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| Major Amtrak derailment in Philly (1351660) | |
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| (1351661) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by r33/r36 mainline on Tue May 12 21:37:47 2015, in response to Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 21:35:00 2015. WTF, Amtrak trains go pretty slow in Philly, how did it derail that bad to the point the car fell sideways? |
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| (1351662) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 21:38:58 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by r33/r36 mainline on Tue May 12 21:37:47 2015. I think the phone is sideways. |
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| (1351663) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 21:40:34 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 21:38:58 2015. Or maybe not: There's a former congressman from PA on the train tweeting photos from inside. |
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| (1351664) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by WillD on Tue May 12 21:45:23 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by r33/r36 mainline on Tue May 12 21:37:47 2015. It looks like it happened at the broad turn just to the north of SHORE.NBC10. |
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| (1351666) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by r33/r36 mainline on Tue May 12 21:49:34 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 21:38:58 2015. After I made my post I remembered seeing a photo of MN WOH train tilted sideways after derailing in the yard...http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=479565&nseq=14 So I guess its possible to happen if this Amtrak derailed between 30th and Zoo. |
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Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by r33/r36 mainline on Tue May 12 21:55:28 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by WillD on Tue May 12 21:45:23 2015. Ah ok, it makes sense that type of derailment could happen there. |
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| (1351668) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 21:58:30 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by r33/r36 mainline on Tue May 12 21:55:28 2015. Wow, this is a big deal. MAJOR derailment (Spuyten Duyvil level)http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/Amtrak-Derailment-Philadelphia--303536331.html |
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| (1351670) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by R30A on Tue May 12 22:18:33 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 21:58:30 2015. Don't mean to be a pessimist, but more Eschede then Spuyten Duyvil I think. This is really bad. |
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| (1351671) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Jersey Mike on Tue May 12 22:21:26 2015, in response to Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 21:35:00 2015. Anyone know the engine involved? I heard it was 601. |
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| (1351673) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 22:21:35 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by R30A on Tue May 12 22:18:33 2015. They say it's #188, a Regional. |
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| (1351675) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by G1Ravage on Tue May 12 22:44:12 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by r33/r36 mainline on Tue May 12 21:37:47 2015. Wow, those cars are all over the place. |
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| (1351678) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Tue May 12 22:47:21 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by r33/r36 mainline on Tue May 12 21:49:34 2015. Seems to be further north - at or near the point where the AC line branches off.-w- |
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| (1351679) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Fulton Frank on Tue May 12 23:17:53 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Tue May 12 22:47:21 2015. It's called Frankford junction. Beautiful curve. If you sit in the last car of even a 5 car train you can see the whole train if you're looking forward.Can see from the helo photos that the motor is an ACS. |
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| (1351680) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by gOld_12th on Tue May 12 23:24:20 2015, in response to Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 21:35:00 2015. terrible news, heard there are fatalities. |
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| (1351681) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Tue May 12 23:27:53 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Fulton Frank on Tue May 12 23:17:53 2015. Confirmed. Engine is an ACS. |
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| (1351682) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Tue May 12 23:28:54 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Fulton Frank on Tue May 12 23:17:53 2015. The same one where the Congressional Limited crashed in 1943?-w- |
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| (1351683) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Tue May 12 23:36:10 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 22:21:35 2015. Confirmed. |
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| (1351684) | |
At least 5 dead, Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by gOld_12th on Tue May 12 23:37:01 2015, in response to Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 21:35:00 2015. :( |
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Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Rockparkman on Tue May 12 23:37:28 2015, in response to Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 21:35:00 2015. 5 fatalities. |
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Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by transitgallery on Tue May 12 23:52:47 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Rockparkman on Tue May 12 23:37:28 2015. its very sad. If you have heart, I made a memorial page and 100% will go to these people who are in need. The link is at http://igg.me/at/02JLG8PUOXYGod bless and Godspeed these people. Pray for the best. :( |
