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Re: MTA Bus to get... |
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Posted by Q46 LTD Glen Oaks on Mon Jul 27 22:15:44 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by petabread2 on Mon Jul 27 22:12:52 2009. True, also going by the lastest roster those 85 buses would be exactly enough to retire the all the pre 1994 buses at MTA Bus. The ex PBL buses would still be around though |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Mon Jul 27 22:24:17 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by petabread2 on Mon Jul 27 21:28:39 2009. That's roughly the cost of 5 O7 NG hybrids (with some money left over); each O7 NG hybrid is $514K. |
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Posted by R160 8818 on Mon Jul 27 23:21:01 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by AMoreira81 on Mon Jul 27 19:20:18 2009. Thanks! |
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Posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Mon Jul 27 23:56:54 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by AMoreira81 on Mon Jul 27 19:08:32 2009. Not all...9311 has 2x2 seating in it. |
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Posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Mon Jul 27 23:59:33 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by R33/R36 mainline on Mon Jul 27 18:07:48 2009. Don't get your high hopes up. Expect ALL of the Bee Line Orions to be renumbered and repainted into the MTA Blue And White before they will see service. |
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Posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Tue Jul 28 00:02:12 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by AMoreira81 on Mon Jul 27 19:20:18 2009. I think the worst of the 400-580 and 611-680 batch will get replaced. The rest will stick around a little longer. |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Jul 28 00:11:11 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Mon Jul 27 23:59:33 2009. I wonder what numbers they will use. |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Tue Jul 28 00:16:11 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Mon Jul 27 23:59:33 2009. That may be the case if only because the doors will need to be modified. |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Tue Jul 28 00:16:36 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Tue Jul 28 00:02:12 2009. I actually expect 631-680 to stay, but all of the rest to go. |
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Posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Tue Jul 28 00:25:59 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Q46 LTD Glen Oaks on Mon Jul 27 22:15:44 2009. The Ex-PBL 1994 TMC RTSs are currently being displaced. What will probably stay around a little longer are the 1993 TMC RTSs. The main buses that will be replaced this time around will be the 1990-1991 TMC RTSs as well as the 1993 Orion Vs and the 1994 TMC RTSs from the PBLs. Don't get me wrong, the 1993 TMC RTSs are up for replacement too. But they will last a little longer than the other buses.Here's what I can see happening for the WCBL Orion Vs: About 30 buses will go to JFK to make their local fleet all Orion and displace all of the remaining RTSs there. About 25 buses going over to Far Rock to make their local fleet all Orion and displace all of their RTSs there. The 1993 TMC RTSs would get split between BP and LGA. Also, I can see more Orion VII buses would get transferred out from FR and perhaps SC to LGA and BP to displace some of their RTSs. SC could get the rest. Then the rest of the Orion V CNGs would head over to CP and the Orion VIIs could head over to LGA. LGA would get more of the 1993 TMCs until their next set of NG arrive. Then those will be displaced. When CP receives SC's CNGs, I could see more of the 9800 Orion V CNG Series heading to WF and perhaps the 6000s would head back to NYCT...my guess would be CS Depot so they can displace more of the worst 400-500 series Orion V buses. With the transfers coming in the fall and winter picks, CP will not need many local buses. They will have plenty with the Orion V CNGs. At the same time, LGA will need more buses for their local lines. I can see them getting more RTSs as well as Orion VIIs. When these WCBL Orion Vs arrive to MTAB, heads will be spinning with all of the movements. Also, it's for 84 buses...not 85. The Orion Vs were numbered from 401-484. |
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Posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Tue Jul 28 00:29:15 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Q46 LTD Glen Oaks on Mon Jul 27 22:01:22 2009. As more 9800s from CP arrive at WF, I can see the Novas currently at WF getting transferred over to QV to knock off any remaining repowered TMC RTS. Also, QV will be getting more Novas when Jamaica Depot receives their shipments of Orion VII NGs. |
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Posted by rionOne on Tue Jul 28 00:29:57 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Mon Jul 27 23:59:33 2009. I D K, I see them pressing them into service, much like the ex-PBL equipment, then gradually painting them in cycles.From what i've seen of some of the equipment these buses are replacing, thier time has come and past, this Orion Vs need to hit service, ASAP! -Trevor |
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Posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Tue Jul 28 00:34:17 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Jul 28 00:11:11 2009. If they wanted to make things easy, they could use 2401-2484?7000-7083? 7820-7903? We'll see. |
