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| Andy's Almanac - June 28 (1605468) | |
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| (1605470) | |
Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by zac on Tue Jun 28 23:05:35 2022, in response to Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Andy on Tue Jun 28 21:08:54 2022. I'd never realized how soon after the connection was made through Grant Ave that the Rockaway line was opened. Did they have enough cars to cover the extra lines? |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by William A. Padron on Tue Jun 28 23:39:41 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by zac on Tue Jun 28 23:05:35 2022. Fifty R-16 cars (#6300-6349) were sent over to the IND Rockaway Line, and some of the R-10 cars that were at the BMT Eastern Division eventually sent back to the IND "A" line. There was a need for the R-1/9's to operate there at slower speed at first, because full power was not there yet, due to the result of a Westinghouse supplier strike.   -William A. Padron ["Rockaway Park"] |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Edwards! on Tue Jun 28 23:52:02 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by zac on Tue Jun 28 23:05:35 2022. Everything was almost completed.in early 1955,except power.They couldn't get power to the line and branches because of a strike at the provider. So substitute supplies were brought in to at least give the line power enough to provide service, but NOT at wrap around. Things were slow going. The line to Lefferts was opened first using 6 car shuttle trains,then followed up with full trains through routed later. The same happened with the Rockaway, with 4 car R1/9s operating to Rockaway Park,and Wavecrest. The E did most of the work,while the Shuttle covered the rest,except rush hours when A trains were extended to Far Rockaway in 1958. The Rockaways always had weird operations,since it was ran as the "third system " Motor men changed out at Euclid Ave in both directions, whereas today, they operate through to respective terminals. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Edwards! on Wed Jun 29 00:20:22 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by William A. Padron on Tue Jun 28 23:39:41 2022. Notice the roadies of the first picture.Still not complete because of the power issues. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by murray1575 on Wed Jun 29 07:19:26 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Edwards! on Tue Jun 28 23:52:02 2022. Far Rockaway trains terminated at Wavecrest and used the trackage leading to Mott Ave. to relay until the Mott Ave. station opened in 1958. The line to Lefferts Blvd. was opened to subway cars on April 29, 1956 and the first trains to the Rockaways operated on June 28, 1956 after substation equipment was borrowed from the Dyre Ave. line which was still operating shuttle service as the connection to the IRT main line was not yet in service. The remaining section of the Fulton St. elevated line was torn down and all the C type cars were scrapped. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by FYBklyn1959 on Wed Jun 29 08:38:35 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Edwards! on Tue Jun 28 23:52:02 2022. Motor men changed out at Euclid Ave in both directions, whereas today, they operate through to respective terminals.I remember that. In the summer of 1967, my mother and I went to visit a cousin who lived in the Rockaways (don't remember exactly where, but it was in one of the high-rises near Beach 60 St/Straiton Av station. Started out on the Franklin shuttle where we boarded a 3-car train of R-11s (I didn't know the contract number until much later). I thought it was the strangest looking subway car I had ever seen. Since my orientation at that time was mainly IRT, it looked to me like a cross between an R-10 and an R-15. Got to Franklin and got the A (R-10 of course), then I was surprised to hear the train dump at Euclid (again, I wouldn't know that term until later). I was like, this isn't the end of the line. Apparently, we were in the first car, as I saw the motorman leave the cab, and a different one take over. I was like, whatever. Also interesting was the additional fare you had to pay upon leaving at Beach 60th. Apparently, that went on until the fare was raised to 50˘ in 1975. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Jun 29 09:12:59 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Edwards! on Tue Jun 28 23:52:02 2022. Did they change out the conductor too?? |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by TUNNELRAT on Wed Jun 29 09:18:17 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by murray1575 on Wed Jun 29 07:19:26 2022. was the rails on the rockaway trestle original lirr or repalced by the T.A.? |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Italianstallion on Wed Jun 29 14:07:38 2022, in response to Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Andy on Tue Jun 28 21:08:54 2022. I never understood why they didn’t build the new Mott Ave. station adjacent to the LIRR station, so as to allow easy transfers. