|
|
| IND Ser ice Changes Afoot (1641667) | |
 |
|
| Home > SubChat | |
[ Post a New Response | Return to the Index ]
|
|
| (1641671) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Jailhousedoc on Thu Jun 5 16:52:39 2025, in response to IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by TRAIN DUDE on Thu Jun 5 16:00:39 2025. I wonder if this change is being done due to the wheel problem sustained by the R-160 car class - I don't have proof but after reading the posts on this board this is what comes to my mind. Granted there may be other reasons, but this does appear to be what is going on, plus the fact that movement of trains might go faster once this is accomplished. But then, when the M trains shut down for nights and weekends are they replaced by F line trains ? |
|
|
| (1641673) | |
Re: IND Service Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Wallyhorse on Thu Jun 5 18:03:58 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by Jailhousedoc on Thu Jun 5 16:52:39 2025. The story I heard was this is in response to complaints on Roosevelt Island of (F) trains being so full some people had to wait 3-4 trains before they could get on. The belief is the (M) on this route will be far less crowded.If this does happen, it's expected to be on weekdays from 6:00 AM-9:30 PM. I would myself be looking to make the (M) a 24/7 line to avoid confusion and also allowing QB local riders to have two lines on weekends as well as at least one full-time local. You could even do it on weekends where (M) trains are 4-5 cars so OPTO remains in service on the (M). |
|
|
(Sponsored) |
iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
|
| (1641674) | |
Re: IND Service Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Jailhousedoc on Thu Jun 5 18:16:56 2025, in response to Re: IND Service Changes Afoot, posted by Wallyhorse on Thu Jun 5 18:03:58 2025. That sounds like a possibility - While we are at it, bring back the G trains going all the way to 71st / Continental - or even to 179th. Queens can use some more lines, especially east and southeast. They can find the money for that. |
|
|
| (1641675) | |
Re: IND Service Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Jun 5 18:21:58 2025, in response to IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by TRAIN DUDE on Thu Jun 5 16:00:39 2025. What's the goal for those changes? |
|
|
| (1641678) | |
Re: IND Service Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Thu Jun 5 19:38:18 2025, in response to Re: IND Service Changes Afoot, posted by Jailhousedoc on Thu Jun 5 18:16:56 2025. I like the idea of having the G local going to 179 from 6 to 6 M-F. Have the F as an express to 179 with E going to Jamaica Center. As of now, 179 is vastly underused. |
|
|
| (1641679) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Thu Jun 5 19:43:04 2025, in response to IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by TRAIN DUDE on Thu Jun 5 16:00:39 2025. OK, but then the M will really need to be 24/7. With the extension of the Q up 2nd Ave, there are now lots of people who travel between 2nd Ave and Queens with a change at Lex/63rd. Some kind of Queensbridge shuttle on the weekends wouldn't go over well any more. |
|
|
| (1641682) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by zac on Thu Jun 5 21:36:50 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by AlM on Thu Jun 5 19:43:04 2025. The F will cover when the M doesn't run to QBL. |
|
|
| (1641685) | |
Re: IND Service Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Jailhousedoc on Thu Jun 5 22:40:37 2025, in response to Re: IND Service Changes Afoot, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Thu Jun 5 19:38:18 2025. 179 is underused ? Ray Charles and Stevie Wonder can see that - but if the IND Second system was built with the line on Hillside Ave. getting extended out to Langdale Street ( which is a few blocks east of Little Neck Parkway ), the line and station would be getting properly used. To those who believe that more subways would bring in a ' bad element ' - 1. criminals would prefer to steal a getaway car to use for escaping capture as that would give them flexibility in that they could turn onto other streets and even go in different directions to aoid capture - that cannot be done on the subway -2. during the wintertime a heavy snow storm would prevent motor vehicle use on the streets and highways but the underground subways can be used- so long as adequate preparation and planning for bad weather was done on a timely basis. Eastern Queens would benefit - if only the IMBY crowd would open up their eyes. |
|
|
| (1641686) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Wallyhorse on Thu Jun 5 23:22:44 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by zac on Thu Jun 5 21:36:50 2025. Right, but that will confuse a lot of people.If you're going to do this change, make the (M) 24/7 to 71-Continental even if nights and weekends the (M) is only four or five cars to keep OPTO. |
|
|
| (1641688) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Fri Jun 6 03:42:40 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by Wallyhorse on Thu Jun 5 23:22:44 2025. I won’t be any more confusing than having the N going via bridge 6A - 12 mid and via tunnel overnight. |
|
|
| (1641691) | |
Re: IND Service Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by italianguyinsi on Fri Jun 6 08:56:29 2025, in response to Re: IND Service Changes Afoot, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Thu Jun 5 19:38:18 2025. 179 and the 179 yard are underused. You now have extra MUs that can make up another 5 - 6 400' G trains, so there isn't an excuse. G being truncated at Court Sq. doesn't serve a niche group along QBL that need to go crosstown as but one example. |
|
|
| (1641692) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by zac on Fri Jun 6 09:48:01 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by Wallyhorse on Thu Jun 5 23:22:44 2025. As long as they keep the side signs correct it'll be pretty easy. |
|
|
| (1641693) | |