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Posted by rionOne on Tue Jul 28 00:35:44 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jul 27 18:19:35 2009. A) The 20 runs FAIRLY lateB) The 19 doesn't need Sunday service, sorry! Bee-Line is working on service improvements, but not having 24 hour service doesn't bring the operation. Sorry, you're not gonna find another operation in this area that keeps thier equipment immaculate from day one to retirement. You're Not gonna find nearly an operation with operators trained they way Bee-Line operator's are trained. Bee-Line is one of the few CLASS ACT operations left out there. And those a FAR and few between. -Trevor |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Tue Jul 28 00:52:50 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by rionOne on Tue Jul 28 00:35:44 2009. A) The 20 runs FAIRLY lateTrue, but there's still heavy demand for 24/7 service to at least Yonkers Avenue. B) The 19 doesn't need Sunday service, sorry! Yes it does, look at its ridership statistics it gets more ridership than the 16 that runs 7 days a week. It's very popular on Saturdays with people in Ossining commuting to Pleasantville and shopping in Mount Kisco. Bee-Line is working on service improvements, but not having 24 hour service doesn't bring the operation. Just like it brings down Suffolk Transit it also brings down Bee-Line. Part of running a public transportation involves actually serving passengers when they need it, and in many cases Bee-Line fails to do so like how early the last 14 bus leaves Peekskill. Even Transport of Rockland runs most of its buses until at least 11PM. You're Not gonna find nearly an operation with operators trained they way Bee-Line operator's are trained. I agree when it comes to Liberty Lines and PTLA, but Port Chester-Rye transit employees can't even dress properly for the job, I once saw one oddly dressed in a T-Shirt, Swimming Trunks, and flip-flops, so if those guys can't even dress properly it's hard to believe that they're trained properly. |
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Posted by rionOne on Tue Jul 28 01:11:46 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Osmosis Jones on Tue Jul 28 00:52:50 2009. Even Transport of Rockland runs most of its buses until at least 11PM.Ok, as a Ex-Transport of Rockland driver, I can tell you that some of that late service is unnecessary. Hell I had a saturday run, where I BARELY carried 10 people the whole day and that is 4 round trips! Part of running a public transportation involves actually serving passengers when they need it, and in many cases Bee-Line fails to do so.. Sorry, I live in a Bee Line service area. I have ZERO complaints about my service. Bee Line does a good job, I'm on a line that gets a 20 minute headway 95% of the day and that line DOESN'T EVEN come into the Bronx. Its a suburban operation, not a city operation. The ONLY lines that could benefit from 24 hour service is the 2, 4, 20 and 42. And even that is a stretch... I've been on the last 2, the last 20 AND the last 42. Ridership on those trips are not worthy of 24 hour service. The rest of the system works great. And thanks to the MTA and its MetroCard, the system is actually suffering because of that, but they make due. |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Jul 28 01:23:00 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Tue Jul 28 00:25:59 2009. I dunno, I for some reason dont see the buses SC have sent to Far Rock going back to SC again.Also speaking of the SC-FR swaps, are they finished swapping the buses yet? |
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Posted by RyogaRidesTheMTA on Tue Jul 28 01:32:46 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by AMoreira81 on Tue Jul 28 00:16:11 2009. ...and the side destination signs.Unless they're gonna be confined to the Q6, Q7, Q8, or Q9, those LCD signs need to go. I wonder if they'll order whole new LED sign sets for the front/side/rear or (more likely) take flip-dot Luminator side signs out of retired buses to work with the existing Luminator front/rear signs. Regarding the rear doors, I wonder if they'll take rear doors off of retired Orion Vs (like they did with the MTAB-to-NYCT Orion V CNGs) or just add touch bars (since they're the latest thing at the MTA) to the existing doors... |
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Posted by RyogaRidesTheMTA on Tue Jul 28 01:40:27 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by RyogaRidesTheMTA on Tue Jul 28 01:32:46 2009. Correction, the route sign on the side signs can display three characters (sorry, brain fart) so techically as is, they can't go to CP, SC or BP (those depots have routes with four characters-Q101, Q112, B103, etc.) but will be okay anywhere else.Then again, I severely doubt MTAB will keep the LCD signs anyway, so maybe I'm overanalyzing. |
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Posted by GOLD_12th on Tue Jul 28 01:44:52 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by JFK DEPOT on Mon Jul 27 19:04:01 2009. Nah, MTA should just leave the bus scheme as it is. Just slap some MTA decals & you got a very unique scheme. Better then plain boring White blue stripe bus. |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Tue Jul 28 05:05:30 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by rionOne on Tue Jul 28 01:11:46 2009. Ok, as a Ex-Transport of Rockland driver, I can tell you that some of that late service is unnecessary. Hell I had a saturday run, where I BARELY carried 10 people the whole day and that is 4 round trips!Yeah that's true, but if those routes get service to at least 11PM, then why can't Bee-Line routes that have more ridership get that kind of service too? Its a suburban operation, not a city operation. The ONLY lines that could benefit from 24 hour service is the 2, 4, 20 and 42. And even that is a stretch... I've been on the last 2, the last 20 AND the last 42. Ridership on those trips are not worthy of 24 hour service. The 7 could also benefit from a 24/7 service as it connects two large cities, in addition to serving a major casino that I'm pretty sure has employees living in those cities. The 40 which connects Westchester's biggest hospital with Westchester's biggest city would also benefit from a hawk, and if you add the 20 between Yonkers and The Bronx, you have the 2 Bee-Line routes that I think need 24/7 service the most right now. The 2 and 4 should just get later service on Weekends, and the 42 is fine I wasn't referring to that route. The rest of the system works great. I agree, but there are still minor things about it that I think should be changed so it can be more convenient. |
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Posted by JAzumah on Tue Jul 28 07:54:37 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by rionOne on Tue Jul 28 00:35:44 2009. 100% agree.Bee-Line is probably the best managed bus system in the region, bar none. This is simply a fact. |
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Posted by Newkirk Images on Tue Jul 28 07:58:18 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Tue Jul 28 00:25:59 2009. The Orion Vs were numbered from 401-484.So far no one has mentioned what MTAB fleet numbering would be applied to the ex-W.C. buses. Any idea what numbers will be used ? Bill Newkirk |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Tue Jul 28 08:21:38 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by RyogaRidesTheMTA on Tue Jul 28 01:40:27 2009. You never know. They'd be quite useful for subway shuttles.
