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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 08:32:51 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by RockParkMan on Mon Feb 27 05:15:25 2012.

It's not 2008 any more. These idiots in Brussels are dragging down the world's economy with them. It's everyone's problem now, to some extent or other.

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast

Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 08:52:48 2012, in response to EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast, posted by Olog-hai on Thu Jan 12 02:26:02 2012.

Of the eurozone states, only France, Slovakia and Slovenia face scheduled national elections. Out of these three, France is by far the most critical: The Franco-German partnership is the core of the European system, and any serious breach between the two would herald the end of the European Union.

Okay, who are they suggesting the French should vote for to break with Germany? Obviously they don't mean Sarkozy; Hollande is just another Eurosocialist; Bayrou is hopeless on so many levels. Do they really want Marine Le Pen as President of France?!?

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast

Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Feb 29 11:02:09 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 08:52:48 2012.

Okay, who are they suggesting the French should vote for to break with Germany?

France will never break with its abusive boyfriend, even if Le Pen got voted in.

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast

Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 11:04:17 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Feb 29 11:02:09 2012.

So Stratfor are wrong then?

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss


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Re: EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast

Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Feb 29 11:11:13 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 11:04:17 2012.

They've been wrong about quite a bit of stuff. They aren't wrong about Germany's push for power, however; they're one of the few info outlets detailing it.

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders

Posted by SMAZ on Wed Feb 29 13:24:12 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 08:22:50 2012.

Those colonels are long retired.

Greece would do a classic default (rather than the managed one they are now doing) and unhinge from the euro and go back on the drachma if it came to that.


The current managed default should have been done in a manner where they'd leave the euro anyway and return to the drachma at about 70% of its current peg.

The firewall could have then been used to stabilize it within that range.


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Re: EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast

Posted by SMAZ on Wed Feb 29 13:30:08 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 08:52:48 2012.

French Socialists are hopeless.

They keep running the same retreads.
They are the gift that keeps on giving.
When Dominique Strauss-Kahn was the best they had, that tells you the whole story.

How else would people that the French don't like, like Sarkozy and Shitrack before him, keep on winning.

I would probably vote for Sarkozy.

Do they really want Marine Le Pen as President of France?!?

nahhh....she's too librul for him.

Olog is a Phillipe Petain kind of guy.



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Re: EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast

Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 16:54:24 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast, posted by SMAZ on Wed Feb 29 13:30:08 2012.

The most tempting option is emigration sometimes...

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders

Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 16:55:26 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders, posted by SMAZ on Wed Feb 29 13:24:12 2012.

That assumes that the Eurocrats are in touch with economic reality...

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders

Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Feb 29 16:58:46 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 08:22:50 2012.

Hey guy! Good to see you! :)

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Feb 29 17:00:07 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 08:32:51 2012.

Remember when I told Olog all of this would be a self-curing problem? Germany's even replacing "ugly American" ... :)

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast

Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Feb 29 17:01:46 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 11:04:17 2012.

Always ... only Pajamas Media have worse "intelligence".

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast

Posted by RockParkMan on Wed Feb 29 17:03:46 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU per 57R47F0R's 2012 forecast, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Feb 29 11:11:13 2012.

Israel's nukes will guarantee that Germany won't behave too badly.

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by RockParkMan on Wed Feb 29 17:12:10 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Feb 29 17:00:07 2012.

Fuck Olog.

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by RockParkMan on Wed Feb 29 17:14:39 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 08:32:51 2012.

I'll go in the Goddamn woods, build a camp and eat frogs. With what the Nazis did to my country, I'll probably have to anyway.

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Feb 29 17:27:52 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by RockParkMan on Wed Feb 29 17:14:39 2012.

I'll go in the Goddamn woods, build a camp and eat frogs

The Germans will find you there too.

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by RockParkMan on Wed Feb 29 17:29:57 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Feb 29 17:27:52 2012.

This ain't World of Warcraft. They can eat my shitty pungi sticks too.

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Feb 29 17:30:09 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 08:32:51 2012.

If you had kept your eyes and ears open, you would have seen that coming, and you would have known that the EU caused what happened in 2008.

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Feb 29 17:30:37 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by RockParkMan on Mon Feb 27 05:15:25 2012.

You wish. But you'd rather blame the "GOP Nazis" than the real cause.

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Feb 29 17:31:30 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by RockParkMan on Wed Feb 29 17:29:57 2012.

You're gonna have to face the real world sometime . . .

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by RockParkMan on Wed Feb 29 17:32:28 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Feb 29 17:31:30 2012.

You can eat my shit without the Pungi Stick.

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Feb 29 18:16:43 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by RockParkMan on Wed Feb 29 17:12:10 2012.

Now THERE'S a frightful vision. :)

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders

Posted by JayMan on Wed Feb 29 19:00:54 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders, posted by SMAZ on Wed Feb 29 13:24:12 2012.

The current managed default should have been done in a manner where they'd leave the euro anyway and return to the drachma at about 70% of its current peg.

But if they did that, what's to stop the other EU countries, say the rest of the PIIGS, from leaving the Euro? The Euro would fall apart...

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders

Posted by SMAZ on Thu Mar 1 12:51:19 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders, posted by JayMan on Wed Feb 29 19:00:54 2012.

The other countries have no intention and no need of leaving the Euro.

What you are implying is that because somebody grossly obese must lose 120 pounds that somebody merely 15 pounds overweight must lose 120 lbs too.

There is no such thing as PIIGS countries.
It's a media invention that is not grounded in financial reality.

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders

Posted by AlM on Thu Mar 1 13:19:01 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders, posted by SMAZ on Thu Mar 1 12:51:19 2012.

There is no such thing as PIIGS countries.

???

You may mean they have nothing in common. But there sure are 5 countries with those intiials.




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Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders

Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Mar 1 14:42:12 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders, posted by JayMan on Wed Feb 29 19:00:54 2012.

Ireland is very different from the others: they'd be fine if only they admitted that they have no interest in the EU besides relations with Britain; they have an extremely Atlanticist economy, and it was in a very good state before they adopted the DM and screwed themselves over. The other four, plus France (and to an extent Belgium), are just total basket cases, and were basket cases before the crash.

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders

Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Mar 1 14:44:55 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Feb 29 16:58:46 2012.

Thanks! Good to see you all too!

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Mar 1 14:45:41 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Feb 29 18:16:43 2012.

PMSL

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders

Posted by AlM on Thu Mar 1 14:50:52 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Mar 1 14:42:12 2012.

Why is Italy a basket case? Perfectly functional, no. Nut in a totally different category from Greece.


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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Mar 1 14:53:14 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Feb 29 17:30:09 2012.

And quite what were we meant to do? We had Gordon Brown, the only man more economically deluded than the Eurocrats, as Prime Minister. Yes, I went out and campaigned for William Hague in 2001. It did no good: watching the results come in that election night was beyond disappointing. Somehow, I couldn't bring myself to campaign for Michael "something of the night about him" Howard and his "are you sinking like we're sinking" posters four years later. I feel like the past decade has been stolen.

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders

Posted by SMAZ on Thu Mar 1 15:18:43 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Mar 1 14:44:55 2012.

Now the big question.

Will Gareth Bale play for the Olympic team?

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders

Posted by SelkirkTMO on Thu Mar 1 17:37:00 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU turning Greece into ''Protectorate'' by Germany's orders, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Mar 1 14:44:55 2012.

I'd thought you'd given up on your fellow tards! :)

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by SelkirkTMO on Thu Mar 1 17:37:50 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Mar 1 14:45:41 2012.

Well you'd better towel off then. :)

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by SelkirkTMO on Thu Mar 1 17:38:53 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Mar 1 14:53:14 2012.

Same story over on this side ... especially after the Clinton years. And the trogs want to double down on all that now. :-/

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Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss

Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Mar 1 20:57:05 2012, in response to Re: EUEUEUEUEU's democracy on the edge of the abyss, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Mar 1 14:53:14 2012.

Somehow, I couldn't bring myself to campaign for Michael Howard . . .

. . . because of your personal biases?

