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| Re: Tunnel stubs (751780) | |
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| (755745) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by bigrene22 on Thu Mar 12 12:10:36 2009, in response to Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Tue Mar 3 18:49:05 2009. Finally got the chance to see the never used short section of the shell station above the Utica Avenue Station on the A/C lines. It was really easy to get in. In other words no locked doors. The station as a whole is mostly mezzanines. One level layered on top of another in order to fit everything. On one closed off level of mezzanine I was able to touch the ceiling very easily. I am 5'10" and I would say the ceiling was 6'6". On the mezzanine there are two staircases that go down to other mezzanines. One on each side of the unused station. There were four staircases at one time but on one side of the mezzanine are now offices for different functions. After going down the staircase (either one) make a 360 and there is an open doorway that leads right to the local trackway. The station is on a diagonal and is a typical express station with four trackways and two island platforms. The station is as long as the A/C lines downstairs are wide. The platforms end about an inch or two away from the walls. There are no staircases on the platform and no tilework whatsoever. I couldn't help but stand there on the station platform and wonder what might have been. |
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| (755754) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by Tony Clifton on Thu Mar 12 12:21:37 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by daDouce Man on Thu Mar 12 12:08:44 2009. Nothing happened to them. |
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| (755755) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by South Brooklyn Railway on Thu Mar 12 12:22:47 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by Tony Clifton on Thu Mar 12 12:21:37 2009. Are you the actual Tony Clifton? |
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(Sponsored) |
iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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| (755793) | |
Re: Tunnel portal and el stub at 149th St |
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Posted by Mellow One on Thu Mar 12 13:21:05 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel portal and el stub at 149th St, posted by 3-9 on Wed Mar 11 04:53:38 2009. The Bergen Route up Westchester Ave was one of the original Suburban Railway routes of 1888. As built, the original two track Suburban route on the PROW from the Harlem River to 1444th St in the Bronx had a stub for that route built into the structure at 144th St. The route was not built at that time because it was held for the planned subway, which did utilize it later. This map illustrates the stub at 144th St. I can not remember what the lower level at 144th St looked like at the end of the el south of 149th St in 1955. This is an image of the upper level at 144th St showing the single 3rd Ave line express track descending down to the local tracks at 145th St and on to Third Ave. The two Bergen Ave Cutoff tracks go off to the right to Willis Ave. The lower level stub was never utilized.  Have a nice day. |
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| (755798) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by GIS Man on Thu Mar 12 13:36:33 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by Tony Clifton on Thu Mar 12 12:21:37 2009. They are under the local tracks at Bergen St. The platforms have long been used as storage areas, with locked doors on the local platforms.Bob |
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| (755799) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by Mark S. Feinman on Thu Mar 12 13:37:13 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by MCI D4000 81994 on Wed Mar 11 22:50:49 2009. If you mean coming off the Manny B into Brooklyn, then yes.--Mark |
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| (755801) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by Mark S. Feinman on Thu Mar 12 13:40:07 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Thu Mar 5 18:38:43 2009. That pristine bit of tunnel was probably the completed sections of 2nd Ave tunnel under the Confucious houses in Chinatown. They do not connect to anything.--Mark |
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| (755805) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by Mark S. Feinman on Thu Mar 12 13:45:10 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Thu Mar 12 11:45:44 2009. That track never went anywhere. It was basically a place to put a layup or disabled train, if necessary. No connection was ever planned for that single track.--Mark |
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| (755815) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by Marc A. Rivlin on Thu Mar 12 14:07:25 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by daDouce Man on Wed Mar 11 18:38:49 2009. A private site would be better. The advantage of Wiki is that a whole bunch of people can work on it easily without overwhelming the host or moderator with update responsibilities. The down side is as you mentioned. For accuracy sake, either a new site or the station pages of David Pirmann's site would probably be better. |
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| (755828) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Thu Mar 12 14:32:17 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by Mark S. Feinman on Thu Mar 12 13:40:07 2009. could be. the reporter was not very specific. Sadly, he also was not very unhappy that the second system hadn't been built. |
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| (755891) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by randyo on Thu Mar 12 17:12:13 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by Ed Alfonsin on Wed Mar 11 23:00:16 2009. There was a corresponding track on the S/B side but according to retired Trainmaster M. R. Deckinger, the switches were removed sometime in the late 1930s and I can't recall what he said about the track but I believe the rails remained there until the rebuilding of the area circa 1960. |