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Tue Jul 28 08:33:34 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Newkirk Images on Tue Jul 28 07:58:18 2009. They could simply slap a 2 or a 4 in front of the original number to get 2401-2484 or 4401-4484. |
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Posted by rionOne on Tue Jul 28 10:39:06 2009, in response to MTA Bus to get..., posted by petabread2 on Mon Jul 27 13:49:20 2009. I'd heard about this back in May, I also heard that the 4 Orion 07.501 Hybrids are in the deal as well. |
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Posted by The Flxible Neofan on Tue Jul 28 10:49:19 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Osmosis Jones on Tue Jul 28 05:05:30 2009. The 7 could also benefit from a 24/7 service as it connects two large cities, in addition to serving a major casino that I'm pretty sure has employees living in those cities. The 40 which connects Westchester's biggest hospital with Westchester's biggest city would also benefit from a hawk, and if you add the 20 between Yonkers and The Bronx, you have the 2 Bee-Line routes that I think need 24/7 service the most right now.My main gripe with Bee-Line is that they decide to PACK artics with infrequent headways on the weekend. But I guess in the interest of saving money, they prefer to PACK artics rather than run more frequent (every 20 minute) service on routes like the 7. |
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Posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Tue Jul 28 10:58:29 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by R36 #9346 on Tue Jul 28 08:21:38 2009. Come again?! Say what?! |
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Posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Tue Jul 28 11:00:12 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Jul 28 01:23:00 2009. This wouldn't be a swap between SC and FR. SC and LGA or BP...perhaps. |
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Posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Tue Jul 28 11:01:14 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by R36 #9346 on Tue Jul 28 08:33:34 2009. They will not be able to use the 4401-4484. Those are slated for the Orion VII NGs. |
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Posted by trainspot12 on Tue Jul 28 11:29:08 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Tue Jul 28 11:01:14 2009. This is something that has been mentioned in May. The Orion V are going to be here around the Fall and Winter when the NABI buses are delivered. Look for a bus around October (or maybe sooner) because they desperately want the 1990-1991 TMC, 1993 O5 and 1994 TMC gone.Along with the Orion V, they may also take the Orion VII Hybrids (201-204) as well. If they do, then the O7 will be 3784-3787 (but that I haven't heard if they will take those yet). The order is for 25 buses for Far Rockaway, 35 buses for JFK and 24 for Spring Creek (however this is NOT yet set in stone). Also when Flatbush receives their next batch of NGs, this will displace all of their 1993 TMCs to LGA/BP. So this will be an interesting bus swap in the next few weeks/months. |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Tue Jul 28 11:41:41 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by rionOne on Tue Jul 28 10:39:06 2009. So it is 88 buses instead of 84? |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Tue Jul 28 11:42:59 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by R36 #9346 on Tue Jul 28 08:33:34 2009. 4401-4484 is NOT open...that's for the O7 NG order. |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Tue Jul 28 11:43:57 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by trainspot12 on Tue Jul 28 11:29:08 2009. The NABI order may be complete by August. |
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Posted by R33/R36 mainline on Tue Jul 28 11:50:16 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by trainspot12 on Tue Jul 28 11:29:08 2009. Why would SC need these buses? They don't have any TMC repowers or 93 Orions, just hybrids and 98-99 CNGs. |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Tue Jul 28 11:53:57 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by R33/R36 mainline on Tue Jul 28 11:50:16 2009. Maybe SC would be losing its O7s? |
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Posted by Q46 LTD Glen Oaks on Tue Jul 28 15:17:24 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by AMoreira81 on Tue Jul 28 11:53:57 2009. it would make more sense if those buses bumped the CNGs out. |
