...the first segment of the DC Metrorail opened. The initial segment had 5 stations along 4.2 miles of track. Today, the system has nearly 120 miles of track serving 91 stations.
Posted by
Sand Box John
on Tue Mar 28 00:02:44 2017, in response to On this date in 1976..., posted by WMATAGMOAGH on Mon Mar 27 21:40:46 2017.
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...the first segment of the DC Metrorail opened. The initial segment had 5 stations along 4.2 miles of track. Today, the system has nearly 120 miles of track serving 91 stations.
I was there and have the pictures I took to prove it.
And at the time it was said the trains when nowhere mighty damm fast.
Posted by
Sand Box John
on Tue Mar 28 00:08:18 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by 3-9 on Mon Mar 27 22:48:56 2017.
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And despite the lack of maintenance, the underground stations with those vaulted ceilings still make me swoon.
You should have seen the within first couple of years after they opened. The station were clean, bright and devoid of all the advertising and redundant way finding clutter.
Posted by
Far Rockaway A Train
on Tue Mar 28 00:20:58 2017, in response to On this date in 1976..., posted by WMATAGMOAGH on Mon Mar 27 21:40:46 2017.
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The Metro has come a long way. I wasn't able to ride it until 1981 and considering the conditions we were dealing with in NYC, I was instantly hooked on Metro.
Posted by MainR3664 on Tue Mar 28 07:15:21 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by Sand Box John on Tue Mar 28 00:08:18 2017.
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Compared to what was going on in NYC, it must've seemed miraculous. For all the troubles Metro has these days, it's still pretty good. Non-railfans still like it better than NYCTA. The stations are a bit grim and uniform, but the routes are easy to understand, and there seem to be far fewer freaks riding with you.
Posted by
Sand Box John
on Tue Mar 28 08:09:00 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by 3-9 on Tue Mar 28 07:54:16 2017.
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Why have some of the pictures aged differently than others?
Quality of the way they were stored and quality of the slide scanner used to scan them, 7 of the 12 are mine. The cleaner 5 are from the WMATA photo archive and are so credited in the full sized picture album.
And many people still see it that way!! I know many people, even those who ride occasionally, who truly believe if asked, that NYCTA is full of graffiti.
while of course it's light years ahead of where it was in '76, the routes- even the official mapped ones, are confusing- the A has 3 Queens terminals and the 5 has 2 terminals in the Bronx. Then you have the secret Es to 179th, Ns to 96th, and 2s to New Lots. With today's electronic signage (both on NTTs and R46s) these should be separate routes.
Then there's weekend GOs, like the F that runs via Broadway and the West End...
Posted by
3-9
on Wed Mar 29 19:05:57 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by MainR3664 on Tue Mar 28 14:21:21 2017.
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I know many people, even those who ride occasionally, who truly believe if asked, that NYCTA is full of graffiti.
Considering that the war on graffiti/scratchiti/etc., is never really over, I can't completely blame them. Some cars get scratched or stained (by solvents) rather badly.
With today's electronic signage (both on NTTs and R46s) these should be separate routes.
I don't know about know about that. I think the rationale is that the routing has to be in operation for a significant period of time to be considered a "line", otherwise people may try for a line that only exists as an operational convenience. The A to Rockaway Park is probably the biggest exception to this.
Posted by
Sand Box John
on Wed Mar 29 20:12:14 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by Fulton Frank on Wed Mar 29 08:41:48 2017.
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Yes, a nice system that I have ridden often, but no express!
Express is unnecessary when you design a system that doesn't have stations so close to one another they can't get up to speed before having to slow to stop at the next station.
Express exists on NYCT primarily to increase capacity in the corridors that have them.
The boarding stats for the 3 stations on the Second Avenue Subway dwarf the boarding stats for most heavily used stations on WMATA.
Oh, and WMATA is a long way from operating its railroad to its designed capacity.
Posted by
AlM
on Wed Mar 29 20:21:22 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by Sand Box John on Wed Mar 29 20:12:14 2017.
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Express exists on NYCT primarily to increase capacity in the corridors that have them.