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(EUEUEUEUEU) Germans suing Poland over WWII expulsions (again)

Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Mar 2 01:29:51 2012, in response to EUEUEUEUEU Olog, posted by RockParkMan on Sat Nov 12 14:58:17 2011.

It's recolonization, the first steps thereof. "Zentropa"? Just a new name for old Prussia.

Proprietors in Waiting

2012/02/28

Extreme rightwing German militants have announced new lawsuits against Poland to have former property of "expelled" Germans returned. The newly-formed "Property Owners Association—East (EBO)" announced that it is demanding not only the transfer of property rights to resettled Germans for real estate and buildings in Poland, but are also demanding that a "use compensation" be paid by the so-called expelling country. According to a report broadcast on Swiss television, already in the past, the association's president has forced his way into a house in southern Poland, he claimed belonged to him. The association has also announced its intention to wage a political campaign this spring in several Polish cities. EBO's president is the national executive director of the extreme rightwing "pro-Deutschland" party, affiliated with an extreme rightwing splinter group of the German League of Expellees (BdV). Its honorary president would like to transform a large segment of Polish territory into a neutral country: "Zentropa." The fact that the Federal Republic of Germany has, since 1949, consistently declared the resettlement of Germans "unjust" and the "question of reparations open" is encouragement for the lawsuits demanding reparations for the resettled.

Restitution Demanded

The "Property Owners Association—East, (EBO)," officially founded in January 2010, has announced new lawsuits for the former property of "expellees." This property consists of houses and land in regions, which, in the course of the creation of a new European order in the aftermath of World War II, were allotted to or returned to Poland or Czechoslovakia. In these regions numerous items of real estate had belonged to ethnic Germans at the time, which were taken over by the liberated countries, when the ethnic Germans were resettled to the west. The EBO maintains that this was an injustice; therefore, the "expellees" have a right to restitution, or even reparations. If Warsaw or Prague refuses negotiations on this question, the association will take the matter to court. This has been done already in the past, by an alliance under the name of the "Prussian Trust." Until now, they have been unsuccessful, but are continuing their process of appeals.

Political Campaigns in Poland

As announced by the EBO, it is not limiting itself to the "issue of property rights." The organization is also demanding that "the expelling states pay a use compensation," on the grounds that, for decades, the German resettled were deprived of use of their property. The Czechoslovakian Beneš Decrees as well as the corresponding Bierut Decrees in Poland must be annulled; "Polish and Czech war criminals must be prosecuted." In addition, the EBO is demanding "bi-lingual street signs in all localities of Silesia, East Prussia, Pomerania and the Sudetenland" as well as measures (not more explicitly explained) for the "protection of the German minority" in Poland and the Czech Republic. Finally, the association announces its intention to wage a political (enlightenment) campaign in several Polish cities in the spring. According to the association, leaflets will be distributed, "explaining Polish crimes committed against German civilians and Polish violations of international law." This will be done in Zgorzelec, Szczecin, Wroclaw and Opole.

East Trips

A report televised on Swiss TV gives an idea of the type of actions that can be expected in Poland. The TV station accompanied today's EBO President, Lars Seidensticker in the city of Otmuchow in southern Poland. Seidensticker claimed that his grandparents had owned a house there and that today, he is the legal owner. On a visit to Otmuchow, Seidensticker harassed not only Polish authorities — they should sign the house over to him — the Swiss television also filmed how he forced his way into the house, introducing himself as the "proprietor." The EBO's plan to initiate a supplementary political campaign in Poland, brings to mind earlier political activities carried out by the youth organization of the "League of Expellees." In 2004, for example, a group of "Silesian Youth" militants implanted wooden crosses along Polish country roads in commemoration of those Germans who died during resettlement and plastered posters reading, "No statute of limitations exists for murder." The following years, "Silesian Youth" members were involved in "East Trips" to Poland. Participants exchanged comments on the internet: "Yesterday, I had a dream; a Pole was hanging from a tree." Because of obvious extremist rightwing tendencies, the "Homeland Association—Silesia" has severed ties with the "Silesia Youth" national organization, which had been its official youth organization.

"Stolen Land"

Militants of the "Silesian Youth" national organization were also on hand when, August 21, 2011, the Honorary President of the EBO, Alexander von Waldow, spoke at an event of the "Central Council of German Expellees," an extreme rightwing organization, which had split off from the "League of Expellees." As reported by the "Central Council," the EBO adopted a resolution to join the council on July 8, 2011. Waldow has since been a board member of the "Central Council." Waldow is known to be on the ultra right wing of the "Expellees," since he laid claim to a country estate of his aristocratic ancestors, the Palace Mierzecin, near Gorzow Wielkopolski. He has been quoted alleging that this is "stolen land." When Waldow showed up, it causes a commotion and outrage with Palace Mierzecin's current owners, who bought the castle in 1998.

Brotherly Love and the Holy Ghost

Waldow has forged plans for the future state organization of large portions of Poland. In a text, published on EBO's webpage, he contends that there is "still an alien administrative rule over purely German regions" in the former German Eastern Territories. This has to be changed. Therefore, Waldow pleads for detaching the former German East Territories from Poland and establishing a neutral nation "Zentropa." "Zentropa" should be founded "under EU aegis with its own constitution." It must be "founded" on "the commandment of brotherly love and the aid of the Holy Ghost."

Not Irreversible

The "Property Owners Association—East," closely affiliated with extreme rightwing "pro-" organizations, can feel encouraged by the fact that every West German government has characterized the resettlement as well as the uncompensated confiscation of the property of the resettled as an "injustice." According to the jurisprudence of the Federal Republic of Germany, the reparations issue is "open." Most recently in the summer of 2011, the government of the federal state Hesse distributed a brochure in numerous schools, saying that the time has come to intensify "the search for feasible ways for (...) a just settlement, even in the difficult property issues." "There is a widespread idea that accomplished expulsion is irreversible, but it is false."


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Re: (EUEUEUEUEU) Germans suing Poland over WWII expulsions (again)

Posted by AlM on Fri Mar 2 09:24:58 2012, in response to (EUEUEUEUEU) Germans suing Poland over WWII expulsions (again), posted by Olog-hai on Fri Mar 2 01:29:51 2012.

Hmm.

When foolish Germans try to resurrect up claims that are already fully adjudicated you illustrate it as a case of resurgent nationalism.

When foolish Italians similarly try to resurrect up claims that are already fully adjudicated and the court that deals with such issues tells them they have no claim, you rant about the prejudices of the UN.

Give it up. Adjudicated is adjudicated. The end.

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Re: (EUEUEUEUEU) Germans suing Poland over WWII expulsions (again)

Posted by SMAZ on Fri Mar 2 15:57:56 2012, in response to Re: (EUEUEUEUEU) Germans suing Poland over WWII expulsions (again), posted by AlM on Fri Mar 2 09:24:58 2012.

Great post.

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EUEUEUEUEU facing Anti-Austerity Front

Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Mar 2 22:04:33 2012, in response to EUEUEUEUEU Olog, posted by RockParkMan on Sat Nov 12 14:58:17 2011.

Pity that they'll be painted as the bad guys to excuse the continued centralization of power.

Le Monde via PressEurop

Anti-austerity front grows in Europe

1 March 2012

The European Union Council, which begins on Thursday, is scheduled to sign the new fiscal compact. But at the same time, a dozen countries, led by Italy, are contesting the austerity policies imposed by "Merkozy" and calling for an economic stimulus package.

Philippe Ricard
French President Nicolas Sarkozy has given the pact minimal support, out of consideration for German Chancellor Angela Merkel. His Socialist opponent (in the upcoming presidential election) François Hollande has promised to renegotiate the accord if he wins the ballot. The Budget Pact is scheduled to be signed by 25 European heads of government on Friday, March 2, in Brussels. Only the United Kingdom and the Czech Republic are expected to abstain, but the issue is not yet closed.

Signing the pact opens the way for the ratification procedure, but this could be tricky at a time when there is a relative reprieve of the sovereign debt crisis due to the Greek bailout. This Tuesday Irish Taoiseach (Prime Minister) Enda Kenny unexpectedly announced his intention to organize a ratification referendum.