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| (755895) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by randyo on Thu Mar 12 17:20:51 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Thu Mar 12 12:10:36 2009. When I was there in 1983, there were "stairways" on the U/L platforms which would have led down to the A Line platforms but which had no actual steps installed and were more like very steep ramps. Were the cutouts for these stairways still there or were they filled in when the enclosed staircases on the A Line platforms removed? |
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| (756084) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by Edwards! on Thu Mar 12 23:22:49 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Thu Mar 12 12:10:36 2009. If you are NOT AN EMPLOYEE...STAY YOUR ASS OUT OF THOSE AREAS...if you get hurt..nobody will know,nor will they be able to help you. |
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| (756104) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by metropod on Fri Mar 13 00:20:26 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Thu Mar 12 12:10:36 2009. there's a word for that, what was it?oh, that's right... TRESPASSING! take some good advice, unless you want to be the urban legend of the lost railfan, stay out of those areas. |
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| (756135) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by MattW@15st_prospect_park on Fri Mar 13 03:01:27 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by randyo on Tue Mar 10 17:51:11 2009. Why would it be called South 4th Street? That is a great question, I understand why the Broadway station is called Broadway, But I don't know why South 4th is South 4th. Is there a chance it's called that because thats what railfans call it or was that its official name? As for Utica Ave and a corrisponding door on the north end of the mezz. I really have no idea. I have never worked out of Utica Ave. or that area of Brooklyn for that matter so I never have had time to poke around there. The one and only time I was at Utica Ave. and saw the shell was purly by chance and I knew someone workeing there at the time. One of these days I'll drag my self down there and really give the place a good going over or I'll ask Tunnel Rat next time I talk to him. |
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| (756215) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by bigrene22 on Fri Mar 13 08:50:49 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by Edwards! on Thu Mar 12 23:22:49 2009. I am a employee, fool. |
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| (756217) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by bigrene22 on Fri Mar 13 08:52:19 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by metropod on Fri Mar 13 00:20:26 2009. It's not trespassing for me, you don't even know me. |
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| (756224) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by bigrene22 on Fri Mar 13 09:16:54 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Fri Mar 13 08:50:49 2009. Sorry, dude. |
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| (756234) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by bigrene22 on Fri Mar 13 09:39:12 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by randyo on Thu Mar 12 17:20:51 2009. They filled in the cutouts for the stairways, when the enclosed stairways to them was removed, when they renovated the station in the Mid 1990s. |
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| (756246) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by daDouce Man on Fri Mar 13 10:19:56 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Fri Mar 13 08:50:49 2009. How long before you pass probation? |
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| (756249) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by bigrene22 on Fri Mar 13 10:26:27 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by daDouce Man on Fri Mar 13 10:19:56 2009. Don't know yet.... |
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| (756291) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by metropod on Fri Mar 13 11:36:33 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Fri Mar 13 08:52:19 2009. entering those areas without premission isn't much diffrence. you still shouldn't go back there alone. |
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| (756295) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by bigrene22 on Fri Mar 13 11:44:01 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by metropod on Fri Mar 13 11:36:33 2009. Ok, I understand. I'm a NYCT employee, so I CAN go in there alone. |
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| (756324) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by MattW@15st_prospect_park on Fri Mar 13 12:37:05 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Fri Mar 13 11:44:01 2009. Yes, you can go in there alone but it is not a good idea. If you go hurt while back there and no one knew you were there, the chances of getting help are slim. |
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| (756343) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by daDouce Man on Fri Mar 13 13:02:26 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Fri Mar 13 10:26:27 2009. Then watch your step.Be invisible. Stay under their radar. Be especially careful if they call you shortly before probation ends. |
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| (756353) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by daDouce Man on Fri Mar 13 13:17:42 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by MattW@15st_prospect_park on Fri Mar 13 12:37:05 2009. Before you go for a walk back in a closed area like Fulton Street,Tell someone about your plans to wonder around the station. Seriously! |
