|
|
| Re: Trump's Restart Plan (1710612) | |
 |
|
| Home > OTChat | |
[ Post a New Response | Return to the Index ]
|
Page 5 of 5 |
||
|
| (1711427) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 28 16:31:46 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by ClearAspect on Sat Mar 28 16:23:58 2020. At the time no one understood what was to come |
|
|
| (1711430) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 16:40:36 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 28 16:11:59 2020. Exactly. TD was the first to bring up the party affiliation of the LA officials. Joe just called it a red state, which is true. And Joe wasn't the first to blame Trump in general - that was Stephen.PS. I long ago said that Joe was wrong in suggesting that Trump had any kind of responsibility for Mardi Gras not being canceled. |
|
|
| (1711431) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 16:42:22 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 28 16:31:46 2020. True. But Trump saying that Democrats were engaged in a hoax (to make covid-19 sound worse than it really was) made the situation worse.It turns out the Democrats weren't excessively alarmist - they weren't alarmist enough. But Trump called them hoaxers for the alarm they did raise. |
|
|
| (1711435) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 16:48:47 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 16:42:22 2020. Link to where Trump said that? |
|
|
| (1711439) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 28 16:54:16 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 16:30:33 2020. You have trouble following threads? JoeV claimed the conservatives in red state Louisiana were to blame for it spreading there, and specifically mentioned Mardis Gras in NO in February. It was pointed out that both the governorship and city of NO were held by democrats. Then he said that it was up to the federal government that was responsible (even after blaming red state Louisiana is actually currently run by democrats). Then I asked who did it in other states like NY. Then you out of no where, Mr rationalization, claimed there was no question (not that anyone was addressing you), but of course you are free to answer. But obviously you had trouble following the thread (or at least the parts that don't suit your political ideals). |
|
|
| (1711441) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 16:59:17 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 16:48:47 2020. Linkthe outbreak is “their new hoax” |
|
|
| (1711442) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 28 17:00:12 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 16:42:22 2020. Proof???Trump did not say the Corona virus or the democrat's view of it being a "hoax". He claimed the Democrats criticism of how his administration handled it was a hoax because they were politicizing it. You repeatedly have been promoting the false claim here. |
|
|
| (1711445) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Kevin from Midwood on Sat Mar 28 17:03:37 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 28 16:31:46 2020. At the time no one understood what was to comeWhy not? Mobile World Congress was canceled on 2/12. Italy began lockdowns in the midst of an outbreak on 2/23. “It’s not a question of if but rather a question of when and how many people in this country will have severe illness,” said Nancy Messonnier on 2/25. Did she arrive at that conclusion suddenly on that very day? People on Twitter were expressing concern about the possibility of the virus spreading at Mardis Gras days earlier. It's hard to escape the notion that someone screwed up. |
|
|
| (1711446) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 17:13:45 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 16:59:17 2020. Good use of quotes by that writer to be purposefully misleading. What Trump actually said was that Democratic criticism of the administration's response to coronavirus was a hoax.Snopes even states that exact thing, but bizarrely rate the claim that Trump called coronavirus a hoax as a "Mixture". Had the political leanings been reversed, I doubt that would have happened. Snopes |
|
|
| (1711447) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 17:24:40 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Kevin from Midwood on Sat Mar 28 17:03:37 2020. You can use those same facts to say that Japan should have seen it coming as well. They are geographically much closer, have an older population, live in a much more crowded country, and it's people rely on public transportation. But weirdly it never really came there. They've had cases, but nothing like us. Hindsight is 20/20.But I do recall people wondering if Mardi Gras would be canceled. |
|
|
| (1711448) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by ClearAspect on Sat Mar 28 17:24:42 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 28 16:31:46 2020. He was notified about the potential in January by the Intelligence commuity. There was a playbook developed in 2016 that the administration ignored.Then Trump on 2/24 said.... “The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA. We are in contact with everyone and all relevant countries. CDC & World Health have been working hard and very smart. Stock Market starting to look very good to me!“ https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.politico.com/amp/news/2020/03/25/trump-coronavirus-national-security-council-149285 So stop making excuses for Trump. Enough |
|
|
| (1711449) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by ClearAspect on Sat Mar 28 17:26:10 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 17:24:40 2020. Most of Japanas cases at one point were on the cruise ship. Their cities did very well. |
|
|