That's an often-repeated theme here, but I disagree. In rush hours, locals are pretty slow because they have quite a high dwell time, and an express really saves a LOT of time.
Posted by
3-9
on Wed Mar 29 20:43:10 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by Sand Box John on Wed Mar 29 20:12:14 2017.
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The boarding stats for the 3 stations on the Second Avenue Subway dwarf the boarding stats for most heavily used stations on WMATA.
Seriously??? I thought that, despite the less than ideal accessibility, the heaviest used WMATA stations would approach quite a few Manhattan stations, though not the very worst ones.
Posted by
3-9
on Wed Mar 29 20:45:55 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by Fulton Frank on Wed Mar 29 08:41:48 2017.
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We can only thank the early NYC subway planners for having the foresight to provide express tracks, even though some of them ended being chronically underutilized.
Posted by MainR3664 on Thu Mar 30 07:21:44 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by italianstallion on Tue Mar 28 15:20:53 2017.
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I know. And I'm sure really cued in, regular riders of those routes look for those runs- if I worked in Chelsea and lived near Hillside Ave., I would definitely try to get one of those Es..
But they still have serious potential to take people by surprise- especially those As with Europeans looking for JFK airport. That route, at least, should be the K (for JFK).
I think the A train situation on Queens is crazy. I mean, here we are, trying to encourage tourists to use it- and we have to tell them to look for only certain A trains, and to watch the side signs, which change every few seconds? And some of these folks barely speak English.
I've seen the puzzled Spaniards and French folks at West 4th...
I mean, c'mon. Label the train to Far Rockaway as the K- or even the old JFK Express symbol. Nobody would have trouble understanding that.
At least in Wmataland, a Blue is a Blue and an Orange is an Orange.
Posted by MainR3664 on Thu Mar 30 07:29:11 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by Sand Box John on Tue Mar 28 19:59:54 2017.
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Thank you very much for sharing your excellent photos and historical perspectives, and keeping us updated on the progress of WMATA. That system, despite its current problems, shows that a major system can get built and can expand, even in the modern era.
Yes, this is true. And a lot of personal taste comes into play here. Me, I'll walk a few extra blocks or wait for a couple locals to come by in order to get an express. Locals in rush hour are extraordinarily slow, as AlM says. Sure, if you just want to huddle, get into a zone and read or listen to your mobile device, a local doesn't matter. But I do those things at home. For me it's "minimize the time in the train". And also.... get an (even flawed) RFW and look ahead. I love seeing the speed-O topping at 45 on the 2 or 3 or the B in the 34 -W4 dash!
Posted by
Sand Box John
on Thu Mar 30 08:34:48 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by 3-9 on Wed Mar 29 20:43:10 2017.
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Seriously??? I thought that, despite the less than ideal accessibility, the heaviest used WMATA stations would approach quite a few Manhattan stations, though not the very worst ones.
Seems I was off by about 10,000 for the average of the 3. 3 station that have been open less then a year compared to 8 that have been open for at least 40 years.
Boardings at the top 20 stations, compiled from a PDF file posted at planitmetro.com.
Posted by
Sand Box John
on Thu Mar 30 09:51:39 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by AlM on Wed Mar 29 20:21:22 2017.
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That's an often-repeated theme here, but I disagree. In rush hours, locals are pretty slow because they have quite a high dwell time, and an express really saves a LOT of time.
Dwell times are one of the things that are lengthening trip times on WMATA today. I have boarded trains when crowds on the platforms were reasonably high and the train stood at the platform 10 to 15 seconds after everybody boarded before closing doors and proceeding to the next station.
Posted by
Olog-hai
on Thu Mar 30 10:32:28 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by Sand Box John on Thu Mar 30 09:42:49 2017.
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Always wondered why more European Fords weren't allowed into the USA. They let the Capri in (changed from Ford make to Mercury), but not the original Escort or other cars like the Cortina.
Posted by
Edwards!
on Thu Mar 30 14:03:24 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by Fulton Frank on Thu Mar 30 08:21:48 2017.
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Fastest local service in NYC is the Number 1 Broadway 7th Avenue route.
