you think I'm somehow at fault, you don't actually have to read this thread. You're free to read it, ignore it, post supporting me, post opposing me, or post whatever you want; just please don't disrupt it in the service of a long-standing feud between yourself and another SubChatter. I don't want another pointless flamewar, so here's a 1 train at 125th Street.


(33528)

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Osmosis Jones on Sat Feb 23 01:32:52 2008, in response to ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by Nilet on Wed Feb 20 20:45:31 2008.

I guess that's one of the things that's good about taking pictures with a camera phone, nobody harassing you, I even took pictures of both Airtrains and the PATH train and no one bothered me.

(33529)

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Re: Let's Put It To A Vote (was: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!)

Posted by BLE-NIMX on Sat Feb 23 01:33:30 2008, in response to Let's Put It To A Vote (was: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!), posted by Train Dude on Fri Feb 22 22:43:18 2008.

Lets enjoy the early exit we have until tomorrow night. Whats the penalty without a kill file?

(33530)

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Re: Sigh. (Reefing Debate; eons ago, was ''Robbed By A Cop.'')

Posted by monorail on Sat Feb 23 01:35:21 2008, in response to Sigh. (Reefing Debate; eons ago, was "Robbed By A Cop."), posted by Nilet on Sat Feb 23 01:31:23 2008.

excellent photo!

updates can always be sent to my email

(33531)

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Mr Mabstoa on Sat Feb 23 05:08:14 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by Train Dude on Fri Feb 22 00:27:08 2008.

Yeah. I don't get it.
Or maybe I do.
12 years ago Terrapin was running around in his overhalls & straw hat in his Fathers chicken slaughterhouse in Scanton.
So that makes it irrevelent.
Shame on you Railman!

(33532)

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Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Mr Mabstoa on Sat Feb 23 05:35:33 2008, in response to Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by SUBWAYSURF on Fri Feb 22 17:14:19 2008.

Or even better, don't post your exploits with the police in here.
Put it in a Anarcist board, or a Scranton hillbilly BBS!

(33533)

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Train Dude on Sat Feb 23 06:03:01 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by Mr Mabstoa on Sat Feb 23 05:08:14 2008.

"12 years ago Terrapin was running around in his overhalls & straw hat in his Fathers chicken slaughterhouse in Scanton"

He sounds positively Amish.

(33534)

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Train Dude on Sat Feb 23 06:14:42 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by Mr Mabstoa on Sat Feb 23 05:08:14 2008.

"12 years ago Terrapin was running around in his overhalls & straw hat"

That was better than his Halloween costume from last October. I heard that he put a condom over his head and masqueraded as a little pr1@k

(33535)

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Re: NOT ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Bingham C50 on Sat Feb 23 06:17:24 2008, in response to Re: NOT ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by BMTLines on Thu Feb 21 09:53:32 2008.

100% correct.

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Re: NOT ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Train Dude on Sat Feb 23 06:35:25 2008, in response to Re: NOT ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by BMTLines on Thu Feb 21 09:53:32 2008.

I think that people should report HONEST ACCOUNTS of confrontation with authorities. Also, those who railfan unmolested should also report it so we get a balanced picture.

(33537)

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Re: NOT ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by AMoreira81 on Sat Feb 23 06:49:26 2008, in response to Re: NOT ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by BMTLines on Thu Feb 21 09:53:32 2008.

However, is photography the relevant issue here? It may be that photography was a secondary issue...and that trespassing is the #1 issue, as noted by signage.

(33538)

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Re: Let's Put It To A Vote (was: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!)

Posted by AlM on Sat Feb 23 07:37:57 2008, in response to Let's Put It To A Vote (was: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!), posted by Train Dude on Fri Feb 22 22:43:18 2008.

No, Train Dude, I do NOT feel any personal attack on you is proper and justified.



(33539)

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Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by MJF on Sat Feb 23 07:43:35 2008, in response to Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by Train Dude on Fri Feb 22 22:40:04 2008.