In France, Sarkozy has decided not to rush the ratification of the pact by parliament, preferring to wait until after the presidential election (April 22 & May 6) and the legislative elections (June 10 & 17). But he intends to schedule the ratification vote quickly if he is re-elected. On the other hand, if Hollande is elected, many leftist leaders do not want to ratify the pact as it exists. They hope to strengthen, as of the June EU summit, the growth and economic governance chapters of the pact, which they see as, first and foremost, a way to etch in stone the notion of budgetary discipline so close to Merkel's heart.

Herman Van Rompuy, President of the European Council, whom the heads of government should confirm for another two and a half years in his post, hopes to avoid a challenge to the European Stability Mechanism, which is currently on course for ratification. Under pressure to strengthen this permanent bailout fund, Germany insisted on linking the two agreements politically.

In substance, the difference of opinion on the new treaty between Sarkozy and Hollande reflects the current state of discussions within the 27 EU members. Having, under market pressure, favored austerity they must now discuss the best way to support their economies without increasing deficits. The austerity plans currently implemented just about everywhere on the continent are being more and more contested by trade unions and by public opinion as unemployment rises in the most precarious countries.

“The crisis we are facing is also a growth crisis”

In addition, they risk, according to many leaders, aggravating the looming recession. "Right now we are focusing too much on the financial penalties and the austerity plans," said Socialist Martin Schultz, President of the European Parliament during a visit to Athens on Tuesday.

Warnings of this sort are more and more frequent. Twelve countries, including Italy, Spain, the Netherlands, the United Kingdom and Poland, are asking for a reorientation of the economic policies defended by the Merkel/Sarkozy duo. "The crisis we are facing is also a growth crisis," they said in a letter initiated by Mario Monti, the caretaker Italian Prime Minister.

But, in the minds of the twelve signatories to this letter, the solution is to be found in greater deregulation, through labor market reform in each of the States and by increased commercial opportunities on the continent. These are not the types of solutions touted by the French left.

The recession that threatens the 27 Member States is of special concern to their international partners. In the short-term, the stakes are also — and perhaps even especially — to define the terms of application of the stability and growth pact, as reinforced last autumn. Spain is also asking for its obligations to be reduced, a request batted aside by the EU Commission as well as the European Central Bank.

Upon taking office, the newly-elected French President will be faced with a dilemma: protecting the credibility of the collective monitoring apparatus slowly emerging from the Eurozone crisis.

Translated from the French by Pat Brett


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Re: EUEUEUEUEU facing Anti-Austerity Front

Posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Mar 2 22:35:39 2012, in response to EUEUEUEUEU facing Anti-Austerity Front, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Mar 2 22:04:33 2012.

Why would anyone care about what's going on over there when your right wing pals over HERE are trying to turn US into Greece?

Since you support them here, you support fully the same thing happening over there.

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(EUEUEUEUEU) Germany "back in power" in Europe

Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Mar 2 22:54:16 2012, in response to EUEUEUEUEU Olog, posted by RockParkMan on Sat Nov 12 14:58:17 2011.

Mr. Chu gets a lot of the status quo correct, but he's gotten it very wrong in his perception that Germany never had this ambition.

Los Angeles Times

Germany finds itself back in power in Europe

Germany is the unquestioned boss amid Europe's debt crisis and economic woes. But the turnaround has inspired discomfort among its neighbors and among Germans.

By Henry Chu, Los Angeles Times
February 27, 2012, 6:45 p.m.
Reporting from Berlin — For nearly 70 years, Germany's grand national ambition has basically been not to have one.

After losing two world wars and carrying out a horrific genocide, the country set to working its way back into the European fold, content to focus on rebuilding its shattered economy while dutifully leaving continental leadership to the likes of France.

The plan has been a roaring success — so much so that, in one of history's great ironies, Germany today finds itself right back where it wasn't supposed to be: dominating Europe.

As the region's richest, most populous nation, with control over purse strings rather than panzers, Germany is the unquestioned boss amid Europe's stubborn debt crisis and deepening economic malaise. But the turnaround has inspired a fair bit of discomfort and unease, not just among some neighboring nations but also among some Germans.

"We have an ambivalent relationship with power," said senior research fellow Ulrike Guerot of the European Council on Foreign Relations in Berlin. "We've never gotten it right."

Potentially the fate of the global economy now lies in Germany's hands as it heads the effort to keep heavily indebted Greece (where people mutter about a "Fourth Reich") from going under and pulling down other Eurozone countries with it. On Monday, Chancellor Angela Merkel successfully steered approval for a $175-billion Greek bailout through the German Parliament, a deeply divisive measure for German taxpayers who will foot more than half the bill.

Even so, President Obama and other world leaders are urging Germany to contribute even more to a permanent European bailout fund that might stanch the debt crisis — pressure that Merkel has so far resisted.

The leadership role thrust onto Germany is turning out to be a minefield in many ways, complicated by the nation's past. Berlin is caught in a classic damned-if-you-do, damned-if-you-don't position, its every move fodder for critics eager to spot signs either of Teutonic belligerence or a failure to exercise power responsibly.

Officials here in the German capital are keenly aware of the delicate balance they must strike.

"It's very important to weigh your words. Even if you do something with best intentions, it can resonate in another place completely differently," Deputy Foreign Minister Michael Georg Link said in an interview, adding, "We have always to be aware of our political history."

Even so, critics fault Merkel's government for mistakes of both style and substance amid what they complain is an ever-increasing German hegemony over its neighbors.

The plan that Europe is pursuing to save the euro currency bears an unmistakably German stamp, with its insistence on solemn pledges of fiscal rectitude, stiff austerity measures and punishment for countries that stray. This week, nearly all of the European Union's 27 nations are due to sign a pact on fiscal discipline that was largely written in Berlin.

Despite the growing chorus of detractors and indicators showing that austerity is strangling economic growth in ailing nations, Merkel has refused to yield, and no fellow European leader has been strong enough to overrule her.

"She's the queen of Europe," said Josef Joffe, editor of the newspaper Die Zeit.

Gone are the days when Germany was considered an economic giant but a political dwarf, as the cliche had it, Joffe said. "In an age where economic power suddenly moves to the fore, as it has in the last 18 months, the economic giant also becomes a political giant."

Still, in November, observers both inside and outside Germany were aghast when one of Merkel's closest political allies crowed that "Europe is speaking German" now, comments she quickly disavowed.

That same month, lawmakers in Ireland, one of three Eurozone countries to sign up for international bailouts, were outraged to discover that members of a German parliamentary committee saw copies of draft proposals for the Irish budget before they did. The leak hardened perceptions among other Europeans that their economic futures were no longer in their own hands.


And not just their economic futures. Both Italy and Greece now boast unelected technocratic prime ministers who meet with Germany's approval as men willing to follow its recipe of austerity cuts and structural reform. Likewise the new chief of the European Central Bank, Mario Draghi, whose German-style financial outlook earned him the admiring nickname the "Prussian Italian" and a photo in the bestselling tabloid Bild depicting him (approvingly) in a spiked Prussian helmet.

Last month, Berlin caused yet more consternation with a proposal that a European commissioner be appointed who would exercise veto power over parts of Greece's budget. The suggestion isn't without merit, many analysts say, given Athens' failure to fulfill all its promises so far. But its presentation was evidence of a political tin ear.

"On content, Merkel is right. On form, she's not.... We're doing this without a learning curve. We have no historical example," said Guerot of the European Council on Foreign Relations. "It's not so good to send a German budget commissioner to Greece, because it feels like a German whip. We don't want German flags to be burned in Athens."

Unfortunately, that is already happening in Greece, where anti-German rhetoric, much of it tinged with references to power-hungry Nazis, is now commonplace, to the dismay of many here.

Even Mario Monti, the Italian leader who commands the ear of Merkel in a way his predecessor, Silvio Berlusconi, never did, warned that Germany risked a backlash as the "ringleader of EU intolerance" if it failed to recognize the sacrifices being made by other countries.

Merkel recently surprised many with the startling announcement that she would cross the Rhine and actively campaign on behalf of French President Nicolas Sarkozy for re-election in April — more proof, critics say, of Germany's pan-European aspirations.

