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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed May 6 23:01:51 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by lonerebel on Wed May 6 22:50:16 2009.

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It's hard to believe people were expected to get on and off there (not that many did).

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(781472)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Thu May 7 00:07:30 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed May 6 19:20:56 2009.

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The line does indeed serve some centers of employment in LIC and Maspeth.

Isn't that still mostly industrial space?

I think ridership at these stations suffered more from people not knowing the service existed

The ridership suffered because the line dumps you at Long Island City with a long walk to the 7 with the high Zone 1 railway tariffs. $6 peak ($4.25 off peak and $135 for monthly) seems absurd with no free transfer to a subway or a ride into Penn Station. I think the only hope you'll get is if the LIRR decides to spend some cash on building a connector into either ESA or NYP, jury rig a subway in the area, or hope and pray the FRA will let you have freight and subway cars playing together on the same track with modern signaling and protection practices.

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(781479)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 00:14:45 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by d_mind on Wed May 6 22:46:29 2009.

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Probably saw the station.
But thought the LIRR train had just left
and noone now on the platform.

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(781480)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by LuchAAA on Thu May 7 00:18:11 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed May 6 21:49:19 2009.

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I'd like to see photos of Fresh Pond Station when it maintained. There must've been a platform, and not just those ugly concrete curbs that were there in the 80's.

Remember the shelters at Fresh Pond?

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(781482)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 00:20:53 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by lonerebel on Wed May 6 22:13:33 2009.

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I think with the outbound trains, passengers usually get on at and after Jamaica. I don't know about the inbound trains. I've heard a good crowd usually get on the subway at Vernon-Jackson.

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(781484)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?

Posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 00:25:17 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed May 6 22:24:45 2009.

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And if you didn't know where to look,
you'd never find it

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(781487)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by d_mind on Thu May 7 00:41:05 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 00:14:45 2009.

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Thanks, but i'm quite aware that no LIRR stations are visible from the J, unless you squint real hard at Broadway Junction.

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(781491)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 00:52:54 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by d_mind on Thu May 7 00:41:05 2009.

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I thought you were talking about Richmond Hill from the J line.

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(781494)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 01:04:23 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 00:52:54 2009.

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At East New York you could see the LIRR East New York Station on the Atlantic Line. But that station is not abondoned.

Past it is the abondoned LIRR station on the Bay Ridge Line. That station is in a trench. Even if you knew where to look and squinted your eyes very hard, you wouldn't be able to see it.

From the L line at Atlantic Ave you could. From the J line, no.

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(781501)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Thu May 7 02:17:04 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by Mitch45 on Wed May 6 16:09:05 2009.

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Meh, very rarely did I find the Deep Thoughts by Jack Handy amusing... Phil Hartman's a funny guy but most of them were just...

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Thu May 7 02:45:51 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by lonerebel on Wed May 6 22:13:33 2009.

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A few, but most are employees from the Arch St. shop. Most people prefer to use the transfer from the 7 at Hunterspoint. It's a lot closer.

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by LuchAAA on Thu May 7 03:32:01 2009, in response to A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by streetcarman1 on Wed May 6 11:37:19 2009.

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Forgot to mention, they now have electronic ticket vending machines at LIC.

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(781521)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu May 7 06:59:58 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by lonerebel on Wed May 6 21:15:24 2009.

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A few workers in the Long Island City-area take that train in addition to "veteran" commuters who know that they'll easily get a seat on that train.

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu May 7 07:25:24 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by LuchAAA on Thu May 7 00:18:11 2009.

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Aside from graffiti, Fresh Pond hadn't changed much from the 1940's. Someone older person I know from Ridgewood took these photos of Fresh Pond in 1949 when he was a kid. Compare to my photos taken in 1991 from similar angles, not much different and not much has changed between then and 1991.
Fresh Pond had a station building, but that was demolished at some point, before the 40's.









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(781527)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu May 7 07:29:42 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 00:20:53 2009.

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How can they get on "after" Jamaica, as there are no more local stops on the line between Jamaica and LIC.
When I used to ride those trains, the trains weren't "empty", they had passengers, but must did get on at Jamaica, and most stayed on until LIC.

The morning trains had an express, and then about 15 minues later, a local. The express began in Oyster Bay, the local originated in Patchogue. In the afternoon there was also an express, but that was a "semi Express", and it stopped at Penny Bridge, Haberman, and Fresh Pond, and then ran to Jamaica and to Oyster Bay. Abotu a 1/2 hour later was a full local, and that also went to Oyster Bay.

