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| Ok to ride around City Hall Loop (1307503) | |
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| (1307503) | |
Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Express Rider on Tue Aug 12 17:14:45 2014 Found this article in the Voice last night. If link has already been posted, sorry for the duplication:http://blogs.villagevoice.com/runninscared/2014/08/its_not_illegal_to_ride_the_6_train_through_the_abandoned_city_hall_station--so_why_were_these_guys.php |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Michael549 on Tue Aug 12 19:57:46 2014, in response to Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Express Rider on Tue Aug 12 17:14:45 2014. This is an interesting article.On one hand the MTA at times through the conductor's announcements and computer message systems instruct passengers to leave the train. At other times, it seems that the computerized messages indicate it is okay for riders to travel via the City Hall Station. At other times folks can get a ticket for doing so. And if enough of a news media commotion is made, the ticket is discarded. (Thank goodness for slow media periods.) Just a thought. Mike |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Keeping the RAPID in Rapid Transit on Fri Aug 15 20:55:20 2014, in response to Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Express Rider on Tue Aug 12 17:14:45 2014. Transit issued a Bulletin for employees yesterday: 1. It's legal for customers to ride the Loop, 2. Train crews do not have to clean out the train s/b at Brooklyn Bridge-City Hall, 3. conductors should play two automated announcements while in the Loop - the next stop is Brooklyn Bridge-City Hall, uptown plat, and customers should stay seated until the train makes the station stop at the uptown plat. |
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(Sponsored) |
iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Aug 17 16:02:38 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Keeping the RAPID in Rapid Transit on Fri Aug 15 20:55:20 2014. Excellent. Thanks for the update. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Express Rider on Tue Aug 19 05:11:17 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Keeping the RAPID in Rapid Transit on Fri Aug 15 20:55:20 2014. Woo-hoo....!! Finally!!- a friend and I were given grief by a conductor back in 1966 for riding around the loop..... Now they only have to put the platform railings back up, install gap fillers, record an announcement about the first five cars not platforming, get the same firm who did the kiosk at Astor Place to construct one or two replicas, and re-open the station... (in my dreams right???) |
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| (1308418) | |
Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Aug 19 07:21:52 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Express Rider on Tue Aug 19 05:11:17 2014. What do you mean "finally"? Such bulletins have been in effect for the past few years making it permissible to ride around the loop. |
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| (1308429) | |
Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Express Rider on Tue Aug 19 07:47:14 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Aug 19 07:21:52 2014. "Such bulletins have been in effect for the past few years..."Thanks for the info., I didn't know about them. Don't work for the MTA, nor do I know anyone who does (not an active ERA member or I would), and I live outside of the city so I don't use the subway every day. If you don't it would be hard to keep track of the bulletins. I remember older Subchat /Subtalk posts which have discussed this, and they contradict each other. Posts state it's been OK'd to ride around the loop, and then some time later (a month or more maybe), I would read soneone posting just the opposite. Then you try riding around the loop, and you're ordered off the train by conductors, and when you tell them you've heard it's ok to ride around the loop, and that it's revenue track they become surly and state that they haven't heard anything about it. Motormen have let me stay on, while saying, something like, 'you know you're not supposed to do this.' And obviously the cops who gave the guy a ticket weren't aware of these bulletins either. From that previous post, it sounds to a non MTA person, that the bulletin was issued once again, hopefully with some kind of priority, so the MTA wouldn't have to deal with a ticketed rider at either a hearing or in court. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Aug 19 13:38:52 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Express Rider on Tue Aug 19 07:47:14 2014. Thanks for the info., I didn't know about them.No problem. That's what I suspected. Here are the original threads: "Bronx-bound (6) train"...no more (385627) Question: Real Info (435261) |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Mitch45 on Tue Aug 19 17:04:49 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Keeping the RAPID in Rapid Transit on Fri Aug 15 20:55:20 2014. Until the NYPD gets the bulletin, it won't much matter. MTA employees are not the ones handing out tickets. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by randyo on Tue Aug 19 18:26:39 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Mitch45 on Tue Aug 19 17:04:49 2014. That may be true, but laws of discovery would require the appropriate bulletin to be produced in court requiring acquittal of the ticket recipient. |
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Re: Not Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Nilet on Tue Aug 19 18:55:31 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Michael549 on Tue Aug 12 19:57:46 2014. The Interborough Rapid Transit company faced scandal earlier this week for instructing the constabulary to detain customers boarding or alighting at the City Hall station.Mr. Belmont could not be reached for comment, but his representative cited the importance of preventing passengers from riding trains through the City Hall loop. "It's just, like, not a good thing, dude," he told reporters from the Herald. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Tue Aug 19 19:01:03 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Mitch45 on Tue Aug 19 17:04:49 2014. even if they get the Bulletin, the cops will still fuck with people. I think... |
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| (1308523) | |
Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Nilet on Tue Aug 19 19:10:11 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by LuchAAA on Tue Aug 19 19:01:03 2014. Yeah. The cops fucked with me just yesterday.I was waiting for the train when a cop approached me. He said: "We got a call about you." I said: "Oh?" He said: "They said you were walking down the platform." I waited for him to finish. I realised that he had. He realised he sounded very silly. He said: "...did you walk past the end of the platform?" I said: "No." He said: "OK then." And he left. OK, maybe "fuck with" isn't the correct phrase, but you read this far so it works in a sort of marketing sense or summat. I eagerly await certain Usual Suspects screeching about how this proves I'm an evil criminal who does bad things and breaks the law. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue Aug 19 22:38:23 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by randyo on Tue Aug 19 18:26:39 2014. You don't GET to do "discovery" with an administrative law judge unless you seriously want to spend far more money on your own wallet than it'll ever be worth. :( |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Mitch45 on Wed Aug 20 08:34:50 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by LuchAAA on Tue Aug 19 19:01:03 2014. Why? |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Mitch45 on Wed Aug 20 08:35:31 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by randyo on Tue Aug 19 18:26:39 2014. Yes, but the police may be banking on someone just paying the fine instead of going to all of the bother of fighting it. |
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| (1308590) | |
Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Mitch45 on Wed Aug 20 08:40:28 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue Aug 19 22:38:23 2014. I once fought a bogus traffic citation (some Barney Fife of a cop in a Long Island village ticketed me for "unlawful use of a car horn" - I had honked my car horn at the car in front of me when the driver failed to notice that the light had turned green). I had to go to court three times before I ever got a trial date and then I had to attend a "conference" with the "Village DA". I told him that I was a lawyer, would be representing myself and was ready to proceed. The "DA" basically admitted that the Village had no case but also told me that the judge could keep adjourning the case and making me come down to the courthouse until I gave in. Since I didn't want to keep losing time from work, I agreed to pay the fine ($50) and the "DA" agreed to "waive the service charge" incurred when I actually demanded to have a trial!!It was the most kangarooish of a kangaroo court I have ever seen in over 23 years of practice, and believe me, I've seen plenty. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Aug 20 09:24:15 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Mitch45 on Wed Aug 20 08:40:28 2014. That is sick. No wonder even the ordinary law-abiding person has lost trust in governmental institutions—all thanks to liberalism. |
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| (1308599) | |
Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Aug 20 09:52:50 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Mitch45 on Wed Aug 20 08:34:50 2014. 'cause cops cannot read. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Patrick Boylan on Wed Aug 20 10:09:56 2014, in response to Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Express Rider on Tue Aug 12 17:14:45 2014. I don't remember for sure if I've ever posted my dark secret, or even told anybody the old fashioned way. I had long heard "if you ask the crew they might let you ride around", but had never tried.Sometime in the last 20 or so years I was at the 6's end of the line. Just to show how much I'm not a New Yorker, I don't even know for sure what station it is. I was surprised to see dozens of people on the southbound platform, who did indeed board the train and were still on board when it came back around northbound. Subsequently I rode around myself, accompanied by dozens of other seemingly jaded and knowledgeable commuters. Moral of this story, what's happened that cops are now apparently very selectively ticketing lone round City Hall station riders when the practice last time I looked, again admittedly more than 10 years ago, was that dozens of regulars per train often did it? |
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| (1308616) | |
Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by italianstallion on Wed Aug 20 10:50:21 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Aug 20 09:24:15 2014. You are so full of it. Local kangaroo courts are as likely to be staffed by conservatives as by liberals. |
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| (1308620) | |
Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by AlM on Wed Aug 20 11:15:42 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Mitch45 on Wed Aug 20 08:40:28 2014. But isn't it actually improper use of a car horn to honk just because the guy ahead of you failed to move at a green light? |
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| (1308621) | |
Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Train Dude on Wed Aug 20 11:22:27 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Aug 20 09:24:15 2014. Well it likely works both ways but with liberal mayors come liberal appointees. |
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| (1308625) | |
Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by randyo on Wed Aug 20 12:41:20 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue Aug 19 22:38:23 2014. Get a good ACLU lawyer and make a federal civil rights case out of it. Then all court costs and attorneys fees will be paid. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by randyo on Wed Aug 20 12:43:23 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Mitch45 on Wed Aug 20 08:35:31 2014. Sue toe officer in Federal court for violation of your civil rights. Right now with a certain amount of anti police sentiment seeming to build up across the country such a suit will probably be relatively easy. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by italianstallion on Wed Aug 20 12:56:21 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by AlM on Wed Aug 20 11:15:42 2014. Yes, it is. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Aug 20 13:10:40 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by randyo on Wed Aug 20 12:41:20 2014. This has nothing to do with civil rights. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Aug 20 13:11:14 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by italianstallion on Wed Aug 20 12:56:21 2014. So then how do you signal to the driver that the light is green? |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by AlM on Wed Aug 20 13:15:29 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Aug 20 13:11:14 2014. My understanding is that in most jurisdictions you are not allowed to do so. Honking is only to indicate danger. |
