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| "RFP" on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design (1535740) | |
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| (1535740) | |
"RFP" on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by gold_12th on Fri Jan 17 17:12:29 2020 This is in planning phase, we won't see the actual production cars in 8 to 10 years at least. unless MTA kiss Bombardier's ass; delivery in 20 years with 20 damage free cars as a gift.$ TBD Contract Term To Be Determined Contract# R-34262 RFP Authorizing Resolution for the purchase of 504 A Division Rapid Transit Open Gangway Cars with an option to purchase 445 additional cars and a second option to purchase up to 415 additional cars. Click the image to see a larger view...    page 285, pdf link |
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| (1535741) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by GojiMet86 on Fri Jan 17 17:20:23 2020, in response to "RFP" on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by gold_12th on Fri Jan 17 17:12:29 2020. I guess that number comes from about 24 cars (divided into four 6-car units on the Shuttle), leaving 480 for 5-car units on the rest of the base. |
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| (1535748) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by italianstallion on Fri Jan 17 17:48:39 2020, in response to "RFP" on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by gold_12th on Fri Jan 17 17:12:29 2020. Notice - all open gangway. |
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| (1535753) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Fri Jan 17 18:01:30 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by italianstallion on Fri Jan 17 17:48:39 2020. good |
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| (1535769) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Fri Jan 17 19:01:37 2020, in response to "RFP" on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by gold_12th on Fri Jan 17 17:12:29 2020. 40 year useful life. That’s a crock. |
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| (1535814) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by randyo on Sat Jan 18 02:42:45 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Catfish 44 on Fri Jan 17 19:01:37 2020. That’s just the minimum. Look at the R-32s. |
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| (1535815) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by randyo on Sat Jan 18 02:44:53 2020, in response to "RFP" on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by gold_12th on Fri Jan 17 17:12:29 2020. Bombardier isn’t the only game in town. There is still Kawasaki, Westinghouse Amrail and Alsthom and probably a few others I’m not aware of. |
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| (1535816) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by randyo on Sat Jan 18 02:47:56 2020, in response to "RFP" on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by gold_12th on Fri Jan 17 17:12:29 2020. Another comment. What’s with the return to the double drop sash T/O cab windows? Single drop sah windows were able to be done on the R-62s, 68s and R-143s so why not on the BMT/IND’s NTTs which are larger cars and the R-211s? |
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| (1535839) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by FYBklyn1959 on Sat Jan 18 09:08:42 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by randyo on Sat Jan 18 02:44:53 2020. Hitachi/Breda, who is finishing up delivering 236 cars for Miami Metrorail. Granted, they have never produced anything for MTA. |
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| (1535843) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Sat Jan 18 09:22:09 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by randyo on Sat Jan 18 02:42:45 2020. What I mean is that those cars are just fine. But. They are from the 1980s so they don’t have 2020 amenities and have to go.When I am heading up to Pelham Bay on the 6 I’m very happy to ride one of those trains. |
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| (1535845) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by pragmatist on Sat Jan 18 09:37:21 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by randyo on Sat Jan 18 02:44:53 2020. Didn't BBD get disqualified in the R-211 competition? Is the MTA likely to lift that dq before this is bid if the R-179 order is still not completed and stable in service? |
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| (1535848) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Jan 18 09:48:23 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Catfish 44 on Sat Jan 18 09:22:09 2020. Their interior lighting sucks too, but that can be improved upon. |
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| (1535849) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Sat Jan 18 10:36:05 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Joe V on Sat Jan 18 09:48:23 2020. I think they could invest in other things to make improvements to the system instead of buying cars to replace good equipment in service. I suppose they qualify for federal funding to replace cars 40+ years old so they jump on the opportunity. |
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| (1535852) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Jan 18 10:41:50 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Catfish 44 on Sat Jan 18 10:36:05 2020. The MDBF on the R32's got rather bad when they hit 50. They don't want a repeat of that. |