But Joffe said Berlin had neither sought nor built up much experience for its current ascendancy in European affairs, which helps explain some of its missteps.

"The leadership of Europe has really been dropped into its lap, a country with a culture that's not prepared for leadership, doesn't have the apparatus and doesn't feel comfortable in the role," he said.

Not that Germany can't grow into its newfound position.

"Appetite comes with the eating," Joffe said. "But it's still a very subdued appetite."


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EUEUEUEUEU "enlargement" propaganda video

Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Mar 5 18:36:58 2012, in response to EUEUEUEUEU Olog, posted by RockParkMan on Sat Nov 12 14:58:17 2011.

Slogan: "The more we are, the stronger we are." They've always been at war with Eastasia? ("Enlargement" in EU-speak = the EU annexes more territory.)



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(EUEUEUEUEU) The role Nazis played in building West Germany (long)

Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Mar 7 01:36:30 2012, in response to EUEUEUEUEU Olog, posted by RockParkMan on Sat Nov 12 14:58:17 2011.

Important bit of history. History is prophecy. And you can bet that the de-Nazification program was wiped out by the "former" Nazis instigating the Cold War . . .

Der Spiegel

03/06/2012
From Dictatorship to Democracy

The Role Ex-Nazis Played in Early West Germany

By Ralf Beste, Georg Bönisch, Thomas Darnstaedt, Jan Friedmann, Michael Fröhlingsdorf and Klaus Wiegrefe

After World War II, West Germany rapidly made the transition from murderous dictatorship to model democracy. Or did it? New documents reveal just how many officials from the Nazi regime found new jobs in Bonn. A surprising number were chosen for senior government positions.

Ten days before Christmas, the German Interior Ministry acquitted itself of an embarrassing duty. It published a list of all former members of the German government with a Nazi past.

The Left Party's parliamentary group had forced the government to come clean about Germany's past by submitting a parliamentary inquiry. Bundestag document 17/8134 officially announced, for the first time, something which had been treated as a taboo in the halls of government for decades: A total of 25 cabinet ministers, one president and one chancellor of the Federal Republic of Germany — as postwar Germany is officially known — had been members of Nazi organizations.

The document revealed that Chancellor Kurt Georg Kiesinger, a member of the conservative Christian Democratic Union (CDU) who governed Germany from 1966 to 1969, had been a member of the Nazi Party ever since Adolf Hitler seized power. According to the Interior Ministry list, German President Walter Scheel, a member of the business-friendly Free Democratic Party (FDP) who was in office from 1974 to 1979, had been a Nazi Party member "from 1941 or 1942."

The list names ministers of all political stripes and from a wide range of social backgrounds. Some, like leftist Social Democratic Party (SPD) mastermind Erhard Eppler (Minister of Economic Cooperation), did not become Nazi Party members until the end (at 17, in Eppler's case). Others, like conservative Christian Social Union (CSU) agitator Richard Jaeger (Minister of Justice), had been part of Hitler's paramilitary organization, the SA (since 1933, in Jaeger's case). Even FDP luminary Hans-Dietrich Genscher (first Interior Minister and later Foreign Minister), who denies to this day that he knowingly joined the Nazi Party, is listed as a Nazi Party member.

According to the government list, former SPD Finance Minister Karl Schiller was in the SA, while his fellow cabinet minister Horst Ehmke was a Nazi Party member, as were ("presumably," the list notes) former SPD Labor Minister Herbert Ehrenberg and Hans Leussink, a former education minister with no party affiliation. On the conservative side, the report names several former Nazi Party members, including former CDU Foreign Minister Gerhard Schröder and former CDU Minister for Displaced Persons Theodor Oberländer, as well as former CSU Post and Communication Minister Richard Stücklen and former CSU Interior Minister Friedrich Zimmermann.

Germany's Dark Past

None of this information is new. It isn't just since the 1968 student revolts that critical citizens, intellectuals and the media have broadcast new details on the contemporary relevance of Germany's dark past. For years, the notion that partisans of the Nazi regimes were able to manipulate their way into the top levels of government in the young federal republic, and that former Nazi Party members set the tone in a country governed by the postwar constitution in the 1950s and 60s has been a subject for historians.

But six decades after the Nuremberg Trials against the leaders of the Nazi regime, a new attempt — the first official one, at that — to come to terms with postwar Germany's Nazi past is now underway. Now everything has to come out. Throughout the former West Germany, investigations are digging deep, extending all the way down to the foundations, seeking to answer a fundamental question: Just how brown — the color most associated with the Nazis — were the first years of postwar West Germany?

The government's 85-page response to the Left Party's inquiry about old Nazis in the halls of power is nothing more than an interim summary of research being undertaken in the archives of many ministries and federal agencies. As part of the effort, historians are reviewing enormous stacks of personnel files on behalf of the government.

No one has ever dug this deeply. The highly controversial study on Nazi involvement at the Foreign Ministry, marketed last year as a bestseller, was only the beginning. Historians are now studying old files at the Finance Ministry, in the judiciary and the Economics Ministry and, in particular, in the police and intelligence services. How many Nazis took part in the rebuilding of the government after World War II? How much influence did the surviving supporters of the Nazi dictatorship have on the establishment and operation of Germany's first functioning democracy?

Officials at the Interior Ministry, the source of the most recent government document, have issued an EU-wide call for assistance in addressing Germany's Nazi past. Historians from the western city of Bochum are now poring over old files from the Federal Office for the Protection of the Constitution (BfV) which stretch for about 500 meters (1,640 feet) to determine how many of the Nazi dictatorship's helpers hid under the coattails of the domestic intelligence service in the early years of the Federal Republic — and how this could have happened.

An Enormous Confession

Was the protection of the young, optimistic constitution in the hands of former National Socialists? It is as if the government were determined to finally shed all of its oppressive secrets.

It's an enormous confession. The discussion revolves around an entire generation of civil servants, all "public employees," according to the German government's most recent report to the Left Party, "who were at least 17 at the time of the collapse of the Nazi dictatorship, and no more than 70 at the time of constitution of the Federal Republic of Germany." The people in question would have been born between 1879 and 1928.

Whether it will ever be possible to separate the good from the bad seems questionable at the very least. About a million people from the generation in question worked for the government in the early years of the republic. But according to the report, only about 200,000 personnel files from this period still exist.

Nevertheless, Berlin historian Michael Wildt expects "substantial new information" to emerge from the file rooms of government agencies. Wildt is convinced that it will become clear that all government institutions, provided they existed at the time, were involved "in the mass crimes of the Nazis." And the institutions that were newly formed under the postwar constitution, namely the police and the intelligence services, were largely staffed with civil servants from the old, criminal organizations. Ministries and government agencies have "covered up, denied and repressed" their dark history, says Wildt.

Covered up, denied and repressed. It's a charge that doesn't just apply to politicians and public servants, at least not in the early years of the republic. Senior members of the media, including at SPIEGEL, proved to be unwilling or incapable of sounding the alarm. This isn't surprising, given the numbers of ex-Nazis who had forced their way into editorial offices.

Blood on Their Hands

The new wave of revelations from Germany's past doesn't just provide additional gruesome details about the generation of perpetrators. In the middle of the flourishing democracy of reunified Germany, people are turning their attention to the roles of those who actively helped the Nazis, or at least looked the other way, when politicians, civil servants and lawyers with blood on their hands claimed important positions once again.

The willingness to let bygones be bygones, either because of a guilty conscience or for the sake of a new beginning, was disastrous. It is this attitude that has prompted historians to accuse the founding generation of having jeopardized the new, hopeful Germany, where human dignity was treated as the most important constitutional value.

Germany in the 1950s was "a precarious nation," a country on the brink, says historian Wildt. Even though the 50s were seen as Germany's "golden years," the period was also haunted by the demons of the past, whose machinations, as we are learning today, could easily have brought Germany to what Wildt calls a tipping point. For many historians and constitutional experts, the fact that this did not happen — once again — was a stroke of luck, and a miracle of the Bonn republic.

Biologically speaking, Germany has largely lost its connection to the generation of perpetrators. Even those who sought to cover up the Nazi past are mostly retired nowadays. The opportunity is favorable. Now it is up to the grandchildren to address the miracle, which must seem like a timeless lesson to some, a lesson on the difficulties of building a democracy from the ruins of a brutal dictatorship.