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by murray1575 on Wed Jun 29 16:50:32 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Italianstallion on Wed Jun 29 14:07:38 2022. Well they actually did...for about a month. The next month the LIRR opened a new ground level station about three blocks east at Nameoke Ave. The old station on the 1942 vintage elevated structure was torn down and the property sold and redeveloped as a shopping center. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Edwards! on Wed Jun 29 17:02:45 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by murray1575 on Wed Jun 29 16:50:32 2022. Yes.The shopping center is where the trestle dropped to the street level. What would have better was building a joint station serving both systems. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Andy on Wed Jun 29 17:34:51 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Edwards! on Wed Jun 29 17:02:45 2022. Today that would have happened. In 1956 NYCTA and LIRR were completely separate entities. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Wed Jun 29 17:37:42 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Edwards! on Wed Jun 29 17:02:45 2022. This thread about the LIRR Far Rockaway station being moved prompts me to ask this one. Is there now direct subway/escalator service between the Sutphin/ & Archer subway stp and the LIRR Jamaica station? If not, why not? |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Wed Jun 29 17:44:57 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Edwards! on Tue Jun 28 23:52:02 2022. In the late 50' and early 60's, I always remembered the "A" train going to Lefferts Blvd, the "E" to both Rockaways during rush hours, and the "HH" from Euclid Ave to either Far Rockaway or Rockaway Park, at other times. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by r33/r36 mainline on Wed Jun 29 18:27:58 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Elkeeper on Wed Jun 29 17:37:42 2022. Theres elevators from the subway mezzanine to the mezzanine above the LIRR tracks.The escalators from the subway only go to street level, you gotta take stairs to reach the LIRR platform you need. |
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| (1605516) | |
Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by randyo on Wed Jun 29 19:33:21 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Jun 29 09:12:59 2022. Crews changed at Euclid due to an agreement with TWU. When the IND was being extended to the Rockaways, the BMT crews complained that they were losing jobs the way they did when the IND took over the Culver 2 years earlier. The intent was to have IND crews be relieved by BMT crews at Euclid as part of a separate “Rockaway Division.". The wrinkle came in when the IRT crews which outnumbered the BMT and IND crews combined packed the union meeting about the job issue. The IRT crews insisted on being included in the new division despite not actually losing any jobs. The total number of Rockaway Div jobs was allotted base on the total number of employees on each of the other division and since the IRT had the largest number of employees of the 3 divisions the largest number of Rockaway jobs went to IRT crews followed by the BMT leaving the IND crews with the smallest number of jobs available to be picked even though the Rockaway Div was essentially a subdivision of the IND. Towermen’s jobs were also apportioned among the 3 divisions but since there were only 2 towers. Liberty Jct and Rockaway Pk that were available to be picked, the allotment of tower jobs was set at 2 Tw/M per division. That situation lasted till the 1967 Chrystie merger when the BMT and IND divisions were essentially combined into a single B Division leaving the IRT out. |
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| (1605517) | |
Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by italianguyinsi on Wed Jun 29 19:33:28 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Edwards! on Tue Jun 28 23:52:02 2022. I thought that there was a complete ban on dual motor MUs and only the pre-war R units can travel to the Rockaways... |
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| (1605518) | |
Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by randyo on Wed Jun 29 19:35:14 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Andy on Wed Jun 29 17:34:51 2022. Despite bing separate entities, a ground level IND Far Rock station could have been built and still be within city limits |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Edwards! on Thu Jun 30 00:40:14 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Elkeeper on Wed Jun 29 17:37:42 2022. No escalator service.Only elevator service to between subway and LIRR mezzanines. |
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| (1605529) | |
Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Edwards! on Thu Jun 30 00:45:47 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Jun 29 09:12:59 2022. That,I've never seen.I've only witnessed the motown leaving the cab and another taking over. It's safe to say,however, that the possibility exist. Crews replaced crews at Euclid Ave terminal. |
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| (1605531) | |
Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Edwards! on Thu Jun 30 00:56:13 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Elkeeper on Wed Jun 29 17:44:57 2022. Yeah.The E did the Rockaway line during the rush,while the HH covered the rest from Euclid Ave. The A was through routed in 1967,to Far Rockaway Rush hours midday and evening's. Some traffic ended at Euclid. |