Ahh, I see. So in other words, HE'S FULL OF SHIT!

(33540)

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by BMTLines on Sat Feb 23 07:46:23 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by Osmosis Jones on Sat Feb 23 01:32:52 2008.

But the resolution sucks compared to a REAL camera ;-)

(33541)

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Re: NOT ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by TimLawNYC on Sat Feb 23 07:54:14 2008, in response to Re: NOT ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by AMoreira81 on Sat Feb 23 06:49:26 2008.

That's actually part of the problem, the way I see it. Even when stopping people for "other" issues, police aren't sure how to deal with cameras, so we get things like ripped out batteries and stolen memory cards. Also, it's entirely feasible that other issues are used somewhat as pretext; it's possible that you're more likely to get stopped for "trespassing" or whatever small violation if you happen to be taking photos at the time. Since photography is, by default, perfectly legal in this country, the police who want to stop it need to come up with some OTHER reason to write you up; they can't give you a summons for taking pictures. So, in a way, it's irrelevant whether photography is the primary issue or a secondary one in any given stop; the fact is that photographers are generally being treated unfairly.

(33542)

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by TimLawNYC on Sat Feb 23 07:56:38 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by BMTLines on Sat Feb 23 07:46:23 2008.

And if you feel limited to only using a camera phone so that you don't get stopped,, it just shows what a problem the treatment of photographers really is.

(33543)

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Re: NOT ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by BMTLines on Sat Feb 23 08:06:52 2008, in response to Re: NOT ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by AMoreira81 on Sat Feb 23 06:49:26 2008.

This is why I posted the MTA's response in addition to all relevant correspondence I could find on the issue. I report - you decide ;-)

It appears that the authorities on the ground are making photography the issue in their verbal communication to photographers. Nilet was not told "please exit this platform if you do not have a ticket for this train", he was told "photography is illegal". If they simply said the former and he refused to obey then we would not be arguing here today (at least I wouldn't). The problem is they made an issue about the photography and used trespassing as the excuse to write a summons since there is no law against photography.

You will probably have noticed that I am a staunch defender of photographer's rights. However I do not advocate defying cops on the ground. What I do and what I advocate is that each and every time a photographer is told to "move on" or "no photos", etc. is that he should not just take it in stride and accept that "times have changed". Those incidents no matter how minor in the eyes of the photographer should be ranted about on the internet and in the media if possible and reported to the NYCLU and any other agency that takes complaints (i.e. CCRB, 311, etc). The authorities must be exposed for what they are doing to photographers until heavy public pressure is brought to bear forcing them to stop the harassment. Public pressure is what forced the MTA to back down on its photo ban and public pressure and legal action are what is going to force them to back down on this as well.

(33544)

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Re: NOT ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by AlM on Sat Feb 23 08:35:44 2008, in response to Re: NOT ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by AMoreira81 on Sat Feb 23 06:49:26 2008.

However, is photography the relevant issue here? It may be that photography was a secondary issue...and that trespassing is the #1 issue, as noted by signage.

I am sure photography was the thing that got their attention.

On numerous occasions I have taken a roundabout route to get to or from a train at GCT, just to see what's going on in the station but not to take pictures. With platforms having multiple access points nowadays you can take a fairly long trip in the train area without being obvious about it.

I've passed crew who just totally ignored me even though it was pretty clear that I couldn't really be on the most direct route from a train to one of the main waiting areas.





(33545)

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Re: NOT ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by TimLawNYC on Sat Feb 23 08:35:54 2008, in response to Re: NOT ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by BMTLines on Sat Feb 23 08:06:52 2008.

I second the encouragement to report these incidents to the NYCLU. :)

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Re: LARRY PLEASE REEF THIS THREAD!

Posted by SUBWAYSURF on Sat Feb 23 09:30:14 2008, in response to SHUT UP (Re: LARRY PLEASE REEF THIS THREAD! Was: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!), posted by G1Ravage on Sat Feb 23 01:05:02 2008.