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Posted by MCI D4000 81994 on Tue Jul 28 19:30:00 2009, in response to MTA Bus to get..., posted by petabread2 on Mon Jul 27 13:49:20 2009. Nice - and a side plus - they might be able to use the LCD displays as spares/replacements for the subway trains. |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Tue Jul 28 22:02:47 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Bee Flexible #823 on Tue Jul 28 10:58:29 2009. The LCD signs on the side of those buses would come in quite handy if they were to be used as subway shuttles.Let's say that the E was running shuttle buses between Kew Gardens and Jamaica Center. Instead of having the boring ol' E TRAIN TO E JAMAICA CTR AND E TRAIN TO E UNION TPKE You would have… E JAMAICA CENTER |
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Posted by RyogaRidesTheMTA on Tue Jul 28 23:24:59 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by rionOne on Tue Jul 28 10:39:06 2009. Wow I didn't know Bee-Line hated BAE that much...They specified for any other hybrid system other than BAE (which excluded Orion from bidding on the hybrid order) and now they want to get rid of of the Orion VIIs...wow. |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Tue Jul 28 23:44:24 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by RyogaRidesTheMTA on Tue Jul 28 23:24:59 2009. Actually, those four buses would be oddballs. |
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Posted by R 36 ML 9542 on Wed Jul 29 02:56:59 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by Q46 LTD Glen Oaks on Tue Jul 28 15:17:24 2009. I think FLA is next for the NGs? How would this work out for FLA/LGA/BP? |
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Posted by TC40102A#9167 on Wed Jul 29 17:21:05 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by JAzumah on Mon Jul 27 22:06:10 2009. You are absolutely right! They would be amazed probably on how much NIMCO gets running buses for. |
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Posted by rionOne on Thu Jul 30 08:58:20 2009, in response to MTA Bus to get..., posted by petabread2 on Mon Jul 27 13:49:20 2009. Reconfirmed, the MTA is picking up all 84 of the 1995-96 BIA/OBI Orion 05.501 Diesels (401-484). These buses are SLOWLY being retired and are being placed in a Storage facility in Vahalla (NOT the Vahalla Depot). Also, I found out that its a good possibility that not only will they take the 84 Orion 05.501s, they may also take the 4 2006 DaimlerChrysler Orion 07.501 Hybrids (201-204). I've been told that its more a yes than a no that this will occur.It makes no sense for BEE-LINE to retain these 4 oddball Hybrid buses while they operate a majority GM/Allison Hybrid fleet. -Trevor |
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Posted by R40SlantontheB on Thu Jul 30 22:40:32 2009, in response to MTA Bus to get..., posted by petabread2 on Mon Jul 27 13:49:20 2009. I guess Bee-Line is getting a bunch of new buses. Quite odd MTA would buy buses from a non-MTA agency. Those 1995 Orion V's are in great shape, I doubt that MTA will keep them in as good shape for long. |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 30 22:55:50 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by R40SlantontheB on Thu Jul 30 22:40:32 2009. 95 NABI 40LFW hybrids to be exact, with 11 (7 if the Bee-Line O7 hybrids are being sold as well) for service increases. |
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Posted by PHXTUSbusfan on Thu Jul 30 23:04:23 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 30 22:55:50 2009. Does it appear that the O7s are going to be sold? |
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Posted by R33/R36 mainline on Fri Jul 31 07:38:34 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by R40SlantontheB on Thu Jul 30 22:40:32 2009. I doubt that MTA will keep them in as good shape for long.If they go to SC they will stay in good shape... |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Fri Jul 31 11:04:49 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by R33/R36 mainline on Fri Jul 31 07:38:34 2009. I think they would do fine at FR as well since they've been getting nothing but 'hand me down' RTS's, only the 8600's have been the more decent buses, the SC hybrids have also been pretty good as they have lower milage. |
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Posted by brightonr68 on Fri Jul 31 16:07:24 2009, in response to Re: MTA Bus to get..., posted by The Flxible Neofan on Tue Jul 28 10:49:19 2009. something that people on this board forget is that these bus lines LOSE MONEY with every runExcept for getting to work there is NO NEED to get somewhere on public subsidy unless it creates extra tax revenue that makes up for the subsidy. If you need to get somewhere save up for a car like is done in most rural areas. You can get a running car for a few grand NYS LOSES thousands of jobs due to the high tax structure I am a bus geek but there needed to be some compromise running artics at longer headway gets you there an makes the operation more cost neutral |
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