Re: IND Service Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Fri Jun 6 11:49:02 2025, in response to Re: IND Service Changes Afoot, posted by Jailhousedoc on Thu Jun 5 22:40:37 2025. I'm sure you mean NIMBY. That said its a damn shame if they had any influence on stopping the extension the IND beyond 179. In two major mass transit improvements that come to mind right now in the last century was the Jamaica Ave El going to 168 & the Airtrain going down the middle of the Van Wyck. In both cases, the NIMBYs screamed like hell against those projects...and lost. Point being, if theres enough fire in the belly and the $$$ that goes along with it, NYMBYs can be beaten. Its a shame that they should be allowed to stop growth and improvements |
|
|
| (1641694) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Fri Jun 6 12:37:19 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by randyo on Fri Jun 6 03:42:40 2025. N going via tunnel overnight means 7 stops are added and none are subtracted.F going via 63rd overnight and weekends will mean 4 stops added and 4 stops subtracted. Considerably greater change. |
|
|
| (1641697) | |
Re: IND Service Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Jailhousedoc on Fri Jun 6 13:45:49 2025, in response to Re: IND Service Changes Afoot, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Fri Jun 6 11:49:02 2025. Yes, I did mean NIMBY - that NIMBY crowd cannot see their own hand in front of their face from half an inch away due to the hardness of their heads, but that is how they are. When the AirTrain was being built there was yelling and screaming about the noise from construction, traffic jams, and on and on - the Port Authority built in the middle of the Van Wyck expressway and turned a deaf ear to those complainers. Now we have the finished product, although the ROW of the abandoned LIRR Rockaway line should have been utilized - but it is what it is. |
|
|
| (1641701) | |
Re: IND Service Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Q4 on Fri Jun 6 16:26:46 2025, in response to Re: IND Service Changes Afoot, posted by Jailhousedoc on Fri Jun 6 13:45:49 2025. By using the ROW of the State owned Van Wyck, it took away several Legal means and overall arguments the Nimby’s would ordinarily used to go to court and delay the project and in their mind ultimately win. |
|
|
| (1641708) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Sat Jun 7 05:34:59 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by AlM on Fri Jun 6 12:37:19 2025. However, pre Chrystie the reverse took place. During the “day” when Brighton expresses ran, the Brighton Lcl ran via the tunnel. Nights and weekends when the Brighton Exp didn’t operate, Brighton Lcls ran via the bridge. |
|
|
| (1641709) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Railman718 on Sat Jun 7 06:17:49 2025, in response to IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by TRAIN DUDE on Thu Jun 5 16:00:39 2025. Oh its making for GREAT Crew Room Chatter...I cant wait for the Work Program to come out.. Then again, they'll run a supplement a base supplement then in December they'll drop that Nugget with the new stuff.. They have done it before.. Me? Meh it just makes for good discussion, i have no horses in any more Queens Korridor races im counting down the Months... |
|
|
| (1641733) | |
Re: IND Service Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Allen45 on Sun Jun 8 06:07:46 2025, in response to Re: IND Service Changes Afoot, posted by Jailhousedoc on Thu Jun 5 22:40:37 2025. These days criminals use Citibike as their getaway car. |
|
|
| (1641747) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Wallyhorse on Sun Jun 8 10:53:47 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by Wallyhorse on Thu Jun 5 23:22:44 2025. Right:I said the same thing on that one. |
|
|
| (1641748) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Transitbuff on Sun Jun 8 11:15:50 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by randyo on Sat Jun 7 05:34:59 2025. The difference there was QT for tunnel operation and QB for bridge ..easily distinguishable. |
|
|
| (1641771) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Mon Jun 9 03:32:53 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by Transitbuff on Sun Jun 8 11:15:50 2025. Not before the R-27s arrived on the property since the ABs didn’t display letters. |
|
|
| (1641772) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Jun 9 04:48:10 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by randyo on Mon Jun 9 03:32:53 2025. Did they share the same marker light combination? |
|
|
| (1641776) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Mon Jun 9 08:43:31 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Jun 9 04:48:10 2025. Marker lights are no help in identifying train destinations to the everyday commuter. |
|
|
| (1641777) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Jun 9 10:24:08 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Mon Jun 9 08:43:31 2025. Back in the day, the E trains had different marker light combos for all 5 south terminals (H.T., Euclid, Lefferts. R.P. and F.R.); the C trains (Euclid vs. R.P.) and even after that the northbound B with 168 vs. 57/6.Some passengers, especially old time rail fans certainly had it figured out. |
|
|
| (1641778) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by BILLBKLYN on Mon Jun 9 11:20:07 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Jun 9 10:24:08 2025. I could tell by marker lights if the incoming train was a West End or a Sea Beach (unless they were R40/42). Same with the 4th Avenue Local |
|
|
| (1641780) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Mon Jun 9 12:28:42 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Jun 9 10:24:08 2025. The only time I paid any attention to marker lights was when waiting for a Flushing bound train at GCT. If it displayed a green light (usually on the left side of an R33-36) that meant it was an express. Yellow meant local. |
|
|
