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| LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck (1483112) | |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by pragmatist on Mon Aug 6 20:30:06 2018, in response to LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Aug 6 19:57:15 2018. What about people who think the wall is a waste of money because the money could be better spent going after the people who violate the laws by hiring people who can not legally work in the US. People who not be coming here in large numbers if there weren't a ready supply of dishonest people standing in line to hire them. Hire off the books so we don't have to pay taxes, pay cash to save the sales tax, don't check credentials of their landscapers or domestics because the don't want to know... remember something about casting the first stone ..... |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by AlM on Mon Aug 6 20:36:32 2018, in response to LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Aug 6 19:57:15 2018. There will be no witch hunt for peeps here, but the border MUST be closed to further undocumented immigration.Illegal immigration is way down from levels in 2000. A wall in Big Bend National Park will stop no one. No one crosses there anyway (even though it's trivial) because it's a deadly 100 mile walk to the nearest through highway up in Alpine TX. A wall does not stop people who overstay their visa. Basically, it's just a huge waste of money. |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Aug 6 20:47:52 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by AlM on Mon Aug 6 20:36:32 2018. It’s just bread and circuses for the Trumpenproletariat. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Aug 6 20:48:25 2018, in response to LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Aug 6 19:57:15 2018. Barely on topic. Belongs in OTChat. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by italianstallion on Mon Aug 6 20:50:45 2018, in response to LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Aug 6 19:57:15 2018. "As for peeps already here it was the consensus that none would be deported (as long as they break not the laws). There will be no witch hunt for peeps here,"Then why is Trump deporting them? |
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| (1483120) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by italianstallion on Mon Aug 6 20:51:25 2018, in response to LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Aug 6 19:57:15 2018. "Simply sign up at your US consulate in your country and get a VISA."You seem to think that's easy. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by pragmatist on Mon Aug 6 20:59:30 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by italianstallion on Mon Aug 6 20:51:25 2018. Except for the 38 countries for which there is no visa requirement.... |
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| (1483122) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Andrew Saucci on Mon Aug 6 21:53:01 2018, in response to LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Aug 6 19:57:15 2018. If local governments would fund their own infrastructure improvements instead of relying on Uncle Sam, the horse trading at the federal level would be unnecessary. |
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| (1483123) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Dave on Mon Aug 6 22:07:08 2018, in response to LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Aug 6 19:57:15 2018. Wrong forum. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Aug 6 23:59:33 2018, in response to LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Aug 6 19:57:15 2018. LION spoke with many conservative pols there, all are in favor of new tunnels for NYPName them. If they are actual conservatives, they'd be for tunnels that were built and owned by private enterprise. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Tue Aug 7 00:01:46 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by pragmatist on Mon Aug 6 20:30:06 2018. What about people who think the wall is a waste of money because the money could be better spent going after the people who violate the laws by hiring people who can not legally work in the USThat is not the main driver of the presence of illegal aliens. Although that needs to be done. So does a border wall. After all, Felipe Calderon built a wall between Mexico and Guatemala. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Tue Aug 7 00:02:16 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Dave on Mon Aug 6 22:07:08 2018. He is talking about NYP tunnels. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by AlM on Tue Aug 7 02:32:40 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Aug 6 20:47:52 2018. Agreed. But it's sad to see him among the gullible. |
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| (1483135) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by AlM on Tue Aug 7 02:33:50 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by pragmatist on Mon Aug 6 20:59:30 2018. For a visitor's visa. There is always a visa requirement for working here. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Aug 7 03:09:48 2018, in response to LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Aug 6 19:57:15 2018. not much rail content. 'get thee behind me satan" |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by FormerVanWyckBlvdUser on Tue Aug 7 03:14:30 2018, in response to LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Aug 6 19:57:15 2018. USA builds wall at border. Mexico builds deeper tunnels under wall at border. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by jimmymc25 on Tue Aug 7 03:22:24 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by FormerVanWyckBlvdUser on Tue Aug 7 03:14:30 2018. "USA builds wall at border. Mexico builds deeper tunnels under wall at border"And Mexico will probably get the USA to pay for the deeper tunnels too! heh. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Dave on Tue Aug 7 07:20:04 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Olog-hai on Tue Aug 7 00:02:16 2018. Ah, I missed that in Lion's post. Apologies, Lion! |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Tue Aug 7 10:43:53 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Olog-hai on Tue Aug 7 00:01:46 2018. That is absolutely the main driver of illegal immigration. Except in your imagination. |