| (1711450) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 17:29:55 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by ClearAspect on Sat Mar 28 17:26:10 2020. Exactly. But if they had done poorly, we could say that they should have seen it coming and taken drastic action. But it didn't come. So no one really knows. |
|
|
| (1711451) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by ClearAspect on Sat Mar 28 17:35:13 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 17:29:55 2020. We are the #1 super power of the world easy. I dont care about how Japan or Italy, i care about how when Trump know, what Trump did, and where he failed.Pointing fingers at Other countries is deflecting what obligations we could have done in this nation to mitigate and / or prevent. |
|
|
| (1711452) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Jeff Rosen on Sat Mar 28 17:35:18 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by JayZeeBMT on Sat Mar 28 12:34:30 2020. I meant what it may come to |
|
|
| (1711453) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 17:37:17 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 17:13:45 2020. What Trump actually said was that Democratic criticism of the administration's response to coronavirus was a hoax.That's just what I said a few posts ago. It wasn't a hoax. The Democrats weren't excessively alarmist; it turns out they were insufficiently alarmist. |
|
|
| (1711454) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 17:38:11 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Jeff Rosen on Sat Mar 28 17:35:18 2020. That would be really stupid of them. Lots of food comes from NY. RI doesn't have much in terms of farms. |
|
|
| (1711456) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 17:45:52 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 17:37:17 2020. You said that Trump said that "Democrats were engaged in a hoax (to make covid-19 sound worse than it really was) ". That's false.What Trump actually said was that Democrats were engaged in a hoax (to make his response to the covid-19 crisis appear to be inadequate when he actually did a great job). |
|
|
| (1711457) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by ClearAspect on Sat Mar 28 17:50:51 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 17:45:52 2020. He really didnt. Now he wants to be appreciated. |
|
|
| (1711458) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 17:55:05 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 17:45:52 2020. I don't really understand the difference.I'll gladly go with your version of the wording. He said that Democrats were perpetrating a hoax. But they weren't. Exactly what hoax he claimed they were engaged in doesn't matter. It wasn't a hoax. |
|
|
| (1711460) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 18:04:01 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Kevin from Midwood on Sat Mar 28 17:03:37 2020. It's hard to escape the notion that someone screwed up.Most of the US underestimated the virus. I went to a dinner with 7 other people on March 5th and didn't worry about it at the time. Of course by now, a whole bunch of New Yorkers who celebrated something that evening (none in our group) are in the ICU. I still took the subway home from the office on March 10th, only trying to stay in an emptier portion of the car, nothing more. I made a post suggesting that Cuomo overreacted in his actions in New Rochelle that day (I still think his actions were pointless, but they turned out to be an underreaction). |
|
|
| (1711461) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 18:09:27 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 17:55:05 2020. To use the war analogy what he said was that Democrats criticism of his war strategy was a hoax. Your wording implied that he was denying that there even was a war. |
|
|
| (1711463) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 18:15:56 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 18:09:27 2020. I'm objecting to his use of the word "hoax." You can disagree with Democratic criticisms of him, but they were NOT a hoax. |
|
|
| (1711470) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 18:18:37 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 18:15:56 2020. I dunno. I think that no matter he did they would have criticized him. It's what political parties do. |
|
|
| (1711473) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 18:21:38 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 18:18:37 2020. Sure. But it wasn't a "hoax." |
|
|
| (1711480) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 18:48:19 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by ClearAspect on Sat Mar 28 17:35:13 2020. My point is that hindsight is 20/20. We can say that we should have known, but obviously we didn't. I believe that if Obama were president that we would have ended up in a very similar situation. Maybe better, maybe worse. We have never had the infrastructure in place to deal with something like this at a national level. |
|
|
| (1711481) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 18:52:53 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 18:48:19 2020. I believe that if Obama were president that we would have ended up in a very similar situation.Except for Trump firing the pandemic people on the NSC staff. If they hadn't been fired, they would have been raising holy hell in February that we needed to move faster on testing and on ventilator production. But they weren't there, so they couldn't say anything. Of course the Obama administration or a Clinton Administration would still have made plenty of mistakes too. |
|
|