Part 2: The Grandchildren Want to Know

And the grandchildren want to know. A specialized history book like "Das Amt" ("The Department") hasn't had this much success as a bestseller in a long time. The publisher, Blessing Verlag, has already sold more than 75,000 copies of the €34.95 thriller about the Nazi foreign ministry.

In 2005, then Foreign Minister and Green Party member Joschka Fischer deployed a commission of historians to trace the new activities of old Nazis in his ministry back to their roots. In a dispute over obituaries for deceased diplomats, which are customarily couched in reverential terms, it had become apparent that the spirit of yesterday still hovered above the Foreign Ministry, especially when it came to diplomats with a Nazi past.

It was only the work of the historians deployed by Fischer that finally debunked the legend that the diplomats had been part of a secret resistance cell in the Third Reich. The story first emerged in the years after the war when, following the Nuremberg Trials, officials from Hitler's foreign ministry were also put on trial. At the time, Ernst von Weizsäcker, the former secretary of state in Hitler's foreign ministry, defended himself against the accusation that he had been a willing helper to the dictatorship. One of the supporters of his cause was his son Richard, who later became the German president.

This old theory was still quasi-official in 1979, when Hans-Dietrich Genscher (FDP) was the foreign minister. "The Foreign Ministry put up a fierce and sustained resistance to the plans of the Nazi leaders, and yet was unable to prevent the worst from happening," a brochure titled "Foreign Policy Today" declared.

In truth, it wasn't just a few implanted Nazis who participated in the Holocaust through the so-called Judenreferat (Jewish Department). In fact, the entire ministry implemented the political dictates of the rogue regime with the practiced effectiveness of a functioning government agency. The Foreign Ministry was "part of this monstrous dictatorship, and it performed its duties," says Norbert Frei, a historian from the eastern German city of Jena and one of the authors of the study.

'Maintaining the Continuity of Berlin Tradition'

After the war, the restoration of former officials to positions in the Foreign Ministry occurred at an astonishing rate. The political division alone soon counted 13 former Nazi Party members among its top officials, while 11 of the 17 senior members of the legal department were former Nazis. "There is no other federal ministry," then SPD parliamentarian Fritz Erler concluded, "that is maintaining the continuity of Berlin tradition in this manner than the Foreign Ministry."

The restoration of the old elites also had consequences for foreign policy, which veteran diplomats still deny to this day. Old Nazis were usually sent to posts in South America and Arab countries, where they shaped the image of the supposedly new republic. The diplomats repeatedly took steps to protect Nazis hiding abroad and accused war criminals from persecution.

In the 1950s, the German embassy in Buenos Aires unquestioningly issued travel documents to the family of Adolf Eichmann, one of the key organizers of the Holocaust, for a trip to Germany. No one bothered to draw any conclusions about Eichmann's whereabouts.

As SPIEGEL revealed in 1968, the main legal protection office at the Foreign Ministry even developed into a "warning service" for old Nazis. With the help of the Red Cross, the diplomats informed about 800 Germans and Austrians that they should avoid traveling to France, because they had been convicted of war crimes there and could run into "difficulties."

The case of the Finance Ministry, in particular, highlights the dangerous pragmatism adopted by West Germany's founders in their personnel policies. Shortly after the new constitution had come into effect, Konrad Adenauer, postwar West Germany's first chancellor and anything but a Nazi sympathizer, demanded an "end to this sniffing out of Nazis."

"You can't build a Finance Ministry if you don't have at least a few people in senior positions who understand something about earlier history," Adenauer told the parliament, seeking to justify his support of staffing continuity.

An Abominable Lawyer

The chancellor, for his part, entrusted himself and his chancellery to Hans Globke, a former official in Hitler's interior ministry and one of the authors of the Nuremberg race laws. The man Adenauer once called "my dear Herr Globke" was the most powerful government official in Germany for a time, even though anyone who wanted to know could easily consult the abominable lawyer's anti-Semitic concoctions. He was responsible for the mandatory assignment of the first names Israel and Sara to Jews in Nazi Germany. The ability to quickly identify someone as a Jew was one of the preconditions of the Holocaust.

Globke was the most capable civil servant that the new country believed it had at its disposal. Part of his competence had to do with the precision with which he once distinguished among different classifications of Jews: "The three-eighths Jew, who has one fully Jewish and one half-Jewish grandparent, is considered a crossbreed with one fully Jewish grandparent, while the five-eighths Jews with two fully Jewish grandparents and one half-Jewish grandparent is considered a crossbreed with two fully Jewish grandparents." With the same Prussian bureaucrat's sense of perfection, Globke also developed Adenauer's center of power, the Federal Chancellery at Schaumburg Palace. Globke was adept at pleasing everyone. During the Nuremberg war crimes trials, he even appeared as both a witness for the defense and a witness for the prosecution.

Only once did the past catch up with Adenauer's senior state secretary. When it was revealed that Globke, as an assistant department head in the Nazi interior ministry, had announced that "the independent state of Luxembourg was dissolved" as a result of the Nazi occupation, Luxembourg demanded that Globke return the Grand Cross of the Order of the Oak Crown, which the small country had conferred on him after the war, in 1957.

This didn't seem to trouble Adenauer, who said: "I don't know of anyone who could replace Globke." The "Globke System," which SPIEGEL ridiculed at the time, wasn't just a system of spinning thread that all came together at the Chancellery. It was also a system that was holding together the young Federal Republic. Globke was a defining force in West Germany. The country needed men like him, people who were flexible and experienced — and who didn't look back.

Institutions that, unlike the Finance Ministry, were newly established in the spirit and on the foundation of the new constitution, also employed people formerly affiliated with the Nazis. As the new study shows, former SS members with Gestapo experience were employed at the BfV as wiretapping and postal surveillance experts — initially as free agents, "because, after all, they did have to respect the fact that these people were tainted," then BfV President Hubert Schrübbers once noted. Schrübbers himself was later removed from office over allegations of his own Nazi past. But nothing against Hitler's Gestapo. "These people were experts," a former senior BfV official said in 1965.

There was no looking back when the Globke system dominated the entire security apparatus. Even contemporaries suspected that Nazi-era experts were given jobs in the intelligence services of the new republic and at the Federal Office of Criminal Investigation (BKA).

The British press openly scoffed at the "Gestapo Boys" working for the organization headed by Reinhard Gehlen, the precursor of the Federal Intelligence Service (BND). The networks of old Nazis were also an issue in Bonn. SPD opposition leader Kurt Schumacher took Adenauer to task, claiming that the intelligence service was "infiltrated" with men from the vicious SD — the intelligence service of the SS.

Today, experts estimate that about one in 10 of Gehlen's employees came from the empire of SS chief Heinrich Himmler, bringing the total to a few hundred men. They do not include those who may have been involved in murder campaigns while wearing the gray uniform of the Nazi armed forces, the Wehrmacht, or as Nazi officials.

The situation was even worse at the BKA. At times, former members of the SS's Totenkopf division held more than two-thirds of all senior positions. When the agency began looking into the past of its employees in 1960, about 100 officials, or a quarter of the entire workforce, were investigated.

The payrolls of the BKA, BND and BfV include men like former SS Oberführer Wilhelm Krichbaum, who, as head of the Geheime Feldpolizei (Secret Military Police), tortured and killed tens of thousands of "suspected partisans" on the Eastern Front. Krichbaum joined the Gehlen Organization in 1948 and was soon put in charge of its district office in the Bavarian town of Bad Reichenhall.

Part 3: 'Staunchly True to His World View'

Theo Saevecke embarked on a career in law enforcement at the BKA. He had joined the Nazi Party in 1929, when it was still very small, and eventually reached the rank of Hauptsturmführer in the SS. While with the SS, Saevecke organized forced labor operations involving Tunisian Jews and ran the Milan office of the security police, where he was responsible for hundreds of executions.

