Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/S.I. (1313033) | |
Home > SubChat |
[ Post a New Response | Return to the Index ]
|
Page 1 of 6 |
(1313047) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Allan on Mon Sep 15 15:25:31 2014, in response to Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/S.I., posted by Gold_12th on Mon Sep 15 14:18:19 2014. I read that (while on the subway) and I take issue with this:"MTA spokesman Adam Lisberg said there are operational challenges in implementing express service. For instance, there is less track space for trains between the Bergen and Jay street stops where the rails merge, he said. "It's not as simple as just throwing on extra trains, because they all have to end up merging together," Lisberg said." Would there really be less track space since the F express track is a separate track south of Jay. The only possible "bottleneck" would be where the N/B F express merges south of Jay. If they scheduled the F trains properly ten there shouldn't be a problem. After all, the service was in place until 1987 and there didn't seem to be any major issues. (Maybe someone should get Adam Lisberg a copy of the track map for that area. |
|
(1313077) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Sep 15 16:16:04 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Allan on Mon Sep 15 15:25:31 2014. So it looks like another discussion on the merits of F express service in Brooklyn, which has been beaten to death previously, is going to start again.Adam Lisberg is an MTA mouthpiece. His job. He know something about everything, but not the nooks and crannies. Us railfans are more knowlegable than him about a lot of stuff so don't let him get to you. F express in Brooklyn = less local service in Brooklyn. That's a fact. F local stations berween Church and Jay are extremely heavy stations. You will have uneven loading leaving Brooklyn. You cannot get Bergen St. lower back for service because of newcsignal and other support equipment on the leaky decepit platforn which will never be suitable for passenger use. You can't have F express service because there will be no transfer to it for passengers from Bergen to 4th Ave. All F trains must stop at 4th Ave. because it's a transfer station. |
|
(Sponsored) |
iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It
|
(1313095) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/S.I. |
|
Posted by Edwards! on Mon Sep 15 17:07:11 2014, in response to Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/S.I., posted by Gold_12th on Mon Sep 15 14:18:19 2014. Sorry...as much as I would love to see the TA do SOME THINGS in the 'outer boros',its not going to happen.The City of Manhattan is given top priority over every thing. |
|
(1313108) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by randyo on Mon Sep 15 17:45:17 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Sep 15 16:16:04 2014. Never say never. If warranted, Bergen can always be returned to passenger service and it wouldn't be much different from 86 or 59 St stations on Lex. |
|
(1313116) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by italianstallion on Mon Sep 15 18:18:04 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by randyo on Mon Sep 15 17:45:17 2014. I agree. Where there's a will there's a way. |
|
(1313147) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Nilet on Mon Sep 15 19:27:08 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Sep 15 16:16:04 2014. Is the viaduct wide enough to turn 4th Avenue into an express station? I do recall a significant gap between the express tracks, big enough for a platform on at least one place between Carroll Street and 7th Avenue. |
|
(1313152) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Joe V on Mon Sep 15 19:28:06 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by randyo on Mon Sep 15 17:45:17 2014. Skip-stop south of Church Ave to KH or Ave X for the same reason as the J/Z: most of those stops don't need 15 TPH. |
|
(1313186) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Mon Sep 15 22:19:33 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Sep 15 16:16:04 2014. F local stations between Church and Jay are extremely heavy stations. You will have uneven loading leaving Brooklyn.Not if the local Fs start/end at Church Av. A fresh train every 8 minutes is better than a full one every 4, no? In the reverse direction, after the new patterns are learned, the local passengers will have a train similar to the M in Queens - avoided by the people going farther, so they would also have more room, while people going farther have a faster trip. Win-win. |
|
(1313204) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Sep 16 00:48:48 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Mon Sep 15 22:19:33 2014. Church Ave. is the 24/7 terminal for the G.Want F trains to start @ Church? This would mean a cut in F service south of there. |
|
(1313211) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Wallyhorse on Tue Sep 16 01:25:14 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by randyo on Mon Sep 15 17:45:17 2014. Right:I would be doing what is necessary to get Bergen lower re-opened so that can be an express station for this. The real problem is what line would be put there to be the Culver Express? The best candidate to me would be the (C) after West 4th going with the (F) and (M) to Coney Island via the Culver Express (while the (F) and (G) both terminate at Church Avenue, except overnights when the (F) would continue to run as it does now). If you can manage 30-32 TPH stopping on the local track at Broadway-Lafayette, it can work. As I would likely do it: (A) runs as it does now, except it would now be an express at all times in Manhattan and Brooklyn. (C) as it currently does to West 4th, then via the (F) and Rutgers to Jay Street and via Culver Express to Coney Island (except overnights, though this incarnation of the (C) could be 24/7 if warranted). This gives Coney Island and Culver Express riders