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| (1535854) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Andrew Saucci on Sat Jan 18 10:43:45 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Catfish 44 on Sat Jan 18 09:22:09 2020. "they don’t have 2020 amenities and have to go."I'm happy to get on a train that moves and gets me where I'm going as quickly as possible. It doesn't need "2020 amenities." In the end, it's transportation. |
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| (1535855) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by pragmatist on Sat Jan 18 10:44:37 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Catfish 44 on Sat Jan 18 10:36:05 2020. Yes, but new cars do bring some advantages. AC propulsion and split package a/c in the roof would be big pluses. The cost of retrofitting the old cars for CBTC, forget it....Take the Fed money and move on... |
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| (1535864) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Sat Jan 18 12:41:07 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Joe V on Sat Jan 18 10:41:50 2020. That has to do with not giving a damn not because they’re over 50. |
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| (1535865) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Sat Jan 18 12:42:00 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by pragmatist on Sat Jan 18 10:44:37 2020. I’m not going to disagree. |
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| (1535866) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Sat Jan 18 12:42:53 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Andrew Saucci on Sat Jan 18 10:43:45 2020. I’m not disagreeing with that either. If they’re kept up with they could run indefinitely. |
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| (1535875) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by El-Train on Sat Jan 18 15:51:42 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Catfish 44 on Sat Jan 18 09:22:09 2020. The R62A's AC systems have been crapping out during the summer for a long time now due to their flawed design. While they may be structually sound otherwise for 35+year old cars, I think they should go within the next decade. |
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| (1535876) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Jan 18 16:09:41 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by El-Train on Sat Jan 18 15:51:42 2020. So 40 +/- not bad |
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| (1535880) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Sat Jan 18 17:15:06 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by El-Train on Sat Jan 18 15:51:42 2020. I knew someone would use that to support an argument to dump them. |
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| (1535887) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Bill Newkirk on Sat Jan 18 19:07:43 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Joe V on Sat Jan 18 09:48:23 2020. Their interior lighting sucks too, but that can be improved upon.They already replaced the fluorescent tubes with LED tubes. The cars are brighter, but that's as good as it's going to get. Bill Newkirk |
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| (1535888) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Jan 18 19:21:47 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Bill Newkirk on Sat Jan 18 19:07:43 2020. In all of them ?The trouble with them is the advertising back lit lighting blocks lumens. While sufficient light comes out the bottom, little comes out the top facing inward, and the ceilings appear dark and have a non-reflective matte finsih. They need a line of lights down the middle of the ceiling. |
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| (1535890) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Bill Newkirk on Sat Jan 18 19:52:56 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Joe V on Sat Jan 18 19:21:47 2020. In all of them ?I can't say all of them were converted, there may be some that yet to be converted. It takes time to do a whole fleet. While sufficient light comes out the bottom, little comes out the top facing inward, and the ceilings appear dark and have a non-reflective matte finish. They need a line of lights down the middle of the ceiling. With a fleet that's about thirty years of age, I don't think they'll spend more money to improve the interior lighting because of an old innovation of backlit lighting. Bill Newkirk |
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| (1535910) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Far Rockaway A Train on Sun Jan 19 03:20:53 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Catfish 44 on Sat Jan 18 09:22:09 2020. Just like the R46s. I'll take them over these NTTs anytime. |
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| (1535923) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Sun Jan 19 09:30:33 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Far Rockaway A Train on Sun Jan 19 03:20:53 2020. That’s right |
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| (1535925) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Union Tpke on Sun Jan 19 09:59:40 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by GojiMet86 on Fri Jan 17 17:20:23 2020. That is what I surmised. |
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| (1535926) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Union Tpke on Sun Jan 19 10:00:08 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Andrew Saucci on Sat Jan 18 10:43:45 2020. Bingo! |
