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| Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs (1221423) | |
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Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 11:37:19 2013 Suburban News
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 12:01:06 2013, in response to Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 11:37:19 2013. (Eliminating a transfer in Newark means a 35-minute reduction in commuting time)Average transfer time is 10 minutes. 35 for a round trip is quite a stretch. There are no rush hour slots to be had. They can dream on. They are hoping to exile a NJCL or NEC train to Newark or Hoboken. The RVRC has nothing else on their agenda but this, which affects 38% of RVL loadings. How about more shoulder rush frequencies and do something for the 62% that do not go to NYPS. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 12:27:56 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 12:01:06 2013. There's capacity during off-peak hours. However, I cannot see the possibility of direct one seat service at all times EXCEPT rush hour. People will start bitching and demand other lines be cut. Civil war. |
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(Sponsored) |
iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by AlM on Sat May 11 12:34:36 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 12:27:56 2013. Hmm. Perhaps the capacity to midtown Manhattan needs to be increased. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 12:36:10 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 12:27:56 2013. No need for the Lackawanna lines to dominate. Montclair Direct was overkill, and even cut into the traditional direct NJCL service. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 12:54:30 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by AlM on Sat May 11 12:34:36 2013. An affordable expansion, both the ARC and Amtrak proposals are not. I've advocated building a single new Hudson River tube and 4 additional stub tracks south of Track 1 at NYP as the most reasonably cost-effective solution. |
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| (1221435) | |
Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 13:02:38 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 12:36:10 2013. RVL electrification was hampered by having to share track with CSA between Hunter and Aldene. It was cheaper to simply extend the wire from Bay St to Great Notch than to electrify the entire RVL. The dual modes now make this problem moot, but now the capacity into NYP is gone. |
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| (1221440) | |
Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Dan on Sat May 11 13:50:29 2013, in response to Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 11:37:19 2013. "Every minute saved on a morning commute to NYC increases nearby home values by $3,000"Really? Sounds high because more and more NJ residents work in-state in surrounding suburbs. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 13:51:33 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Dan on Sat May 11 13:50:29 2013. Been hearing that for a decade or so. Yet demand for the train to go to Manhattan still is not wavering. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 13:56:49 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 13:02:38 2013. There was never to be electrification of the Aldene Plan.One of the original PRR-sponsored alternates was to have the CNJ take over Exchange Place Terminal (which was the CNJ's original waterfront terminus prior to crossing Newark Bay and building their own, ironically), getting there via the Aldene/Hunter connector and Newark Penn. As for the Montclair-Boonton, if NJT really weren't working on dual modes, they would have electrified all the way to Denville and not even built stations like MSU or Wayne Route 23. |
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| (1221443) | |
Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 13:58:49 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by AlM on Sat May 11 12:34:36 2013. How about to lower Manhattan? That's never thought of.Of course, the costs of even expanding NYP keep climbing. Gateway is currently at the last estimate (by Christie) for the price of the last ARC. That's four times what the original NYP cost (adjusted for inflation), including tunnels. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by RockParkMan on Sat May 11 14:09:41 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 13:58:49 2013. We're all sick of your STUPID pipe dreams. Penn Station IS THE New York City transit hub. Infrastructure to strengthen that status can only enhance the entire Metro/Tri-State region. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by RockParkMan on Sat May 11 14:11:43 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 12:54:30 2013. scrap a couple aircraft carrier battle groups and we could have a second national rail system. |
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| (1221446) | |
Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 14:18:05 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Dan on Sat May 11 13:50:29 2013. If they want a token rush hour train to/from NYPS, Oyster Bay, Port Jeff, and Speonk have those. Show me the evidence that it increased their property values. And it did nothing to reverse the exodus to the Ronkonkoma line of the 1988 electrification.RVRC is pursuing this con job that such is equivalent to Midtown Direct. Even the Gladstone Branch only gets 2 MD trains. |
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| (1221451) | |
Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 14:30:26 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 12:27:56 2013. Don't count your chickens on weekends. Amtrak demands single-threading capability, which is 8 slots each way, 3 for Amtrak, 5 for NJT.At times of the day when they have not only 2 TPH to Trenton, but also Rahway shuttles, they are pretty much there. I once figured out if they gave the Rahway shuttles over the the RVL, it would not work. They'd have to flip the schedules in one direction by 30 minutes, and the single-tracking on the LV wouldn't work. |
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| (1221452) | |
Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 14:33:34 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 13:56:49 2013. I was talking about a potential electrification, which until 2007 was the only way to get the RVL trains directly into NYP. Hanging wire on the shared Lehigh track would have been problematic. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 14:35:09 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by RockParkMan on Sat May 11 14:11:43 2013. You'd have to scrap the entire Navy for that. One aircraft carrier alone wouldn't even pay for ARC. |
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| (1221457) | |
Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by the Silence on Sat May 11 15:06:04 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by RockParkMan on Sat May 11 14:09:41 2013. So what he wants is a pipe dream, but it's not a pipe dream if you like it... |
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| (1221459) | |
Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 15:44:55 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 14:33:34 2013. Then there's the issue of what to do with west of Raritan, for all of 375 loadings a day. |
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| (1221465) | |
Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 16:33:08 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by RockParkMan on Sat May 11 14:09:41 2013. Penn Station IS THE New York City transit hubShows how backwards-thinking you are, rocKKKparKKKnazi. Keep trying to stuff the contents of five waterfront terminals (six if you count LIC) into a station never designed to handle it, and today's quandary happens. That's why LIRR was desperate to build ESA—because they couldn't expand operations at NYP and because they didn't want to work with NJ to build the so-called "pipe dream" further downtown instead by joining the Hoboken Division with the Atlantic Branch (thanks to entrenched parochialism in NY's government). Nobody to blame but the city itself for the lack of rail bridges across the Hudson. It was the city that wanted to force all the railroads from NJ to "cooperate" on a single giant bridge from Hoboken into Manhattan instead of several bridges from where their main lines terminated at the waterfront. Most likely the city again that got in the way of stuff like the "giant bridge" idea (which would have joined the CRRNJ with the Atlantic Branch of the LIRR, look at that). |
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| (1221466) | |
Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 16:35:39 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 14:33:34 2013. Electrification before 2007 was the only way to get any other trains from unelectrified lines into NYP.I recall proposals to electrify the entire NJT commuter rail network. The only real problem with electrifying the RVL would have been renegotiating with the owners of the Lehigh Line; most likely there's enough clearance for the wires even with the double-stackers that run on that line. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 16:36:23 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 15:44:55 2013. Why would that be an issue if the trains suddenly do reach NYP? |
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| (1221468) | |
Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by RockParkMan on Sat May 11 16:42:52 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 16:33:08 2013. CNJ's SHITHOLE doesn't count |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 16:45:25 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 16:36:23 2013. I was referring to electrification of the RVL. Hard to justify west of Raritan |
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| (1221471) | |
Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 16:49:15 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by RockParkMan on Sat May 11 16:42:52 2013. You're a Rail Luddite, rocKKKparKKKnazi. Completely against rail. You want to strangle NYC and have businesses and employment leave. If you were a real rail advocate, you'd be calling for exactly what I'm calling for, even entering the city via bridges so that no dual mode anything would ever be necessary. NYP was never even designed to handle all of the PRR's passenger traffic, which is why Exchange Place stayed open for fifty years after NYP opened. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 16:51:08 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 16:45:25 2013. Depends. You can't gauge demand by status quo. Look at how Midtown Direct got overwhelmed.And assuming these dual-power locos stay reliable, demand for reopening the railroad west of High Bridge would resurge. The RVL is already connected to the Lehigh Line just west of Bloomsbury. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 16:57:36 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 16:51:08 2013. Getting back to the RVRC, there's plenty of other things to complain about:- long gaps in eastbound service from Raritan after 630pm - to late a start in the day of the weekend service - lack of peak fares when they can seldom fill 3 coaches, usually just 2, like on weekends. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 17:04:51 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 16:57:36 2013. - lack of off peak fares when they can seldom fill 3 coaches, usually just 2, like on weekends. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Sat May 11 17:13:08 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 17:04:51 2013. One big reason there is low ridership on weekends is BECAUSE there is no direct service to NYC. It's a "chicken and egg" scenario... |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 17:28:37 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Sat May 11 17:13:08 2013. And the 47% off-peak fare hike 3 years ago had nothing to do with it ?I remember them opening 3 or 4 Comet cars commonly on weekends. No more. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 17:52:43 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 15:44:55 2013. Nothing. Leave it diesel, shuttle it to Raritan, run an express or two to Newark during rush hour. Any electrification would logically end at Raritan. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Sat May 11 17:52:48 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 17:28:37 2013. And the 47% off-peak fare hike 3 years ago had nothing to do with it ?Admittedly, I forgot about that... although, did the 47% off peak fare hike affect the Corridor, Coast Line, and MidTown Direct weekend ridership? Aren't those trains just as busy as always on the weekends? I remember them opening 3 or 4 Comet cars commonly on weekends. No more. When 3 Comet cars were open, the first and the last cars were usually light, so that kind of a crowd fits comfortably in 2 multilevels. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by J Trainloco on Sat May 11 17:55:15 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 16:33:08 2013. ESA made sense because it allowed the new east river crossing to benefit the subway system and the LIRR commuter rail system. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 17:56:20 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Sat May 11 17:52:48 2013. That fare hike wasn't really a fare hike as severe as that, they just eliminated the ORT ticket option. Man, did I miss that, but it's not a fare hike per se, but an elimination of a discount.NJT does need peak fares. It's absurd they don't have them. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Sat May 11 18:07:17 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 17:56:20 2013. That fare hike wasn't really a fare hike as severe as that, they just eliminated the ORT ticket option. Man, did I miss that, but it's not a fare hike per se, but an elimination of a discount.I agree, but many people don't see it that way. NJT does need peak fares. It's absurd they don't have them. The biggest problem with the off peak tickets in the past was the ultra ignorance or "scam artistness" of the passengers (take your pick), trying to use those tickets on peak trains. That was the biggest source of aggrivation and confrontations on peak hour trains, and no matter how many announcements were made or how nicely we spoke to the offenders, most passengers still refused to pay the step ups. According to people I know who work for Metro North and the LIRR, they rarely had problems with their passengers as far as wrong tickets or willingness to pay the step ups. It seems like the NJ Transit riders were the only problem passengers. So when they eliminated the ORT's, it was like a weight lifted off of our shoulders! But then came the quiet cars.... :-( |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by streetcarman1 on Sat May 11 18:11:37 2013, in response to Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 11:37:19 2013. So when will we get an extension down to Phillipsburg, NJ? |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 18:22:11 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Sat May 11 17:52:48 2013. Well the diesel lines have more demand elasticity. Not all markets are equal. Weekend ridership went down all over on weekends initially. Some have bounced back.Bay Head shuttles were busy last summer. No one seat ride for them. The MLV's only have about 20 - 30 more seats, depending on the Comet. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 18:26:58 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 18:22:11 2013. Bay Head shuttles were busy last summer. No one seat ride for themForcing that transfer does not mean their ridership matched that of the expresses that NJT summarily canceled. Bay Head used to have a one-seat ride to NYP for many decades—until NJT screwed up that historic operation by not doing engine changes with the ALP-44s. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 18:27:43 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 14:18:05 2013. RVRC is pursuing this con job that such is equivalent to Midtown Direct. Even the Gladstone Branch only gets 2 MD trains. . . due to capacity. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 18:28:20 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Sat May 11 18:07:17 2013. Let's stop with the semantics. Off-peak fare went up 47%. Math is math.As you say every other railroad in the NY metro area can deal with the peak blackout. The problem here was directional use. Since when do they care about conductor's aggravation ? The real reason they came off was NJT management's contempt for non-commuters, and the fact that the interstate buses never had them. As we all know, NJT corporate culture is that of a glorified bus company. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Sat May 11 18:30:16 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 18:22:11 2013. The MLV's only have about 20 - 30 more seats, depending on the Comet.I know, and I used to work weekend RVL trains back in the Comet days, and I deadhead on weekends occasionally on the RVL when I want to visit NYC. The ridership looks similar to the old days on the trains I've been riding. Of course, when there is an event (parade, ball game, concert) ridership goes up as usual.. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 18:30:26 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat May 11 17:52:43 2013. Well, I'd over lap the shuttle service to Somerville. High level platforms, it's a county seat, has bus service, so better hub. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 18:31:15 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by J Trainloco on Sat May 11 17:55:15 2013. Meanwhile, the costs have expanded well beyond the original $4.3 billion to more than double. The project was supposed to have been open five years ago originally, as well; then it was supposed to have opened this year; and now the opening date has been pushed back to 2019, ten years after the original predicted opening. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 18:32:52 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 18:30:26 2013. Nobody would put up with a shuttle when there are dual-power locos. Word does get out. (Unless you're counting on the tolerance for shuttle trains like on Metro-North's electrified New Canaan branch?) |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 18:37:54 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by streetcarman1 on Sat May 11 18:11:37 2013. Never.- P-Burg is not much of a traffic generator for Trans Bridge. There is Hampton and Bloomsbury, but they are small towns. - 94% of auto traffic from that Delaware River crossing turns over in Hunterdon and Somerset Counties - most of the Lehigh Valley - NYC market is already on the bus, which the train can never come close to beating timewise. - which leaves little for a NYC-centric rail market For Trans Bridge, the market is Clinton, Easton, and Bethlehem. NJT has no trackage right west of P-Burg, and unlike Amtrak, would have to pay market costs, not incremental costs, for NS trackage rights into Pennsylvania, and probably have to pay a ransom in double-tracking and terminal yard costs. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Sat May 11 18:40:45 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 18:28:20 2013. Let's stop with the semantics. Off-peak fare went up 47%. Math is math.True, but even though I agreed with Chris, you should address that directly to him, since he brought up the "eliminated discount" thing... Since when do they care about conductor's aggravation? I never said they did, I was only stating why the elimination of the off peak tickets benefited the trainmen. That was the added bonus for us! And I did like to tell the people who complained shortly after they eliminated the off peak round trips that it was mainly due to the passenegers who refused to cooperate when they tried to use the tickets on peak trains, just in case they WERE one of those people! :-) |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 18:42:55 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Sat May 11 18:30:16 2013. What is really pathetic is a train like the 4:38 and 5:38pm from Newark, which were the best patronized from what I can tell. Now just 2 cars.Seems to me it would save you guys a hassle to simply open 3 upper levels and rope off the lower levels. Less chance for fare evasion too. What do you think ? |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 18:48:41 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 18:32:52 2013. When 3% of the ridership continues beyond the primary terminal, word would not matter. With shuttles, there could be a frequency gain. The current mid-day frequency of 3 hour intervals renders the service unusable with a taxi load of patrons. This thru service mid-day makes the Greenport Scoot look successful. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 18:50:12 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Olog-hai on Sat May 11 18:27:43 2013. Whatever the reason, token NYPS trains don't change people's habits. I think that has been pretty well proven. |
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Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs |
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Posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Sat May 11 18:54:43 2013, in response to Re: Raritan Valley Coalition pushing for direct NJT RVL service to New York using ALP-45DPs, posted by Joe V on Sat May 11 18:42:55 2013. Sounds good to me, but I believe it's actually against the rules for us to rope off either of the levels. When the RVL first got the multilevels, the conductor on 5458/5403 (the last round trip of the night) used hefty bags to "rope off" the upper level, and I remember seeing or hearing a rule thereafter forbidding us from doing that. Keep in mind, this is the same company that had a rule a couple of years ago requiring us to open ALL of the cars on anything leaving NY Penn late at night (including 6601 and 6603). So you had less than 200 people spread out through 8 cars on the Dover trains, and similar situations on the Coast Line and Corridor trains. Not a safe situation... that rule has since been rescinded... |
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