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| (1400093) | |
Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by OCTD 2039 on Mon Jun 27 00:47:14 2016 3 children and 2 adults died when the train smashed their vehicle. They should've drove away when it had the chance. I'm unsure why it bothers with those incompetent idiots.http://www.9news.com/news/local/amtrak-train-collides-with-vehicle-in-southern-colorado/256385191 | |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 08:22:21 2016, in response to Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by OCTD 2039 on Mon Jun 27 00:47:14 2016. There should be gates and lights. A tiny white?! railroad crossing sign? Doesn't cut it. Especially in this day and age when people expect to be warned and notified about every little thing. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by AlM on Mon Jun 27 09:55:29 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 08:22:21 2016. Looking at Google Maps, looks more like a private crossing to me.Dirt road, probably private, not County, serves 4 or 5 houses. Landscape is flat. How hard is it to stop, look both ways, and proceed? |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Jun 27 10:09:28 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 08:22:21 2016. There should be gates and lights. A tiny white?! railroad crossing sign? Doesn't cut itHow much would it cost to idiot-proof everything? The grade crossing is in a rural area. Not bothering to stop at a grade crossing when the engineer is blowing the horn is what doesn't cut it. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Jun 27 10:09:50 2016, in response to Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by OCTD 2039 on Mon Jun 27 00:47:14 2016. Blaming the train again? |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by AlM on Mon Jun 27 10:52:42 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Jun 27 10:09:50 2016. Wow, your failure at reading comprehension is amazing. The original poster, despite the incoherence of his post, is very clearly blaming the driver of the vehicle. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by OCTD 2039 on Mon Jun 27 11:26:51 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Jun 27 10:09:50 2016. The train driver must've forgot to stop in which he failed to see the minivan, and then crashed into it. The windows on that train were small, so the driver could hardly see anything. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Steamdriven on Mon Jun 27 11:32:52 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by OCTD 2039 on Mon Jun 27 11:26:51 2016. "The train driver must've forgot to stop"I think we're being trolled. Nobody's that dense. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by AlM on Mon Jun 27 11:41:13 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by AlM on Mon Jun 27 10:52:42 2016. Never mind, I stand corrected by the original poster himself. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 13:26:24 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Jun 27 10:09:28 2016. I agree that there are drivers who should be more cautious and aware of their surroundings. But here I have to sympathize a little, of course while not knowing the mind of the driver.You always have to assume that it's someone's first time driving at that location. I don't live there, but it may not be totally evident to a first-time driver that s/he is approaching a railroad track and your first official notification of that is the tiny sign right at the edge of the track. Also, it seems that no matter which way you are coming from you will be making at least a slight turn/curve approaching the crossing. So without gates and lights, the train's whistle alone is left to guard against an accident, but the whistle should be a redundancy, a cover for when all else fails, not the end-all be-all. And when you are driving in curves, it may not be always completely clear that the far-off whistle you hear is relevant to you. I'm playing victim's advocate here, I know, and in reality it is most likely that it is the victim's fault, but I don't consider the adding of gates and lights to this crossing to be a waste. As to who should install them. . .not sure about that. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 13:37:05 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by AlM on Mon Jun 27 09:55:29 2016. According to this, there is no expectation to stop in Colorado. And in fact if you drive from state to state the law keeps changing, slightly or more.For Colorado, you only have to stop if you meet the criteria given there. The government doesn't want to deal with school buses and hazardous materials ending up in crashes, but everyone else is safe to cross without stopping. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by AlM on Mon Jun 27 13:39:12 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 13:26:24 2016. Look at the Google maps view I posted.- The crossing serves 5 houses, which are on one side of the tracks while the rest of civilization is on the other side. - The houses are all right by the tracks. The people there must hear every train that passes by. This can't possibly be anything other than the van driver's fault. He has to have crossed that track many times. No one in their right might would cross that track repeatedly without stopping, looking, and listening. All I can imagine is that some kind of brain short circuit caused him to forget where he was. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by AlM on Mon Jun 27 13:42:45 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 13:37:05 2016. So what? It makes no difference what Colorado law is. There's no police officer lurking there to give anyone a ticket anyway.The only reason to stop is not because it's illegal, but because you don't want to kill your spouse and children. everyone else is safe to cross without stopping. No. Everyone is allowed to cross without stopping, without risking a summons. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 14:04:50 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by AlM on Mon Jun 27 13:42:45 2016. It is reasonable for a driver to presume that by obeying the law, he will not end up in an accident that is not somehow the fault of someone else.For example, do you stop at every green light to make sure no cross-traffic is planning on running the red? The law does not require you to stop for a green light because it is reasonable to assume that you can safely cross the intersection without stopping. For trains, it's different. If a train will never stop for a car, which is and should be the case, then the car should always be required, by law, to stop to check for trains where there are no other protections - don't you think? |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon Jun 27 14:24:31 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 08:22:21 2016. Plenty of unprotected crossings up by me, with a larger population density. The minivan driver is entirely at fault here, but we can all admit he's paid the price. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 14:27:30 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by AlM on Mon Jun 27 13:39:12 2016. It's probably the driver's fault, here, yes. Not arguing against that.The crossing serves 5 houses, which are on one side of the tracks while the rest of civilization is on the other side. So? All safety measures should account for someone coming by, and for coming by for the first time. I should be able to drive in from NY and go and visit someone in those houses and, following the laws of the locale, not get hurt without a vehicle problem or someone else being at fault. The houses are all right by the tracks. The people there must hear every train that passes by. There is a clear transition from the houses "area" to the track area, and that transition requires you to turn on to it. You aren't walking out your front door to find the tracks under your feet. You are already in your car and, chances, are, have turned the steering wheel a great deal to join a road, all before you cross the tracks. As far as I'm concerned, you are driving, and at this point the number of houses in the vicinity and how close they are doesn't make much of a difference. No one in their right might would cross that track repeatedly without stopping, looking, and listening. Yes, once you learn the area and realize, "oh, right, if I don't check, nothing else will save me," But again, what about the first time? |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Jun 27 14:31:37 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 13:26:24 2016. On a small private crossing like that the train DOES NOT whistle.Your eyes or your ass. ROAR |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Jun 27 14:52:34 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by AlM on Mon Jun 27 09:55:29 2016. If that is the correct crossing, there is only ONE house on the other side of the tracks, the rest of the buildings are farm buildings.Ergo: Private CROSSING Ergo: NO WHEASLES. Was this day or night? The video was NOT on line. Is there more of the story elsewhere? ROAR |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Jun 27 15:05:53 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 14:04:50 2016. even if not required by law, ALL drivers should approach grade crossings at restricted speed prepared to stop. It may be, with the average intelligence of drivers continually decreasing, that we need to put Stop signs at ungated crossings. Using driver stupidity as population control is dumb. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Jun 27 15:11:09 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Jun 27 15:05:53 2016. This is a private crossing, there are no signs, no whistles.This train was slowing down to make the Trinidad Station. just a few miles away. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by AlM on Mon Jun 27 15:29:04 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 14:04:50 2016. It is reasonable for a driver to presume that by obeying the law, he will not end up in an accident that is not somehow the fault of someone else.Um, read your own link. You have to slow down to a reasonable speed. A reasonable speed is one that will leave you alive. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Mon Jun 27 15:57:32 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 14:04:50 2016. I feel some have never heard of "defensive driving" classes on this board. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Mon Jun 27 16:01:19 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 13:26:24 2016. You know, in the handbook, it talks about yielding?Like when -you make a right turn into traffic, -left turn on green in places, -a parking lot entrance, -against pedestrians -at a railroad crossing.... But I agree, I wish all of the places I mentioned had my own private traffic director too. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Jun 27 16:14:14 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Jun 27 15:11:09 2016. All the more reason to approach slowly, "Stop. Look and Listen". |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Steamdriven on Mon Jun 27 17:34:27 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 14:27:30 2016. " I should be able to drive in from NY"Make The World Safe for New Yorkers? I don't think that'll go over too well out West. Last winter we actually had the Governor tell people to stay indoors during a quite ordinary snowstorm. Not just 'don't drive', but 'don't even walk'. The Mariolito was, of course, out driving around. He's special, y'know. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Jun 27 19:12:28 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Jun 27 14:31:37 2016. On a small private crossing like that the train DOES NOT whistleFalse. There are no quiet zones in Colorado, and that means private crossings too. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Mon Jun 27 20:56:12 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 14:04:50 2016. This is more akin to, if you are adjacent to a truck and he's put his blinker on to change into your lane. Technically you don't have to move to accommodate him, but he's moving into your lane whether you're still in it or not, so you probably should GTFout of the way. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Mon Jun 27 20:59:13 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 13:26:24 2016. Don't need gates, just lights. Honestly, a simple traffic light that turns yellow, then red as the train approaches should be more than enough for 90% of grade crossings out there. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Mon Jun 27 21:00:43 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Steamdriven on Mon Jun 27 11:32:52 2016. I don't think trolling, just sarcasm. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Jun 27 21:43:11 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Mon Jun 27 20:59:13 2016. Actually, the apparatus at the grade crossing is the least expensive part of protecting it. There's a lot more involved in being able to determine when a train is approaching, hope this copypasta helps to explain why traffic light or crossbucks doesn't really cost that much more over the other:There are three basic types of crossing circuits. 1) The first is called a DC Stick Circuit or "Easer-Weaser." It involves three separate track circuits separated by insulated joints. Let's say a westbound train enters the east approach track. This shunts the east track causing the east track relay to drop, which in turn de-energizes the crossing relay (XR). De-energizing the XR in turn activates the bell, de-energizes the crossing gate relay (XGR) causing the gates to drop and de-energizes the crossing repeater relay (XRP). The latter feeds energy to a flasher (EOR) relay, which cycles the lights by swapping polarity through the lighting circuit. Now the train reaches the island, which is always a separate circuit in its own right regardless of what kind of crossing control system is used. Whenever a train is in the island, the XR drops and crossing must remain activated until the island clears. OK, so in this case the island track relay drops. Also, what's called a stick relay has picked at this time, in this case the west stick relay. So even though the train has entered the west approach track and the west track relay is down, the stick relay circuits "wraps" around the track relay contacts. As far as the rest of the crossing circuit is concerned, there's no train any more and the crossing recovers once the island is clear. We call them Easer-Weaser for East Stick/West Stick, which has the mnenomic of ESR/WSR. 2) The second is called a motion detector. This is essentially a complicated on-off switch with a power supply for the XR or a motion detector relay whose contacts feed energy to the XR. Motion detectors do their work on the track via AC current and monitor what's called "phase angle." (That's the relationship between inductive reactance and resistance. For an AC crossing circuit the relationship is more a parallel resistor/inductor circuit. Thus the phase angle is measured using current vectors rather than resistance/impedance vectors as in series.) A perfect phase angle in a wholly inductive reactance circuit is 90 degrees. But we don't live in a perfect world, and railroad tracks certainly aren't perfect. Dirt, mud, rust, poor ballast, salt, even wet ties create lots of ways for current to go elsewhere. Most phase angles I see are in the 65- to 79-degree range. Anyway, the motion detector looks for a change in the phase angle, usually an increase of 2 percent, or a drop in the impedance distance (RX) of 0.2 volts. Doesn't take much to get that. As a train enters an AC crossing approach, the phase angle increases and the RX drops. As soon as the MD senses that change, it removes power from the relay and the crossing activates. When the phase angle begins to increase, the crossing recovers. But it will never recover while a train is occupying the island. The island has its own high frequency AC circuit. It doesn't matter how fast or slow a train is moving in a motion detector crossing circuit, it's on and sometimes on for a long time when it's a slow train. However. ... 3) . .. it does matter with predictors. A predictor is a smarter kind of motion detector. Rather than activate the crossing immediately, the predictor uses the decreasing RX value to determine the train's speed. It then performs a time-versus-distance calculation and activates the crossing at a pre-set time before the train reaches the crossing. It's the same time for every train regardless of speed because we program the approach length and warning time into the predictor's CPU. One caveat to the last sentence: If a train speeds up or slows down in the crossing approach, the predictor gets a little baffled. Also, if a train stops in the crossing approach, the crossing recovers after pre-set time. The predictor then swtiches itself over to become a motion detector. As soon as it senses movement, a change in phase or RX, it activates immediately. When the train clears the island, the predictor senses the rapid increase in RX and energizes the relay. I won't go into pre-empts, interties, wraps, uni-directional, bi-directional, remotes, and auxililary crossing circuits. It's a lot of Inside Baseball. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Jun 27 23:12:35 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 14:04:50 2016. If a train will never stop for a car, which is and should be the case, then the car should always be required, by law, to stop to check for trains where there are no other protectionsMost DMV manuals tell drivers to stop and look both ways, and to listen for trains, before proceeding across a crossing marked only with crossbucks. This is not a suggestion. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Jun 27 23:13:58 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Mon Jun 27 20:59:13 2016. How many drivers obey those at street intersections? Only takes one noncompliant fool to cause an accident. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Jun 27 23:14:36 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Jun 27 23:12:35 2016. They also tell you to signal a left turn before you do so. :) |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by OCTD 2039 on Tue Jun 28 00:48:16 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Jun 27 23:13:58 2016. Transit buses always stop before the train tracks to ensure the possibility of a train. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Tue Jun 28 06:01:09 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by OCTD 2039 on Tue Jun 28 00:48:16 2016. The buses stop and open the front door(s) to get a clearer view on the right side. The left side view is adequate through the driver's window. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Lou From Middletown NY on Tue Jun 28 08:46:31 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by TransitChuckG on Tue Jun 28 06:01:09 2016. The open door is not only for the 'view', it is also so the driver can listen.... |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by chud1 on Tue Jun 28 09:01:24 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Jun 27 23:12:35 2016. New York State DMV says i must STOP, LOOK AND LISTEN before i cross railroad tracks.i have been driving with a license since i was 18 and i am 59 now. thats 41 yrs. chud1. :)..... |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Tue Jun 28 10:00:51 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by AlM on Mon Jun 27 15:29:04 2016. Fair enough. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Tue Jun 28 10:04:10 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Jun 27 14:52:34 2016. Ergo: Private CROSSINGErgo: NO WHEASLES Please stop repeating this lie. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Tue Jun 28 10:11:32 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Jun 27 23:12:35 2016. Yes.But since trains are so different than cars, I would say that a rail crossing should stand out at least in some way beyond just a simple 4-way intersection. I'm saying that the tiny white x-shaped R/R sign doesn't cut it given the fact that we're talking about heavy trains at high speeds. Was there a R/R crossing ahead sign? I don't know, but that would at least make me feel a little better. How often we see large "Do Not Enter" and "Wrong Way Signs" at appropriate locations? Usually on both sides of the road. Basically, you have to catch this little white x, or end up on the tracks that are right behind it. The tracks themselves you have to assume are not visible to the driver, since driver's ed encourages you to keep a high visual horizon, not to stare at the pavement. Gates and lights may be too far, but at least a larger, duplicate, or full-stop sign. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Tue Jun 28 10:21:27 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Lou From Middletown NY on Tue Jun 28 08:46:31 2016. Yes, correct, thank you. So it would be recommended that his sliding driver's window be open to also listen. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Tue Jun 28 10:34:49 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Olog-hai on Tue Jun 28 10:04:10 2016. Is not lie. LION nose his stuff. Him not knoe of different roule in Co.We got LOTSA private crossings in ND. No wheazels there. ROAR |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Tue Jun 28 11:08:06 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Broadway Lion on Tue Jun 28 10:34:49 2016. Well, then , people have to stop, look and if no whistle, warning, get across fast and hope the automobile does not stall. Or, just listen for the train when you stop, is that so hard to do? |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Tue Jun 28 11:47:07 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Broadway Lion on Tue Jun 28 10:34:49 2016. I looked it up, and it appears to be legal to run over a private crossing without sounding the horn in North Dakota (see page 4), so I stand corrected there. But that's a state regulation, and not all states are the same. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by terRAPIN station on Tue Jun 28 12:34:06 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by chud1 on Tue Jun 28 09:01:24 2016. New York State DMV says i must STOP, LOOK AND LISTEN before i cross railroad tracks.Assuming you are a car driver, then no, it doesn't say that, as far as I can tell. You should look and listen but you are not told to stop (unless there's a train coming, of course). i have been driving with a license since i was 18 and i am 59 now.So have you been doing it wrong for 41 years? |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by randyo on Tue Jun 28 13:38:13 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by terRAPIN station on Tue Jun 28 12:34:06 2016. Certain NY DMV regulations have changed over the years and although I don’t recall my first manual since I have been driving longer than that, stopping may have been required at one time. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Karl M, eX nEW yORKER on Tue Jun 28 13:44:08 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Jun 27 08:22:21 2016. Anyone with a brain who see's a RR sign over SHINY tracks must know to at least to stop and LISTEN and LOOK for signs of any trains and for any train horns, unless of course one wants to commit suicide which I'd suspect in this case but to take your family with you is insane, just my thought on this case. Karl |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by Steamdriven on Tue Jun 28 13:47:35 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by New Flyer #857 on Tue Jun 28 10:11:32 2016. " I'm saying that the tiny white x-shaped R/R sign doesn't cut it "100% agreed. That's easy to miss, and it doesn't convey the level of hazard. Visually, the little RxR sign registers to this East Coaster as "How quaint, there must have been a railroad here 100 years ago, and there's still tracks". Of course, I will stop at the stop sign because I'm aware that those track might have come back into use, use which could be once a week or once an hour. But most people have no interest in such trivia; if they've never seen a train on X set of tracks, said trains do not exist. That's how we are wired to think. Consider that one passes tens of thousands of road signs per year, the average human will have some of them pass un-noticed. If they saw, registered and were conscious of every sign, they'd miss more vehicles and pedestrians. The mind discards a great deal of stuff that comes in through your eyes; if it didn't, your ancestors would have been eaten by bears while noticing every pine cone. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by terRAPIN station on Tue Jun 28 14:01:27 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Karl M, eX nEW yORKER on Tue Jun 28 13:44:08 2016. Anyone with a brain who see's a RR sign over SHINY tracks must know to at least to stopIncorrect. You do not and should not have to stop if 1) the law doesn't require it, and 2) you can adequately look and listen without stopping. |
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Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people |
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Posted by terRAPIN station on Tue Jun 28 14:02:15 2016, in response to Re: Amtrak train destroys minivan carrying 6 people, posted by Steamdriven on Tue Jun 28 13:47:35 2016. Of course, I will stop at the stop signWhat stop sign? |
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