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| (1605542) | |
Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by murray1575 on Thu Jun 30 09:18:24 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by italianguyinsi on Wed Jun 29 19:33:28 2022. At the beginning of service yes only R1-9 cars were allowed to operate in short trains with speed restrictions due to the limits on available electrical power. R10 and newer cars (at that time only the R11 and R16 were in service) could not operate until full power was available. |
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| (1605570) | |
Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Italianstallion on Thu Jun 30 17:31:07 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by murray1575 on Wed Jun 29 16:50:32 2022. Thanks for that info. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Thu Jun 30 20:27:37 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Edwards! on Thu Jun 30 00:56:13 2022. I should have said service from 1958-1967. My bad! Most of my subway/elevated interests lessened after July 1st, 1967. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Thu Jun 30 20:32:25 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by r33/r36 mainline on Wed Jun 29 18:27:58 2022. Any reason why they never added escalators from the subway street level to the LIRR station? |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by murray1575 on Thu Jun 30 23:26:14 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by TUNNELRAT on Wed Jun 29 09:18:17 2022. I would think that all the track across the bay was completely replaced when the TA took over because they had sand pumped in to completely cover the old trestle in the areas where it was left in place to prevent fires. Much of that track was probably worn out anyway due to lack of maintenance. The two steel swing bridges were also completely replaced with new ones. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by murray1575 on Thu Jun 30 23:39:33 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Elkeeper on Wed Jun 29 17:44:57 2022. I remember taking a trip in the late 1950s with my father where we changed from an A train of R-10s at Euclid Ave. for an HH train of Arnines which were packed to overflowing. They used the express tracks and a double crossover west of Euclid Ave. to relay and begin their trip out to the Rockaways since there was no express service on weekends. During late night hours a round robin shuttle served both Rockaway Park and Far Rockaway. I have also heard that the shuttle trains at one time were split up at Broad Channel going out and reassembled there going back towards Euclid Ave. Also some E trains terminated at Lefferts Blvd. which wasn't far from the other end of the line at 179th St. where both the E and F terminated before the Archer Avenue line was opened in 1988. However any of these destinations were a long run with many stops for the train crews. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by randyo on Fri Jul 1 02:06:44 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by murray1575 on Thu Jun 30 09:18:24 2022. You mean R-10 and R-16. R-11s were on the BMT at the time. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by TUNNELRAT on Fri Jul 1 10:52:28 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by murray1575 on Thu Jun 30 23:26:14 2022. I know this,photos have been posted here. now,once again did the T.A.replace the tracks on the rockaway trestle or use original lirr rail that was installed 1039,42? |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Edwards! on Fri Jul 1 16:49:41 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Elkeeper on Thu Jun 30 20:27:37 2022. Yeah I hear you.Looks like you kept up enough though. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Sun Jul 3 13:41:50 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Edwards! on Fri Jul 1 16:49:41 2022. The final straws were the elimination of lower Myrtle Ave el and the Bronx 3rd Ave el. But, something currently interesting pops up, from time to time! |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Edwards! on Sun Jul 3 17:54:10 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Elkeeper on Sun Jul 3 13:41:50 2022. That's understandable.I'm with you in that regard. Transit barely has enough going on these days to keep me involved. Just barely. Was sort of excited for the new rolling stock at one point...but that program followed the typical ordeal most projects suffer from. 10 years is way too long for any subway car to be designed built and delivered. |
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Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28 |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Sun Jul 3 20:32:22 2022, in response to Re: Andy's Almanac - June 28, posted by Edwards! on Sun Jul 3 17:54:10 2022. I just want 10% of the money the MTA and the City pissed away on: Court Square, the 63rd St (F) bypass, the intial SAS sections in the 1970s, and my favorite Schivone-Mob project- the Archer Ave subway. Now, that has been closed for shoddy initial construction. |
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