Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad

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Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by chicagoMotorman on Tue Jun 21 09:56:24 2022 Chicago Tribune.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Italianstallion* on Tue Jun 21 13:28:21 2022, in response to Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by chicagoMotorman on Tue Jun 21 09:56:24 2022.* Subscribers only.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Spider-Pig* on Tue Jun 21 13:31:59 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Italianstallion on Tue Jun 21 13:28:21 2022.* https://archive.ph/e5Fp6
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by chicagoMotorman* on Tue Jun 21 13:33:49 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Italianstallion on Tue Jun 21 13:28:21 2022.* Oops, Sorry.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by chicagoMotorman* on Tue Jun 21 13:34:58 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Spider-Pig on Tue Jun 21 13:31:59 2022.* How did you do that. And thanks?
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Joe V* on Tue Jun 21 13:36:40 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Spider-Pig on Tue Jun 21 13:31:59 2022.* It's a great project they are doing , and also the West Lake extension to Dyer, but too bad Indiana doesn't give a shit about investing in any Amtrak service. Driving up the interstate from Indianaplis and onto the Dan Ryan is no picnic.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Spider-Pig* on Tue Jun 21 13:37:39 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by chicagoMotorman on Tue Jun 21 13:34:58 2022.* I went to archive.ph and pasted in the address of the article.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by chicagoMotorman* on Tue Jun 21 13:44:53 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Joe V on Tue Jun 21 13:36:40 2022.* I agree. I really wonder if it would be worth the toll to use the Skyway.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by chicagoMotorman* on Tue Jun 21 13:46:14 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Spider-Pig on Tue Jun 21 13:37:39 2022.* Thanks, and bookmarked. Glad to know there is way to circumvent it.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Joe V* on Tue Jun 21 13:46:34 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by chicagoMotorman on Tue Jun 21 13:44:53 2022.* You can get shot driving on the Dan Ryan or Lake Shore Drive.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by chicagoMotorman* on Tue Jun 21 13:47:26 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Joe V on Tue Jun 21 13:46:34 2022.* Yeah. The skyway feeds into the Ryan.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Spider-Pig* on Tue Jun 21 13:49:18 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by chicagoMotorman on Tue Jun 21 13:46:14 2022.* You’re welcome.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Jackson Park B Train* on Tue Jun 21 15:23:30 2022, in response to Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by chicagoMotorman on Tue Jun 21 09:56:24 2022.* Great to see the project underway. Note that the two cars shown are from thje group leased fropm Metra Electric to give South Shore more capacity. The West Lake takeover of a short stretch of the Monon is a good start; going further south would be even better.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by BusMgr* on Tue Jun 21 15:35:16 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Italianstallion on Tue Jun 21 13:28:21 2022.* Temporarily turn off java script in your browser, then reload the Chicago Tribune page. Most sites that impose an image on top of an article use java script to do the imposition, so disabling java script is almost always a good starting point. (To disable java script in Firefox, go to about:config, search for java script.enabled, then mark as false.)
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Joe V* on Tue Jun 21 15:57:15 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Jun 21 15:23:30 2022.* I think the entire first tranche of Metra Electric Gallery MU's about 20 or 24 cars, which they do not intermix with the later production cars, are being sold to NICTD.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP* on Tue Jun 21 19:06:58 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by chicagoMotorman on Tue Jun 21 13:47:26 2022.* The Skyway (and for that matter, the Toll Road) and I grew up together. It almost feels weird driving across it, having ridden across it all those times we commuted from South Bend to Chicago.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP* on Tue Jun 21 19:08:24 2022, in response to Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by chicagoMotorman on Tue Jun 21 09:56:24 2022.* No more street running anywhere along the South Shore. The East Chicago Bypass opened two months before I was born, and street running in South Bend ended three years after we left.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by kp5308* on Tue Jun 21 19:23:15 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Jun 21 15:23:30 2022.* Are the single level cars in danger of going to the torch?
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NICTD double-tracking in Michigan City IN
Posted by Olog-hai* on Tue Jun 21 19:25:36 2022, in response to Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by chicagoMotorman on Tue Jun 21 09:56:24 2022.* This spells the end of street running.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Joe V* on Tue Jun 21 19:40:26 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by kp5308 on Tue Jun 21 19:23:15 2022.* No. They need the additional Metra cars for West Lake extension requiring fleet expansion.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by kp5308* on Tue Jun 21 20:53:02 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Joe V on Tue Jun 21 19:40:26 2022.* Good...I really like those cars!
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Dave* on Tue Jun 21 22:15:49 2022, in response to Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by chicagoMotorman on Tue Jun 21 09:56:24 2022.* Nice! Have you ever ridden the South Shore?
