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| (1495269) | |
Speeding up timers |
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Posted by AlM on Mon Dec 10 09:18:34 2018 NY Times Article |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Mon Dec 10 10:49:24 2018, in response to Speeding up timers, posted by AlM on Mon Dec 10 09:18:34 2018. Lets see what happens. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Dec 10 11:49:46 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Catfish 44 on Mon Dec 10 10:49:24 2018. They will have a lot of wrok to do before they can catch up to the Route of the Broadway LION.Him nose howe to run trains. ROAR |
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(Sponsored) |
iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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| (1495283) | |
Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Mon Dec 10 13:32:44 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Dec 10 11:49:46 2018. Adorable. |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Mon Dec 10 18:51:20 2018, in response to Speeding up timers, posted by AlM on Mon Dec 10 09:18:34 2018. This is a lot better news than the previous article. Before they were just making sure timers cleared fast enough to allow for the posted speed.This article is downright talking about speed limit increases. Things are looking up for the first time in 2 decades. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Dec 10 19:48:25 2018, in response to Speeding up timers, posted by AlM on Mon Dec 10 09:18:34 2018. Let's hope they can put the "rapid" back into rapid transit. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Steamdriven on Mon Dec 10 20:49:47 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Mon Dec 10 18:51:20 2018. eh. Better than nothing, still too little.Years ago, an MM on the A told me that the trains formerly reached 60 mph. That was on bolted track, over wood ties. I'll bet the NX reached that speed on every run. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by R46 5636 on Mon Dec 10 21:17:39 2018, in response to Speeding up timers, posted by AlM on Mon Dec 10 09:18:34 2018. They've already done this with the 7 line. Express trains actually keep up at 55mph along most of the stretch. I've never used to be able to get from Junction Blvd to Main Street in under 4 minutes! |
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| (1495351) | |
Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Mon Dec 10 21:48:13 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by R46 5636 on Mon Dec 10 21:17:39 2018. They make 55mph between Woodside & Junction? Weren't timers installed when they moved the interlock to 74th St in both directions on the express track? I remember as a kid going to school waiting for the local to Main St at 69th St & seeing a Manhattan bound express flying down the hill from 74th St & barreling thru the interlock located at that time between 69th st & 61st St. 55mph at that spot seemed conservative.Not a timer in sight. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Stephen Bauman on Mon Dec 10 22:23:09 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Steamdriven on Mon Dec 10 20:49:47 2018. I'll bet the NX reached that speed on every run.You would loose that bet. I rode the NX once. It didn't set any speed records between 59th and Stillwell. It wasn't like the Green Hornet's inaugural ride. |
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| (1495363) | |
Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Stephen Bauman on Mon Dec 10 22:26:54 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by R46 5636 on Mon Dec 10 21:17:39 2018. Express trains actually keep up at 55mph along most of the stretch.I've looked out at the panel that shows the speed. It may hit 50 once or twice on that stretch. I've never used to be able to get from Junction Blvd to Main Street in under 4 minutes! If you remember the date and time, I'll see what the real time position feed said for that run. |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Dec 10 22:39:20 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Stephen Bauman on Mon Dec 10 22:23:09 2018. Agreed, those tracks were poorly tamped. |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Dec 10 22:40:57 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Steamdriven on Mon Dec 10 20:49:47 2018. IDK about 60 MPH.Our trains did not have speedos then. All we could do was estimate. |
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| (1495374) | |
Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Dec 10 22:45:15 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Mon Dec 10 18:51:20 2018. We were complaining at least thru the '90's to the union, our TSS's and anybody else who would listen about the mis-calibration.The universal answer "Operate accordingly". All of a sudden they decide to listen to the captains of their ships. How 'bout that! |
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| (1495375) | |
Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Dec 10 22:46:30 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by R46 5636 on Mon Dec 10 21:17:39 2018. How much does this have to do with CBTC? |
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Posted by randyo on Tue Dec 11 00:16:19 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Dec 10 22:40:57 2018. I once timed a train of R-16s on the Jamaica Exp between E/Pky and Bway Myrtle at 60 MPH using the milepost markers. |
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Posted by randyo on Tue Dec 11 00:19:24 2018, in response to Speeding up timers, posted by AlM on Mon Dec 10 09:18:34 2018. I was watching the Channel 2 news this evening and one passenger who was interviewed said that now that the trains will be allowed to run faster there will probably be more collisions and derailments. What a jerk! |
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Posted by gbs on Tue Dec 11 04:35:44 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Dec 10 22:46:30 2018. Everything. The timers no longer work the old way, and the operators can go much faster where the timers used to slow them down. Their speeds are still controlled (like entering Willets Point down the hill) but not as severely as with the timers. |
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| (1495398) | |
Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Stephen Bauman on Tue Dec 11 04:49:50 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by randyo on Tue Dec 11 00:19:24 2018. there will probably be more collisions and derailments.collision avoidance depends on whether the emergency brakes are maintained according to the 3.0 mph/sec spec. faster trains mean more wear and tear on the rails. if the rails are not maintained, there will be more derailments. slower trains have been the MTA's response to rolling stock and right of way maintenance failures. it was easier to slow the trains than to correct the maintenance deficiencies. the public and politicians swallowed it. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Stephen Bauman on Tue Dec 11 04:54:58 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Dec 10 22:46:30 2018. How much does this have to do with CBTC?Only to the extent that CBTC enforced the actual speed limits. The timers enforced speed limits that were well below what was specified. The track side speed limit signs have not been raised. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Lou from Brooklyn on Tue Dec 11 09:13:50 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by randyo on Tue Dec 11 00:16:19 2018. Era of phase shunting, no? |
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Posted by Steamdriven on Tue Dec 11 14:20:12 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Stephen Bauman on Tue Dec 11 04:49:50 2018. 3.0 mph/s is another bureaucratic shuffle. Min should be 3.5, but I vote 4.25 with a 1/2 second apply time transition. Reduce 'jerk' (3rd derivative) and a reasonable steady acceleration is tolerated. Add a buzzer when the e-brake is activated.People held for a lot more than 4 mph/s braking on PCCs, I've been on them when the hit track brake on dry rails. It was big deal other than the buzzer going off and watching the trolley slide into the car on the tracks, as a child that seemed like a big deal, the braking wasn't. Nobody went splat up against the front of the car, nobody complained/sued/etc, and the trolley was hardly full of saints even then. For NYC, add a regulation stating that passengers can't sue for e-brake application. |
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| (1495447) | |
Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Steamdriven on Tue Dec 11 15:01:03 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Stephen Bauman on Mon Dec 10 22:23:09 2018. It was long before I was in NYC. I did meet someone who lived on that line in the '60s, he said you had to hold on as the train took curves, lotta vibration on the straights. |
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| (1495451) | |
Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Dec 11 15:31:59 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Lou from Brooklyn on Tue Dec 11 09:13:50 2018. They go downhill at a certain point w/o any speed restrictions or timers.I know I was able to "fly" in that area coming from ENYD. |
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| (1495469) | |
Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Dec 11 16:38:06 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Dec 10 22:45:15 2018. no surprises there. That said, Byford may actually be worth his salary if he can force the speed limits up. At least he gets it that faster throughput means better transit and isworth the effort. |
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| (1495470) | |
Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by randyo on Tue Dec 11 16:38:26 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Lou from Brooklyn on Tue Dec 11 09:13:50 2018. This was circa 1960. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by randyo on Tue Dec 11 16:40:14 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Steamdriven on Tue Dec 11 14:20:12 2018. Any regulation that abrogates citizens’ rights would probably be unconstitutional. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by randyo on Tue Dec 11 16:41:39 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by gbs on Tue Dec 11 04:35:44 2018. That’s probably because the CBTC speed restrictions are properly calibrated unlike the older timers. |
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| (1495486) | |
Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Dec 11 17:34:16 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Dec 11 16:38:06 2018. All they had to do was listen to their train operators many years ago. |
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| (1495488) | |
Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Dec 11 18:15:21 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Dec 11 17:34:16 2018. As I think we both know, US bureaucratic culture (public or private) is highly adversarial; mgmt "knows" workers are sloppy, lazy,blah, blah, and workers "know" mgmt are evil, conniving fools who understand nothing. Both sides believe the other are overpaid and mostly useless.Variations on this theme exist throughout our society. Sadly, while many decent folks toil on both sides of this divide, many more perpetuate the stereotype thus sabotaging efforts at cooperation. I have a dim memory of a Muni Operator, who when he made a sugestion to the person at central control, was asked "what color is your uniform" as in, you aren't entitled to even make suggestions because you are not in a "title" which is permitted to think independently. salute, and do as you are told. It is similar to NcD's having timers on the french fry baskets so that NO worker can over or undercook the potatos. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Tue Dec 11 18:28:28 2018, in response to Speeding up timers, posted by AlM on Mon Dec 10 09:18:34 2018. Its a great idea. However let there be one accident where excessive speed is determined to be the cause & out will come the media know nothings & finger pointers blaming Byford and to have him hanged from the highest yard arm that can be found. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Bklynsubwaybob on Tue Dec 11 18:31:03 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Dec 11 18:15:21 2018. Well put! |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Tue Dec 11 18:59:57 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Dec 10 22:45:15 2018. Imagine that! |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Steamdriven on Tue Dec 11 19:04:24 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Dec 11 18:15:21 2018. You've hit upon a key problem in our entire culture. No public figure I know of has the intent and ability to improve it, most have neither. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Tue Dec 11 19:13:29 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by randyo on Tue Dec 11 16:40:14 2018. Print some "Terms and Conditions you agree to by using this service" on the Metrocard. Cable/phone companies do it all the time. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Dec 11 19:18:26 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Dec 11 18:15:21 2018. In FDNY, there is the "fire square": heat, fuel, oxygen, and the chief. Take any one of those away, and the fire will go out. The only time that rule didn't apply, was when Giuliani made Tom Von Essen, an ordinary firefighter, the commissioner. TVE quickly learned that being the big boss was no bowl of cherries, either.That said, the TA's management style has historically been very heavy-handed, and it's corporate culture reflects that. It's a big reason labor-management interactions are often so tense, and why it took so long for the brass to listen to the workers who were trying to tell them for two decades that the timers were out of sync, to cite just one example. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by FtgreeneG on Tue Dec 11 23:54:39 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by randyo on Tue Dec 11 00:19:24 2018. Can't make everybody happy |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by FtgreeneG on Tue Dec 11 23:59:39 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Dec 10 22:45:15 2018. So true. If a T/O hit a timer signal that he/she said wasn't clearing at allotted speed there was a Superintendent (don't want to say the line) that would send a TSS out with a train. They would approach the timer at the exact speed you said if it didn't clear as posted you were let off the hook. That was an exception with supervision than the rule. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Far Rockaway A Train on Wed Dec 12 00:27:11 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Dec 10 19:48:25 2018. I'm dreaming for the day the A train moves as fast as it used to. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by BILLBKLYN on Wed Dec 12 00:32:41 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Far Rockaway A Train on Wed Dec 12 00:27:11 2018. Me too! |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by BILLBKLYN on Wed Dec 12 00:37:54 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Stephen Bauman on Tue Dec 11 04:49:50 2018. Look at what they did to the express trains on Staten Island. Those R44s would hit 60 miles an hour after they made the curve after Clifton and basically stayed at that speed until they were pulling into Great Kills. This happened until that female engineer crashed the train at Tottenville several years ago on New Year's. One of my friends is a SIRT engineer and he told me that since then they are not allowed to go about 45 miles an hour. He also noted that the powers-that-be did not like the way the cars suede on the tracks at 60 miles an hour. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Steamdriven on Wed Dec 12 09:16:25 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by BILLBKLYN on Wed Dec 12 00:37:54 2018. So they fix a personnel problem by crippling the entire line, year after year. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by MorningsideHeightsM100 on Wed Dec 12 09:28:13 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by BILLBKLYN on Wed Dec 12 00:37:54 2018. He also noted that the powers-that-be did not like the way the cars suede on the tracks at 60 miles an hour.I've been on those trains when they ran at the max speed during that stretch between Clifton and Great Kills. I have to agree. The sway was so bad one time it knocked over one passenger that was sleeping on one of the front facing bucket seats. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Dec 12 10:26:55 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by BILLBKLYN on Wed Dec 12 00:37:54 2018. the powers-that-be did not like the way the cars [sway] on the tracks at 60 miles an hour.Did anyone suggest figuring out what caused the sway and fixing it? |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Steamdriven on Wed Dec 12 14:48:56 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by MorningsideHeightsM100 on Wed Dec 12 09:28:13 2018. "The sway was so bad one time it knocked over one passenger that was sleeping"How is that is a bad thing? |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Union Tpke on Wed Dec 12 14:50:26 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Dec 12 10:26:55 2018. "According to current GTFS schedule, 8444 trips will be scheduled tomorrow. Of these 789 or 9.3% of the trips will have one or more stops with a scheduled dwell time of 5 minutes or more each at one or more stops. Most of these are the stops just before the terminal. Terminal OTP is percent of trains that arrive more than 5 minutes late, according to the schedule. Pad an extra 5 minutes just before the terminal and – OTP improves.Also, tomorrow, 1627 or 19.3% of the trips will have an accumulated scheduled dwell time of 5 or more minutes during the trip. On looking at the GTFS-RT feed, the dwell times exist for the most part. Trains are more than 5 minutes late arriving at the 5 minute dwell time stops. The 5 minute dwell time translates into getting many of these trips on time by suddenly increasing their scheduled run time." Where are the most egregious examples according to the current GTFS? |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by Union Tpke on Wed Dec 12 14:53:03 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Union Tpke on Wed Dec 12 14:50:26 2018. Never mind. I remembered this link. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by MorningsideHeightsM100 on Wed Dec 12 14:54:36 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Steamdriven on Wed Dec 12 14:48:56 2018. It was a violent wake up call. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by randyo on Wed Dec 12 16:12:25 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Tue Dec 11 19:13:29 2018. While many so called “terms and conditions” are printed, many of them are contrary to public policy and unenforceable. I have signed many apartment leases that contain restrictive provisions that are against most rent laws. |
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Re: Speeding up timers |
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Posted by randyo on Wed Dec 12 16:24:35 2018, in response to Re: Speeding up timers, posted by Steamdriven on Wed Dec 12 09:16:25 2018. Typical MTA management. |
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