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| Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains (1497040) | |
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| (1497261) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Tue Dec 25 12:48:08 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by pragmatist on Mon Dec 24 21:57:13 2018. Not to mention onion regulations and such.ROAR |
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| (1497262) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Tue Dec 25 12:49:45 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Dec 24 21:32:21 2018. But they would not run on the wire for that 200 or so miles, the would run off the diesel plant until it got to nyp, and then cut the prime movers and raise the pans.That is how LIRR does it with their DMs, AMTK too coming down from albany. |
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| (1497264) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Tue Dec 25 12:53:25 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Dec 24 19:06:22 2018. OShA regulations.But if the cab is filled with smoke, it it is easy for the Hogger to get disoriented. What does it cost to put in. No point in worrying about it. |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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| (1497267) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Tue Dec 25 12:56:02 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Steamdriven on Mon Dec 24 23:43:45 2018. Even SUBMARINES have seat belts for the drivers. |
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| (1497272) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Tue Dec 25 14:02:20 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Broadway Lion on Tue Dec 25 12:53:25 2018. Nope, not OSHA. |
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| (1497273) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Tue Dec 25 14:03:43 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by pragmatist on Tue Dec 25 12:19:13 2018. Heritage fleet has been gone mostly since the 90s. |
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| (1497281) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by pragmatist on Tue Dec 25 14:39:13 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Tue Dec 25 14:03:43 2018. Not the diners and most bags... they have departed much more recently. A major part of the CAF order was the diners so the Heritage diners could be retired... |
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| (1497283) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Dec 25 14:46:37 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Broadway Lion on Tue Dec 25 12:49:45 2018. Hauling the dead weight of the diesel power plantisa huge waste--not to mention the fuel. Look at the size/weight of the AEM7v the dual modes. It may make sense if as with NJT and LIRR there are too many light usage branches w/o wires--no way this pencils out on the DC-NY-BOS line. And, straight electrics should have a much better MDBF/service life. |
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| (1497284) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by 3-9 on Tue Dec 25 14:50:06 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Dutchrailnut on Mon Dec 24 13:45:33 2018. Makes you wonder, then, if it's worth it to have all those propietary electronics, which, if supply disappears, will unnecessarily shorten the life of the locomotive. |
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| (1497285) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Dec 25 14:50:16 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Broadway Lion on Tue Dec 25 12:53:25 2018. yes, "cheap at the cost" and useful. |
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| (1497286) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by 3-9 on Tue Dec 25 14:59:27 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by pragmatist on Tue Dec 25 14:39:13 2018. What's wrong with the diners? Too old? |
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| (1497287) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by pragmatist on Tue Dec 25 15:05:52 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by 3-9 on Tue Dec 25 14:59:27 2018. 1. extremely old - parts and mechanicals obsolete parts difficult to obtain2. frame cracking found on some.... |
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| (1497288) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Tue Dec 25 15:08:02 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Dec 25 14:46:37 2018. How is it dead weight if it moves, especially providing the very motive power?And no, many straight electrics lasted no longer than comparable diesel-electrics. |
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| (1497294) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Tue Dec 25 17:38:39 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Broadway Lion on Tue Dec 25 12:49:45 2018. That's not how NJT does it with their ALP-45DP. |
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| (1497306) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by pragmatist on Tue Dec 25 19:27:49 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Tue Dec 25 17:38:39 2018. Correct. The P32-DM is not designed to run at full speed on 3rd rail power. It is built to run electric to get out of the tunnels. LIRR and NJT expect their DM to run full speed. |
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| (1497307) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by randyo on Tue Dec 25 19:34:28 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Dec 24 20:04:34 2018. NYCT is not much better considering that it has small signs at interlocking points informing T/Os what signals to take for which routes. |
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| (1497320) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Jersey Mike on Tue Dec 25 21:42:50 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Joe V on Mon Dec 24 16:26:42 2018. Also fleet oddballs often get stuck working peak period only schedules. |
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| (1497335) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 26 01:49:37 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Jersey Mike on Tue Dec 25 21:42:50 2018. The F40C was hardly a "fleet oddball" on Chicago rails. |
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| (1497342) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Ian Lennon on Wed Dec 26 03:59:00 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Dec 24 13:52:00 2018. It is my understanding that the F40C was always HEP. This is what I could never understand. Why did they not look at the steam water tanks? They were so focused on the damn trucks, while the answer was right there in front of them. Didn't anyone at Amtrak, or EMD ever look at the F40C? The answer was pretty obvious. Who would put all that sloshing weight up top and not expect it to sway? They should have at least put baffles in the water tanks. |