a new one-seat option via 8th Avenue. (E) replaces the (C) in Brooklyn to Euclid Avenue at all times. During rush hours, some (E) trains still terminate at Chambers as they do now. A new supplemental (K) train (actually a revival of the old (AA) train that was the (K) in the '80s) runs from Chambers-168th Street at all times (to accommodate local riders at the WTC too lazy to walk to the (A) platform at Chambers and for those in lower Manhattan who are looking for spots north of 50th Street). This would be 2-4 TPH. The (F) and (G) would as noted terminate at Church Avenue, except the (F) would still run to Coney Island as it does now overnights. This also would give riders along the Rutgers portion (including Broadway-Lafayette, Essex-Delancey, East Broadway and York Streets) excluding overnights direct access to the 8th Avenue line as well as there being a new transfer to the 8th Avenue line available from the (6) at Bleecker. That to me is the best way to bring back the Culver Express. |
|
(1313216) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by AlM on Tue Sep 16 01:43:12 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Sep 16 00:48:48 2014. People might accept fewer trains in return for them being expresses. |
|
(1313224) | |
Rockaway Beach Branch |
|
Posted by Wallyhorse on Tue Sep 16 02:30:34 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Wallyhorse on Tue Sep 16 01:25:14 2014. Neglected in the first post to mention the other big part of this, the Rockaway Beach Branch:This to me is the much more important one because it can prove to be a game changer for entire stretch of the abandoned line and The Rockaways, PLUS give increased service to the Casino at Aqueduct AND to the Howard Beach station for the AirTrain to JFK. As noted before, since by the time that would be ready the SAS would be back, I would be doing changes already previously noted: The (W) would be the new Rockaway Beach Line, running from Whitehall Street to Rockaway Park at all times. The (R) would go back to being the 24/7 line to Astoria. To accommodate this and so the (R) has a yard, there would be a switch of southern terminals in Brooklyn with the (R) on that end being the West End line from Coney Island. The (D) would have its southern terminal at 95th Street in Brooklyn since it still has Concourse Yard. The (N) would become the supplemental line to Astoria from 5:30 AM-10:00 PM on weekdays. The rest of the time, the (N) would go with the (Q) to 96th Street and 2nd Avenue (later 125th/Lex) to supplement the (Q) on the UES, arguably the most densely populated area in the country. |
|
(1313226) | |
Re: Rockaway Beach Branch |
|
Posted by Nilet on Tue Sep 16 02:36:55 2014, in response to Rockaway Beach Branch, posted by Wallyhorse on Tue Sep 16 02:30:34 2014. The (W) would be the new Rockaway Beach Line, running from Whitehall Street to Rockaway Park at all times.The (R) would go back to being the 24/7 line to Astoria. The (N) would become the supplemental line to Astoria from 5:30 AM-10:00 PM on weekdays. The rest of the time, the (N) would go with the (Q) to 96th Street and 2nd Avenue How I get to 67th Avenue? |
|
(1313270) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Tue Sep 16 08:35:47 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by AlM on Tue Sep 16 01:43:12 2014. If the number of rush hour people between Church Av and Bergen >= the number of people between Ditmas Av and Coney Island, it would be a perfect exchange. The same trains will have the same number of people as they enter Jay St. The difference is, the people from farther out had a faster ride and the people from closer in had a less crowded train. Afternoon rush hour would probably look no different, except again the people going farther out get a faster ride. |
|
(1313325) | |
Re: Rockaway Beach Branch |
|
Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Sep 16 11:33:44 2014, in response to Re: Rockaway Beach Branch, posted by Nilet on Tue Sep 16 02:36:55 2014. Good question. |
|
(1313374) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/S.I. |
|
Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Tue Sep 16 13:28:26 2014, in response to Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/S.I., posted by Gold_12th on Mon Sep 15 14:18:19 2014. Doesn't the current M service count as a service improvement for the riders of the Myrtle Ave el? Even if it was, technically, a service cut?Only way I can really see bringing back the V is contingent upon 2nd Ave opening. SAS will have spare capacity - unless they're planning to run Q trains there on 3-minute headways, which I doubt. So here goes: Run the V weekdays from Stillwell Ave to 96th & 2nd (Lex/125th upon opening of SAS Phase 2) via the Culver el and express between Church and Jay. Then local via 6th Ave to Lex/63rd. Switch over to the Broadway "side" of Lex and turn north onto the SAS from there. The F would stay local in Brooklyn and operate on or near its current headways. It would operate to/from Church Ave when the V is in operation and to/from Stillwell when the V is not running. Doing it this way allows the F to continue to serve the heavier stations from Church Ave north, on or close to its current headways, while giving the lower-usage stations below Church an express without over-serving those stations. I admit it would be a tight fit on the 6th Ave local tracks with the F, M and V trains running there. This V service wouldn't be able to run more than 6-7 tph in order to fit with the F and M. And we know the M isn't getting sent back to Nassau St. |
|
