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(1523785)

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LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 15:17:50 2019

A uniformed LIRR train crew member (a conductor?) was caught on video flipping off a railfan who was filming the new M9 train. Despite the LIRR encouraging people to take and send pics and videos of the new cars, the unnamed employee admonished the railfan, "I told you twice already stop filming. The cops are on their way," says FanRailer, a YouTuber with hundreds of thousands of followers.

"We expect our conductors and all employees to behave professionally at all times," the railroad Tweeted. "This incident has been reported directly to supervisors and will be investigated."

Somebody pissed in the conductor's cornflakes the other day...

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(1523786)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by BILLBKLYN on Fri Sep 13 15:36:23 2019, in response to LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 15:17:50 2019.

Eh... I'm with the conductor on this one.

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(1523787)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 15:37:20 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by BILLBKLYN on Fri Sep 13 15:36:23 2019.

Why? The LIRR sent out Tweets specifically asking the public to take pictures and videos of this train.

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(1523789)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by BILLBKLYN on Fri Sep 13 15:41:23 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 15:37:20 2019.

Because I've witnessed the throngs of "the railfan element" at numerous events. I'm not saying HE was crossing the line, as I like his videos, but sometimes it must be hard for crews to deal with the "element ".

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(1523790)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 15:48:05 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by BILLBKLYN on Fri Sep 13 15:41:23 2019.

That doesn't justify his obscene gesture. Now it's on video for everyone to see, and it becomes a public image of the railroad. Optics do make a difference.

As for the "railfan element", that, too is part of the job when you're dealing with the public. With experience, you learn how to handle it, and flipping the bird ain't the way to do that.

Again, the LIRR actively solicited the public to take pictures and videos of this particular train.

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(1523791)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by LuchAAA on Fri Sep 13 15:58:05 2019, in response to LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 15:17:50 2019.

The difference between LIRR and NYCT is that labor relations will be far more lenient on this guy.



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(1523792)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 16:04:46 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by LuchAAA on Fri Sep 13 15:58:05 2019.

I agree. NYCT labor relations, several current employees tell me, is notorious for handing people brooms over relatively minor infractions. LIRR discipline isn't quite that severe.

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(1523796)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Sep 13 16:34:25 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 16:04:46 2019.

And it should not be that severe.
Nor for the NYCT either.

The remainder of this thought was not recorded.

ROAR

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(1523801)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Joe V on Fri Sep 13 17:42:59 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by BILLBKLYN on Fri Sep 13 15:36:23 2019.

We are not in that era anymore with NJT Chief Bober, and Railfan & Railroad editors getting in trouble on the A line.

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(1523802)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by LuchAAA on Fri Sep 13 17:50:38 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 16:04:46 2019.

I wonder if this guy is in service?

A NYCT would be out of service for this.

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(1523814)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Sep 13 19:04:49 2019, in response to LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 15:17:50 2019.

Not only did this guy get filmed, he made it ridiculously easy to ID him since that was the only train of its type on the road.

BTW, this is kinda blowing up on Twitter and the LIRR account has been repeatedly tagged. So they know ....

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(1523817)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by LuchAAA on Fri Sep 13 19:29:04 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Sep 13 19:04:49 2019.

But what will they do?



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(1523818)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Edwards! on Fri Sep 13 19:33:20 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by BILLBKLYN on Fri Sep 13 15:41:23 2019.

😀!
Now you are just being snarky!

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(1523821)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Dutchrailnut on Fri Sep 13 19:48:53 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by LuchAAA on Fri Sep 13 19:29:04 2019.

Charge him with Conduct unbecoming ?


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(1523828)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Fri Sep 13 20:01:11 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by LuchAAA on Fri Sep 13 19:29:04 2019.

Probably give him a short unpaid vacation. However, if he has any discipline hanging over his head a/c previously being a bad boy for some other offense, his "vacation" might be permanent until an arbitrator gets him re-hired as a ticket seller or custodian or some other non-op position.
Its amazing how stupid some folks can be, potentially blowing a +$80K a year job for something like this. On their pay stubs it should read "before flipping the bone on duty in uniform at someone with a camera, think twice!"

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(1523830)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by LuchAAA on Fri Sep 13 20:23:24 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Fri Sep 13 20:01:11 2019.

Strong union.

Victim could file complaint and sue.

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(1523831)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by LuchAAA on Fri Sep 13 20:31:30 2019, in response to LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 15:17:50 2019.

This kind of ruined M9 week for LIRR.

It got lots of publicity.

