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| Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains (1497040) | |
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| (1497812) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Sat Dec 29 11:39:21 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Dec 29 11:14:45 2018. NO WAY. LIRR does it far better than AMTK could do it.ROAR |
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| (1497814) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Sat Dec 29 11:42:13 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Dec 29 11:13:02 2018. It is fairly simple. Before Park Avenue was there, the trains ran in an open cut.You can open the cut again, and then raise Park Avenue by 3-5 feets. ROAR |
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| (1497815) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by pragmatist on Sat Dec 29 11:42:57 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Broadway Lion on Sat Dec 29 11:28:19 2018. While I don't believe the idea has any chance of happening, since the notion related to international travel, Albany is pretty much out, Canada notwithstanding. Nobody (airline) of consequence flies from ALB to JFK, to connect to an overseas flight, you get one United Express to EWR, and a few to BOS, which also has a few flights on Cape. |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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| (1497816) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Dec 29 11:45:06 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sat Dec 29 11:14:12 2018. A market does not mean Amtrak could get any of it. One or two trains a day might mean a bus load of people at best, which hardly compares with 625,000 people who pass through there every day.There is not other way to get to Saratoga except for Greyhound / Trailways or Amtrak. The E train runs every 5 - 10 minutes. That is how they will go, not sweat out Amtrak and spend a few hours at the airport for their plane to Europe, for which they could have just as readily gone to Newark. |
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| (1497817) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Dec 29 11:46:04 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Dec 29 11:17:56 2018. Amtrak has no checked baggage at all except for trains 66/67 in the middle of the night. |
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| (1497818) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Dec 29 11:47:10 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Dec 29 11:14:45 2018. Amtrak would quickly run it into the ground as they did with Hyannis and Atlantic City service. |
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| (1497819) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Dec 29 11:47:27 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Broadway Lion on Sat Dec 29 11:28:19 2018. Right. |
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| (1497820) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Dec 29 11:48:00 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Dec 29 11:13:02 2018. It won't happen. |
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| (1497824) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Dec 29 12:20:21 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Broadway Lion on Sat Dec 29 11:39:21 2018. According to what metric? |
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| (1497825) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Dec 29 12:21:29 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Joe V on Sat Dec 29 11:47:10 2018. Red herring argument. Amtrak can run any service "into the ground" depending on what kind of support they do or don't get. |
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| (1497827) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Dec 29 12:56:01 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Dec 29 12:20:21 2018. LIRR runs longer train at cheaper fares. On Fridays, Amtrak would simply price everyone out of the market to perhaps run one or two trains. As I said, they would run it into the ground like they do everything else that is seasonal. |
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| (1497828) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Dec 29 12:57:22 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Dec 29 12:21:29 2018. Nobody will give Amtrak "support" when they don't have the equipment, and NYS has their own RR running to the East End as it is. |
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| (1497830) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Dec 29 13:16:38 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Broadway Lion on Sat Dec 29 11:42:13 2018. Before Park Avenue was there, the trains ran in an open cutNot for the entire length IIRC. And Park Avenue was there concurrently besides, although it was originally called 4th Avenue. And the old cut in the 125th Street area was covered over too. That could have been connected to new tunnels, to make an eight-track main even extending into the Bronx via new tunnels. But who has the vision to do things like that anymore, eh? |
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| (1497832) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Dec 29 13:25:51 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Broadway Lion on Sat Dec 29 11:42:13 2018. And do what with the sidewalks and building entrances ? |
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| (1497846) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by VictorM on Sat Dec 29 20:00:39 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Joe V on Sat Dec 29 06:41:05 2018. The 63rd St tunnel is very deep. I'm surprised it's so shallow it barely clears the Park Av tunnels. It could see it being the case at 60th St where that tunnel is much closer to the surface. Also the 53rd St tunnel has to clear the GCT lower level ramp track. |
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| (1497848) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Dec 29 21:06:01 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by VictorM on Sat Dec 29 20:00:39 2018. Yes. Given how deep it is at Lexington that sounds like BS. |
