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| (1317400) | |
The QJ service |
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Posted by INDviaCulver on Tue Oct 7 13:28:18 2014 Long ago on a thread called "Orphans Of Chrystie St", I recall reading that the RJ train filled a gap in QJ service. Does anybody have (or recall after all this time???) what the QJ timetable looked like (ie. When the first QJ left Brighton Beach or 168, and the headways)? |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by Edwards! on Tue Oct 7 14:14:51 2014, in response to The QJ service, posted by INDviaCulver on Tue Oct 7 13:28:18 2014. QJ was the weirdest subway line,but the best as far as I'm concerned.RJ trains operated early am service between the last Broad st JJ and the first Kings Highway QJ beginning Five thirty AM. QJ operated from 168th st Jamaica to Brighton Beach to about 745 pm..Kings Hwy about 8pm. RJ operated peak hour service in one direction...with a few running express along Bway El. |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Tue Oct 7 14:17:59 2014, in response to Re: The QJ service, posted by Edwards! on Tue Oct 7 14:14:51 2014. I would love to ride Express along the Broadway El. None of the GOs that run this way have been at a time when I could go...Too bad this isn't part of regular service. I'm sure NYCT has some very good justifications for that, but as a Subfan, I'd love it!! |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Tue Oct 7 15:29:31 2014, in response to Re: The QJ service, posted by MainR3664 on Tue Oct 7 14:17:59 2014. Is there potential to pick up some good speed if going non-stop from Myrtle to ENY? It looks like a good straightaway, but of course, that doesn't mean it hasn't been "timered" to death. |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by transitbuff on Tue Oct 7 16:33:40 2014, in response to Re: The QJ service, posted by New Flyer #857 on Tue Oct 7 15:29:31 2014. Clear to Chauncey...then timered into B.J. |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Tue Oct 7 16:56:29 2014, in response to Re: The QJ service, posted by transitbuff on Tue Oct 7 16:33:40 2014. That's still pretty good, and probably the way it should be anyway. |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by VictorM on Tue Oct 7 17:51:10 2014, in response to Re: The QJ service, posted by New Flyer #857 on Tue Oct 7 15:29:31 2014. It was even better going from ENY to Myrtle. There's a long downgrade going from Chauncey to Halsey with no timers, and level from there to Kosciusko. Those trains used to fly! You can still experience some of that on the AM expresses going from Myrtle to Hewes because of the downgrade from Myrtle to Flushing. |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by Joe V on Tue Oct 7 18:42:06 2014, in response to The QJ service, posted by INDviaCulver on Tue Oct 7 13:28:18 2014. I lived on the Jamaica Line back then and nobody knew when it ran. TA maps simply said rush hours, so we expected QJ/RJ/JJ to show up in triplicate. |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Tue Oct 7 18:53:05 2014, in response to The QJ service, posted by INDviaCulver on Tue Oct 7 13:28:18 2014. Long ago on a thread called "Orphans Of Chrystie St", I recall reading that the RJ train filled a gap in QJ service. Does anybody have (or recall after all this time???)IND: Here's the article that you were referring to: Tuscarora Despatch No 3 - The Orphans of Chrystie Street Part 1 : The RJ – Fourth Avenue-Nassau Street Line Began service: Monday, November 27, 1967 Ended service: Friday, June 28, 1968 The Route: 168th Street – Jamaica Avenue, Queens 95th Street – 4th Avenue, Brooklyn via the Williamsburg Bridge and the Montague Street Tunnel Distance: 21.81 Miles Running Times: 70 Minutes - express 78 minutes – local Stations: 49 Map Color: Red The RJ was listed on the front of the subway map as a “Special Rush Hour Service” which also included the NX,QB and 5 (Thru-Exp). It was a somewhat arbitrary designation as several other rush hour routes were not included. The service guide stated that the RJ ran during the AM rush northbound and the PM rush southbound as a “local” service. The reverse side of the map contained a strip map with the following information: Trains operate during rush hours Mon-Fri. During the PM rush from 6:20 to 6:55 RJ trains operate express along Broadway Brooklyn. Now how could a train that is listed as running in one direction only on the front of the map suddenly start running in both directions by the time it reached the back of the map? More intriguing, how could a train listed as running as a southbound local on the front of the map run as an express on the reverse side. Especially as it would be running express southbound at the same time that the QJ was running express northbound on the Broadway Brooklyn Line. The Broadway Brooklyn Line is a three track line and the center express track can only be used in one direction at a time. As we shall see the RJ ran in both directions in the rush hour and certain trains did run express on the Broadway Brooklyn Line. SERVICE DURING THE AM RUSH Northbound service: A total of five trains left 95 Street from 7:46 AM to 8:33 AM. The 7:58 and 8:10 departures ran all the way to 168th Street while the other three terminated at Eastern Parkway . These trains made all local stops. Southbound service: A total of five trains left 168th Street from 5:28 AM to 6:19 AM and ran to 95th Street . The first four trains made all local stops while the last one ran express on the Broadway Brooklyn Line from