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| (1483153) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Tue Aug 7 11:15:09 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Andrew Saucci on Mon Aug 6 21:53:01 2018. Sure, LION agrees to that but how to fund such a thing, ah, that is the question.Yess, it can be done esp in concert with CSX and NS who woulod get freight tunnels under the river with stops in Manhattan for the pax trains. While $60 billion is no longer chump change, I cannot see it being raised by bonds either. Who will pay back the bonds. I'd not invest in such a bond for fear of never being paid back. Bonds are ok for small projects, these have a decent possibility of repayment, but not one that big. Maybe sell you bonds to the Federal Government. ROAR |
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| (1483330) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Nilet on Thu Aug 9 01:23:22 2018, in response to LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Aug 6 19:57:15 2018. Just FYI— a single offhand mention of a rail tunnel does not justify posting an unhinged racist rant on the main board. Keep it to OTChat. Or better yet, keep it to yourself. |
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| (1483331) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Nilet on Thu Aug 9 01:23:25 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by italianstallion on Mon Aug 6 20:51:25 2018. He never got a visa, but he demands other people do so. That is the definition of a hypocrite. |
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| (1483342) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by pragmatist on Thu Aug 9 06:50:39 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by AlM on Tue Aug 7 02:33:50 2018. That is one of the root problems. People come here and don't leave. Tourist, work, and student visas where required are routinely overstayed. They are employed by companies or individuals who don't care about the work status of people they hire. |
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| (1483352) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Aug 9 08:14:18 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Nilet on Thu Aug 9 01:23:22 2018. LION said nothing racist.ROAR |
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| (1483353) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Aug 9 08:15:07 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Nilet on Thu Aug 9 01:23:25 2018. Why would I need a visa???Besides of course a VISA card? ROAR |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Aug 9 14:40:36 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by FormerVanWyckBlvdUser on Tue Aug 7 03:14:30 2018. So Mexico = Hamas? |
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| (1483398) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Nilet on Thu Aug 9 16:34:42 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Aug 9 08:15:07 2018. Why would I need a visa???Why would anyone? If you didn't get a visa, but you demand other people get one as a condition of being allowed to exist under US law, then you are a hypocrite. |
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| (1483399) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Nilet on Thu Aug 9 16:35:09 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Aug 9 08:14:18 2018. Just stop it. |
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| (1483451) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Alan Follett on Fri Aug 10 00:31:23 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Nilet on Thu Aug 9 16:34:42 2018. Hmm? A visa is authorization by one country’s government for a foreign citizen to enter that country. I don’t know of any situation in which one would need a visa to enter or be present in one’s own country.Alan Follett |
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| (1483452) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Nilet on Fri Aug 10 01:07:56 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Alan Follett on Fri Aug 10 00:31:23 2018. I don’t know of any situation in which one would need a visa to enter or be present in one’s own country.Quite a few million Americans are called "illegal" specifically because they don't have visas. |
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| (1483459) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Alan Follett on Fri Aug 10 08:11:15 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Nilet on Fri Aug 10 01:07:56 2018. Sorry, I think there may be a problem of terminology. If you’re using “American” in the specific sense of “US citizen,” their presence is automatically legal; no visa is required, and none would or could be issued. Of course, there are some millions of Americans in the broader geographical sense of “persons from the Americas” who are non-citizens here unlawfully with no visa, or an expired visa; but I very much much doubt that that’s LION’s situation. If he were, say, a closet Brazilian, wouldn’t he be Broadway JAGUAR?Alan Follett South San Francisco, CA |