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| (1497849) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by AlM on Sat Dec 29 21:42:34 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by VictorM on Sat Dec 29 20:00:39 2018. Your surprise is justified, because it can't be so.Long ago I saw a schematic. The LIRR 63rd Street tracks curve southward well east of Park Ave in a gentle curve underneath the foundations of a whole bunch of buildings that brings them under Park Ave. a few blocks south of 63rd. They are well under the MNRR tracks - they are also UNDER the 53rd street tracks, which are already pretty deep, as well as under the 63rd street subway tracks, which are even deeper. Then at GCT they are far deeper than the MNRR Lower Level. There is no reason to believe that between 60th street and 45th the LIRR tracks have risen closer to the surface. |
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| (1497850) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by AlM on Sat Dec 29 21:43:24 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Dec 29 21:06:01 2018. It has to be. See my other post. |
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| (1497852) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Dec 29 22:42:01 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by AlM on Sat Dec 29 21:42:34 2018. Wires for GCT then? |
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| (1497853) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by R30A on Sat Dec 29 23:18:56 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Dec 28 10:19:38 2018. There is also no reason that this door is different than any other. Doors are not obvious when the room is filled with smoke. |
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| (1497854) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by R30A on Sat Dec 29 23:20:35 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Joe V on Sat Dec 29 10:44:36 2018. 63rd is not only much deeper, but also has a high ceiling. You could put multiple levels of tracks between metro North and the 63rd tunnel. |
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| (1497859) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Sun Dec 30 06:00:15 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by R30A on Sat Dec 29 23:18:56 2018. There is also no reason that this door is different than any other. Doors are not obvious when the room is filled with smoke.Bingo! |
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| (1497860) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Dec 30 06:02:26 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by TransitChuckG on Sun Dec 30 06:00:15 2018. If the cab (not room) is really filled with smoke, there's no way you're going to see an "Exit" sign. |
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| (1497861) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Dec 30 06:14:13 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Joe V on Sat Dec 29 11:48:00 2018. Oh, I know that. |
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| (1497863) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sun Dec 30 08:28:54 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by R30A on Sat Dec 29 23:20:35 2018. Not true. |
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| (1497864) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Dec 30 08:55:24 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Dec 30 06:02:26 2018. Exit signs are designed to remain visible even in extremely poor conditions. |
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| (1497866) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Dec 30 09:12:41 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Joe V on Sun Dec 30 08:28:54 2018. When floor of park avenue tunnel was lowered in early 1990's the roof of 63 tunnel was visible, there is less than 6 inches of ballast between ties of MN tracks and 63 street tunnel top. |
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| (1497868) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Dec 30 09:14:24 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Dec 30 08:55:24 2018. smoke rises, so exit sign stays visible longer when applied near floor. same reason walkway lights on planes and trains are within a foot of walk area. |
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| (1497870) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sun Dec 30 09:29:13 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Dec 30 06:02:26 2018. Smoke is hot, so tends to rise. That's why the exit sign is low and why reflectorized stripes in passenger train cars are low and on the floor as well. |
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| (1497871) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sun Dec 30 09:30:26 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Dec 29 22:42:01 2018. There are still vertical separation regulations.That is why ARC's stub tracks for Macy's Bunker could not cross 6th Avenue: a NYC Water Tunnel. |
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| (1497872) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sun Dec 30 09:31:49 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Dec 30 09:12:41 2018. Thank you. I thought so. |
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Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sun Dec 30 09:32:45 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Dec 30 09:12:41 2018. Do you know how thick the 63rd street tunnel caissons are ? |
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| (1497874) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Dec 30 09:36:42 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Joe V on Sun Dec 30 09:32:45 2018. walls are only like 12 or 16 " thick from what I have seen in pictures , the pictures were of the floated in sections, not sure how thick the locally built sections are., pretty sure they must have made it sufficient size under were it crosses park avenue rail tunnel. |
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| (1497875) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sun Dec 30 09:37:46 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Broadway Lion on Sat Dec 29 11:42:13 2018. Do you actually think NY City DOT would permit that ? They don't answer to MTA. |
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| (1497877) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sun Dec 30 09:40:37 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Dec 30 09:36:42 2018. Also, the 63rd Street tunnel must start rising as it heads west to match cut and cover subways it runs onto. So it is not as deep as some people imagine. |