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| (1351691) | |
(photos) Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by gOld_12th on Wed May 13 00:01:03 2015, in response to Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 21:35:00 2015. philly.com: http://www.philly.com/philly/gallery/Amtrak_crash_in_Philadelphia.html |
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Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by R2Chinatown on Wed May 13 00:05:49 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by r33/r36 mainline on Tue May 12 21:37:47 2015. Confirmed 5 dead at this point |
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| (1351693) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Wed May 13 00:10:36 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Jersey Mike on Tue May 12 22:21:26 2015. NBC Philadelphia just had a nice shot of the locomotive. I'm pretty sure it's 601. |
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| (1351694) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 00:18:38 2015, in response to Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 21:35:00 2015. The exact location:https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0010088,-75.0942463,17z/data=!3m1!1e3 |
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| (1351695) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 00:25:28 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 00:18:38 2015. I feel horrible for what happened there with such a horrific wreck. It's not the time now to speculate, but the map view makes it rather obvious as to what happened here. :( |
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| (1351696) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Jersey Mike on Wed May 13 00:30:07 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by R36 #9346 on Wed May 13 00:10:36 2015. Just caught 601 in DC on Monday 5/11. |
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| (1351697) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Wed May 13 00:44:33 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Jersey Mike on Wed May 13 00:30:07 2015. That may be a major focus of this crash, to see if the engine was a problem. |
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| (1351698) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Jersey Mike on Wed May 13 01:08:29 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by AMoreira81 on Wed May 13 00:44:33 2015. I'm really hoping it's a problem with the engines. If it is then the HHP-8's will probably get to come back :-) |
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| (1351699) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by AlM on Wed May 13 01:09:39 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 00:25:28 2015. The radius of that curve looks like it's about 1,000 feet. So obviously one possibility is excessive speed. But there's no intrinsic reason it couldn't be a track defect (other than that there aren't supposed to be track defects), is there? Trains put much more sideways force onto the track on a curve than on a straight stretch unless the curve is perfectly banked for the speed. |
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| (1351700) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 01:10:37 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Jersey Mike on Wed May 13 01:08:29 2015. Doubtful. According to some really early information since Amtrak has already downloaded the event recorder, it's really looking like Spuyten Duyvil redux based on their early comments to the media. :(Too early to tell until the information is released though. |
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| (1351701) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 01:20:59 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by AlM on Wed May 13 01:09:39 2015. Hard to say, and that's why we won't have any clues until after the sun rises and NTSB gets to check that out. I'll only offer that given the distance from the locomotive to its trailing cars where it landed, and the way the cars went over on their sides, it remarkably coincides with what we saw in the Spuyten Duyvil wreck.I'm going on a basis of checking the street view of the tracks where the curve was, where everything landed and unless the rails were undermined and "fell over" then where things landed genuinely strike me as excessive speed until we know different. I've been watching Channel 10 down there since I got off work and the most interesting part of what they were reporting, and what Mayor Nutter said along with an NTSB "reporter" from NBC in Washington is that an Amtrak official told them that (and I quote) "We (Amtrak) can download the data remotely" and then continued with the Washington DC reporter, "we are looking into possibly excessive speed at the location of the incident." Perhaps the Amtrak person misspoke to the reporter, but they DID get a quote out of that. We STILL need to wait though until NTSB can look over the site tomorrow. On the Spuyten Duyvil wreck, what happened was very obvious once daylight broke and physics was obvious on the ground. The physics of where everything landed sadly looks remarkably similar. :( |
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| (1351702) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Jersey Mike on Wed May 13 01:28:06 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 01:10:37 2015. ::shrug:: That would take some doing as someone calculated that curve's overturn speed to be close to 100mph. Speed through North Philly is 70 so even if the engineer did nothing the train would not derail. |
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| (1351703) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Jersey Mike on Wed May 13 01:33:07 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 01:20:59 2015. Like I said this is a faster curve then Spuyten Duyvil that is "deadman safe" in the eastbound direction. Engineer would have had to have increased speed before the curve, not just dozed off. |