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| (1535943) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by BLE-NIMX on Sun Jan 19 12:56:04 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Catfish 44 on Sat Jan 18 12:41:07 2020. The MDBFs on the R44s were through the roof because they received SMSs a few years before they were rushed out the door. |
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| (1535944) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Sun Jan 19 14:56:08 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by BLE-NIMX on Sun Jan 19 12:56:04 2020. Well it’s curious that whatever defect they had was not detected during the SMS. |
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| (1535945) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Train Dude on Sun Jan 19 15:11:07 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by BLE-NIMX on Sun Jan 19 12:56:04 2020. I might add that the 172 cars that received SMS, were highly successful for 2 reasons:1) Much of the scope of the work was done at the suggestion of Pitkin Shop personnel base on in service failures and not some cookie cutter plan. 2) Much of the work was done at Pitkin Shop by the people who "owned" the cars. |
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| (1535946) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Sun Jan 19 15:54:08 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Train Dude on Sun Jan 19 15:11:07 2020. That’s an important point. And God forbid common sense. |
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| (1535954) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sun Jan 19 18:20:43 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Catfish 44 on Sun Jan 19 15:54:08 2020. Ah, but if the R44's were still around, the R32 lovers on this board, other boards and Facebook would have one less thing to foam over. |
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| (1535978) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Sun Jan 19 20:40:42 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sun Jan 19 18:20:43 2020. Very true |
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| (1535987) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Sun Jan 19 21:18:44 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by randyo on Sat Jan 18 02:44:53 2020. Bombardier isn’t the only game in town. There is still Kawasaki, Westinghouse Amrail and Alsthom and probably a few others I’m not aware of.In NYS, the choices are Alstom, Kawasaki, Bombardier, and CAF. If the agency doesn't rig the process to require "Made in New York", it opens up Siemens, Stadler, and Hitachi (the former Breda). Westinghouse-Amrail hasn't existed in years... |
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| (1535988) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by pragmatist on Sun Jan 19 21:25:56 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Sun Jan 19 21:18:44 2020. As pointed out before, BBD was DQ'd from the R211 bid because of the R179 issues, that may or may not still be the case when this goes out. Also,the extent and type of Fed funding in the acquisition may limit the ability to over credit NY content in scoring. There is no "made in ny" it is points in scoring for percentage o NY content (including labor) |
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Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Jan 20 00:51:38 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by pragmatist on Sun Jan 19 21:25:56 2020. there may not be an explicit 'made in nys'clause, but it is evident fromseveral recent contracts that made in the locale of the agency is a de facto winner. |
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| (1536002) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by randyo on Mon Jan 20 01:26:17 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Sun Jan 19 21:18:44 2020. I wasn’t sure about WH-Amrail but there is nothing to prevent Siemens, Hitachi or any other railcar company from opening a factory in NYS to comply the way Kawasaki did with the old Otis elevator factory in Yonkers. I believe that Bombardier had a plant in upstate NY that it will no longer need if banned from MTA contracts so any other railcar manufacturer could probably acquire it. |
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| (1536004) | |
Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by pragmatist on Mon Jan 20 05:43:42 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Jan 20 00:51:38 2020. A great deal of the Kawasaki work is done in Lincoln, Nebraska, and it has not been the case with New Flyer on the bus side. But it is a strong incentive. |
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Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Joe V on Mon Jan 20 09:08:06 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by randyo on Mon Jan 20 01:26:17 2020. BBD still needs a domestic plant because NJT is in bed with them for more cars. There are also going to get 17 more ALP45DP's (that they don't need). |
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Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design |
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Posted by Marc A. Rivlin on Mon Jan 20 23:54:28 2020, in response to Re: ''RFP'' on R-262 car order, plan up to purchase 1,364 cars; based on R-211 design, posted by randyo on Mon Jan 20 01:26:17 2020. Westinghouse-Amrail was a joint venture of Westinghouse with French manufacturers ANF Industrie (later acquired by Bombardier in 1989), and Jeumont Schneider, which sold its railcar division mid-contract to Alsthom (now Alstom) a successor to the French operations of GE-owned Thomson-Houston Electric. So, the lineage of the R68 leads to Bombardier and Alstom. |
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