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Jersey Mike* on Wed Jun 22 01:14:33 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Joe V on Tue Jun 21 15:57:15 2022.* Good idea.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Joe V* on Wed Jun 22 07:54:41 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by kp5308 on Tue Jun 21 20:53:02 2022.* They must be pushing 40 years old by now. Unlike NJT, they know how to maintain MU's.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Chicagomotorman* on Wed Jun 22 12:33:49 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Dave on Tue Jun 21 22:15:49 2022.* Yes I have. Although I Will moss the Michigan City street running, I understand why they are eliminating it. A lot of rail fans are upset over it. The South Shore is business to move people. Not appease railfans.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Jackson Park B Train* on Wed Jun 22 13:19:45 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Joe V on Wed Jun 22 07:54:41 2022.* Having walked through one undergoing GOH in the shops at Carroll St (Michigan City) I think they do good work. My first ride on the South Shore was in the early 50s so I am very pleased to see the RR getting upgrades and the ex-Monon ROW for a new route.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Olog-hai* on Wed Jun 22 13:22:14 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Chicagomotorman on Wed Jun 22 12:33:49 2022.* If that were the case, then the passing loop that used to be on 11^th Street would have been rebuilt. This is an overly-expensive upgrade for minimal passenger increase. And speaking of street running, there used to be some in South Bend itself that got the trains right into the heart of the city. You can't even get into the city center anymore since the trains were rerouted into the airport.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Joe V* on Wed Jun 22 13:30:51 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Wed Jun 22 13:19:45 2022.* Too bad Indiana has zero interest in any rail service other than NICTD. They would not subsiize the Hoosier State for a measly $3 million a year, yet they got some federal fund and state funds for a $725 million Dyer extension. Amtrak's Beech Grove shops does give them some positive economic impact.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by chicagoMotorman* on Wed Jun 22 13:43:50 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Jun 22 13:22:14 2022.* The South Shore should have used the Pennsy right of way to enter downtown South Bend.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Spider-Pig* on Wed Jun 22 13:48:37 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by chicagoMotorman on Wed Jun 22 13:43:50 2022.* The South Shore used to use the current Amtrak station after street running was ended but before the airport station was built.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by chicagoMotorman* on Wed Jun 22 13:51:23 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Jun 22 13:48:37 2022.* Yes and no. The old Bendix station was a block away from the Amtrak station.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Olog-hai* on Wed Jun 22 13:59:23 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by chicagoMotorman on Wed Jun 22 13:43:50 2022.* Probably right on that score.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by chicagoMotorman* on Wed Jun 22 14:13:24 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by chicagoMotorman on Wed Jun 22 13:43:50 2022.* Well I have ridden it. Unfortunately I never rode the South Bend street running.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Jackson Park B Train* on Wed Jun 22 16:52:59 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Joe V on Wed Jun 22 13:30:51 2022.* NICTD was lucky. Joel Garreau, in his excellent Nine Nations of North America, describes Indiana as a mix of what we now call the rust belt,, the great midwest farm belt and dixie. The net result is a conest between center and far right over culture, money, etc. As Chicagoland expands its bedroom reach,sustaining and improving South Shore became necessary. Half a dozen years ago, I rode MED on the South Chicago branch to revisit some of my youth, and see what ridership was like. Heavyist boarding SB in rush was 59th--University of Chicago (which now has a huge medical operation and is the only NICTD stopsouth of McCormick Place), most stayed on to the terminal which now feature a large parking lot. I have read that many of the license plates there are from Indiana thus adding the West Lake spur may 'reclaim' Indiana riders.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Jackson Park B Train* on Wed Jun 22 16:57:07 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by chicagoMotorman on Wed Jun 22 13:51:23 2022.* Not very different from Erie and B&O in Akron--a civil walk between stations. While ideally CSS&SB would still run downtown, frankly the airport is more useful. Steve-B might care to comment on how dormant 'downtown' SB is. (My observations from attending a 2008 Centenary of the RR presented at the airport)