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(1523832)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Peter Rosa on Fri Sep 13 20:58:54 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by LuchAAA on Fri Sep 13 19:29:04 2019.

I doubt the unions will allow for any punishment.

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(1523834)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Dutchrailnut on Fri Sep 13 21:08:13 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by Peter Rosa on Fri Sep 13 20:58:54 2019.

Conduct unbecoming is hard to defend , specially with a video proving it.


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(1523838)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 21:22:23 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by LuchAAA on Fri Sep 13 17:50:38 2019.

Yup. After some days in the street, Labor Relations would make him a car or station cleaner--if he was lucky.

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(1523839)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Jsun21 on Fri Sep 13 21:31:41 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by Dutchrailnut on Fri Sep 13 21:08:13 2019.

Don't worry, the Super Sayan unions can do anything and NEVER say 'yep, he had it coming'. There are people who probably think he'll end up with a raise.

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(1523846)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sat Sep 14 04:50:47 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Sep 13 16:34:25 2019.

It should be severe. In the private sector, flipping a customer off while on duty will almost always get you fired, period.

Flipping a customer off while they are taking photos specifically asked for by corporate? Fired *and sued* by the company!

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(1523849)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by murray1575 on Sat Sep 14 06:37:09 2019, in response to LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 15:17:50 2019.

It is unfortunately typical of the attitude some LIRR employees who are highly paid for the work that they do have towards rail fans and the customers who ride the railroad. I suppose that the union which represents the conductor or other trainman will have his back but I think at least he deserves a warning and/or suspension from service. The MTAPD are non-existent at LIRR stations other than NYP or Atlantic Terminal anyway I am sure that they have more important issues to deal with.

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(1523850)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Dutchrailnut on Sat Sep 14 07:24:55 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sat Sep 14 04:50:47 2019.

hey : "We serve with pride" is missing with Cdr.


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(1523854)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by ChicagoMotorman on Sat Sep 14 10:03:52 2019, in response to LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 15:17:50 2019.

Asshole.

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(1523855)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by ChicagoMotorman on Sat Sep 14 10:04:13 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by BILLBKLYN on Fri Sep 13 15:36:23 2019.

Why?

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(1523856)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by ChicagoMotorman on Sat Sep 14 10:04:47 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 15:48:05 2019.

iawtlp

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(1523866)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by TRAIN DUDE on Sat Sep 14 13:26:55 2019, in response to LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 15:17:50 2019.

Of course, the aftermath of this video will be all LIRR employees will be more open and receptive to rail fans in the future.

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(1523867)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by The Silence on Sat Sep 14 13:29:44 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by TRAIN DUDE on Sat Sep 14 13:26:55 2019.

Just put a sign in the crew room "Social Media is a thing. Think before you act."

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(1523870)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by TRAIN DUDE on Sat Sep 14 13:52:15 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by The Silence on Sat Sep 14 13:29:44 2019.

Or the crews will think that the only motivation in posting that video was too hurt the employee -> all employees. The fact that the original C/R acted like a jerk will be irrelevant.

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(1523871)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Edwards! on Sat Sep 14 13:52:28 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by TRAIN DUDE on Sat Sep 14 13:26:55 2019.

That's a 'lets wait and see' thing.
However,I'm surprised at his demeanor.
Railfans do their fair share of being the 'eyes and ears' of the system. They have served as a detterent to the criminal elements in the past.

Why treat THEM like they're committing a crime?
If he didn't want to be filmed,he should have kept his damn head inside the railcab.

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(1523872)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by TRAIN DUDE on Sat Sep 14 13:55:48 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by Edwards! on Sat Sep 14 13:52:28 2019.

I agree, especially the off-side window. But railfans being eyes and ears for the LIRR or the MTA is hardly a positive with the rank & file.

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(1523875)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Sat Sep 14 14:26:30 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by Edwards! on Sat Sep 14 13:52:28 2019.

...and his hands in his pockets!

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(1523878)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Edwards! on Sat Sep 14 14:59:07 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by TRAIN DUDE on Sat Sep 14 13:55:48 2019.

Yeah.


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(1523891)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by randyo on Sat Sep 14 16:15:44 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by Jsun21 on Fri Sep 13 21:31:41 2019.

There are some things that even the stongest union canít stop.

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(1523893)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by JayZeeBMT on Sat Sep 14 16:20:24 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by TRAIN DUDE on Sat Sep 14 13:26:55 2019.

But in this particular case, the railfan was filming the train at the solicitation of the railroad.

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(1523895)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Catfish 44 on Sat Sep 14 16:25:05 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 15:48:05 2019.

