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US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Phantom909 on Tue Nov 17 22:02:57 2009 http://www.usdebtclock.org/For the first time in history the US debt has broken the $12 trillion barrier. It is triple what it was last year. Also notice that the Debt is also almost as high as the US GDP. And also notice, everybody`s share is almost $39,000 apiece. That includes infants born today. Just thought you guys would like to know Joe |
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| (525524) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue Nov 17 22:08:50 2009, in response to US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Phantom909 on Tue Nov 17 22:02:57 2009. Yep ... sounds like it's time to go down to the JP Chase Morgan bank and ask for our money back. :( |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Nov 17 22:10:07 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue Nov 17 22:08:50 2009. Better do it soon before they give it all to their new Chinese customers in China... |
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| (525527) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Train Dude on Tue Nov 17 22:11:35 2009, in response to US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Phantom909 on Tue Nov 17 22:02:57 2009. Didn't this happen on obama's watch? |
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| (525530) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue Nov 17 22:17:42 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Nov 17 22:10:07 2009. Ah! You HEARD about that. :)Ah well ... give them another bailout and bonus and we'll call it even. :-\ |
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| (525532) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Nov 17 22:18:58 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Train Dude on Tue Nov 17 22:11:35 2009. Well if the '$10 trillion' happened under W Bush, Obama is on the hook for this $2 trillion. "Whooo for the economy!" |
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| (525551) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Nov 17 22:39:58 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue Nov 17 22:17:42 2009. Yeah, I told you about it a few days ago ;) |
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| (525552) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue Nov 17 22:41:37 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Nov 17 22:39:58 2009. Wouldn't it be really neat if folks got handed a little truth instead of truckloads of bullshit? :-\ |
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| (525564) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Stephen Bauman on Tue Nov 17 22:48:54 2009, in response to US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Phantom909 on Tue Nov 17 22:02:57 2009. It is triple what it was last year.US Govt Debt 2008: $9,985.8 B; 2009 (est): $12,867.5 B is a 29% increase not 300%. the Debt is also almost as high as the US GDP It was 120% of GDP, when I was a lad. The bigger problem is the trade imbalance by an order of magnitude. Before you start pointing fingers - look at how we got here: 
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| (525582) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by italianstallion on Tue Nov 17 22:59:30 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Stephen Bauman on Tue Nov 17 22:48:54 2009. The other side doesn't like such facts. |
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| (525592) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Nov 17 23:43:29 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue Nov 17 22:41:37 2009. Believe it or not - heard this from coast to coast am. It maybe 'conspiracy', but at least they have good info from time to time. |
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| (525594) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue Nov 17 23:46:47 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Nov 17 23:43:29 2009. Even a blind dog eventually catches the frisbee. :) |
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| (525604) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Wed Nov 18 00:20:23 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue Nov 17 23:46:47 2009. heh, well I usually listen to that show for entertainment first :) |
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| (525606) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by salaamallah@hotmail.com on Wed Nov 18 00:28:30 2009, in response to US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Phantom909 on Tue Nov 17 22:02:57 2009. CUT THE DEFENSE BUDGET!!!!!!!! yea |
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| (525608) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by David Fairthorne on Wed Nov 18 00:45:05 2009, in response to US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Phantom909 on Tue Nov 17 22:02:57 2009. During this, the worst recession since the great depression, it makes good economic sense to increase the national debt. i.e. run a budget deficit, in an attempt to spend ones way out of the recession. This is precisely what the Treasury and the Federal Reserve are trying to do. The policy began late last year after Lehman failed and when Paulson was still Treasury Secretary.The big mistake was to let the national debt increase so much (about double) during the Bush 43 administration. That was done by mainly starting two wars and instead of raising taxes to pay for them, doing the exact opposite by cutting taxes (for the rich). The government should run a budget surplus during the fat years and a budget deficit during the lean years. |
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| (525609) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Nov 18 00:54:26 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by David Fairthorne on Wed Nov 18 00:45:05 2009. EXCELLENT POST! |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 01:00:55 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Grand Concourse on Wed Nov 18 00:20:23 2009. Bingbong and I were guests on Art Bell's show many times years ago ... he's really out there. :) |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 01:01:59 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by David Fairthorne on Wed Nov 18 00:45:05 2009. Logic completely eludes these guys. :( |