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| (1483460) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Aug 10 08:27:41 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Nilet on Thu Aug 9 16:35:09 2018. You see, that is what leftists do.I said that I said nothing racist. You shut off the conversation. ROAR |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Alan Follett on Fri Aug 10 08:52:42 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Alan Follett on Fri Aug 10 08:11:15 2018. Oh, and to nitpick myself, I’m aware that Chile is a visa-waiver country, and that Argentina and Uruguay formerly were. However, VW status only authorizes 90 days’ presence, and does not entail work authorization.Alan Follett South San Francisco, CA |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Nilet on Fri Aug 10 08:59:57 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Alan Follett on Fri Aug 10 08:11:15 2018. Sorry, I think there may be a problem of terminology.To clarify: An "American" is someone who resides in the United States of America and intends to do so for the foreseeable future. It also includes people who have previously resided in the United States of America, currently reside elsewhere, but intend to return to the United States of America in the foreseeable future. Within that category, some millions of people are told it's "illegal" to exist for failure to procure a visa, or have been exiled from their country for lack of visa. If you’re using “American” in the specific sense of “US citizen,” their presence is automatically legal; no visa is required, and none would or could be issued. With regards to terminology, a citizenship and a visa both belong to a category of legal documents that might be referred to collectively as "existence permits." Without an existence permit, your existence will be declared "illegal," though a visa and a citizenship both meet the criteria. Broadway Lion has claimed that other people should be required to put considerable effort into obtaining an existence permit, yet he has put no effort into acquiring one for himself, and has offered no justification for a double standard. It also means that using "American" to mean "US citizen" simply tries to dodge the question by definition— even the worst criminals can truthfully state that they're innocent of all the crimes that they didn't commit. Of course, there are some millions of Americans in the broader geographical sense of “persons from the Americas” who are non-citizens here unlawfully with no visa, or an expired visa; but I very much much doubt that that’s LION’s situation. I'm not talking about "persons from the Americas." I'm talking about Americans— people who reside in the United States and intend to do so for the foreseeable future. Broadway Lion falls into that category. So do quite a few million people whose existence is declared "illegal" because they have failed to acquire paperwork that Broadway Lion demands they obtain despite never having done so himself. If he were, say, a closet Brazilian, wouldn’t he be Broadway JAGUAR? If he were Brazilian, he would not be subject to US law while at home, and so the point would be moot. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Nilet on Fri Aug 10 09:03:54 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Aug 10 08:27:41 2018. Numerous previous exchanges with you have made it quite clear that you are not intellectually capable of holding a conversation more sophisticated than that typically heard in kindergarten classrooms.I can't possibly debate your beliefs, because you don't actually understand what you believe; you just memorize by rote and recite on cue. Moreover, you would be wise to learn that nobody owes you a conversation. If you spew racist garbage and people shun you, then you should learn to stop spewing racist garbage— claiming that if nobody is bothering to debate you then you've "won" might give you momentary satisfaction but it's hardly the recipe for a fulfilling life. |
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| (1483477) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Aug 10 11:28:26 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Nilet on Fri Aug 10 09:03:54 2018. But I said nothing racist. Maybe you see racism under every cabbage leaf. |
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| (1483482) | |
Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Aug 10 11:38:19 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Nilet on Fri Aug 10 08:59:57 2018. But I do have the required documentation required for an Real ID Identification (Enhanced ND Driver's License)Required Documentation Information To obtain a REAL ID compliant driver license, permit, or ID card you must present proper documentation. The following documentation from each category 1, 2, and 3 is required: Category 1 1. Proof of Identification All individuals applying for a permit, license, or Identification card must show proof of identity, date of birth, legal presence in the United States, by presenting one of the documents listed below. As a reminder, no photocopies; no hospital certificates; all documents must be original or certified copies only: U.S. birth certificate (state certified; Government issued) Valid, unexpired U.S. passport Report of Birth Abroad issued by the U.S. Department of State Certificate of Naturalization Certificate of Citizenship Valid, unexpired Permanent Resident Card Valid, unexpired Employment Authorization Card Valid, unexpired Foreign Passport with I-94 I-94 Card stamped Refugee or Asylee If your current name is different than the name on your identity document, you