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| (1497344) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Ian Lennon on Wed Dec 26 04:18:48 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by pragmatist on Mon Dec 24 21:57:13 2018. It's just like the cut and cover method vs. deep bore. Even the cut and cover sections on 2nd Ave. needed modification to be used. |
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| (1497345) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Ian Lennon on Wed Dec 26 04:23:05 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Ian Lennon on Wed Dec 26 04:18:48 2018. What passed in 72 is a whole different world than today. |
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| (1497356) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Wed Dec 26 07:13:37 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Tue Dec 25 12:08:19 2018. CAF Order:70 baggage cars 25 diners. 10 Baggage-dorms 25 sleepers |
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| (1497357) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Wed Dec 26 07:15:49 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by pragmatist on Tue Dec 25 19:27:49 2018. The ALP45DP can handle 10 MLV cars in electric mode, but only 8 in diesel mode, and run "full" speed. |
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| (1497366) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 26 09:51:43 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Joe V on Wed Dec 26 07:15:49 2018. Still more than the P32AC-DM or DM30AC. Of course, that's not saying much, and there are no unwired corridors where any ALP-45DP-hauled train can run at 100 mph. |
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| (1497367) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 26 09:54:30 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by Ian Lennon on Wed Dec 26 03:59:00 2018. They should have at least put baffles in the water tanksJust like there are baffles in ever steam locomotive's water tender. But Amtrak at its outset was heavily into Keystone Kops mode, looking at every opportunity to self-destruct, blowing public money on the SDP40F and E60 despite their obvious (deliberate?) defects. |
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| (1497369) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by MorningsideHeightsM100 on Wed Dec 26 09:56:30 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by r33/r36 mainline on Mon Dec 24 07:23:21 2018. The only Gennies that I recall had rebuilds are the P32ACDMs that MNRR own. Not even sure if the Amtrak ones are rebuilt.Don't think those are being replaced by this order either. Not even close. |
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| (1497371) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 26 09:59:59 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Diesel locomotives for LD trains, posted by MorningsideHeightsM100 on Wed Dec 26 09:56:30 2018. That'll put a strain on the Empire Corridor. And NY State owns the ones Amtrak uses IINM. |
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| (1497372) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by pragmatist on Wed Dec 26 10:04:06 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 26 09:59:59 2018. If they don't own them, they pay for them as part of the Empire Service. Moving forward, they could choose to buy equipment much like other corridors have. |
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| (1497373) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by MorningsideHeightsM100 on Wed Dec 26 10:08:15 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by pragmatist on Wed Dec 26 10:04:06 2018. Except that they'll have to be dual mode in order to go into NYP via the Empire Connector tracks. |
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| (1497374) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 26 10:16:15 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by pragmatist on Wed Dec 26 10:04:06 2018. Such as what?The way that the NY Central did GCT-Albany (Union Station originally) service was to change between electric and non-electric power at Croton. (Who knows if building third rail all the way out to Albany was once planned.) The dual-mode operation is still relatively new, as is running out of NY Penn instead of GCT. Nothing else fits other than the present way of doing things. |
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| (1497377) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by pragmatist on Wed Dec 26 10:28:55 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by MorningsideHeightsM100 on Wed Dec 26 10:08:15 2018. Of course. But they have bought dual modes to enter NYP in the past (NY-MTA, not NYSDOT) for the LIRR. And for MNRR into GCT |
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| (1497379) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by pragmatist on Wed Dec 26 10:35:47 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 26 10:16:15 2018. California, Washington, and a cluster of midwest states have gotten together to replace Amtrak provided equipment with their own, Siemens Charger power, NS cars (now changed to Siemens cars), not dual modes, but the same situation as to owning rather than leasing from Amtrak. |
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| (1497380) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Dec 26 10:45:45 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by pragmatist on Wed Dec 26 10:35:47 2018. find the PR IIa rules, states must buy their own power. under those rules MN- LIRR - Amtrak(NYDOT) will have to buy the same Dual mode.http://www.highspeed-rail.org/Documents/Revised_DM_DC_3rd_Rail_Req_Doc_for_E-Board__Approved_-_1-6-15.pdf |
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| (1497382) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Dec 26 10:47:12 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Dec 26 10:45:45 2018. DUAL Mode ala France....ROARING |
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Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Dec 26 10:47:12 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Dec 26 10:45:45 2018. https://www.transportation.gov/content/passenger-rail-investment-and-improvement-act-2008-priia |
