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| (1409568) | |
Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by Dave on Wed Sep 21 21:33:40 2016 
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by Joe V on Wed Sep 21 21:39:15 2016, in response to Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Dave on Wed Sep 21 21:33:40 2016. Does that part of the highway use BRT el pillars or beams ? |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by Dave on Wed Sep 21 21:52:56 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Joe V on Wed Sep 21 21:39:15 2016. Don't know. |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by gbs on Wed Sep 21 22:09:09 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Joe V on Wed Sep 21 21:39:15 2016. I'm sure it doesn't use any leftover beams or pillars from the el structure. I've been under most of that highway and all the supports are highway structures. My guess is that the engineers determined that the el pillars and beams were not sufficiently strong for the weight of the roadway and its vehicles, if they even considered it at all. |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Wed Sep 21 22:13:34 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Joe V on Wed Sep 21 21:39:15 2016. I don't think so. All BRT/BMT structures in that area were demolished no later than 1944-45, with the iron and/or steel almost certainly going to the war effort. The highway wasn't built in that area until the post war period.This is quite unlike the Gowanus between 38th-65th, which we all know was built on remnants of the El, and evidence of that can be seen. |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 21 22:56:04 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Joe V on Wed Sep 21 21:39:15 2016. That is the Brooklyn Bridge. |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Sep 22 10:42:39 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by MainR3664 on Wed Sep 21 22:13:34 2016. I was thinking of the Gowanus portion, didn't know if that applied to the Sands Street area too. |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Sep 22 10:53:41 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Joe V on Thu Sep 22 10:42:39 2016. Gowanus portion of what? The highway in the picture is not the BQE, it is the Brooklyn Bridge. |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Sep 22 11:06:36 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Sep 22 10:53:41 2016. My point was BRT structure was used for part of the highway (Gowanus/BQE/Belt/whatever it is called in various places) didn't know which portions. |
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| (1409619) | |
Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Sep 22 12:55:11 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Joe V on Thu Sep 22 11:06:36 2016. The BQE is completely out of the way of the Sands Street station site, and was built several years later. |
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| (1409624) | |
Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Thu Sep 22 13:22:05 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Joe V on Wed Sep 21 21:39:15 2016. No, the BQE ran only as far south as Meeker Ave, until after the War. Southbound work resumed in 1947. You are thinking of the pillars of the old Bay Ridge el pillars on the 3rd Ave portion, which were used until it was rebuilt. |
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| (1409687) | |
Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by randyo on Thu Sep 22 17:48:58 2016, in response to Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Dave on Wed Sep 21 21:33:40 2016. There is a building just to the left out of sight of the photo that has large arched windows which either is, or at least was, a Red Cross blood center where I went years ago to donate blood. It looks to me like it might have been a part of the Sands St station complex that was left after the rest of the station was demolished. Does anyone out there have any idea if that is the case? |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by displaced angeleno on Thu Sep 22 18:55:12 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by randyo on Thu Sep 22 17:48:58 2016. That explains why the street is named Red Cross Place, roughly 25 feet north of where High Street once was. The building is now some sort of NYCTA structure whose purpose I have been unable to figure out. Many NYCTA trucks enter and leave the enclosed (with razor wire) lot attached to the squat light pink building.I always figured it was NYCTA property on the site of Sands Street station. If you look on Google Maps Street View, the northern portion of that building has an archway that has been bricked up/closed up with cinder blocks. Other windows in the building have slight arches above them and have also been bricked up. Given the unlikelihood that such architecture was used post 1945 gives me the impression that the building was in existence at the time the station closed and somehow survived the demolition. The relevant photo is here, and both surfaces of the building reveal bricked up arched entrances/windows. |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by TerrApin Station on Mon Sep 26 10:09:46 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Sep 22 12:55:11 2016. IAWTP |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by TerrApin Station on Mon Sep 26 10:09:55 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Sep 22 10:53:41 2016. Exactly. |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Mon Sep 26 14:35:29 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by MainR3664 on Wed Sep 21 22:13:34 2016. The Fulton St el from Myrtle/Fulton demolition began on 12/15/41. The High St Loop was removed, beginning on 3/25/43. The remaining Park Row Terminal, Sands St, and the elevated line to Bridge/Jay Sts were removed in the summer of 1944. All were gone by the fall of 1944. |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by Express Rider on Tue Sep 27 06:46:04 2016, in response to Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Dave on Wed Sep 21 21:33:40 2016. The road in the foreground, of the photo is the ramp section of the Brooklyn Bridge approach road. It was built during the 1950s as part of the urban renewal plan for the area.