| (1711482) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 19:02:41 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 18:52:53 2020. I have my doubts about the significance of that. We needed more than a pandemic team sounding the alarm. We needed an infrastructure that could respond and we have never had that.What did the pandemic team do during SARS? I'm asking because I never heard of them before a couple weeks ago. Were people in general upset when they were fired? Was that seen as controversial? |
|
|
| (1711485) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 19:09:22 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 19:02:41 2020. I looked at Snopes and they verified as "True" that Trump fired the "US Pandemic Team" to fight costs. But then you read the Snopes article and two people were fired. One of them was a Rear Admiral and the other was a lawyer. And there wasn't anything called the "US Pandemic Team", but the two people let go did supervise those areas, but John Bolton was ultimately in charge.Are you saying that if Trump hadn't fired a Rear Admiral and a lawyer that we would have been ready for this pandemic? Because that sounds ridiculous. |
|
|
| (1711498) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 28 19:37:49 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 17:37:17 2020. For the 100th time, that's not what he was calling a hoax, and you keep pushing that inaccuracy. He SAID the Democrats criticism of how his administration handled it was a hoax because they were politicizing it. |
|
|
| (1711500) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 28 19:39:33 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 18:15:56 2020. The hoax was how the Democrats were portraying the administration's actions to the virus. |
|
|
| (1711501) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 28 19:40:25 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 18:21:38 2020. But it was. They attempted to portray his administration's action a certain way. |
|
|
| (1711503) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 28 19:43:00 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 19:09:22 2020. It's another ridiculous thing Al has pushed at least 100 times |
|
|
| (1711504) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 19:47:49 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 28 19:39:33 2020. Really? You contend the Democrats really were perpetrating a hoax? |
|
|
| (1711505) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Mar 28 19:49:42 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 19:09:22 2020. Ah, the dreaded Rear Admiral. |
|
|
| (1711508) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 20:02:01 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 19:09:22 2020. More neglect than just firing two guys. |
|
|
| (1711515) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 28 20:39:44 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 19:47:49 2020. That was Trump's claim....not that Corona virus was a hoax. And not that the Democrats were overstating it. His claim was the hoax was the Democrats criticism of the administration's handling of it |
|
|
| (1711516) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 20:44:49 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 20:02:01 2020. I think that there will be plenty of time later to analyze what went wrong and what could have been done better. I'm sure that there will be lots of both. And I think that this article is more political than anything. I'm guessing that they constantly find and write about how republicans screw everything up.That aside, it is pretty fascinating. I skimmed the plan and I'm guessing that most didn't. Maybe you didn't either since it directly contradicts a point that you have made many times. More about that later. The first half of the Pandemic Plan is about the US assisting foreign governments. We actually offered assistance to China and they declined. So skip the first half. The rest is about how the US should respond. One of the first things that the article says to do is to "consider implementation of travel restrictions and border controls". That is in fact one of the first things that Trump did and something that you have stated was ineffective. Maybe you're right, but it was supposed to be considered and given the severity, it seems like the right choice was made. There's no smoking gun in that manual that I see. If you see one, let me know. |
|
|
| (1711517) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Jeff Rosen on Sat Mar 28 20:46:40 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Mar 28 19:49:42 2020. You wouldn't be joking if he was your commanding officer |
|
|
| (1711518) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Easy on Sat Mar 28 20:47:51 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Jeff Rosen on Sat Mar 28 20:46:40 2020. It's a Simpsons reference. Maybe something like an atomic wedgie? |
|
|
| (1711522) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 21:12:58 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 28 20:39:44 2020. His claim was the hoax was the Democrats criticism of the administration's handling of itAnd you agree that the criticism was a hoax? |
|
|
| (1711531) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sat Mar 28 21:29:19 2020, in response to Re: Trump's Restart Plan, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 28 21:12:58 2020. Did I say that either way?And that would be irrelevant to the discussion. And stop trying to change the subject. What you have been claiming multiple times isn't the case. |
|
|
| (1711800) | |
Re: Trump's Restart Plan |
|
|
Posted by Orange Blossom Special on Sun Mar 29 18:17:09 2020, in response to Trump's Restart Plan, posted by Stephen Bauman on Thu Mar 26 20:47:11 2020. "may-relax-social-distancing/"LOL, relax WHAT social distancing? LOL |
|
|
|
Page 5 of 5 |
||