Out of the blue? This thread should have been reefed after about 10 posts. A bunch of foamers beating a dead horse. Maybe you should grow up.

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by SUBWAYSURF on Sat Feb 23 09:32:47 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Fri Feb 22 23:12:16 2008.

Bad move NOW he will live to harrass you.

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by SUBWAYSURF on Sat Feb 23 09:33:34 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by RonInBayside on Fri Feb 22 23:37:05 2008.

>>>>>Brian does look good in a thong,<<<<<

I just lost my breakfast.

(33549)

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by LuchAAA on Sat Feb 23 09:38:09 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by RonInBayside on Fri Feb 22 23:37:05 2008.

That's funny, even though I like Terrapin. Almost as funny as your Smelly poem late last year.

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Re: MTA Contradictory Communication! (continued)

Posted by Dave on Sat Feb 23 09:55:49 2008, in response to Re: MTA Contradictory Communication! (continued), posted by TimLawNYC on Fri Feb 22 18:06:08 2008.

The fact that one can buy a ticket on the train doesn't negate his (or her) status as a business invitee. As an invitee, his (or her) First Amendment rights can be limited to the extent doing so is necessary to avoid infringing on the rights of other invitees.

Now whether someone taking pictures is infringing on the rights of others is a different question.

Were somone standing on the platform stopped by a cop and asked to produce a ticket (tresspassing issue); and that someone said they were buying a ticket on the outbound train from that platform (to avoid the tresspass issue); and that someone never boarded the train; then the cops probably would be able to make tresspassing charge stick...provided GCT posted "no tresspassing" regulations in a publically accessible place for all to see.

(33551)

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Re: LARRY PLEASE DO NOT REEF THIS THREAD! Was: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Sat Feb 23 09:57:10 2008, in response to Re: LARRY PLEASE DO NOT REEF THIS THREAD! Was: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by BMTLines on Sat Feb 23 00:35:46 2008.

I don't think it's just the MTA that needs to cease the harassment. It's other people that will not mind their own business and don't know the difference between a troublemaker and a railfan as well as the proper authorities who do not know what the rules are.


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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Sat Feb 23 09:58:55 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by SUBWAYSURF on Sat Feb 23 09:32:47 2008.

No I will not allow it.

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Feb 23 10:32:07 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by BrooklynBus on Fri Feb 22 21:01:31 2008.

"Experience" is usually an excuse for having spent a lot of time without actually having learned anything. Like jobs that benefit seniority. You can gain a lot of experience in very little time and at the same time can spend a lot of time gaining very little experience.

(33554)

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Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Feb 23 10:33:14 2008, in response to Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by BrooklynBus on Fri Feb 22 18:09:11 2008.

Even if someone is stupid, telling him so IS A PERSONAL ATTACK. The smart thing is to prove someone is stupid without having to tell him so. That way it isn't an attack.

I agree with you here.

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Re: FOAMER LIMITATIONS

Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Feb 23 10:39:44 2008, in response to Re: FOAMER LIMITATIONS, posted by Dan Lawrence on Fri Feb 22 23:51:56 2008.

We've gone through this already. The only way I could see you in the mirror is if you stand in front of it.

I guess with you there are TWO such people.

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Re: MTA Contradictory Communication! (continued)

Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Feb 23 10:50:06 2008, in response to Re: MTA Contradictory Communication! (continued), posted by Dave on Sat Feb 23 09:55:49 2008.

Nilet posted that he had a receipt from a train recently ridden. There is no way a person having disembarked a train they rode with a one-way ticket to GCT would still have the ticket (unless it was bought on board).

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Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by monorail on Sat Feb 23 10:51:54 2008, in response to Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by SUBWAYSURF on Fri Feb 22 17:14:19 2008.

perhaps the pigs should stop acting like pigs

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Feb 23 11:00:33 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by Edwards! on Thu Feb 21 12:39:56 2008.