will need to bring additional proof of your legal name. Acceptable documents for proof of name change are a certified marriage certificate, a certified adoption document or a certified court order authorizing a name change (no photocopies, court seal required). Individuals born in North Dakota may obtain a copy of their certified birth certificate by contacting Vital Records at the North Dakota Department of Health (visit www.ndhealth.gov/vital for details.) Individuals born in another state may access vital record offices through www.vitalrec.com or http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/w2w.htm Category 2 2. Proof of your social security number by presenting one of the documents listed below: Social Security Card (the actual blue and white paper card) W-2 Form SSA 1099 Form Non-SSA 1099 Form Pay stub (must contain name and social security number) Category 3 3. Proof of North Dakota residence address by presenting one document from List A and one document from List B OR two documents from List A: List A A government issued property tax form Mortgage/Lease/Rental document Homeowners/renter’s insurance policy Utility bill (electricity, gas, water, sewer, cable, recycle) Residential non-cellular telephone bill Parent’s proof of address for a minor child List B North Dakota Driver’s License, ID Card, or Permit Valid North Dakota Vehicle Registration or Vehicle Title Transcript or report card from accredited school Statement from a financial institution (bank, credit union, or other financial institution) Credit, debit, or charge card statement Pay stub or statement from employer All documents must contain your name and physical residence address. Post Office boxes are NOT acceptable for residence address. No photocopies, all documents must be original or certified copies only. Why should anything less than this be required of anyone else??? |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Alan Follett on Fri Aug 10 12:03:17 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Nilet on Fri Aug 10 08:59:57 2018. Okay, it is terminology, then. By your proffered definition, there are indeed “Americans” whose presence is unlawful, as evidenced by lack of a current visa or resident alien card. But nothing in that definition would require the large subset of Americans-by-your-definition who are US citizens to obtain those documents—indeed, a citizen /couldn’t/ have those documents in current status. If for some reason citizen status needs to be proved—well, see LION’s list of Real ID evidence requirements. (I’m not, by the way, particularly a fan of the Real ID Act, which is currently creating chaos in California DMV offices.)Alan Follett Hercules, CA |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Aug 10 12:13:26 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Alan Follett on Fri Aug 10 12:03:17 2018. In North Dakota you can get a REAL ID or an un-real ID (Driver License)Perhaps later the lesser ID will disappear. ROAR |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Alan Follett on Fri Aug 10 12:29:09 2018, in response to LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Aug 6 19:57:15 2018. I think the main driver (so to speak) of the current rush of Real ID applications in that in a couple of years an RID-compliant document will be required for airline boarding. I have a passport, but my driver’s license is up for renewal next year anyway, so I’ll probably just pick an odd hour on a rainy midweek day in February, grit my teeth, and wait in line at DMV for Real ID.Alan Follett South San Francisco, CA |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Aug 10 12:31:54 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Alan Follett on Fri Aug 10 12:29:09 2018. In North Dakota you can make an appointment for your Real-ID card.ROAR |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by pragmatist on Fri Aug 10 12:36:19 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Aug 10 12:13:26 2018. REAL ID compliant documentation is required for entry into most Federal Facilities, and when the last of the extensions end, a non real id compliant drivers license will not get you on an airplane. The term "Enhanced" is confusing, since it is used by some states to describe a REAL compliant document, and by others (I believe 5) to describe a WHTI compliant DL with which you can cross a land or sea border (not air) in/out of a WHTI signatory country. Only available to a US citizen, it is very useful in states where people go in and out of Canada regularly, and don't wish to carry (or pay for) a passport. It is what I have for a NY DL. It is embedded with a chip that can be read at the border crossing. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Nilet on Fri Aug 10 12:39:32 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Alan Follett on Fri Aug 10 12:03:17 2018. But nothing in that definition would require the large subset of Americans-by-your-definition who are US citizens to obtain those documents—indeed, a citizen /couldn’t/ have those documents in current status.That's actually irrelevant. The point is that Broadway Lion didn't obtain such documents, yet he believes that other people should be required to as a condition of being allowed to exist. Therefore, Broadway Lion is either a bigot (who believes some people are inherently less worthy of human rights than he is) or he is a hypocrite (because he believes in equality, yet treats some people as lesser). While there is substantial evidence that he is a bigot, the principle of charity requires me to presume that he is the least odious of the available options, and thus merely a hypocrite. Hence, my initial post remarking on his hypocrisy. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Nilet on Fri Aug 10 12:44:10 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Aug 10 11:28:26 2018. Why do I think you're lying?Could it be this? Before you diss me for building a wall, a WALL is NOT a raciest thing If you felt the need to preemptively deny that you're being racist, you know you're being racist. Since you are being consistently dishonest, you render any sort of meaningful debate impossible. Maybe I should tell your dad abbot what you're up to and he'll take away your internet privileges. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by George Foelschow on Fri Aug 10 12:46:39 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Olog-hai on Thu Aug 9 14:40:36 2018. False equivalence. Numerous tunnels have been built under the Mexico-U.S. border wall by drug smugglers. I doubt that the drug smugglers are Hamas members. Numerous tunnels were constructed under the Berlin Wall by East Berliners escaping to the West. Again, no Hamas connection has been demonstrated. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Nilet on Fri Aug 10 12:50:01 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Aug 10 11:38:19 2018. See, if you were both smart enough to understand what you're saying rather than just memorizing beliefs by rote and reciting them on cue and you were mature enough to understand that everyone is entitled to the same fundamental rights before the law, you would see the problem with what you just posted very quickly.And if you were also honest, you wouldn't have posted it. I'm not going to hold your hand through becoming a minimally decent human being. Read over what you just posted and see if you can figure out what the problem is. If you can't, then you're plainly not worth my time trying to help; my lessons would be better spent on people actually capable of learning. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Alan Follett on Fri Aug 10 13:01:58 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Nilet on Fri Aug 10 12:39:32 2018. We’re talking past each other, I think. Didn’t because needn’t and couldn’t.I’m actually pretty liberal on immigration issues, but it doesn’t seem unreasonable for a nation to want to maintain some scrutiny and control over who is admitted. Documentation requirements are a mechanism for this. Alan Follett Hercules, CA |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Nilet on Fri Aug 10 13:21:39 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Alan Follett on Fri Aug 10 13:01:58 2018. Didn’t because needn’t and couldn’t.I'm not saying he should have. I'm saying it's hypocritical to demand other people do it when you yourself have not. Accordingly, one may avoid hypocrisy by either (1) doing it oneself, or (2) not demanding others do. Since, as you point out, (1) is not an option (and would be silly even if it were), that leaves (2). If you didn't jump through hoops to get a visa, you can't legitimately demand that other people do so. I’m actually pretty liberal on immigration issues, but it doesn’t seem unreasonable for a nation to want to maintain some scrutiny and control over who is admitted. Documentation requirements are a mechanism for this. Any argument based on the security of a nation is just as applicable to the security of a state. Surely New York should maintain some scrutiny and control over immigrants from New Jersey, Ohio, Florida, Puerto Rico, and Maine? Except that it does. If you want to move to New York, you'll need to register your new address. You'll probably need to get a New York driver's license (or other ID). If you have a car, you'll need to register it here. There's nothing wrong with any of that— but if New York declares that you're not allowed to move here unless you jump through nigh-insurmountable bureaucratic hoops just to obtain a provisional right to live in the state subject to exile at any time, then that would be a problem. Similarly, I have no objection to the US demanding that immigrants produce documentation of identity and register for citizenship— as long as it doesn't assert a right to exclude entry outright based solely on the circumstances of their birth. That's the distinction that Broadway Lion seems intent on ignoring amidst his lengthy lists of documents; at the end of the day, some people are born with an inherent fundamental right to live and work under US law, while other people must "earn" the right to exist through a process that is functionally impossible to complete, and this double standard is a form of bigotry that no civilised society should be willing to tolerate. In short, if I was born with the inherent right to live and work in the US, then the right to live and work in the US must be a fundamental human right, and denial of that right to millions of people is a crime against humanity. |
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Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Aug 10 13:31:19 2018, in response to Re: LION REPORT from CPAC Bismarck, posted by Nilet on Fri Aug 10 12:44:10 2018. A wall is a wall, a thing and a THING cannot be racist. The wall stops people from just walking across. It stops drug and or human smugglers from crossing.People who are honest, no matter what race, color, sexual orientation comes across at an established border crossing and presents their documentation. NEXT ISSUE.... There should be NO undocumented persons in the country. If you do not have US or state documentation, then you have documentation from your country of origin. WE will be delighted to accept your foreign documentation. If you do not have documentation from your home country, you should contact your consulate to obtain them. ROAR |
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