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| (756609) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Fri Mar 13 21:21:10 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Thu Mar 12 09:56:01 2009. That trackway, along with the Brooklyn (south) bound tunnel and platform under Nevins Street had been part of the origional IRT construction. In 1908, 10 years before the Lexington Ave. subway opened, the IRT asked the City to use the northside tracks of the Manhattan Bridge to connect Nevins St. to the Manhattan Bridge and to the 3rd Ave el. In return, the IRT promised to rebuild the 3rd Ave el to hold longer steel subway trains to provide service on the east side of Manhattan. This request was denied in 1911 and the City gave all of the bridge's subway tracks to the BRT. |
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| (756612) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by randyo on Fri Mar 13 21:37:24 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Fri Mar 13 09:39:12 2009. Thanks for the info. Maybe one of these days I'll get a chance to get up there again. |
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| (756614) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by randyo on Fri Mar 13 21:40:20 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by daDouce Man on Fri Mar 13 13:17:42 2009. I agree. When I was there in 1983 I was with another employee just in case there was a problem. |
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| (756712) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by Edwards! on Sat Mar 14 02:43:06 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by randyo on Fri Mar 13 21:40:20 2009. "Another Employee..."Dude...first you said you were a "new jack"... Now you saying you were there in '83..? I'm saving your post and making copies. You are SUSPECT LISTED,untill you clear up . |
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| (756714) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Mar 14 02:45:32 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by Edwards! on Sat Mar 14 02:43:06 2009. I'll vouch ... he was there in MY day. :) |
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| (756716) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sat Mar 14 02:49:00 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Fri Mar 13 10:26:27 2009. If you don't know where you're going, take another employee with you so if one of you gets hurt, the other can get help.As a probie, you can be quickly fired for doing something stupid. Even employees should not be going into closed off areas without a legitimate purpose or assignment. The TA, like any other employer, does not want to have to pay for injuries you suffer while on TA property. The TA is paying you to work, not go spelunking in every hidden corner of the subway system. |
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| (756722) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by daDouce Man on Sat Mar 14 03:36:07 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Mar 14 02:45:32 2009. No wonder why he didn't know when he probation is up. |
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| (756724) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Mar 14 03:46:03 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by daDouce Man on Sat Mar 14 03:36:07 2009. Heh. Never finished mine either. :) |
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| (757617) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Mar 15 21:06:46 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by Edwards! on Sat Mar 14 02:43:06 2009. I don't know where or how you ever got the impression that I was a newbie. I started in 1966 as a C/R and went to towerman while the BMT was still the BMT Division and when we had 4 Av and Brighton locals Sea Beach expresses etc and before the MTA was even created. I then went to M/M and worked vacation relief where I spent most of the summer of 1960 operating Qs on the Myrtle Av El, BMT steels and R-9s. I then got promoted to train dispatcher, spent 4 years in the command center, and became a schedule maker in 1976 and a trainmaster in 1983. It was during that time when I and the late trainmaster George Abere and I explored Utica upper as well as the are S/O Euclid in an attempt to find some evidence of 76 St. In 1985 I was promoted to a managerial position in the schedule office where I retired from in 1997. If you had seen any of my other posts you would knew my extensive transit history. Any more questions? |
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| (757649) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by MattW@15st_prospect_park on Sun Mar 15 21:31:51 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by randyo on Sun Mar 15 21:06:46 2009. Wow, sounds like you had a nice and long career with a bit of everything. What was you favorite position during your time down there. Also, when you were south of Euclid, was the cinder block wall in place by then or was it a wooden wall? |
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| (757676) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Mar 15 22:06:16 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by MattW@15st_prospect_park on Sun Mar 15 21:31:51 2009. At the risk of telling tales out of school, I was at the wall S/O Euclid in 1962 before I was a TA employee with the same George Abere who was working the PM at Euclid at the time and from what I can remember, the solid wall was there and it was concrete not cinderblock. The end sof the Yd leads A7 and A8 were a different story entirely. In 1962 the tracks (Yes the rails were stil in then although the switches connecting them to A5 and A6 had been removed) ended in mounds of earth at the ends of the tunnels. By 1983, cinder block walls had been erected and the rails were removed. |
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| (757695) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by Tony Clifton on Sun Mar 15 22:56:00 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by Edwards! on Sat Mar 14 02:43:06 2009. 