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(781528)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu May 7 07:31:25 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by d_mind on Thu May 7 00:41:05 2009.

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The station is quite visable from passing J trains, even today, very hard to miss. It's right at the 121st St station.

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(781529)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by Terrapin Station on Thu May 7 07:35:58 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu May 7 07:29:42 2009.

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How can they get on "after" Jamaica, as there are no more local stops on the line between Jamaica and LIC.

Typical stupid Douce Man post :)

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(781530)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu May 7 07:36:43 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?, posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 00:25:17 2009.

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And even harder from street level. I had NO IDEA there was a station there. The first time I used the station, I used it from Patchogue, and then got off at Fresh Pond, and then of course you just follow the stairs and then the maze of a pathway to the street. If you were told to wait there, people would have thought you were nuts, as no one would have expected that to actually be a "station". i couldn't even imagine a woman waiting there alone for a train. It's not a bad neighborhood, but it's so desolate down there, that it would have been an invitation for problems.
To top it all off, it was extremely fun waiting for trains there at Fresh Pond in the winter....when the days were short, and it was dark by 5:00 (the trains stopped at 5:06 and about 5:30 in the afternoon), it was PITCH black down there, no lighting at all, just the faint glow of street lights on Metropolitan Ave above. Then you heard the horn blasting, and finally out of the darkness a bright light would blind you as your eyes weren't used to light by that point. The train blasted through with it's horn and head light, and it was like satan himself had arrived for you.....

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(781531)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu May 7 07:38:03 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu May 7 07:36:43 2009.

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Oh, and to add, not only is the station well hidden, most people driving through or walking through that intersection don't even know there are railroad tracks down there, much less used to be a station. The tracks themselves are well hidden there, as they are in a tunnel for that intersection.

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(781534)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 07:45:21 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by Terrapin Station on Thu May 7 07:35:58 2009.

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I think with the outbound trains, passengers usually get on at and after Jamaica.

Funny how noone's reading before posting today.

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(781536)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 07:51:08 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu May 7 07:29:42 2009.

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I was refering to outbound trains.
Trains going TO Long Island.

On the inbound trains
Trains going TO LIC
Most get off at Jamaica.

Noone is reading today.

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(781539)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by (3) Livonia Ave. Local on Thu May 7 07:53:53 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed May 6 22:39:07 2009.

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Woah...I took that 8:11 express to LIC in March...couldn't even tell those stations had existed except for Richmond Hill. Didn't even think that as they were open they would've looked like that. I guess now I know why they were closed.

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(781540)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 07:55:35 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu May 7 07:31:25 2009.

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Wasn't d_mind was talking about Broadway/Junction?

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(781543)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by LuchAAA on Thu May 7 08:18:10 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu May 7 07:25:24 2009.

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Thanks Chris. But don't you remember how slow those trains always went between Richmond Hill and LIC? I don't think they go faster than 25mph for the most part.

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by ntrainride on Thu May 7 11:54:37 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed May 6 22:19:22 2009.

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Mere speculation on your part.

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 13:20:11 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu May 7 07:25:24 2009.

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Amazing!
It's not too often one sees old and new pictures from the same angle and from the same location.

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(781628)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by NIMBYkiller on Thu May 7 15:00:15 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed May 6 19:20:56 2009.

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Where are these people working? I've always said the industrial area is a good draw for ridership, but how many people actually do work in the area? It seems like LIC area is getting more commercially built up, sort of an extension of midtown. If that's the case, then in the future, this could also be a draw for more ridership

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by NIMBYkiller on Thu May 7 17:39:41 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by Terrapin Station on Thu May 7 07:35:58 2009.

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Typical Terp post

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(781692)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by d_mind on Thu May 7 17:52:07 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 07:45:21 2009.

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I can't wait for Brians wonderful rebuttal to this.

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu May 7 22:03:48 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 13:20:11 2009.

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And it's a total coincidence too. I took my photo in the early 1990's, and hadn't seen his photo until earlier this year. It just so happens, that about 40 years apart, we took the photo in almost the same angle.

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(781824)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu May 7 22:05:45 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by ntrainride on Thu May 7 11:54:37 2009.

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That's nice.

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(781839)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 22:15:38 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu May 7 22:03:48 2009.