After the war, the senior official openly described himself as a "former old National Socialist." He remained staunchly true to his worldview. As a CIA contact noted, Saevecke would "literally stop at nothing to suppress the communist movement, against which he has felt an elementary hatred since the 1920s." While with the BKA, Saevecke was in charge of the police effort surrounding the 1962 SPIEGEL scandal, before going into retirement.

Because it was to be expected that the expertise of former Nazis would be in demand once again, the Allies had initially obtained an express power of veto from the BfV. The Berlin Document Center routinely investigated job applicants — albeit not with sufficient thoroughness — for evidence of former Nazi Party and SS membership. BND founder Gehlen also shunned the men from Himmler's organization at first.

Until the fall of the Third Reich, Gehlen, a general in the German army during World War II, had maintained a department at Wehrmacht headquarters that wrote analyses about the Red Army. In 1946, the Americans recruited him to continue his old activities, but this time for the US Army. Washington also feared that secret agents with a Nazi past could be blackmailed by the Soviets or the intelligence agencies of other countries.

'If He Can Help Us, We'll Use Him'

But the Americans did not insist that Gehlen provide them with access to the personnel files of his employees. When a critical member of the US Congress questioned then President Harry S. Truman about cooperation with Gehlen, Truman grumbled: "This guy Gehlen, I don't care if he screws flies. If he can help us, we'll use him."

A panel of historians has also now been appointed to investigate the question of why the BND recruited former Nazi thugs. Why did the agency use someone like Konrad Fiebig, a former member of an SS paramilitary death squad known as an Einsatzgruppe who was later charged with the murders of 11,000 Jews in Belarus, as a courier? And what exactly did his superiors know about the crimes?

Of course, former Nazis helped each other out. For example, one former SS member said that Krichbaum expressly asked him to "report former SD people who no longer have a profession, because they could become active again."

An especially large number of tainted agents were associated with an organization known as Dienststelle 114, with offices in the back courtyard of a building on Gerwigstrasse in the southwestern city of Karlsruhe.
Officially, the office housed a company called Zimmerle & Co., a maker of roller shutters. The original purpose of the organization was to find out, on behalf of the Americans, what Moscow's agents were up to in the American occupation zone. But conservative nationalist Gehlen used the counterespionage mission to develop a system of informants against pacifists and communists. The word was soon out among former Nazis that there was good money to be made in Gehlen's organization.

The ex-Nazis were no longer committing murders at the BND. However, experts suspect that the former SS officials, who had once held the ranks of Sturmbannführer, Obersturmführer and Oberführer, introduced the crusader mentality into the BND that gave the agency the reputation of being a stronghold of people living in the past. Anyone who occasionally traveled to East Germany, made left-leaning political statements or even struck a neighbor with connections to the BND as suspicious ran the risk of being placed under surveillance, having his mail opened or his telephone conversations wiretapped by the BND.

'Willing Servants of the Regime'

Even top politicians were placed under surveillance, including the later head of the SPD parliamentary group, Herbert Wehner ("an extremely dangerous enemy of the state") and the later President Gustav Heinemann, who was observed after being classified as a suspicious "element."

Hardly anyone in law enforcement was not tainted with a Nazi past. Most, says current BKA President Jörg Ziercke, were "supporters and willing servants of the regime."

This tradition continued on the inside of the agency, even if the personnel at the BKA adjusted to the new conditions. The officers devoted special attention to people known as "country travellers," who were still referred to as "gypsies" during the Third Reich.

A 1967 manual reads: "The penchant for an unattached vagrant lifestyle and a pronounced aversion to work are among the special attributes of a gypsy." As much as a decade after the end of the war, the BKA included the prisoner number tattooed on the arm of a presumed delinquent in its search profile.


Dieter Schenk, the former head of the criminal division at the BKA, is sharply critical of the agency, saying that for years it was dominated by "toadyism, wagon wall behavior and an authoritarian style of leadership." These are the secondary bad habits of a bureaucracy that has something to hide, and in which yesterday's and today's officials cannot look each other directly in the eye.

No ministry in West Germany was spared the army of surviving accomplices, helpers and accessories. "This continued activity of the old National Socialists is a fundamental affliction of the inner constitution of the Federal Republic," Karl Jaspers, the philosopher of West Germany's formative years, said in 1966.

When the old affliction was no longer painful, parts of the government that were seemingly above suspicion began recalling their own problems. In 2007, the Federal Ministry of Transportation issued a thin report on its own past. It turned out that thousands of outwardly virtuous railroad workers were willing accessories to the genocide of the Jews.

Responsible for the Nazis' Starvation Policy

Meanwhile, a historian had compiled a list of 62 people with Nazi pasts for a study on the precursor agency to the Federal Consumer Protection Ministry. During World War II, employees of the Reich Agriculture Ministry were responsible for the Nazis' starvation policy in eastern Poland, Lithuania and Belarus.

In 2009, then Finance Minister Peer Steinbrück (SPD) established a seven-member panel of historians whose results were to be released to the public. Their job was to examine "how the Reich Finance Ministry contributed to the plundering of the Jews and the financing of the arms buildup and the war." The Federal Ministry of the Economy commissioned a similar study in the following year.

It has already been revealed that half of all state secretaries, section heads and subsection heads in the 1950s were former members of the Nazi Party.

According to research by Norbert Frei, a historian in the eastern city of Jena, about a third of the people working in the federal government's ministerial bureaucracy in 1953 had been fired by the Allies directly after the war. They were considered no longer usable at the time. The fact that most of them returned, and that some even went to court to get their old jobs back, is tantamount to a coup d'état.

The former Nazis who had been deprived of their power took advantage of a provision of the new constitution to secure power, influence and a good pension until the end of their lives. During the debate over the constitution in the Parliamentary Council, the public servant lobby was the only group in society that managed to file legal and financial claims for compensation. This isn't exactly surprising, given that public servants held the majority of votes within the council.

In this manner, German civil servants had managed to quickly and painlessly sweep aside their pasts. The German judges didn't even need a new law to help them along.

Part 4: The Judiciary That Sentenced 50,000 People to Death

The self-righteousness of the German postwar judiciary stands in sharp contrast to the calamity that the profession inflicted on Germany. Indeed, its crimes are at the very top of the list of disgraceful deeds. Between 1933 and 1945, German judges, both civilian and military, handed down an estimated 50,000 death sentences, most of which were carried out. "The dagger of the assassin was concealed beneath the robe of the jurist," said Telford Taylor, the US chief prosecutor at the Nuremberg Trials.

Roughly 80 percent of the judges and prosecutors who had served Hitler's regime of terror until May 8 were soon dispensing justice once again — but this time in the young Federal Republic. "Perhaps there is truly evidence," wrote Nazi expert Jörg Friedrich, "that a constitutional state can stand on a judicial mass grave."

In the misery of the postwar era, lawyers were urgently needed. Although the crime rate skyrocketed in the era of black markets and refugees, there was a shortage of judges to hear cases. To make up for the deficiencies, the occupiers of the western zones appointed judges who had retired before 1933, or they hired lawyers untainted with Nazi connections. Starting in October 1945, the British practiced the so-called "piggyback procedure" in the recently established judicial administration: For each judge without a Nazi past, one judge with former Nazi connections could be appointed. But, by the summer of 1946, even this restriction had been dropped.

Now the halls of justice were even staffed with judges who had once served on the Nazis' People's Court (Volksgerichtshof), which was set up in 1934 to handle "political offenses" and became notorious for the frequency, arbitrariness and severity of its punishments. Nevertheless, the civilian courts handling the de-Nazification process merely classified them as "hangers-on." In 1953, at least 72 percent of judges on the Federal Supreme Court, Germany's highest court for criminal and civil law, had former Nazi connections. The number increased to 79 percent by 1956 and, in the criminal division, it was at 80 percent by 1962.

Suppressing Opposition to the Regime

It wasn't until after 1964, when Nazi-affiliated judges still made up 70 percent of the court, that one could begin "to observe a decline," says Hubert Rottleuthner, a sociologist of law. He also points out that this statistic does not include the judges and prosecutors who worked exclusively in the military justice system. Their trail of blood is significantly wider than that of even the "special courts" (Sondergerichte), established to suppress opposition to the regime, and the People's Court.