Eastern Parkway to Essex Street. It was the first southbound express of the day on the line. Note that the southbound service from Jamaica filled a service gap between the last JJ departure to Broad Street at 5:13 AM and the first QJ departure to Brighton Beach at 6:29 AM. SERVICE DURING THE PM RUSH Northbound service: Six trains leave 95th Street from 5:37 PM to 6:25 PM and run to 168th Street. The first five ran express from Essex Street to Eastern Parkway with the 6:14 PM departure closing out the day's express service on the Broadway Brooklyn Line . The last departure at 6:25 PM made all local stops. Note that the northbound service fills a 45 minute gap in northbound QJ service. Southbound service: Five trains leave Eastern Parkway and make all stops to 95th Street. There is no southbound PM rush service from 168th Street. The RJ ended service on Friday, June 28, 1968. Its replacement was an RR Nassau Street – Fourth Avenue Local between Chambers Street and 95th Street via the Montague Street Tunnel. Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Tue Oct 7 18:54:25 2014, in response to The QJ service, posted by INDviaCulver on Tue Oct 7 13:28:18 2014. Long ago on a thread called "Orphans Of Chrystie St", I recall reading that the RJ train filled a gap in QJ service. Does anybody have (or recall after all this time???)IND: Here's the article that you were referring to: Tuscarora Despatch No 3 - The Orphans of Chrystie Street Part 1 : The RJ – Fourth Avenue-Nassau Street Line Began service: Monday, November 27, 1967 Ended service: Friday, June 28, 1968 The Route: 168th Street – Jamaica Avenue, Queens 95th Street – 4th Avenue, Brooklyn via the Williamsburg Bridge and the Montague Street Tunnel Distance: 21.81 Miles Running Times: 70 Minutes - express 78 minutes – local Stations: 49 Map Color: Red The RJ was listed on the front of the subway map as a “Special Rush Hour Service” which also included the NX,QB and 5 (Thru-Exp). It was a somewhat arbitrary designation as several other rush hour routes were not included. The service guide stated that the RJ ran during the AM rush northbound and the PM rush southbound as a “local” service. The reverse side of the map contained a strip map with the following information: Trains operate during rush hours Mon-Fri. During the PM rush from 6:20 to 6:55 RJ trains operate express along Broadway Brooklyn. Now how could a train that is listed as running in one direction only on the front of the map suddenly start running in both directions by the time it reached the back of the map? More intriguing, how could a train listed as running as a southbound local on the front of the map run as an express on the reverse side. Especially as it would be running express southbound at the same time that the QJ was running express northbound on the Broadway Brooklyn Line. The Broadway Brooklyn Line is a three track line and the center express track can only be used in one direction at a time. As we shall see the RJ ran in both directions in the rush hour and certain trains did run express on the Broadway Brooklyn Line. SERVICE DURING THE AM RUSH Northbound service: A total of five trains left 95 Street from 7:46 AM to 8:33 AM. The 7:58 and 8:10 departures ran all the way to 168th Street while the other three terminated at Eastern Parkway . These trains made all local stops. Southbound service: A total of five trains left 168th Street from 5:28 AM to 6:19 AM and ran to 95th Street . The first four trains made all local stops while the last one ran express on the Broadway Brooklyn Line from Eastern Parkway to Essex Street. It was the first southbound express of the day on the line. Note that the southbound service from Jamaica filled a service gap between the last JJ departure to Broad Street at 5:13 AM and the first QJ departure to Brighton Beach at 6:29 AM. SERVICE DURING THE PM RUSH Northbound service: Six trains leave 95th Street from 5:37 PM to 6:25 PM and run to 168th Street. The first five ran express from Essex Street to Eastern Parkway with the 6:14 PM departure closing out the day's express service on the Broadway Brooklyn Line . The last departure at 6:25 PM made all local stops. Note that the northbound service fills a 45 minute gap in northbound QJ service. Southbound service: Five trains leave Eastern Parkway and make all stops to 95th Street. There is no southbound PM rush service from 168th Street. The RJ ended service on Friday, June 28, 1968. Its replacement was an RR Nassau Street – Fourth Avenue Local between Chambers Street and 95th Street via the Montague Street Tunnel. Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Tue Oct 7 18:59:43 2014, in response to The QJ service, posted by INDviaCulver on Tue Oct 7 13:28:18 2014. what the QJ timetable looked like (ie. When the first QJ left Brighton Beach or 168, and the headways)?IND: Here's the answer to the second half of your question. QJ Service: Lv: 168 Street 6:29 AM to 7:20 PM Lv: Brighton Beach 5:56 AM to 5:27 PM and 6:14 PM to 7:47 PM I do not have accurate headway information. Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by Joe V on Tue Oct 7 19:03:10 2014, in response to Re: The QJ service, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Tue Oct 7 18:53:05 2014. I think its real purpose in life was to facilitate swapping of the R16 and R27 fleets between the Eastern and Southern Divsions, though that was pretty much accomplished 4 weeks after Chrystie. For these few weeks, they did not chop consists on weekends so as not to mix consists.Once I started seeing 6 car R27's on weekends on the JJ, I knew the deed had been done. |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Tue Oct 7 19:11:31 2014, in response to Re: The QJ service, posted by Joe V on Tue Oct 7 19:03:10 2014. I rode on a 6-car R-27/30 JJ in March of 1968 from Elderts Lane to 168th and back. There was a recital at FKLHS and I managed to persuade my parents to let me take in a subway ride. They agreed (I was 11 at the time) and so I missed the first half of the recital. I tried to talk my mother into letting me do it again, but she put the kebosh on that. |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Tue Oct 7 19:14:43 2014, in response to Re: The QJ service, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Tue Oct 7 18:59:43 2014. Then beginning on July 1, 1968, the Curly Joe began operating 24/7, going only as far as Broad St. during nights and weekends. On August 18, it along with the QB swapped Brooklyn terminals with the D, running all the way to Coney Island. The D began terminating at Brighton Beach during weekdays when it ran express in Brooklyn. |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Tue Oct 7 21:54:49 2014, in response to Re: The QJ service, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Tue Oct 7 19:14:43 2014. Curly Joe was a fun ride, especially on the flea-bitten R-7a/R-9 cars that wound up out there.wayne |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by Edwards! on Tue Oct 7 22:22:10 2014, in response to The QJ service, posted by INDviaCulver on Tue Oct 7 13:28:18 2014. QJ was the weirdest subway line,but the best as far as I'm concerned.RJ trains operated early am service between the last Broad st JJ and the first Kings Highway QJ beginning Five thirty AM. QJ operated from 168th st Jamaica to Brighton Beach to about 745 pm..Kings Hwy about 8pm. RJ operated peak hour service in one direction...with a few running express along Bway El. |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by INDviaCulver on Wed Oct 8 00:13:59 2014, in response to Re: The QJ service, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Tue Oct 7 18:59:43 2014. Interesting!! I assume D trains were Northbound Brighton Locals during that gap btwn 527PM to 6:14PM? OR did a couple of QB trains run northbound back to Manhattan for a lay-up somewhere?? |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by zac on Wed Oct 8 03:28:01 2014, in response to Re: The QJ service, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Tue Oct 7 18:59:43 2014. So what ran along the Brighton line during that 45 minute gap? Did the D just run local? Or was there a QB that filled in? I don't recall the QB running late, but I often caught one running early towards Manhattan, at about 4pm or so. This probably turned at 57th and was a regular PM rush run. |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Wed Oct 8 07:58:36 2014, in response to Re: The QJ service, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Tue Oct 7 19:11:31 2014. At that age, and at my present 46, I'd prefer a ride on the El to a "recital", LOL. |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Wed Oct 8 08:00:04 2014, in response to Re: The QJ service, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Tue Oct 7 18:59:43 2014. Thank you :) |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Oct 8 12:45:59 2014, in response to Re: The QJ service, posted by INDviaCulver on Wed Oct 8 00:13:59 2014. I assume D trains were Northbound Brighton Locals during that gap btwn 527PM to 6:14PM?IND: There were several strange aspects of the subway service during the period between November, 1967 and July, 1968. The forty five minute gap in 'QJ" service was one of them. The "D" was another. It did restore midday express service to the Brighton line which had been missing for several years. "D" trains ran express on the Brighton Line as follows: southbound 7:52 AM to 7:28 PM (appx) exp Prospect Park to Brighton Beach, 7:37 to 8:23 PM exp Prospect Park to Kings Highway. Northbound express left from Coney Island from 6:00 AM to 5:30 PM after which they ran as Brighton Locals. This was the plan although as time went on "D" trains would run local south of Kings Highway earlier due to congestion at Brighton Beach. Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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Re: The QJ service |
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Posted by coneyisl on Wed Oct 8 14:37:39 2014, in response to Re: The QJ service, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Oct 8 12:45:59 2014. Pure speculation, but the 45 minute gap in QJ service might have been necessitated in order to allow NX trains to terminate at BB although it is not clear whether that was typically on the BB local or the express track. It's also possible that those trains then laid up between BB and Sheepshead Bay on the express track, which would have kept the D from running express northbound out of BB. Once the NX service was done for the evening, several D trains would layup between BB & OP for the night. This would necessitate QJ northbound local service our of CI until D's began to run through to CI. That begs the question as to where the QJs were laid up during the gap. Is it possible that NX trains were re-signed (or "de-signed"). I witnessed trains laying up on the pocket tracks between BB & OP during this time-gap, so it is possible that those were the missing QJs. I sure wish there was an old-timer out there that worked BB Tower back then whom could shed some light on that!!!! |
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