Public image? You think people will be dwelling on for years to come.
Get
Over
It

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(1523897)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by BILLBKLYN on Sat Sep 14 16:40:53 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 13 15:48:05 2019.

Way back long ago, when I was a uniformed policeman, I would curse people out or give the finger or the "suck my dick" crotch-grabbing gesture when warranted. I didn't GAF

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(1523899)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by BILLBKLYN on Sat Sep 14 16:45:25 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by Edwards! on Fri Sep 13 19:33:20 2019.

Nope! Railfans are the worst part of these events!

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(1523900)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by JayZeeBMT on Sat Sep 14 16:51:34 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by BILLBKLYN on Sat Sep 14 16:45:25 2019.

I beg to differ. When I had Bill Wall (the man who does the Holiday Trains) on my show several years ago, he said the transit fans were the people who made thoze excursions a real thing.

In fact, but for railfans like Don Harold (who was the subject of one of my college papers) there would be no fun buff stuff like the Museum or nostalgia rides at all.

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(1523901)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Sat Sep 14 17:20:14 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by randyo on Sat Sep 14 16:15:44 2019.

He signs a waiver (no hearing w/admission of guilt) gets a formal repremand on his record & goes back to work, unless he's a fuckup & has deferred discipline over his head. IF thats the case, they might just drop the hammer on him with a long unpaid vacation.

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(1523906)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Edwards! on Sat Sep 14 18:19:44 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by BILLBKLYN on Sat Sep 14 16:45:25 2019.

Except, nobody really cares about what you think since it's been established that you are a joke.

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(1523907)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Edwards! on Sat Sep 14 18:24:18 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by BILLBKLYN on Sat Sep 14 16:40:53 2019.

What...is this click bait cause you are bored?

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(1523908)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Edwards! on Sat Sep 14 18:27:38 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by BILLBKLYN on Fri Sep 13 15:41:23 2019.

So,of course, you justify His action with your own stellar example.
Way to go.
No wonder you are a carded member of the REPUBLICAN PARTY.

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(1523909)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by TRAIN DUDE on Sat Sep 14 18:31:23 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by JayZeeBMT on Sat Sep 14 16:20:24 2019.

The fact that you've made that point ad nauseum does not make it any more relevant. The fact that the employee, in the head car was not performing any duties at the time, seemingly just flipping off the railfan to be obnoxious. He was a jerk who got caught being a jerk.


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(1523911)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by TRAIN DUDE on Sat Sep 14 18:32:49 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by JayZeeBMT on Sat Sep 14 16:20:24 2019.

The fact that you've made that point ad nauseum does not make it any more relevant. The fact that the employee, in the head car was not performing any duties at the time, seemingly just flipping off the railfan to be obnoxious is all that is relevant, here. He was a jerk who got caught being a jerk.


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(1523920)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Sat Sep 14 19:09:12 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by TRAIN DUDE on Sat Sep 14 13:52:15 2019.

Or the crews will think that the only motivation in posting that video was too hurt the employee -> all employees. The fact that the original C/R acted like a jerk will be irrelevant.

That's been my general fear of the situation. Yes, I'd feel sorry for the guy if he was fired despite his terrible actions, but I really don't want to see relations between crews and railfans soured over this.

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(1523921)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Jsun21 on Sat Sep 14 19:24:47 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by randyo on Sat Sep 14 16:15:44 2019.

Ding Ding Ding, what a lot of people miss is that in terms of discipline there are a number of rules that are Black & White and there is not a lot of wiggle room in the application of discipline. He'll take his lumps, no two ways about it especially since it was unprovoked, high-publicity, contrary to the rules, etc.

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(1523939)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Train Dude on Sat Sep 14 21:55:17 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by Jsun21 on Sat Sep 14 19:24:47 2019.

Until they get to Arbitration. The arbitrator is paid 50-50 by union and management so the arbitrator (who may earn well over $1500 for the day)tries to please both sides, lest he may not be invited back again. Therefore it depends on which side wants this guy more.

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(1523944)

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Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut

Posted by Jsun21 on Sat Sep 14 23:17:02 2019, in response to Re: LIRR Trainman Filmed Flipping Off Railfan During M9 Debut, posted by Train Dude on Sat Sep 14 21:55:17 2019.

Sure, and then the video plays. The company says "text book example of conduct unbecoming and a violation of rules E,K,Q, " there really isn't anything for the arbiter to weigh in the Employees favor. And I'm sure there's some established precedent in the case of obvious rude gesture.

At least in the case of the Hoboken Engineer there was ADA and NJT not detecting a hazardous medical condition.

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