Due to the way the westside subway is built, you might as well stay on the local since the express is only a few minutes faster.
Posted by
Edwards!
on Thu Mar 30 15:16:46 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by Fulton Frank on Thu Mar 30 14:19:18 2017.
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Nothing wrong with the express.
It use to work awesomely back in the day,before the MTA cut the balls off the trains.
Now,its a leisurely trip down the extra capacity track,nuthin more.
I have to give it to SEPTA,though ..The Broad st express put the A train to shame.
Posted by randyo on Thu Mar 30 22:10:59 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by MainR3664 on Thu Mar 30 07:21:44 2017.
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ALL trains on the A line operate between 207 St and Rockaway Blvd before diverging therefore there is no reason for a different letter for the smaller portions of the line that differ!!!
I would never question you on train dispatching, scheduling, operations, or anything that took place on the subway from 1958 onwards :)
But from a rider's (someone who is neither a TA employee nor a railfan..) when two branches of a line go by a major international airport, and third does not, that's a pretty big deal. I've seen the confused Europeans on the IND. The R46s have electronic side signage, so this shouldn't be a big deal. Within a decade, every train will likely be an NTT...
I like the brown 1973 Cadillac in Pic 10 (year easily distinguishable by the grille) right against the El. Also the Fishbowl bus that's behind it.
Also look at the dented door on the blue or gray Granada in the first pic. That was a new car- they first appeared in the '75 model year.
Tell ya the truth, I look at those 1970s cars, they look current to me. When my friends and I started driving in the 1980s, most of us got those types of cars...
I was on a D on the 4th Ave Line just this Wednesday. It picked up some speed that vaguely reminded me of what an express run used to be like... didn't quite get there, but it was quick enough to at least remind me.
Posted by randyo on Fri Mar 31 16:23:08 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by MainR3664 on Fri Mar 31 07:29:50 2017.
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Even when they are all NTTs, there is no reason to have a separate letter for a line that is consistent for most of its length. In fact that would only cause more confusion for passengers who ride on the principal portion of the line and were always used to boarding an A train to get to/from their destinations. You are further complicating things for the out of town passengers fro whom the branches are of no consequence by for example, telling them that the A and the K go where they want instead of merely saying, to cite Duke Ellington, “Take the A Train."
Posted by
Michael549
on Fri Mar 31 16:54:03 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by MainR3664 on Fri Mar 31 07:29:50 2017.
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In fairness while the Far Rockaway A-trains run at all hours and are very helpful to JFK Airport bound riders. The Rockaway Park A-trains direct to/from Manhattan only consists of a handful of trains during the rush hours - with the Rockaway Park S Shuttle providing the bulk of that segnement's service at all other times.
In plain English, there is 1 (One) branch of the A-train that operates at all times at all hours consistently to and from the JFK Airport and beyond to Far Rockaway. The Lefferts branch of the A-train currently operates to 6am to midnight hours, and the Rockaway Park branch exists as a handful of trains in the rush hours, and all other hours shuttle.
Of course on the signage/decals of the Far Rockaway A-trains line an airplane symbol could be added to aid riders. As well as for the few Rockaway Park A-trains.
The suggestions to "re-name" train segments has been argued here in the past - most of the time - it is seen as not worth the effort. For example - why would the few E-trains that originate out of 179th Street to/from WTC be called anything other than the "E-train"?
Why increase confusion among local New Yorkers who know how to travel about the subways for the benefit of tourists who individually will not be in town for long?
Posted by
VictorM
on Fri Mar 31 18:58:57 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by Michael549 on Fri Mar 31 16:54:03 2017.
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I think it would be a great idea if an airplane symbol could be added to the Far Rockaway (and Rockaway Park) electronic destination signs on the R46 cars, if that's technically possible.
Posted by
3-9
on Fri Mar 31 19:56:57 2017, in response to Re: On this date in 1976..., posted by randyo on Fri Mar 31 16:25:02 2017.
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I've always wondered about Philadelphia. Is it really worth it for the Broad St subway to have an express? Or did they have to justify those tracks somehow?