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| (1351704) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 01:39:04 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Jersey Mike on Wed May 13 01:28:06 2015. If you check out the way the cars landed, as well as the distance the locomotive travelled before the nose was snagged by the rails on the other side there, it pretty much matches the layout of the wreck at Spuyten Duyvil. I have no way of knowing what track it was on, but assuming that it was the outside track, even there, the roadbed would have had to collapse for a good distance for it all to land the way it did.In most normal derailments, one would have expected the tightlocks to have held and stayed largely in a straight line following the curve. Most of the cars went over in the same direction and rolled, that would definitely appear to be well past "tipping speed." But AGAIN, we need to wait until the facts are in, all I'm offering is that this is what it looks like to me right now. |
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| (1351705) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 01:47:23 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Jersey Mike on Wed May 13 01:33:07 2015. Event recorder was downloaded, NTSB is there, we'll probably hear something official soon. Until then, let's pray for the injured and the deceased. |
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| (1351706) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Wed May 13 01:57:15 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 01:39:04 2015. https://twitter.com/AirlineFlyer/status/598302314613510144/photo/1Umm...this is especially terrifying. It can't be right, can it? |
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Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 02:07:49 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by NIMBYkiller on Wed May 13 01:57:15 2015. If the speed at the location was 106, that doesn't strike me as out of normal given that MAS in the area is somewhere around 125 or so, what we don't know for sure is what the restrictions are for that curve.We'll need to wait for what the proper speed is for that area once NTSB looks into it. |
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| (1351713) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Wed May 13 04:46:18 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by R36 #9346 on Tue May 12 23:36:10 2015. Been watching the footage. This was BAD.Still five dead, injured up to 140. |
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| (1351714) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by nostalgia on Wed May 13 05:35:38 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 21:58:30 2015. There were fatalities.http://www.amtrak.com/servlet/ContentServer?c=AM_Alert_C&pagename=am/AM_Alert_C/Alerts_Popup&cid=1251628184602 |
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Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Wed May 13 06:27:39 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 01:47:23 2015. Looking at the footage since the sun came up and this could very well be what has been suggested.Excessive speed could very well be the case, but as noted we should wait for any official confirmation of such. If so, then could it be something wrong with the engine or worse. |
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Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by WillD on Wed May 13 06:35:34 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 02:07:49 2015. Per our onetime member's track map the speed through Frankford Junction is 75mph IIRC. |
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Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by WillD on Wed May 13 06:38:41 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Tue May 12 23:28:54 2015. It is. The local ABC affiliate actually mentioned that wreck in their coverage. |
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| (1351720) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Wed May 13 07:02:08 2015, in response to Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Tue May 12 21:35:00 2015. At this point, it's way too early to know the cause. And I have NO railroad expertise. But I will say that I was in Philadelphia in late January/early February. And on the way home, I thought the ride coming just out of 30th Street was very rough and bumpy. |
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| (1351721) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by ntrainride on Wed May 13 07:14:44 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Jersey Mike on Wed May 13 01:08:29 2015. seriously inappropriate comment. |
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| (1351722) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Jersey Mike on Wed May 13 07:19:28 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 01:39:04 2015. Could be a combination of factors such as some overspeed and an issue with the engine's stability. |
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| (1351723) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Fred G on Wed May 13 07:20:49 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by WillD on Wed May 13 06:35:34 2015. TEAR DOWN FRANKFORD JUNCTION!your pal, Fred |
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6 dead, Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by gOld_12th on Wed May 13 07:41:28 2015, in response to At least 5 dead, Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by gOld_12th on Tue May 12 23:37:01 2015. death toll increase. |
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| (1351728) | |
Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Joe V on Wed May 13 07:50:47 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed May 13 01:39:04 2015. Someone on trainorders.com who is a C.E. and usually pretty reliable says:- Train may well have been doing 106MPH in a 60 zone, engineer mistook this nastier curve for another one - Speed limit is enforced by cab signal indication westbound, but not eastbound. If that is the case, this is Back Bay, nearly Elizabeth (about 20 years ago), and Spuyten Duyvil all over again. One Amfleet car was pealed open like a cleaned fish and no longer recognizable. I can't imagine many people or anybody was in that car if there are only 6 dead. |
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Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Wed May 13 07:52:32 2015, in response to Re: Major Amtrak derailment in Philly, posted by Jersey Mike on Wed May 13 01:33:07 2015. Maybe he thought he was past the curve already, and increased his speed.But it is said that he did apply brakes, and one report had the pax confirming that brakes were applied, Ergo, LION suspects that a MONSTER came and dissed with the tracks. ROAR |
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