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Uncanny.
I could see that happen in one set of pics.
But not both!

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(781906)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Thu May 7 23:40:25 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by ntrainride on Thu May 7 11:54:37 2009.

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Dude, take a walk down Cooper Ave and sample the demographics yourself.

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu May 7 23:41:45 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by LuchAAA on Thu May 7 03:32:01 2009.

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Surprisingly only red machines, you'd think that they would put a grey one at a City Terminal Zone station.

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(782103)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by Deaks on Fri May 8 10:00:38 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by d_mind on Thu May 7 17:52:07 2009.

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Looks like we aren't getting one. Fancy that.

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(782143)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by Spider-Pig on Fri May 8 11:38:51 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by daDouce Man on Thu May 7 07:51:08 2009.

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Who is Noone?

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(782151)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by RIPTA42HopeTunnel on Fri May 8 11:50:14 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri May 8 11:38:51 2009.

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Who is Noone?



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(782161)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?

Posted by Spider-Pig on Fri May 8 12:07:56 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed May 6 21:02:12 2009.

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He never said it was used.

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(782163)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by Spider-Pig on Fri May 8 12:09:32 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu May 7 23:41:45 2009.

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What's the difference?

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(782185)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by daDouce Man on Fri May 8 12:45:21 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by Deaks on Fri May 8 10:00:38 2009.

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He must have read my thread and realised he was wrong.
If he responds it'll be to critize me, d_mind or you and not metion what the thread was about.

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(782197)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch

Posted by daDouce Man on Fri May 8 12:56:20 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri May 8 11:38:51 2009.

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Noone in particular.

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(782203)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?

Posted by daDouce Man on Fri May 8 13:02:00 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri May 8 12:07:56 2009.

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The strike threat was called off at the last minute and Richmond Hill Station remained closed.

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(782210)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?

Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri May 8 13:26:10 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed May 6 22:23:16 2009.

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Richmond Hill's enterance was blocked up very soon after it was closed. Any strike contingency plan after 1998 would not have included the use of Richmond Hill. Besides, such a contingency would not be needed after the Archer/Sutphin Blvd subway station opened. The last time I heard of a reference to such a plan was in 1987.

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(782214)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?

Posted by LuchAAA on Fri May 8 13:33:02 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri May 8 13:26:10 2009.

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That's right. I remember a sign on the station entrance at Richmond Hill saying so.

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(782234)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?

Posted by Terrapin Station on Fri May 8 15:21:28 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri May 8 12:07:56 2009.

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Yes he did.

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(782247)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?

Posted by daDouce Man on Fri May 8 15:40:06 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?, posted by Terrapin Station on Fri May 8 15:21:28 2009.

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OK, Show me where I said it was used?

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(782256)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?

Posted by Terrapin Station on Fri May 8 15:52:47 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?, posted by daDouce Man on Fri May 8 15:40:06 2009.

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Um, it's not hard to find.

Wasn't the last time Richmond Hill was used was within the last 2-3 years?

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(782262)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?

Posted by daDouce Man on Fri May 8 16:03:01 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?, posted by Terrapin Station on Fri May 8 15:52:47 2009.

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I knew you were going to use that posting.

I was asking if Richmond Hill Station was going to be used.
Not stating the station was used.

Wasn't the last time Richmond Hill was used was within the last 2-3 years?

Looks like a question. Not a statement.

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(782266)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?

Posted by Terrapin Station on Fri May 8 16:10:36 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?, posted by daDouce Man on Fri May 8 16:03:01 2009.

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I know you were asking a question. But the question you asked was not the one you think you asked.

The question you think you asked was: "Wasn't Richmond Hill proposed to be used within the last 2-3 years?"

The question you actually asked was: "Wasn't Richmond Hill used within the last 2-3 years?"

Two very different questions.

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(782269)

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Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?

Posted by daDouce Man on Fri May 8 16:15:46 2009, in response to Re: A Question about the Lower Montauk Branch?, posted by Terrapin Station on Fri May 8 16:10:36 2009.

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YADDA. YADDA, YADDA!

Wasn't the last time Richmond Hill was used was within the last 2-3 years? IIRC Amtrak was on strike so LIRR trains couldn't used Penn Station. One of the contigency plans was to detrain people there and direct them to 121 Street for the J train to Manhattan.

If you're going to quote me, at least use the correct quote!

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