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| (525615) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by David Fairthorne on Wed Nov 18 01:17:24 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Nov 18 00:54:26 2009. Thanks! |
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| (525616) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Wed Nov 18 01:55:05 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by David Fairthorne on Wed Nov 18 00:45:05 2009. Very true, but another thing that could've been done was to take a large portion of Iraq's oil fields to help 'pay for the liberation costs'.That and/or split the country into 3 parts based on religion and let them fend for themselves. If anything a 'Kurdistan' nation should've been built. |
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| (525617) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Wed Nov 18 01:56:05 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 01:00:55 2009. what sort of topics did you discuss? |
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| (525618) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 02:06:01 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Grand Concourse on Wed Nov 18 01:55:05 2009. The Turks would vehemently argue the latter. And as to the "liberation costs" that was in Halliburton's hands. China offered more and so it goes. Just because you're an American company doesn't mean your management GIVES a shit about America. So they moved to Dubai, UAE so they could pocket the result. :( |
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| (525619) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 02:12:08 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Grand Concourse on Wed Nov 18 01:56:05 2009. At the time, we had come up with a "cookie cleaner" and privacy control software called NSClean and IEClean. Natch the militia types were interested in our tool which would hide them from the "Noo World Order" (heh) and Art Bell went bonkers. We were guests to talk about our product and do some sales hopefully, and all Art Bell wanted to talk about was black helicopters, the UN, the Clinton conspiracies, Arkansas State Troopers and Vince Foster. So we played along ...Ever wonder why I'm so tired of the same old broken record? Did it in the 90's ... do we HAVE to do it again? :) |
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| (525621) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Wed Nov 18 02:25:45 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 02:06:01 2009. Major shame indeed... |
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| (525622) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Wed Nov 18 02:26:06 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 02:12:08 2009. lol |
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| (525623) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Nov 18 02:33:22 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Stephen Bauman on Tue Nov 17 22:48:54 2009. Biased graph, you can make a graph look any way you want.Why is 1940-1945, FDR's presidency not "red"? Why is that conveniently not shown on the big upswing?Where's "Feb 27th to today"? And Obama as a congress member and future president agreed with the bail out that took place in 2008 (the sharp line increase. Why is only one month of Obama's presidency shown on the graph, and shown as a horizontal line instead of vertical - doesn't give the full picture. Funny how it often happens when there is an out of control Democratic Congress, such as during Reagan, and after 2006. Notice how when the Republicans took over Congress in Clinton's years, it went down. Notice that when the Democrats took over in Bush it began to go up, and that after stabalizing soon after the 911 increase. You can skew a graph to fit any need you want. Nice try though. |
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| (525625) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 02:39:40 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Grand Concourse on Wed Nov 18 02:25:45 2009. Meanwhile, Cheney ... much like the bankers, continues to walk the streets. And that isn't enough for the douchebag, he's got to mouth off too. :(Ever wonder why he's being protected by the wrongwing media? Republicans put this nation in the toilet. And we're now blaming Obama for it! Gotta love them droids ... |
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| (525626) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 02:41:42 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Nov 18 02:33:22 2009. Heh. You're kidding, right? The UPswing is a BAD thing! It means that debt is going UP ... and why is FDR not red? It's a BASELINE. Geez! :( |
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| (525627) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Nov 18 02:45:09 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 02:41:42 2009. The UPswing is a BAD thing! It means that debt is going UP .I know, I didn't say otherwise. |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 18 02:46:51 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 01:00:55 2009. and now they're giving Jesse "The Body" Ventura his own show on SyFy, which will be a video version of C2C. |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Wed Nov 18 02:55:45 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 18 02:46:51 2009. Shame they couldn't just give it to Noory. That few eps special was pretty good. |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 02:57:01 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Nov 18 02:45:09 2009. Then why all pissy about the colors? Didn't you note a disturbing trend? Or does THAT go under the carpet as well? |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 02:57:52 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 18 02:46:51 2009. Another network blowed to hell ... THANKS, NBC. :-\ |