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Italianstallion* on Wed Jun 22 17:01:11 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Spider-Pig on Tue Jun 21 13:31:59 2022.* Thanks.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by chicagoMotorman* on Wed Jun 22 17:06:53 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Italianstallion on Wed Jun 22 17:01:11 2022.* You're welcome.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP* on Wed Jun 22 19:01:23 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Jun 22 13:22:14 2022.* I vividly remember when South Shore trains came all the way into downtown South Bend. There were two miles of street running in all. You can even retrace the route those trains took to this day because the ROW where the track curved from LaSalle to Colfax and from Colfax to Orange St. is now paved.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP* on Wed Jun 22 19:06:15 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Wed Jun 22 16:57:07 2022.* Downtown South Bend is nothing now compared to when we still lived there. A few of the larger buildings that I remember are still there, but there are blocks and blocks of vacant lots. Back then, Michigan St. was the main artery and traffic went straight through downtown on it. It was bustling all day long. The owner of Union Station has gone on record as saying he supports the idea of rerouting the South Shore to that depot. Union Station itself is now a fiber optics communications center, plus the South Bend Tribune is now located there. Back when we we still lived there, it was still a train depot.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP* on Wed Jun 22 19:09:24 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by chicagoMotorman on Wed Jun 22 14:13:24 2022.* I rode on it once, to Chicago and back, on April 1 and 2, 1967, two weeks before we left for New Jersey. You walked out onto LaSalle St. to board the train, which boarded passengers in front of the station, across from the LaSalle Hotel (now LaSalle Apartments). It was a slow, 20 mph trudge through the streets until you got to the western outskirts near Bendix.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by ntrainride* on Wed Jun 22 23:15:28 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Wed Jun 22 19:06:15 2022.* i took a look via mapping software and it's true, the current station basically says eff you to the city. nobody is walking up orange to colfax to the morris performing arts center for a day in town. the union station idea...hope it happens.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Olog-hai* on Thu Jun 23 12:31:22 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Wed Jun 22 16:57:07 2022.* While ideally CSS&SB would still run downtown, frankly the airport is more useful To whom? Nobody in South Bend can use the train to get to the airport named for that city. And looking on a map, there are ways to build new rails with minimal impact to allow trains to serve both.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Jackson Park B Train* on Thu Jun 23 13:48:36 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Olog-hai on Thu Jun 23 12:31:22 2022.* 1. airport has parking. 2. as I suggested, and Steve-B I believe concurred, 'downtown'is not a market--many vacant lots' 3.In the current era, real taxis or Lyft are the option when the local bus system doesn't function sufficiently. (Which is why some of us eschew either living in or even visiting such deficient places) The couple of days I spent there in 2008 were basically attending the CSS&SB Centenary, riding an excursion including a tour of the Michigan City Shops, and visiting the Studebaker museum. Then we left. As to new routings, I don't know enough to comment.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Jackson Park B Train* on Thu Jun 23 13:53:08 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by ntrainride on Wed Jun 22 23:15:28 2022.* Not very different from Staples Mill in suburban Richmond. Of course, if downtown South Bend reappears, then serving it would make sense for both Amtrak and NICTD. Long term there has been some talk of moving the Amtrak trains to the South Shore (and with vChicago) and the ex IC Lakefront line to escape NS dispatching. Might happenin a decade or so, might not at all.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by BusMgr* on Thu Jun 23 17:54:36 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Olog-hai on Thu Jun 23 12:31:22 2022.* The airport was somewhat useful before, in providing a common connecting point between intercity bus and railroad service. But the intercity buses no longer stop at the airport, leaving the train by itself, of use only to a handful of air travelers (or airport employees) looking to connect to points west of South Bend.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP* on Thu Jun 23 18:23:14 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Thu Jun 23 13:53:08 2022.* There is a bus transfer station a block or two east of Union Station known as Transpo. The general consensus is, if Amtrak were to relocate to downtown South Bend, their trains would most likely stop at Transpo and not Union Station. A pity Amtrak didn't just take over Union Station back in 1971.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Joe V* on Thu Jun 23 18:32:59 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Thu Jun 23 18:23:14 2022.* I think NS has strong objections into Amtrak moving to S.B. Union Staion area - they don't want trains stopping at that location, clogging up the main line. I don't know why that makes a difference. Indiana is not the least bit interested in intercity passenger service (they want highway toll revenue, not trains), so that state is nothing more than flyover county to Amtrak and their 2 LD trains, and they simply don't care.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by ntrainride* on Thu Jun 23 19:15:55 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Thu Jun 23 13:53:08 2022.* maybe mostly railfans think about it much. but a parking lot station not walkable to the namesake city is lame.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by ntrainride* on Thu Jun 23 19:25:12 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by BusMgr on Thu Jun 23 17:54:36 2022.* well there is the # 4 bus from the amtrak station to the airport. once an hour or so.
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Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad
Posted by Joe V* on Thu Jun 23 19:30:48 2022, in response to Re: Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad, posted by ntrainride on Thu Jun 23 19:15:55 2022.* It ain't much of a city anymore. It's called the rust belt for a reason. Michigan City, IN is trying to make a comeback with the elimination of street running.
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