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| (1497385) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Wed Dec 26 10:48:50 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 26 09:54:30 2018. The E60CH and E60CP were different designs, with different placements for the steam generator. They didn't have any derailment issues, but Amtrak swore off C-C units after the SDP40F mess, and restricted the E60s to 85 MPH MAS on the NEC. That prematurely killed the GEs right there. |
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Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Dec 26 10:55:44 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by JayZeeBMT on Wed Dec 26 10:48:50 2018. hmm it sure did show derailment problems .The E60s began arriving in November 1974; they were the first locomotives to carry Amtrak's new Phase II livery. Problems soon developed, as the locomotives yawed sideways when accelerating, stressing the rails. The National Transportation Safety Board investigation after a derailment at Elkton, Maryland on February 24, 1975, revealed problems with the truck and bolster design.[23] The Federal Railroad Administration restricted the maximum speed of the E60s to 85 mph (137 km/h). While Amtrak accepted the locomotives and publicly expressed "confidence" that they would be cleared for 110 mph (177 km/h) operation, it also arranged for a trial of the Swedish-built four-axle Rc4 electric locomotive.[24] The problems with the E60 persisted into 1977, at which point Amtrak developed the specification for a locomotive based on the Rc4 design.[25] In 1977–78 Amtrak ordered the first of 53 EMD AEM-7s, a twin-cab B-B electric locomotive produced by Electro-Motive Division.[26] |
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| (1497389) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by pragmatist on Wed Dec 26 11:03:09 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Dec 26 10:45:45 2018. I understand that they will buy their own power going forward. I would expect that a common contract makes sense, the LIRR being the outlier, they require a higher max electric speed than either MN or Amtrak. |
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Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Dec 26 11:05:09 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by pragmatist on Wed Dec 26 11:03:09 2018. they only run in electric between Harold and NYP , gapping would prevent running longer distances as it raises havoc with car HVAC's etc. |
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Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by MorningsideHeightsM100 on Wed Dec 26 11:05:55 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by pragmatist on Wed Dec 26 11:03:09 2018. Which is because of the differences in voltages and power support systems?Is the ex-NYC a different voltage than LIRR? IIRC LIRR is at 750v. Not sure what MNRR is. |
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Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Dec 26 11:07:43 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by MorningsideHeightsM100 on Wed Dec 26 11:05:55 2018. same |
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| (1497393) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by pragmatist on Wed Dec 26 11:08:59 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Dec 26 11:05:09 2018. How they use them and how they were spec'd for purchase are 2 different things... |
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Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Dec 26 11:11:59 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by pragmatist on Wed Dec 26 11:08:59 2018. so, read specs in PRiia document . |
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| (1497396) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by pragmatist on Wed Dec 26 11:18:53 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Dec 26 11:05:09 2018. Yeah, I sort of thought they switched a little before Harold so if they failed to switch over and died they wouldn't hose up the whole works.....Never quite "got" the whole LIRR power acquisition for a lot of reasons... |
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Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 26 11:59:33 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Joe V on Wed Dec 26 07:13:37 2018. I'm talking about when it was first announced. The only detail was "single-level cars". |
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Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Steamdriven on Wed Dec 26 12:06:22 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by JayZeeBMT on Wed Dec 26 10:48:50 2018. Does C-C mean 3 axles per truck? It seems like a great idea, lower axle load while at the same time allowing a bit more total weight for cases like dual modes. |
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| (1497400) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 26 12:26:30 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Steamdriven on Wed Dec 26 12:06:22 2018. C-C in US terminology means three axles on one truck and each axle having a separate traction motor. (In Europe, this is called Co-Co.)C-C in European terminology means a three-axle truck with all axles powered by a single traction motor. EMD E-units were A1A-A1A, meaning three-axle trucks with traction motors on the first and third axles; the center axle is unpowered. Depending on the kind of power employed, dual mode locomotives do not necessarily weigh more than straight diesel-electrics. The P32AC-DM is not heavier on rail than the P40DC or P42DC, although aside from having AC traction motors the significant difference is the P32AC-DM's lower-horsepower V12 prime mover versus the V16 prime mover in the other Genesis units. The FL9 had the unusual B-A1A wheel arrangement mostly due to having steam generators. |
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Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Wed Dec 26 12:55:11 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 26 11:59:33 2018. That's all it was ever to be. |
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| (1497402) | |
Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Joe V on Wed Dec 26 12:58:42 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 26 09:59:59 2018. NYS does not own any equipment that run on Amtrak Empire trains. |
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Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Dec 26 19:41:11 2018, in response to Re: Amtrak orders 75 new Siemens Charger locomotives for LD trains, posted by Joe V on Wed Dec 26 12:58:42 2018. like hell, the 18 P32acdm's were bought and paid for by NYCDOT.NYDOT also paid for shitload of heritage cars to be overhauled , but they disappeared real fast, despite being earmarked for NYS use only. |
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