W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th (326638) | |
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(326639) | |
Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Wed Dec 6 08:26:25 2017, in response to W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th, posted by W.B. on Wed Dec 6 04:39:04 2017. completing a process for those two particular avenues begun three years and one month beforeIf you happen to know, what was this process like? Is it the political process or just the changing of the lines and signage? I wouldn't have thought that it would take so long to change the direction of a street. |
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(326640) | |
Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th |
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Posted by W.B. on Wed Dec 6 09:18:17 2017, in response to Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th, posted by New Flyer #857 on Wed Dec 6 08:26:25 2017. Pre-1951 or 1952, changes in traffic patterns were handled by the Police Department. Afterwards this process was put under the aegis of the Department of Traffic, whose first Commissioner was T.T. Wiley. He was later replaced by Henry Barnes. But there was a whole set of navigations in those days one had to go through, from the proposal, to the hashing it out with the Transport Workers Union who fought such one-way conversions tooth and nail, to the date set to convert, and the arrangements for changes to key bus routes, and so on.The whole set of conversions took place in stages. In-between the different sections of Tenth/Amsterdam and Ninth/Columbus being converted, there was the June 1951 one-way conversion of First and Second Avenues. |
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(326641) | |
Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th |
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Posted by andy on Wed Dec 6 09:47:46 2017, in response to Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th, posted by W.B. on Wed Dec 6 09:18:17 2017. The NYC Omnibus Corp. fought the one way conversions as well, claiming loss of future patronage because passengers had to walk an extra block in many cases. Its routes were impacted more than any other operator.The First and Second Avenue conversion in 1951 was easier because the NYC Board of Transportation already controlled the bus routes on those avenues, eliminating the issue of private bus operator opposition. |
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(326643) | |
Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th |
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Posted by Dan on Wed Dec 6 11:24:22 2017, in response to W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th, posted by W.B. on Wed Dec 6 04:39:04 2017. Today the NYCDOT can institute 1-way conversions or any other traffic & parking changes at will. But they usually seek input from community groups, the NYPD and elected officials before making such changes.About 10 years ago Great Kills Road was converted from 2-way to 1-way northbound from Hylan Blvd to Amboy Rd. This came after years of the NYCDOT and local residents arguing about which way the street was to run. One day the NYCDOT put up one-way signs and that was that. https://goo.gl/maps/jAABccrovuR2 |
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(326644) | |
Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th |
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Posted by W.B. on Wed Dec 6 14:19:23 2017, in response to Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th, posted by andy on Wed Dec 6 09:47:46 2017. Of course, when Fifth and Madison Avenues were converted in '66, there was no Fifth Avenue Coach, its (and NYCO's, and Surface Transit's) routes having been taken over by MaBSTOA. Ditto for the 1963 conversions noted in the November 10 bus almanac.But there you have it: The planning for such one-way conversions, for all the reasons mentioned, was very tricky business in the 1950's, had to be handled with the utmost of care - and mapped out very well in advance prior to their taking effect. |
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(326645) | |
Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th |
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Posted by italianstallion on Wed Dec 6 16:40:00 2017, in response to Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th, posted by W.B. on Wed Dec 6 14:19:23 2017. And we all think things were easier back then. |
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(326646) | |
Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th |
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Posted by randyo on Wed Dec 6 17:48:54 2017, in response to Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th, posted by W.B. on Wed Dec 6 09:18:17 2017. I seem to recall that due to the proliferation of one way avenues under Wiley, his nickname became "One Way Wiley” or “Wrong Way Wiley” depending on who you talked to. Barnes also contributed his share of traffic modifications including his “Barnes Dance” in which selected intersections in Manhattan had their Walk/Don’t Walk signs set so that pedestrians could cross in all directions at the same time while all auto traffic was stopped. |
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(326648) | |
Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Dec 7 10:53:14 2017, in response to Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th, posted by randyo on Wed Dec 6 17:48:54 2017. Actually, the so-called "Barnes Dance" was first implemented in NYC by Wiley. It acquired its nickname as more of them were implemented by Barnes. |
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(326649) | |
Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Dec 7 10:55:51 2017, in response to W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th, posted by W.B. on Wed Dec 6 04:39:04 2017. I thought all of these would have been done on a Sunday. December 6, 1951 was a Thursday. |
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(326650) | |
Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th |
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Posted by W.B. on Thu Dec 7 12:08:26 2017, in response to Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Dec 7 10:55:51 2017. Sure was. But the change was announced in The New York Times of Dec. 4, 1951, which headline clearly stated: "Two More Avenues One-way Thursday."But the southern half of those avenues' conversions - on Nov. 6, 1948 - fell on a Saturday. The June 4, 1951 conversions of First and Second Avenues was on a Monday. And Jan. 14, 1966 was on a Friday. Apparently no rhyme or reason. You may want to check the other avenues' conversion dates to figure out what days they fell on. |
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(326652) | |
Re: W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th - ADDENDA |
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Posted by W.B. on Thu Dec 7 16:08:22 2017, in response to W.B.'s Bus Almanac for December 6th, posted by W.B. on Wed Dec 6 04:39:04 2017. On that same 1951 date, another bus route was affected by the same one-way changes:- 17 (79th Street Crosstown): Eastbound buses operate northbound on Amsterdam Avenue from 79th to 82nd Street, then east on 82nd Street and south on Columbus Avenue to 81st Street and the rest of its route. (Additional Information: "Two More Avenues One-Way Thursday." The New York Times, December 4, 1951.) |
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