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| (757745) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by Edwards! on Mon Mar 16 02:07:44 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by randyo on Sun Mar 15 21:06:46 2009. Dude..my bad..I was responding to someone else...plus I was half sleep...Feel me? It wasn't a swipe at you.... |
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| (757943) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by randyo on Mon Mar 16 15:20:58 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by Edwards! on Mon Mar 16 02:07:44 2009. I thought that might be the case. |
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| (758305) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by bigrene22 on Tue Mar 17 08:53:35 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by randyo on Sun Mar 15 22:06:16 2009. Interesting. |
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Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by bigrene22 on Tue Mar 17 09:08:21 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by randyo on Fri Mar 13 21:37:24 2009. No Problem :) |
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Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by bigrene22 on Wed Mar 18 09:50:32 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Thu Mar 12 12:10:36 2009. Have the bellmouths between 63rd Drive/Rego Park been photographed (or filmed), and do they have tunnels and/or portals leading to Whitepot? |
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Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by daDouce Man on Wed Mar 18 12:06:00 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Wed Mar 18 09:50:32 2009. The bellmouth on the Jamaica Bound track is rather short and the only unuaual thing is an emergency exit easily seen. On the Manhattan bound side there is a ramp that goes up and across the roadbed toward Whitepot Underjump. |
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| (758743) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by bigrene22 on Wed Mar 18 12:08:36 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by daDouce Man on Wed Mar 18 12:06:00 2009. Oh, ok. It is ususual seeing a emergency exit on that small turnoff... |
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| (758745) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by daDouce Man on Wed Mar 18 12:10:58 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Wed Mar 18 12:08:36 2009. Maybe when they built that bellmouth they figured it was a good place to build an emergency exit. |
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| (758749) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by bigrene22 on Wed Mar 18 12:23:35 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by daDouce Man on Wed Mar 18 12:10:58 2009. Hmmm, that's weird. |
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| (758792) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by randyo on Wed Mar 18 15:16:41 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by bigrene22 on Wed Mar 18 12:23:35 2009. Not necessarily. The emergency exit from the Manhattan side of the Montague St Tube is actually located in the Nassau Cut which means before the Nassau St Line was built, the emergency exit was actually in the bellmouth for the proposed line. |
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| (758888) | |
Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by Edwards! on Wed Mar 18 21:05:11 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by randyo on Mon Mar 16 15:20:58 2009. Yeah ..it was..everybody knows about YOU,young man.Hey, When I make a mistake..I man up to it.. |
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Re: Tunnel stubs |
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Posted by gbs on Thu Mar 19 00:43:02 2009, in response to Re: Tunnel stubs, posted by randyo on Wed Mar 18 15:16:41 2009. I thought the tracks merge under water. Does the emergency exit go straight up, or at an angle towards the shore?Also, even though the Nassau line came later, the Montague tubes had to have been built in anticipation. The Manhattan-bound R elevates to allow the Brooklyn-bound M underneath; that had to be part of the original construction. |
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