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| A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure (1320079) | |
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Re: Correction: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by shiznit1987 on Wed Oct 22 16:40:34 2014, in response to A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by shiznit1987 on Wed Oct 22 16:39:23 2014. Meant to say NJT trains meant to leave Penn btw 2-10pm leave from Hoboken instead. |
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Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Wed Oct 22 17:02:02 2014, in response to A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by shiznit1987 on Wed Oct 22 16:39:23 2014. How do you cycle equipment? |
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Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by R30A on Wed Oct 22 17:18:12 2014, in response to A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by shiznit1987 on Wed Oct 22 16:39:23 2014. I think the solution is NJT goes to Hoboken, Amtrak reschedules its service so that there are 25 minute windows in each direction, Any remaining free slots not used by Amtrak can go to NJT. |
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Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by Outside the Box on Wed Oct 22 18:05:08 2014, in response to Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Wed Oct 22 17:02:02 2014. This plan doesn't cycle trains. AM rush NJT to NY Penn runs one way and layup at Sunnyside Yards. Those trains run Jerseybound during PM Peak. The Limiting factor is the number of trains the Yard can hold and open track spaces at NY Penn to hold trains Midday.The setup probably makes for 12tph Peak direction. |
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Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by shiznit1987 on Wed Oct 22 18:12:58 2014, in response to Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by R30A on Wed Oct 22 17:18:12 2014. As noted in the other thread, PATH nor ferries cannot in any way deal with that kind of load. At least here this gives the track priority over to where it truly belongs which is into the city in the morning and out of it in the evening. |
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| (1320101) | |
Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Wed Oct 22 18:14:11 2014, in response to Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by Outside the Box on Wed Oct 22 18:05:08 2014. Wouldn't you run out of trainsets. In the AM rush many trains arrive at NYP and d/h west to make another trip.Where do you get needed trainsets from since you need inbound equipment all day but you guys have nothing returning to NJ? |
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Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by shiznit1987 on Wed Oct 22 18:16:32 2014, in response to Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Wed Oct 22 17:02:02 2014. Good question. It's not a perfect plan I'll admit, but perhaps what will have to happen is have trains deadhead back to Hoboken to do the next Jersey bound run. So basically there will be set-asides of equipment specifically for trains going opposite the peak direction market. |
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| (1320103) | |
Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by shiznit1987 on Wed Oct 22 18:20:51 2014, in response to Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Wed Oct 22 18:14:11 2014. We might need to make a setup like this:Run 1: Hoboken to end point Run 2: end point to NYP then Sunnyside ...wait for PM rush... Run 1: NYP to end point Run 2: End point to Hoboken That will apply for some of the trains. Others will just run from their routes to Sunnyside and wait. |
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Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 22 19:10:17 2014, in response to A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by shiznit1987 on Wed Oct 22 16:39:23 2014. I prefer:1. Determine how long the tunnels will last without repair. 2. Tell NJT that the tunnels will be closing on that date. Invite them to build ARC/Gateway by then. 3. If they do not, then close one tunnel at a time and use the open tunnel exclusively for Amtrak trains. Or close both tunnels at the same time and have Amtrak trains terminate at Newark* with shuttle bus connections. 4. Tell NJT to fend for themselves. Wish them luck cramming rush hour traffic into Hoboken. *Additional fantasy plans include Amtrak building a connection to the old CNJ terminal while the tunnels are shut down, or cooperating with the MTA to rebuild the Staten Island North Shore line with the understanding that Amtrak will use it to bring their trains to St. George while the tunnels are closed and the MTA will take over the line once the tunnels have reopened. Other possible fantasy plans include terminating New York-bound Amtrak trains at a temporary terminal just outside the tunnels on the Jersey side. |
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| (1320112) | |
Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by shiznit1987 on Wed Oct 22 19:16:26 2014, in response to Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 22 19:10:17 2014. You can go the spiteful route, sure. And watch the literal flood of companies out of NYC and probably the whole metro region which will have a massive determental impact not just to the concept of rail traffic in America but also people's lives. |
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Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 22 19:57:12 2014, in response to Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by shiznit1987 on Wed Oct 22 19:16:26 2014. Literal flood of companies out of NYC?No, a literal flood is what broke the tunnels in the first place. A figurative flood of companies out of NYC is not going to happen simply because New Jersey Transit won't build new tunnels. It's certainly not going to be detrimental to American rail traffic as a concept. |
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| (1320131) | |
Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by Joe V on Wed Oct 22 20:55:22 2014, in response to A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by shiznit1987 on Wed Oct 22 16:39:23 2014. You cannot turn any of those southern trains in Washington. With the Regionals, VRE, and MARC, there is literally no room in the yards. There is also no expertise to service Viewliners. |
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Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 22 21:35:20 2014, in response to Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by Joe V on Wed Oct 22 20:55:22 2014. There is also no expertise to service Viewliners.If they're not running north of WAS, can't they use Superliners? |
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Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by Dyre Dan on Thu Oct 23 05:13:28 2014, in response to A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by shiznit1987 on Wed Oct 22 16:39:23 2014. What you would need to do if only one tube were open is to have 100% of trains be in the peak direction only during rush hours. Can Amtrak suspend all service heading south from NY during the morning rush, or heading north to NY during the evening rush? And can Sunnyside Yard hold all inbound NJT trains operating during the morning peak, so that they can head back in the evening? If so, we just might get by. What to do during middays might be the biggest problem. |
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Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by WillD on Thu Oct 23 07:59:48 2014, in response to Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 22 19:57:12 2014. Your denial of the simple fact that NJ is what NYC needs to keep growing does not make it any less true. |
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| (1320199) | |
Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Oct 23 08:06:00 2014, in response to Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by R30A on Wed Oct 22 17:18:12 2014. No, there need be no such window in each direction. 10 trains can all go into the city, and then send 10 trains out again. On a 2 minute headway inbound, you can push 10 trains through in 20 minutes, then you send 10 out. Just like flagging a highway.ROAR |
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Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by shiznit1987 on Thu Oct 23 17:12:30 2014, in response to Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by Dyre Dan on Thu Oct 23 05:13:28 2014. I'm trying to get as close to such a target as I can. Amtrak needs to run to Penn, so running a opposing direction regional every hour or so isn't going to ruin everything. My main goal is to maintain current rush hour NJT service levels into/from NYC during rush hours.Middays are fine, we can have everything run from Hoboken btw 10-4 if we have to. |
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Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure |
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Posted by Nilet on Thu Oct 23 19:47:47 2014, in response to Re: A way to maintain peak service into Penn in case of North River tunnel closure, posted by WillD on Thu Oct 23 07:59:48 2014. You have yet to offer any evidence that it is actually a fact. What does NJ have that NYC needs? |
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