*Per Google Maps, Boerum Place becomes Brooklyn Bridge Boulevard, at the intersection with Joralemen and Fulton streets. BB Blvd. continues north and becomes the approach road to the Brooklyn Bridge at its intersection with Tillery Street. I have found one 1944 photo of the Gowanus Expy. Beneath the road are what appears to be the 5th ave el pillars supporting it. URL: http://cdn.brownstoner.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/Gowanus-Expressway-1944-TBATA.jpg ------------------------------------------------------------------- *Read this in the book "When Brooklyn Was the World." I have no more specific info. on this. |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by Fulton Frank on Tue Sep 27 06:57:36 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by displaced angeleno on Thu Sep 22 18:55:12 2016. VERY interesting. Yes, I see the bricked up arches on the SOUTH side. If you navigate around you can also see arches on the north side not bricked up.And, as far as I can tell, that structure is on the exact spot the station was - Sands between Adams and Washington. And I agree it looks pre 1945. If that's a remnant of the station complex it's a major find. Has to be researched further. When I get a chance I'll try to look at pictures of Sands St station again and look for architectural details. |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Tue Sep 27 07:49:11 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by displaced angeleno on Thu Sep 22 18:55:12 2016. Those arches almost conclusively prove that it's a very old building- it almost certainly was there when the station existed.It could have been anything- an electric distribution room, a place to store groundskeeping equipment (snow shovels and the like), place to store spare parts like lightbulbs, window glass... |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Tue Sep 27 07:55:30 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Express Rider on Tue Sep 27 06:46:04 2016. Although the El columns were replaced in 1959 or so, the new columns still have the "look" of an El structure between 65th and 38th Streets. My guess is that that's because they swapped them out one at a time, and just put in stronger versions of what was already there.Sort of like brace a column, skip one (but brace the structure around it) , brace the next one, replace the center one. Repeat until they're all done |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by Express Rider on Tue Sep 27 08:13:33 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by MainR3664 on Tue Sep 27 07:55:30 2016. Thanks for the info! Did not know that the columns on that section of the Gowanus resembled the original el colums. |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Tue Sep 27 08:47:31 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Express Rider on Tue Sep 27 08:13:33 2016. I mean, it's my guess as to what exact technique was used to replace the El columns. But the structure between 38th-65th definitely seems to have El-like columns, bents, and stringers, whereas the part between 39th and the Hugh Carey (LOL) tunnel does not.Go take a look if you get the chance... |
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| (1410251) | |
Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by Express Rider on Tue Sep 27 09:17:31 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by Fulton Frank on Tue Sep 27 06:57:36 2016. Hi Fulton Frank & displaced angelino,I've included some URL's of Sands St. station photos below for you to look over: First of all: http://nycsubway.org/perl/showpix?nsta=12& 2304 This is the URL for the Sands St. page of photos, at nycsubway.org, There are 44 of them. Though you'll probably want to examine all the photos; I've included two URL's of photos from this page below. They are views, at street level, looking back at Sands St. station from the south: http://nycsubway.org/perl/show?52479 http://nycsubway.org/perl/show?52014 In addition, here is a URL of an inbound (Manhattan bound) trolley, ramping up outside Sands St. station without stopping, onto the bridge ramp: http://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/fileSendAction/fcType/0/fcOid/15790232512581590/filePointer/43665862757570107/fodoid/43665862757570096/imageType/LARGE/inlineImage/true/Sands%2520street%2520from%2520the%2520northwest%2520side.jpg What is noticeable about all these photos, is that there is no intermediate "mezzanine" level, for a fare control area, between the street and the main level tracks & platforms. This could mean that the fare control area (building?) would almost have to have been at street level, with a flight of stairs, directly up the main platforms for el trains. So, this building that displaced angelino has found, might possibly be the building that housed the fare control area for Sands St. station. The bricked up arches, and arched windows, certainly seem to be from that era, and match somewhat, the arched window arrangement of the station. If this is true, it is interesting to think about how the entire structure was demolished in 1944, and this one building (if it is part of the station complex) might have been untouched. I have never seen any photos of the street level area, underneath Sands St. station either. And who knows if any were taken, except maybe for documentation purposes by the BRT - they probably do not exist now. More investigation is needed. Especially confirming that this immediate area was indeed the location of Sands St. station. Nice find, displaced angelino! |
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Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park |
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Posted by Express Rider on Tue Sep 27 09:19:24 2016, in response to Re: Where Sands Street station was is now Cadman Plaza Park, posted by MainR3664 on Tue Sep 27 08:47:31 2016. Sounds like a good afternoon's urban expedition. Any good pizza places nearby? There must be! |
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