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| (1308631) | |
Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Aug 20 13:16:45 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by AlM on Wed Aug 20 13:15:29 2014. I'd say that ignoring a traffic control device is dangerous. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 20 13:35:25 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Aug 20 13:16:45 2014. Vigilantism will not be tolerated. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by italianstallion on Wed Aug 20 13:53:42 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Aug 20 13:16:45 2014. Different rules in NYC and NYS -State law allows horn to be used as "a reasonable warning." City law only allows horn to be used in event of an "imminent danger." |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Aug 20 14:43:50 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Aug 20 13:11:14 2014. You give them a gentle push. :) |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by chud1 on Wed Aug 20 15:27:23 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by AlM on Wed Aug 20 13:15:29 2014. hit ur high beam headlights.chud1. :).... |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by italianstallion on Wed Aug 20 15:30:06 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by chud1 on Wed Aug 20 15:27:23 2014. Might work. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by randyo on Wed Aug 20 15:36:25 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Aug 20 13:10:40 2014. Why not? If a so called law enforcement officer attempts to enforce a non existent law then he/she is operating outside the scope of his/he legitimate authority and therefore is violating a citizen's civil rights. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Mitch45 on Wed Aug 20 15:49:37 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by AlM on Wed Aug 20 11:15:42 2014. This is what the New York Vehicle & Traffic Law says about the use of a car horn.VTL 375(1): ...a suitable and adequate horn or other device for signaling, which horn or device shall produce a sound sufficiently loud to serve as a danger warning but shall not be used other than as a reasonable warning nor be unnecessarily loud or harsh. To me, this statute is very vague because on the one hand, the horn is described as a device used for "signaling" but then it goes on to state that the horn must serve as a "danger warning" but cannot be used for other than a "reasonable warning." Clearly, the statute was intended to limit horn use to notify another driver of the presence of your vehicle in order to avoid an accident (such as if the other driver is changing lanes without seeing that you are already in the other lane). This is the "danger warning". However, the fact that the statute also mentions "signaling", apart from the "danger warning" part suggests that the horn can be used to "signal", i.e., send a message to other cars that you are present. Obviously, this is not carte blanche to blast your horn for 30 seconds but it seems to me that there is room in this statute to allow one to honk one's horn to remind someone that a light is green. So, to answer your question, it is not specifically prohibited. In my opinion. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Aug 20 19:32:21 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Mitch45 on Wed Aug 20 08:40:28 2014. Heh. Come on upstate and see how that flies in some of the hamlets around here. As much as that sucks, they REALLY bite your tail if you don't mail in the fine and go away. Hannacroix (just south of Selkirk) has a deal with the State Troopers and a politically connected speed trap going under the bridge at Coxsackie on the Thruway that's been going on there for decades. They even have radars mounted on the bridge.The judge is in once a week. If you REALLY want to deal with him in person. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Aug 20 19:34:21 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by italianstallion on Wed Aug 20 10:50:21 2014. I'd LOVE to see Olog come up to Hannacroix and try to tell the town justice that he's a liberal. :) |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Train Dude on Thu Aug 21 00:34:46 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Aug 20 19:32:21 2014. hahahahaah |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Nilet on Thu Aug 21 01:20:49 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Aug 20 09:24:15 2014. Name three people you believe are not liberal. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Thu Aug 21 01:36:31 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Aug 20 19:32:21 2014. They even have radars mounted on the bridge.Isn't that why we have the second amendment? :-P |
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| (1308721) | |
Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Aug 21 10:29:19 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Mitch45 on Wed Aug 20 15:49:37 2014. But it appears to be prohibited in NYC. |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Thu Aug 21 19:32:53 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Thu Aug 21 01:36:31 2014. That only works on power lines. The radars on the bottom of the bridge over the thruway lanes are pretty small. They look like webcams. :) |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Thu Aug 21 19:37:15 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by Train Dude on Thu Aug 21 00:34:46 2014. WATD! Yeah, go ahead and laugh. Save this page, yo. You may need it. :)http://nysthruwaytrafficlawyer.com/coxsackie_town_court.htm |
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Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop |
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Posted by Express Rider on Sat Aug 23 15:16:04 2014, in response to Re: Ok to ride around City Hall Loop, posted by SelkirkTMO on Thu Aug 21 19:37:15 2014. There was an NYT article sometime in the 90s about local "shoestring style" (my description) courts upstate. One example given was when sessions were held in a "judge's" own private garage etc. |
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