| (1641781) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Mon Jun 9 12:52:11 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Jun 9 10:24:08 2025. Some passengers, especially old time rail fans certainly had it figured out.1. You had to know (either by being told or figuring it out on your own) that the marker lights signified the route. 2. You had to have a commute where it mattered. For many people, it didn't matter because any train on the given track would be fine. |
|
|
| (1641782) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Jun 9 13:29:12 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by AlM on Mon Jun 9 12:52:11 2025. On the Illinois Central Electric, marker lights indicated which route a train was serving. I was taught this as a child by my aunt who was certainly not a railfan. We were on the platform at Van Buren waiting for a South Chicago train and she could see the markers long before the destination roll signage. |
|
|
| (1641790) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by zac on Mon Jun 9 16:56:09 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by randyo on Mon Jun 9 03:32:53 2025. Didn't the ABs have a Via Bridge/Via Tunnel/Via Loop sign too? I only saw the Via Loop sign on the R11 just yesterday, I'd never seen it before. |
|
|
| (1641794) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Jun 9 18:37:09 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by BILLBKLYN on Mon Jun 9 11:20:07 2025. Sea Beach was red-white. |
|
|
| (1641795) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Jun 9 18:38:17 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by AlM on Mon Jun 9 12:52:11 2025. I never paid any attention to the marker lights back in the day. I looked at the front route and destination signs. |
|
|
| (1641800) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Jun 9 20:38:19 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by zac on Mon Jun 9 16:56:09 2025. They had something to that effect. My BMT standard sign box has those signs, something like, "via tunnel to loop and via bridge to Brooklyn" and vice versa. They also had separate, "Via Bridge" and, "Via Tunnel" signs. |
|
|
| (1641801) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by gbs on Mon Jun 9 22:00:44 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by zac on Mon Jun 9 16:56:09 2025. The Standards had two scrolls at each side display. (Originally, they were smaller and installed in the arch windows next to the center doors; later they were enlarged and placed in one of the top rectangular windows next to the arches.) The top scroll was the route ("Culver", "Sea Beach", "via Tunnel", etc.) and the bottom was the destination. There was no permanent bridge/tunnel display. The bottom scroll had to be changed at the start of each trip, which was not a problem when there was a conductor in each car but became problematic once MUDC was installed. The triplexes were much more advanced, and not just because of the end signs on the bonnets. They had three scrolls and one bridge/tunnel light set at each side display. One top scroll had the route, below that was the bridge/tunnel light, and the other two were the two destinations. Standards:       Triplexes:     |
|
|
| (1641804) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by BILLBKLYN on Tue Jun 10 03:03:48 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Jun 9 18:37:09 2025. I remember it as 2 amber. 2 "white" was the West End. Green was the 4th Avenue Local. At least that's how I remember it. |
|
|
| (1641807) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Tue Jun 10 03:52:33 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by BILLBKLYN on Tue Jun 10 03:03:48 2025. Originally, 2 amber meant a work train or other non passenger or out of service train. West End Exp was green/white and West End lcl was yellow/white. It seemed that while on the IND which marker was on the right and which was on the left made a difference, the same was not the case on the BMT. |
|
|
| (1641808) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Tue Jun 10 03:55:01 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Jun 9 20:38:19 2025. The older ABs with the smaller roll signs didn’t have the comprehensively inclusive readings. They had signs that simply read “Nassau St." |
|
|
| (1641823) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Tue Jun 10 19:13:51 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by randyo on Tue Jun 10 03:55:01 2025. They didn't have all that much room, did they?:)Once they went with larger rollsigns on later orders, they got more creative. |
|
|
| (1641824) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Tue Jun 10 19:17:11 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by randyo on Tue Jun 10 03:52:33 2025. IIRC the Concourse Local D was white-green while the express was green-green. One deceased poster said that he normally operated the last pre-rush hour Concourse Local D train. If he saw a CC at 116th, he'd flip the cab side paddle to green. Sometimes he'd get an express lineup. |
|
|
| (1641869) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Fri Jun 13 03:59:52 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Tue Jun 10 19:17:11 2025. After the BMT/IND merger, the newly merged B Division was a little more careful about the order of the marker lights than the BMT by itself had been. The B to/from 168th St had those markers and the D had green/white markers. Pre Chrystie, the RR had green/green markers but since the D Concourse Exp had green/green, post Chrystie, the RR was changed to white/white. D Concourse Lcl/Brighton Exp was green/yellow. In the mid 1970s, formed to try to improve the situation with marker lights and instituted “terminal markers” having trains carry the same markers to the e=terminals regardless of their point of origin. |
|
|
| (1641871) | |
Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot |
|
|
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Fri Jun 13 04:48:24 2025, in response to Re: IND Ser ice Changes Afoot, posted by randyo on Fri Jun 13 03:59:52 2025. I remember seeing an R-32 D in October of 1984 that was sporting a green-white marker light setting. |
|
|