Because it's the kind of lease where the repairs are passed off to the lessee?

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Feb 23 11:01:24 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Thu Feb 21 12:40:33 2008.

But as the lessee, the MTA is the operator and sets all of the rules.

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Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Train Dude on Sat Feb 23 11:05:21 2008, in response to Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by MJF on Sat Feb 23 07:43:35 2008.

Precisely

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Broadway Lion on Sat Feb 23 11:28:52 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Feb 21 10:29:00 2008.

If I lease a field and grow bean in it, then it is *I* who gets to decide who can take pictures of the beans.

OTOH, if I rent an apartment in a building, then it is the landlord who must make the improvements to the building. Still *I* get to decide who can enter my apartment and take pictures of my cats. Yet the landlord *can* prevent my guests of taking pictures in *his* hallways.

ROAR

(33562)

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Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Broadway Lion on Sat Feb 23 11:41:56 2008, in response to Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by Train Dude on Fri Feb 22 22:40:04 2008.

An Attack is unwarranted whither it is warranted or not.

LIONs attack Wildebeests.

If you are not a LION then do not attack.
If you are not a Wildebeest then do not be attacked.

ROAR



(33563)

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Lord Vader on Sat Feb 23 13:40:07 2008, in response to ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by Nilet on Wed Feb 20 20:45:31 2008.

I feel for you Nilet. Eventually, the photo hub-bub will be solved so just be patient. Some on the chats here say this and that but are not aware of what the deal is. Some could be right and some could be wrong but it's up to you to go the right channels and get justice. My advice, forget posting the incidents here and take care of business first. Once you get answers AND results, then post them here so that the rest of us can have an ace up our sleeves should we ever have such an encounter. Remember this, others read this board as well and griping doesn't make it look too good for you especially when it comes to rail-related issues and higher ups do read here periodically. Just keep it kool, take care of business, then hopefully justice will be on our side. Good luck with the suit.

Lord Vader

(33564)

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Re: LARRY PLEASE REEF THIS THREAD! Was: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Karl M, Ex New Yorker on Sat Feb 23 14:18:55 2008, in response to LARRY PLEASE REEF THIS THREAD! Was: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by R142 #6666 on Fri Feb 22 23:51:32 2008.

If you don't like it .....don't read it . Karl M

(33565)

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by Karl M, Ex New Yorker on Sat Feb 23 14:23:43 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by BLE-NIMX on Fri Feb 22 11:00:47 2008.

Well then YOU take a friend or two and visit these so called no photo zones and take photos...and post them no matter what. Karl M

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Re: MTA Contradictory Communication! (continued)

Posted by Dave on Sat Feb 23 14:42:11 2008, in response to Re: MTA Contradictory Communication! (continued), posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Feb 23 10:50:06 2008.

Recently ridden isn't the same as waiting to board the train. From a tresspassing perspective, the license to be on the platform in the case of the former extends to leaving the platform, not standing around taking pictures.

(33567)

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by BMTLines on Sat Feb 23 15:14:03 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by Lord Vader on Sat Feb 23 13:40:07 2008.

My advice, forget posting the incidents here and take care of business first.

Or he can send me the incident reports and I will be more than happy to post them on at least a DOZEN photography rights sites! I have no qualms about dragging the MTA's name through the mud till enough public pressure is brought to bear that they end their war on photography.

(33568)

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Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by BMTLines on Sat Feb 23 15:15:38 2008, in response to Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by SUBWAYSURF on Fri Feb 22 17:14:19 2008.

Cops should stop antagonizing photographers!

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Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by South Ferry on Sat Feb 23 15:17:41 2008, in response to Re: REEFED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by BMTLines on Sat Feb 23 15:15:38 2008.

P.O.T.Y!!!

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Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!

Posted by BrooklynBus on Sat Feb 23 16:26:46 2008, in response to Re: ROBBED BY A COP— AGAIN!, posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Feb 23 10:32:07 2008.

What in the world are you talking about?

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