Between 1939 and 1945, wartime judges sentenced an estimated 30,000 soldiers to death, often for minor offences and, as some said, "as a deterrent." Up to 90 percent of these sentences were carried out by firing squads or executioners.

Despite their horrific pasts, the expertise of these judges was soon in demand at the Federal Ministry of Justice (BMJ). The specialists at the new ministry secretly worked on relevant regulations aimed at establishing new versions of the notorious wartime courts. For example, a special criminal court for the new armed forces, the Bundeswehr, included emergency rules that would have largely deprived German citizens in uniform of their rights.

Among the promoters of a new system of military justice were Josef Schafheutle, who went from working in the Reich Justice Ministry to being head of the BMJ's criminal law division, and his department head, Eduard Dreher. During the war, Dreher had served as the senior public prosecutor at the special court (Sondergericht) in Innsbruck, Austria. In one case, he called for the death penalty "although even the special court supported a reprieve," according to journalist Ernst Klee.

The Death Penalty?

To have the secretly written "preliminary" consultant drafts reviewed by outside experts, the Bonn ministry installed a "Military Criminal Law Commission," whose members — including a former air force judge and a former army senior field judge — repeatedly cited the extremely harsh provisions of the war era during their discussions behind closed doors. And at least three commission members favored reintroducing the long-abolished death penalty.

Another member explained when the "ultimate penalty" was necessary in his opinion, namely when the "capacity of the military" was in jeopardy and, with it, the "security of the nation" and the "maintenance of discipline."

A number of soldiers had been executed during the war for the "violation of discipline." Now the ugly word was back in use in the postwar justice ministry. Although nothing ever came of the law, the malignant spirit of its authors did not disappear as quickly. To this day, every German attorney and judge is familiar with the experienced Nazi jurist Dreher, who also wrote the leading opinion on the German Criminal Code.

The jurists acquitted themselves because they were able to argue on their own behalf. With the exception of two chairman of a military court martial, whose actions could no longer be treated as the actions of judges, not a single judge in the Federal Republic has ever been convicted of perversion of justice.

In the new Germany, victims in the administration, the courts and parliament often encountered judges, bureaucrats and doctors who had once served in Hitler's Third Reich.

For example, someone who had walked into the Department of Reparations in the villa once owned by the industrialist Rudolf ten Hompel — the headquarters of the Ordnungspolizei (the regular police force of Nazi Germany) in the western city of Münster — in the winter of 1953/54 would have stood a good chance of running into a former Nazi there. Three of the seven employees were former party members.

Part 5: Abandoning the Cleansing Plan

Werner Villinger, a doctor who was involved in the mass murder of the disabled prior to 1945, served on the Reparations Committee of the Bundestag, a position in which he was partly responsible for a decision to deny compensation to roughly 400,000 people who had been forcibly sterilized in the Nazi period. One of his fellow committee members was Hans Nachtsheim, who should have been serving a prison sentence instead of in the parliament. According to the research of journalist Ernst Klee, Nachtsheim conducted medical experiments with epileptic children in 1943.

The murderers of yesterday were afforded public support. Even church leaders put in a good word for Nazis who had been convicted by the Allied courts as principal perpetrators. For example, Protestant Bishop Otto Dibelius and World Council of Churches President Martin Niemöller, a victim of Nazi persecution himself, asked the Allies for "mercy for those who, branded with the stigma of war crime, are being held in captivity."

The religious leaders interceded on behalf of men like Martin Sandberger, who was held at the Landsberg Prison in Bavaria until 1958. As the leader of Special Commando 1a, Sandberger had made Estonia "free of Jews" and had admitted to the killings of "about 350" communists. But even the prominent SPD politician Carlo Schmid spoke out on behalf of his former legal intern at the University of Tübingen: "Without the onset of National Socialism, Sandberger would have become a reputable, hard-working and ambitious public servant."

The distinction between perpetrators and victims disappeared in a haze of pity and sympathy.

When, in January 1951, there was a rumor in Bonn that the Americans were planning to execute Nazi mass murderers who were imprisoned in Landsberg and had already been sentenced to death, Landsberg Mayor Ludwig Thoma had no trouble convincing members of the Bundestag and the state parliament to attend a protest event "against barbarity."

Not Prepared to Accept a Fourth Reich

The historian Jens-Christian Wagner has reconstructed the event. A Landsberg electrical business provided a vehicle equipped with loudspeakers free of charge, and the local radio station called upon residents to participate in the protest event. One in three residents showed up. When several hundred Holocaust survivors tried to interrupt the rally, the mob shouted: "Jews out!"

But the Allies were not to be swayed, and a few months later the sentences against some of the prisoners were carried out. One of the men executed was Otto Ohlendorf, commander of Einsatzgruppe D, which had murdered tens of thousands of children, women and men.

Until 1951, the Western Allies executed close to 500 Nazi war criminals, including politicians (like former Foreign Minister Joachim von Ribbentrop), military officers (like Wilhelm Keitel, the head of the Supreme Command of the Wehrmacht) and SS officials (like police chief Ernst Kaltenbrunner). The fact that major figures from the Third Reich were hanged over a period of several years brought it home to the Germans that the Allies were not prepared to accept a Fourth Reich.

The Nazi Party was banned, other right-wing extremist parties were not allowed in the first place, and Nazis were denied the right to vote. "Just imagine that the occupying power were no longer here," Thomas Dehler, the then chairman of the Free Democratic Party (FDP) in the Parliamentary Council, told his colleagues. "What would this democracy look like, and how wretched and weak would it be!"

When the British wiretapped a group of former Nazis surrounding Werner Naumann, the former deputy of Nazi Propaganda Minister Joseph Goebbels, they gained the impression that the ex-Nazis were infiltrating the FDP in North Rhine-Westphalia. On the night of Jan. 14, 1953, British military police officers surrounded the houses in the western and northern cities of Solingen, Düsseldorf and Hamburg where the Nazi conspirators were staying and arrested them. The next morning, the occupying power informed an astonished public that the Nazis had been pursuing "plans to regain power in West Germany."

'No Nazi Renaïssance'

In retrospect, the threat was probably not as great as the British portrayed it, and the case against Naumann and his associates was dropped. But the episode illustrates how seriously the occupiers took the situation. And everyone understood the message, says Berlin historian Michael Wildt, namely that "there would no Nazi Renaissance."

But even the Allies were unable to thoroughly cleanse Nazi-contaminated Germany. The plan to "de-Nazify" the conquered country, the Allies' aim of "removing National Socialists from offices and positions of responsibility," failed as a result of delays stemming from the resistance of those affected by this policy. In the US zone alone, some 13.4 million people over the age of 18 had to complete a questionnaire with 131 questions, and a total of 3.7 million cases were reviewed in all of the Western zones combined. But the lion's share of the investigations ended without indictments. Only 25,000 Germans from an army of millions of yesterday's collaborators were sentenced by the so-called Spruchkammer (the civilian courts handling denazification). They were fined or banned from their professions, but they were rarely sent to prison.

In the end the Americans, as ardent as they had been as first, abandoned their ambitious cleansing plan. The Germans — all Germans — were needed as the Cold War intensified. "If the nominal party members had not been given back their civil rights and the possibility of leading a normal life," the US military governor Lucius D. Clay concluded at the time, "a serious source of political unrest would have developed sooner or later."

The victors' assumptions proved to be correct. "The almost complete social reintegration of the former leading National Socialists was morally questionable, and in some cases scandalous; from a functional standpoint, however, it proved to be highly effective," writes historian Edgar Wolfrum. "Integration into the new democratic nation, as well as personal successes and new careers, offered the guarantee that the democracy would not be immediately questioned or challenged."

Opposed to All Concepts of Morality

But what price did the nation of the constitution have to pay for this small compromise with the past? "The fact that, in light of the millions of victims of Nazi policy, the majority of perpetrators in West Germany were to get off virtually scot-free was a process so fundamentally opposed to all concepts of morality that it could not possibly have remained without consequences for this society," writes Freiburg historian Ulrich Herbert.

