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Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Sat Apr 16 01:19:31 2016 We finally know that the shutdown of the (L) tunnels won't happen until 2019: |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Sat Apr 16 08:18:29 2016, in response to Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Wallyhorse on Sat Apr 16 01:19:31 2016. Lots of scheduling gymnastics to make the F, M, T all fit while syncing everything nicely with the E. Not saying it can't be done but will it mean that all of these lines run super slow all rush hour? |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by AlM on Sat Apr 16 08:40:21 2016, in response to Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Wallyhorse on Sat Apr 16 01:19:31 2016. Brooklyn, get ready: the L train tunnel will shut down in 2019.... “Planning and design work continues and no timeline has been established for work to begin on the Canarsie Tube itself,” MTA spokesman Chris McKniff said. Huh? |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by The silence on Sat Apr 16 09:55:45 2016, in response to Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Wallyhorse on Sat Apr 16 01:19:31 2016. Your idea was terrible then and is terrible now, so why do you insist on repeating it? |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sat Apr 16 10:07:53 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by AlM on Sat Apr 16 08:40:21 2016. I see MTA has a new mouthpiece. Never heard of this McKniff dude. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Sat Apr 16 11:17:55 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by New Flyer #857 on Sat Apr 16 08:18:29 2016. As I said before, there will be MAJOR problems no matter what, which is why I previously suggested what I did and also now incorporating the other idea of a separate Broadway-Brooklyn line to Broad from Canarsie that previously was suggested. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Sat Apr 16 11:19:30 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by The silence on Sat Apr 16 09:55:45 2016. Given what (L) riders want (according to this Gothamist article from February 25), the MTA might actually have to go the way I wrote whether they want to or not and whether it's a good idea or not. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Easy on Sat Apr 16 13:07:12 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by AlM on Sat Apr 16 08:40:21 2016. Shut down in 1st quarter 2019.short summary starting page 30 |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by The Silence on Sat Apr 16 17:49:07 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Wallyhorse on Sat Apr 16 11:19:30 2016. Here's the thing...THE RIDERS DON'T GET A SAY The MTA doesn't have to do ANYTHING because of what they want, because what they want is preposterous. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Sat Apr 16 18:09:15 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by The Silence on Sat Apr 16 17:49:07 2016. Oh, it is preposterous, but I think you will be hearing a lot between now and then.You and I know a third tunnel (unless it was part of a build to eventually connect such to the SAS) is unrealistic and would take a lot longer. I'm sure there will be pressure on the MTA to placate to such between now and then. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Michael549 on Sat Apr 16 18:41:39 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by The silence on Sat Apr 16 09:55:45 2016. From a previous message:"Your idea was terrible then and is terrible now, so why do you insist on repeating it?" Wallyhorse repeats his ideas and proposals, often! He may even "dust off" an old proposals, and repeat them. It is his nature. We (or at least I) expect Wallyhorse to repeat one of his proposal suggestions. There's nothing new here. A couple of weeks ago an M-train was re-routed to 168th Street/Washington Heights - due to a problem on the Sixth Avenue line. There were jokes on the forum of Wallyhorse very much enjoying such an action, since one of his fondest dreams had possibly come true. If after a while Wallyhorse did not repeat one of his long-time proposals, or did not create a new set of proposals - we'd start to wonder if something bad had happened to him! Mike |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Apr 16 18:45:49 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by The Silence on Sat Apr 16 17:49:07 2016. In a democracy (republicif you insist) that situation is defective. Of course building a brand new tunnel would be very expensive, and without lots of bureaucratic waivers, take an eternity, but the long term advantages are potentially huge. So, from my POV, hard fight but likely worthwhile especially if the pressure can include wiping out most of the NIMBY delaying tactics. For comparison, imagine telling anyone 20 years ago that the IRT Flushing Line would be built overo Hudson Yards before the SAS got the stubway up and running. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Apr 16 18:51:29 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Michael549 on Sat Apr 16 18:41:39 2016. While I make no comment as to Wallyhorse's behavior, I point out that apparently citizens actually using the L are making these noises. Just because they aren't all TA lifers does not make them either stupid or irrelevant. And FWIW we should all remember that there are enough examples in history of "cockeyed ideas" which turned out to be brilliant--a French colonel was berated for suggesting tanks would simply drive around the Maginot Line. His bosses ignored him,but Hitler's generals didn't. Stateside Billy Mitchell was pilloried for the crazy idea of strategic bombers... |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Steamdriven on Sat Apr 16 18:56:25 2016, in response to Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Wallyhorse on Sat Apr 16 01:19:31 2016. Tunnel? They don't need no stinkin' tunnel!http://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/river-wood-4-3428617.jpg I will admit the above creates a difficult issue: Where to put the faregate. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sat Apr 16 19:45:11 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Apr 16 18:45:49 2016. They would have cued up that 1958 clip of Steve Allen laughing uncontrollably. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Apr 16 19:49:09 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Apr 16 18:51:29 2016. That is not true. The Maginot Line succeeded in that German troops had to invade through Belgium. The French planners knew this. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Apr 16 20:08:55 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sat Apr 16 19:45:11 2016. and how's your sister? |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Apr 16 20:15:43 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Apr 16 19:49:09 2016. A few extra gallons of fuel. wikipedia says"Ironically, Heinz Guderian is usually credited with creating what was to be known as Blitzkrieg in World War Two. However, the ideas of men such as Charles de Gaulle and Britain’s Captain Liddell-Hart tend to be overlooked when looking at the background to Blitzkrieg. Whereas Guderian was given Hitler’s full support once he got to power in 1933, de Gaulle found that his ideas were not seized on by the French High Command – a similar experience to Liddell-Hart. In World War Two, Charles de Gaulle commanded an armoured division. The French Army and the British Expeditionary Force wilted under the onslaught of the German’s Blitzkrieg which pushed both back to the beaches around Dunkirk." And from another site "De Gaulle's military ideas appeared in his book, The Army of the Future (1934). In the book he also criticized the static theories of war that was exemplified by the Maginot Line. The book was unpopular with the politicians and the military who favoured the idea of a mass army of conscripts during war. In 1936 de Gaulle was punished for his views by having his name taken of the promotion list." |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by merrick1 on Sat Apr 16 20:52:56 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Wallyhorse on Sat Apr 16 11:19:30 2016. It's not happening for three years. Most people in NYC are renters. The L riders surveyed today will be long gone to the suburbs or the next trendy neighborhood before the project happens. What they want really doesn't matter. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Sat Apr 16 20:58:17 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Wallyhorse on Sat Apr 16 11:17:55 2016. Why do all 3 trains HAVE to go to 179th St? Can't one of them be turned at Continental Ave, like the old days? Or, better still, turn the "M" on the center track, east of Queens Plaza, since it only has the "E" to contend with. That would allow the "G" to go to Forest Hills, with only the "R" sharing the same tracks. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by AlM on Sat Apr 16 21:03:07 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by The Silence on Sat Apr 16 17:49:07 2016. Of course the riders have a say. They get to vote with their feet.The MTA will devise a plan that tries to get people where they need to go, subject to budget and not excessively making the lives of other riders miserable. And if they get it wrong (some routes empty, others overly packed), they will try to adjust. Equally obviously, riders don't have the sole say. The MTA will make the trade-offs between competing interests. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Andrew Saucci on Sat Apr 16 21:05:20 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Apr 16 18:45:49 2016. No one is held to the impossible, in a democracy or any other system of government. If what the riders want is truly impossible, it isn't going to get done, no matter how much they gripe. Politics is the art of the possible. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Andrew Saucci on Sat Apr 16 21:09:42 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Steamdriven on Sat Apr 16 18:56:25 2016. Does a tall enough tree grow in Brooklyn? |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sat Apr 16 21:18:39 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Elkeeper on Sat Apr 16 20:58:17 2016. The purpose of the center track East of Queens Plaza is for emergency turning of trains and a place to get defective trains off the road so an investigation can be done. It is no longer used for scheduled revenue (passenger) service. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by AlM on Sat Apr 16 21:25:13 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sat Apr 16 21:18:39 2016. The closing of the 14th street tunnel is an emergency. You have 160 cars full of people that need to get into Manhattan in a different way during the peak morning hour.Maybe the obstacles to using the center track there are too difficult to overcome, but if there ever were a justification for trying, this would be it. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Sat Apr 16 21:47:31 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sat Apr 16 21:18:39 2016. Really? What about the R-9 holiday train? There is no reason why the "M" cant be turned back, using that track! |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Andrew Saucci on Sat Apr 16 21:58:33 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Elkeeper on Sat Apr 16 21:47:31 2016. The holiday train normally runs on weekends, not during rush hours. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Apr 16 22:12:16 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Andrew Saucci on Sat Apr 16 21:05:20 2016. True enough, but it is humankind's instinct to continuously push the envelope of possibility. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Sat Apr 16 22:49:45 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Michael549 on Sat Apr 16 18:41:39 2016. Wait for the miniseries. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Sun Apr 17 03:19:52 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Apr 16 18:51:29 2016. Exactly:As noted in the Gothamist article (linked twice elsewhere in this thread), those on the (L) were demanding a third tunnel be built (which we all know is unrealistic) and what I proposed might be the best compromise possible if they are going to be unrealistic with their demands. I never expected them to go THAT far (demanding a third tunnel be built), but I proposed what I did based on spreading out the pain as much as possible and with the least amount of problems as possible. As said, no matter what is chosen, the MTA is going to be dealing with a bad situation. Mine may just be the best of a slew of very bad options no matter how you slice it. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Sun Apr 17 03:21:38 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by AlM on Sat Apr 16 21:25:13 2016. At least on weekends and late nights. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Sun Apr 17 03:24:31 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Andrew Saucci on Sat Apr 16 21:58:33 2016. My plan for the (M) is to keep the (M) normal during that time, but supplemented by an "Orange (T)" that runs 6-7 TPH to 96th/2nd at all times with late nights and weekends the "Orange (T)" absorbing the current (M) shuttles that operate at those times (as noted before, the "Orange (T)" is the (M), just with a different letter that would go to the UES instead of Queens Boulevard). |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Sun Apr 17 09:32:49 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Wallyhorse on Sun Apr 17 03:24:31 2016. Can you provide a sample of, let's say, 34th St on the Sixth Ave line and imagine a typical AM rush hour and what minutes past the hour (:00 to :59) you imagine each train (F, M, and T) arriving? Maybe this would help me understand how it could all work. Because running three lines, all at different frequencies from one another, does not seem to be an easy feat, especially when two out of those three lines eventually merge with the E. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by AlM on Sun Apr 17 09:42:00 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Easy on Sat Apr 16 13:07:12 2016. Thanks. Very helpful. I see they are going to really put in entrances at Avenue A at the same time. That will save a lot of people a few minutes every day. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by AlM on Sun Apr 17 09:45:02 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by New Flyer #857 on Sun Apr 17 09:32:49 2016. His T would not merge with the E.In the morning AM northbound rush, 14 Fs, 7 Ms, and 7 Ts would merge quite evenly. The problem with Wally's plan is that (probably) 23rd St - Ely needs more service too. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sun Apr 17 10:02:36 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Elkeeper on Sat Apr 16 21:47:31 2016. The turning of 5 measly R1/9 trips on December Sundays every 90 minutes at the relay track at Queens Plaza pales in comparison of using it all day for regular service. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by AlM on Sun Apr 17 11:58:15 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sun Apr 17 10:02:36 2016. Actually, the real reason for turning M trains at Queens Plaza would have been in the early morning rush in order to get them back to Broadway Junction for a second northbound run. But given that we're now talking 2019 there probably will be enough cars available that that isn't necessary.But even so, what would keep it from happening if NYCT concluded it would be helpful? With a bunch of platform conductors you could clear the M train without holding up the E train behind it. And since we're talking morning rush, outbound, we're not talking about hordes of passengers. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Apr 17 13:29:27 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by AlM on Sun Apr 17 09:42:00 2016. Great. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Sun Apr 17 23:53:32 2016, in response to Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Wallyhorse on Sat Apr 16 01:19:31 2016. You cannot operate BOTH a rerouted C train to Rockaway Parkway PLUS a 6th Avenue (T) train. Not without reducing service to the current J/Z or M services, which would be a great big no-no during this shutdown. It will have to be one or the other. I'd choose the (T) if I were you, but I would operate it to/from Queens Plaza, NOT 96th & 2nd. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Mon Apr 18 00:01:34 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sat Apr 16 21:18:39 2016. What other options are there then? They're going to have to make some sort of accommodation for running additional trains to accommodate all the riders who will be displaced while the L's tunnels are shut down. The current amount of trains running between Brooklyn/Queens and Manhattan will not be enough to handle them all PLUS all the people who currently ride them. |
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Re: Queens Boulevard during (L) trains shutdown |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Mon Apr 18 05:48:01 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by AlM on Sun Apr 17 09:45:02 2016. The problem there is, for that to work, you likely need the (G) (M) and (R) to ALL be expanded to 179th Street (something I would consider doing at all times anyway with all three running to 179 24/7 during this shutdown except during CBTC work where only one track is available in one or both directions). Having all three run to 179 more importantly allows the (G) to stop at Queens Plaza and let people switch there to the (R) as well as (via an OOS transfer I would have during the shutdown) the (N) and (Q) at Queenboro Plaza (late nights and weekends, if necessary during CBTC work the (G) and (R) could run to Queens Plaza while the (M) continues to 71-Continental or 179 depending on needs).The idea of the split of the (M) into the (M) and (T) has to really do with the car shortage, as having half of such trains go to 96th/2nd and the other half to 71st-Continetal likely saves the use of an additional 1-2 trainsets that could be crucial to make this work. This also with the "Orange (T)" to 96th/2nd at all times eliminates the need for the current late night and weekend (M) shuttles as this (T) would absorb those while also giving riders on the stub portion of the SAS additional service on the UES, the one area that likely needs that level of service late nights and weekends. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Mon Apr 18 05:52:56 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by AlM on Sun Apr 17 09:42:00 2016. That is a long-overdue items that needs to be done.That said, I would not be surprised if between now and the actual shutdown (especially given 2018 is an election year in New York State) that pols demand the Manhattan portion of the (L) be kept open and running between 1st and 8th Avenues so those who actually use the (L) as the 14th Street crosstown to get to other lines (especially walking first from Avenues C & D) can do so (as I would do that portion then, running only four-car trains and having 7-8 sets on the Manhattan side for that purpose using the layup tracks and one side of 1st and 3rd Avenues for storage with whatever tunnel is not being worked on at that moment available for non-electric work trains to come in and swap cars out on a regularly scheduled basis since you only would need the front half of the 1st Avenue station for that purpose during that time anyway). |
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Re: (M) train during (L) tunnel closure |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Mon Apr 18 05:56:53 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by AlM on Sun Apr 17 11:58:15 2016. Yeah, but the problem is, ONE unruly passenger on a (M) train being fumigated at Queens Plaza could lead to unintended consequences. That is another reason why I would split the (M) into the (M) and (T), with the (T) going to 96th/2nd since that does not mess up Queens Boulevard AND gives riders on the upper east side additional service (especially since this "Orange (T)" would be operating 24/7, absorbing the late night and weekend (M) shuttles currently in place). |
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Re: Other lines during (L) tunnel shutdown |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Mon Apr 18 06:08:09 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Sun Apr 17 23:53:32 2016. First, I agree with some of this, but given what some (L) riders are demanding happen (according to Gothamist, already linked twice elsewhere), it would not surprise me if something close to what I pointed out in the original post has to happen.The reason I split the (M) with the additional trains run as (T) to 96th and 2nd have to do with two primary factors: 1. 71st-Continental. Given the QB local is already often a conga line at times, it would likely be better during that shutdown to have the current (M) along with the (G) and (R) all run to 179th Street, possibly with at least the (G) and (R) running there 24/7 during the (L) shutdown. Doing that has the (G) stopping at Queens Plaza, which allows those on the (G) to either switch to the (R) there or via an OOS transfer I would add the (N) or (Q) at Queensboro Plaza. 2. Car shortages. While this probably won't be as big an issue by the time this happens, having the "Orange (T)" run to 96th/2nd likely saves at least 1-2 sets of trains. 3. The SAS. The SAS may prove popular enough where something like an "Orange (T) could actually be added ahead of any (L) tunnel shutdown. Given how densely populated the UES is, having an "Orange (T)" in addition to the (Q) run to 96th/2nd is likely a very attractive option and something that ought to be considered as such can also as noted eliminate the (M) shuttles that run late nights and weekends since this (T) would absorb those. 4. CBTC. This work likely prevents the (M) from running on QB on many weekends anyway which is also why I have the "Orange (T)" to 96th/2nd. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Apr 18 09:23:14 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Sun Apr 17 23:53:32 2016. Fumigation at Queens Plaza, with 28-29 TPH?Are we looking at cutting some E service? 6th Ave would have 28 TPH, 53rd St would have 28-29 TPH, and somehow all of the switching has to get done. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Mon Apr 18 10:41:14 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Apr 18 09:23:14 2016. Well, the extra trains can't continue past Queens Plaza without cutting F train service. There is spare capacity on the Queens Blvd local tracks, but then you move the fumigation issue to 71st Ave and local trains will get backed up even further waiting to get into 71st. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Apr 18 11:04:42 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Mon Apr 18 00:01:34 2016. Trains would have to continue past Queens Plaza and terminate elsewhere. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by AlM on Mon Apr 18 11:32:09 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Apr 18 11:04:42 2016. Why?There may be a perfectly good reason, but you haven't mentioned it as far as I can see. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Apr 18 11:38:57 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by AlM on Mon Apr 18 11:32:09 2016. That's right, no good reason in your opinion, but I told you the reason why already and the purpose of the center track past Queens Plaza. |
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Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019 |
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Posted by randyo on Mon Apr 18 12:10:06 2016, in response to Re: Brooklyn-Manhattan tunnels on (L) train to close in 2019, posted by Wallyhorse on Mon Apr 18 05:52:56 2016. That would only work if only one of the tubes is taken out at a time. It sounds like the MTA wants to do both at once in order to get them back into service faster. |
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