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Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by VictorM on Sun Dec 30 15:25:21 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Dec 30 09:12:41 2018. The only way that could be is if the escalator cavern west of Lexington Avenue extends under the Park Avenue tunnels. The 63 St tracks are too far down to be a clearance problem. In fact even the upper level 63 St tracks pass under the Lexington Av express tracks, which, in turn, are below the Lexington Av local tracks. |
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Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Sun Dec 30 15:46:23 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by VictorM on Sun Dec 30 15:25:21 2018. You didn't read Dutchrailnut's post.They are 6" apart. |
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| (1497896) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by 3-9 on Sun Dec 30 15:54:49 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Dec 30 09:14:24 2018. How useful would it be to put a reflective sticker around the base of the door handle? |
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| (1497898) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Dec 30 16:03:58 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by 3-9 on Sun Dec 30 15:54:49 2018. not effective enough to comply with law. |
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| (1497903) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by 3-9 on Sun Dec 30 16:13:11 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Dec 30 16:03:58 2018. I wasn't thinking of adding to the current burden of regulations, just wondering if it could prove useful. After all, it wouldn't hurt to highlight the door handle in an emergency. On the downside, the sticker is more likely to wear off. |
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| (1497927) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by VictorM on Sun Dec 30 20:46:08 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Joe V on Sun Dec 30 15:46:23 2018. Maybe what he thinks is the top of the subway tunnel is the top of the escalator cavern or a utility substation cavern or maybe it's a sewer. It's geometrically impossible for the 63 St tracks to be that close to the Metro North Park Avenue tracks. I'd like to see the documentation for this alleged close clearance. |
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| (1497928) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Dec 30 20:52:41 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by VictorM on Sun Dec 30 20:46:08 2018. there is no escalator or caverns at 63th street in park avenue tunnel it is the subway crossing right under MN track. |
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| (1497930) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by AlM on Sun Dec 30 20:57:01 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Dec 30 09:12:41 2018. This makes no sense.At 63rd and Park, there are only 4 MNRR tracks, all on one level. They aren't much below street level. Lower and upper levels of MNRR tracks already merge south of 59th. At 63rd and Lex, the upper of the two levels of subway tracks (Q and F headed southbound) is well over 100 steps down from street level. They can't have climbed that much by the time they get to 63rd and Park. |
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| (1497932) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by AlM on Sun Dec 30 21:00:34 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by VictorM on Sun Dec 30 15:25:21 2018. The only way that could be is if the escalator cavern west of Lexington Avenue extends under the Park Avenue tunnels.It doesn't. You enter at Lex and 63rd and go down maybe 120 steps. That's not enough to get you to Park Ave. |
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| (1497934) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by VictorM on Sun Dec 30 21:06:00 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Dec 30 20:52:41 2018. Then how do you explain the fact that at Lexington Av and 63 St the 63 St subway tracks are so far below ground? Park and Lexington Avenues are only 430 feet apart and the ground is fairly level. The 63 St tracks would have to go up like a rocket to get that close to the Park Av tracks, which are just below the surface. |
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| (1497935) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Dec 30 21:23:06 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by VictorM on Sun Dec 30 21:06:00 2018. the entire discussion is moot, the discussion was about lowering the MN tracks and they can't cause Something is there and to be honest I don't give a fiddlers fuck what it is. |
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| (1497942) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sun Dec 30 22:58:41 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by 3-9 on Sun Dec 30 16:13:11 2018. Not on the doorhandle itself, but I have seen examples of such things applied to the space around the door handle. For the life of me I can't remember where (I'm thinking either stairwell doors, hotel room doors, or possibly the end doors on some railroad cars?). |
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| (1497949) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by 3-9 on Mon Dec 31 00:47:12 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sun Dec 30 22:58:41 2018. I think I've seen it on the end doors of railroad cars, probably the latest models. |
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| (1497960) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Mon Dec 31 07:39:04 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by VictorM on Sun Dec 30 21:06:00 2018. They may have put an additional shell on top of the 63rd Street tube at Park Avenue to prevent any MoW equipment from inadvertently striking the tunnel casing itself.In any case, you ain't going beneath it. |
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| (1497962) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by AlM on Mon Dec 31 07:52:26 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Joe V on Mon Dec 31 07:39:04 2018. Obviously it's incredibly unlikely that the Park Ave MNRR tunnel will ever be dug deeper. This is all silly speculation, which is the main purpose of SubChat.But no one has given anything remotely resembling a plausible explanation of why the Park Ave tunnel floor couldn't be lowered. |
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