On Nov. 7, 1968, a woman climbed onto the podium at the CDU party convention in Berlin, pushed her way to Chairman and Chancellor Kurt Georg Kiesinger, slapped him and shouted "Nazi, Nazi." Beate Klarsfeld was sentenced to a one-year prison term that very same day — proof of how quickly German judges could react when determined to bring about justice.

The anti-Fascist activist, honored in many places (just not in Germany) with medals and awards for her worldwide pursuit of Nazi criminals who had gone into hiding, made a splash with her highly telegenic slap. It went down in German history as an event just as momentous as the establishment of the Federal Republic in 1949: a turning point in the way Germans dealt with the past. It was only the 1968 generation, the generation of Joschka Fischer, who would later become foreign minister, that revolted against the comforting sleep of the republic, the depraved system of chumminess, opportunism and cover-up.

It was a rebellion. The demand to know the whole truth went down in the history of the Federal Republic as a "moral act," says the constitutional lawyer and author Bernhard Schlink, whose novel "The Reader," about a young man born after the war falling in love with a former concentration camp guard, became a global success.

But the days of slaps and revelations are gone. Poet-lawyer Schlink believes that the hour of truth, which is now being celebrated with panels of historians and addresses by cabinet ministers, has the bitter aftertaste of self-righteousness. "This approach to dealing with the past no longer costs us anything," says Schlink. He calls it "part of a new culture of denunciation."

Historian Wildt is no less critical about the new rush to expose old Nazis. He sees the thirst for the truth about one's own history as a form of obsessing political self-purification: "They want to clean themselves. Then they'll have put it behind them."

A "relaxed civil society," says Wildt, would handle the past differently. It would not involve procurement offices and vetted panels with strictly limited access to records, but an opening of the files based on the model of the agency that manages the Stasi records. "All government agencies should place their old files into the archive, so that every citizen can see for himself."

Translated from the German by Christopher Sultan


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Re: EUEUEUEUEU ''enlargement'' propaganda video (EUEUEU removed it)

Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Mar 7 04:25:58 2012, in response to EUEUEUEUEU "enlargement" propaganda video, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Mar 5 18:36:58 2012.

At least someone reposted it.

Bizness Insider

The EU Was Forced To Withdraw This Viral Video After People Complained It Seemed Pretty Racist

Sanya Khetani | March 06, 2012
The European Commission has withdrawn a video promoting EU enlargement after accusations that it was racist, the BBC reports.

The video, called ‘Growing Together’, shows a white woman dressed in a yellow jumpsuit being threatened in an abandoned warehouse by three ethnic minority men: a Chinese-looking man doing kung fu, an Indian-looking man wielding a sword and practicing kalaripayattu (a martial art that originated in south India), and a black man who menaces her in the style of capoeira (a Brazilian martial art).

But after gazing calmly at the trio, the woman multiples herself 12 times and surrounds the three men, following which the men drop their weapons and they all sit down cross-legged as the woman turns into the 12 stars on the EU flag. The video ends with the slogan "The more we are, the stronger we are".




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Re: EUEUEUEUEU ''enlargement'' propaganda video (EUEUEU removed it)

Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Mar 7 04:27:39 2012, in response to EUEUEUEUEU "enlargement" propaganda video, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Mar 5 18:36:58 2012.

At least someone reposted it.

Bizness Insider

The EU Was Forced To Withdraw This Viral Video After People Complained It Seemed Pretty Racist

Sanya Khetani | March 06, 2012
The European Commission has withdrawn a video promoting EU enlargement after accusations that it was racist, the BBC reports.

The video, called ‘Growing Together’, shows a white woman dressed in a yellow jumpsuit being threatened in an abandoned warehouse by three ethnic minority men: a Chinese-looking man doing kung fu, an Indian-looking man wielding a sword and practicing kalaripayattu (a martial art that originated in south India), and a black man who menaces her in the style of capoeira (a Brazilian martial art).

But after gazing calmly at the trio, the woman multiples herself 12 times and surrounds the three men, following which the men drop their weapons and they all sit down cross-legged as the woman turns into the 12 stars on the EU flag. The video ends with the slogan "The more we are, the stronger we are".



In a statement, Stefano Sannino, Director General of Enlargement for the European Commission, said that while feedback from the target audience of 16 to 24 year olds "who understand the plots and themes of martial arts films and video games" had been positive, it was pulling the video owing to concerns about its message. "We apologize to anyone who may have felt offended. Given these controversies, we have decided to stop the campaign immediately and to withdraw the video," he said.

Independent think-tank Open Europe questioned whether viral videos were the way to go for the EU. "It is strange because normally there is something of the ‘Kum Ba Yah’ about the commission. But it has produced a video which shows a white female being threatened by foreign men with weapons. This is in dubious taste and judgment,” Raoul Ruparel of Open Europe told the Guardian.


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Re: (EUEUEUEUEU) The role Nazis played in building West Germany (long)

Posted by AlM on Wed Mar 7 09:34:08 2012, in response to (EUEUEUEUEU) The role Nazis played in building West Germany (long), posted by Olog-hai on Wed Mar 7 01:36:30 2012.

None of this information is new.

You can say that again. I knew Kiesinger was an ex-Nazi back in the 1960s.




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(EUEUEUEUEU) "Holy Alliance" demanding work-free Sundays

Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Mar 7 23:27:15 2012, in response to EUEUEUEUEU Olog, posted by RockParkMan on Sat Nov 12 14:58:17 2011.

This so-called "holy alliance" has labor unions joining with the RCC. This is happening across a number of cities in the EU, not just Rome.

EU Business News (AFP)

'Holy alliance' in Italy protests against working on Sundays

04 March 2012, 15:56 CET
ROME—Trade unions held small protests across Italy and the Catholic Church voiced its support on Sunday as part of a Europe-wide campaign against allowing more businesses to stay open on Sundays.

Susanna Camusso, the leader of Italy's biggest trade union, CGIL, joined picketers outside a Rome shopping center and there were similar demonstrations around the country including street parties in Florence, Milan and Pisa.

"Liberalizing businesses by opening them seven days a week does not increase consumption but it has an impact on the material conditions of workers with ever harsher shifts and increased demands on flexibility," Camusso said.

"A Priceless Day" read the headline of an editorial in Avvenire, the newspaper of the Italian bishops' conference, which hailed the formation a new "holy alliance" between Catholic communities and trade unions on the issue.

"Workers are stressed out by unworkable shifts and the unimaginable difficulties of spending time with their families and taking Sundays not just as a day of rest but of personal reflection," it said.

Italian Prime Minister Mario Monti introduced a reform as part of an austerity package passed in December last year that allows businesses to decide their own working hours, including the possibility of 24-hour opening.

Italy's three main trade unions, CGIL, CISL and UIL, which are already campaigning against government plans to make it easier to fire workers, said in a statement that Sunday openings would lead to "worse economic conditions."

The mobilization in Italy was part of the European Day for a Work-Free Sunday, a campaign called by the European Sunday Alliance, a network of trade unions, civil society organizations and religious communities.


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Re: (EUEUEUEUEU) ''Holy Alliance'' demanding work-free Sundays

Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Mar 7 23:44:27 2012, in response to (EUEUEUEUEU) "Holy Alliance" demanding work-free Sundays, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Mar 7 23:27:15 2012.

Ah yes ... proud words from the guy who worships currency and those who acquire it above Jesus. Bible has a little to say about that too.

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Re: (EUEUEUEUEU) ''Holy Alliance'' demanding work-free Sundays

Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Mar 8 01:02:08 2012, in response to (EUEUEUEUEU) "Holy Alliance" demanding work-free Sundays, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Mar 7 23:27:15 2012.

Hey workers---welcome to the 21st century! What gall!

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Re: (EUEUEUEUEU) ''Holy Alliance'' demanding work-free Sundays

Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Mar 8 10:34:13 2012, in response to Re: (EUEUEUEUEU) ''Holy Alliance'' demanding work-free Sundays, posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Mar 8 01:02:08 2012.

You're confused. Did you forget that it was the left over there that instituted the ban on overtime . . . ? They specifically limited the work week to 48 hours and no longer. Look up the Working Time Directive. (Oh: they based that on the USSR's constitution, which officially limited the work week to seven hours per day in 1936 and was changed to 41 hours per week in 1977.)

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