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| (525632) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 18 02:57:54 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Grand Concourse on Wed Nov 18 02:55:45 2009. venture is a hardcore "truther" who is so out there, he'll turn off even Noory fans. |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 18 02:59:49 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 02:57:52 2009. they've changed TWC big time. lots of shots from Rockefeller Center overlooking Manhattan giving it a local NY feel, so I don't know what the rest of the country will thing. |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Wed Nov 18 03:05:03 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 18 02:57:54 2009. Lol, 'truth is out there'. I guess they want the x-files or something. But yeah, like ghost hunters, I'll pass on watching it. |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 03:17:24 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 18 02:59:49 2009. Heh. I stopped watching the weather channel when they shitcanned John Hope. When I worked in TV, went and got my AMS (American Meteorological Society, but better known amongst us as "Animation and Mouse School") certification and did my stint on Mount Washington. I still have direct access to NOAA data and modelling, so I prefer to fend for myself for forecasts and current conditions since even NOAA no longer knows how to do it correctly. :(As to the rest of America, rent a copy of Idiocracy on DVD ... it'll explain all. Much like "Network" years ago, started out as a comedy - became a documentary. :( |
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| (525636) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Nov 18 03:21:26 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Nov 18 02:33:22 2009. Funny how it often happens when there is an out of control Democratic Congress, such as during Reagan, and after 2006.Funny how it happened with the Republican Congress starting in 2001 and funny how it didn't happen with the Democratic Congress (and both kinds of president) from 1954-1980. I guess the House Democrats became profligate spenders only when they had a Republican Senate to antagonize from 1980-86. |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Nov 18 03:23:08 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 18 02:57:54 2009. And I used to like his politics. |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 03:44:41 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Nov 18 03:21:26 2009. THANK you. |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 03:45:50 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Nov 18 03:23:08 2009. Nah ... after being Governor and seeing the sausage factory up close, he went completely batshit crazy. :( |
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| (525663) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Nov 18 07:07:20 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 18 02:57:01 2009. Yes, I noticed a disturbing trend most of the time when an out of control Democratic congress took control, such as during Reagan, and after 2006. Also it shows how while 9/11 messed it up, it stabalized soon after that, until the Democratic Congress took over in 2006. You can play with the statistics any way you want.There are many factors involved.I also noticed that the biased graph failed to even put down FDR's presidency (conveniently). I also not As I said, you can skew statistics any way you want and make them look any way you want, by playing with the labels and graphics. |
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| (525666) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Nov 18 07:21:50 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Nov 18 03:21:26 2009. Funny how it happened with the Republican Congress starting in 2001Yes, right after 9/11/01 |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SMAZ on Wed Nov 18 09:30:29 2009, in response to US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Phantom909 on Tue Nov 17 22:02:57 2009. God Bless George W. Bush. 
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SMAZ on Wed Nov 18 09:34:36 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Nov 18 02:33:22 2009. Biased graph,Biased graph? HAHAHAHAHA!!! It's from Bush's Whitehouse.gov. It says so on the graph. |
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| (525700) | |
Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SMAZ on Wed Nov 18 09:35:46 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Nov 18 07:07:20 2009. Yes, I noticed a disturbing trend most of the time when an out of control Democratic congress took control, such as during Reagan,WRONG!!! The Democrats lost control of the Senate in 1980 and didn't get it back for six years. |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SMAZ on Wed Nov 18 09:36:09 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Nov 18 03:21:26 2009. Correct. |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by SMAZ on Wed Nov 18 09:40:08 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by David Fairthorne on Wed Nov 18 00:45:05 2009. "Cheney to Treasury: "Deficits don't matter" Former Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neill was told "deficits don't matter" when he warned of a looming fiscal crisis. O'Neill, fired in a shakeup of Bush's economic team in December 2002, raised objections to a new round of tax cuts and said the president balked at his more aggressive plan to combat corporate crime after a string of accounting scandals because of opposition from "the corporate crowd," a key constituency. O'Neill said he tried to warn Vice President Dick Cheney that growing budget deficits-expected to top $500 billion this fiscal year alone-posed a threat to the economy. Cheney cut him off. "You know, Paul, Reagan proved deficits don't matter," he said, according to excerpts. Cheney continued: "We won the midterms (congressional elections). This is our due." A month later, Cheney told the Treasury secretary he was fired. The vice president's office had no immediate comment, but John Snow, who replaced O'Neill, insisted that deficits "do matter" to the |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Nov 18 10:04:56 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Nov 18 07:21:50 2009. Right after the irresponsible 2001 tax cut, passed just before 9/11. |
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Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Nov 18 10:12:02 2009, in response to Re: US National Debt passes $12 trillion, posted by SMAZ on Wed Nov 18 09:35:46 2009. And before that they had control of Congress for 26 years, during which time the debt fell.And when the Democrats took over in 2007, they managed to get the debt to start rising 6 years earlier. Neat trick! |
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