(1313382) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Tue Sep 16 13:55:59 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Wallyhorse on Tue Sep 16 01:25:14 2014. "The real problem is what line would be put there to be the Culver Express? The best candidate to me would be the (C) after West 4th going with the (F) and (M) to Coney Island via the Culver Express (while the (F) and (G) both terminate at Church Avenue, except overnights when the (F) would continue to run as it does now). If you can manage 30-32 TPH stopping on the local track at Broadway-Lafayette, it can work."No, the best candidate would be the V. Not the 2001-2010 service that ran from Forest Hills, Queens, but rather a new V service that runs to/from the 2nd Ave subway. Culver el riders would get an express AND still have direct service to 6th Ave like they've had since 1954. This is because the V would start at Coney Island and go express between Church and Jay, while the F would start at Church and go local. While it would be a tight squeeze between the F, M and V trains on the 6th Ave local, it wouldn't be as bad as what you're proposing with the C, F and M trains. You're calling for 30-32 tph, while I'm suggesting 28tph (14 F, 8 M, 6 V). 28 tph is more manageable than 32. |
|
(1313390) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Mark S. Feinman on Tue Sep 16 14:45:29 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Mon Sep 15 16:16:04 2014. All F trains must stop at 4th Ave. because it's a transfer station.Don't Flushing expresses pass 74th Street, which is also a transfer station? Why is the 4th Ave / 9th St transfer deemed more important? --Mark |
|
(1313394) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by AlM on Tue Sep 16 14:55:58 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Mark S. Feinman on Tue Sep 16 14:45:29 2014. Don't Flushing expresses pass 74th Street, which is also a transfer station?Also, the 2/3 bypass 59th. The 4/5 bypass Bleecker and Canal. The B/D bypass 14th. |
|
(1313395) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Spider-Pig on Tue Sep 16 14:58:50 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by AlM on Tue Sep 16 14:55:58 2014. Also the 4/5 bypass 51st and the A bypasses Franklin.There's also the other end of the 4th Avenue/9th Street station: bypassed by the D and N. So this whole "expresses must stop because it's a transfer station" doesn't hold water at all. Especially given the extreme inconvenience of this transfer and the fact that at least as far as the F is concerned, it is now redundant. |
|
(1313399) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/S.I. |
|
Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Sep 16 15:19:19 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/S.I., posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Tue Sep 16 13:28:26 2014. The G is the 24/7 service at Church Ave.The lead from the main line to the yard is 300'. This is why the G is ideal here and one reason why they run 300' trains there. |
|
(1313401) | |
Re: Rockaway Beach Branch |
|
Posted by Wallyhorse on Tue Sep 16 15:21:44 2014, in response to Re: Rockaway Beach Branch, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Sep 16 11:33:44 2014. (M) wiuld be full-time to 71st-Continental as would the (G), with rush hours bith lines to 179th Street and the (F) express all the way then. |
|
(1313402) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Wallyhorse on Tue Sep 16 15:25:52 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Tue Sep 16 13:55:59 2014. The reason I would do it with the (C) is because it also gives riders along the Culver line (at express stations and east of Churcu Avenue) a one-seat 8th Avenue option they don't have PLUS give riders at Jay-Metrotech who are looking for midtown via 8th Avenue the option to switch to the (C) and bypass lower Manhattan. You also give riders on the (6) a direct transfer to 8th avenue trains at Broadway-Lafayette. |
|
(1313403) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Sep 16 15:26:17 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Mark S. Feinman on Tue Sep 16 14:45:29 2014. Fine. NYCT is not going to take away a transfer that is already there. |
|
(1313404) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Tue Sep 16 15:33:42 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Wallyhorse on Tue Sep 16 15:25:52 2014. 6 line riders already have a direct transfer to 8th Ave trains at 51st St to the E. There are other, more direct ways for 6 line riders who live below 51st St to get to the West Side if they need to.And how many Culver Line riders are clamoring for direct 8th Ave service? More people just want an express, as opposed to having their service completely rerouted to Lower Manhattan and two avenues west in Midtown. |
|
(1313426) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/S.I. |
|
Posted by randyo on Tue Sep 16 17:05:19 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/S.I., posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Sep 16 15:19:19 2014. When I was the T/D at Church, the GG ran 8 X 60 ft trains (480 ft) that turned there during rush hours with no problem and prior to Chrystie, alternate 600 ft D trains terminated at Church, so turning long trains there should be no problem. |
|
(1313431) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/S.I. |
|
Posted by Bill From Maspeth on Tue Sep 16 17:14:05 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/S.I., posted by randyo on Tue Sep 16 17:05:19 2014. With the reconstruction there are now timers galore, key-by's and no direct route coming into 5 track. You have to take 7 lead, then into 5.Also under the old way, if you were on 6 tk you came straight onto the lead. Now you go from 6 to 8, then to the lead. |
|
(1313440) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Michael549 on Tue Sep 16 17:44:44 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by AlM on Tue Sep 16 01:43:12 2014. "People might accept fewer trains in return for them being expresses."Just some questions: What transit rider turns down "express service"? The word "express" has the connotation of being "faster". Who really wants to ride "the local" which often has the connotation of being "slow" and "dreadful". Exactly "what folks" along the F-train might accept fewer trains in return for those trains being express? Exactly which is a greater problem? Having frequent service that stops at every station? Or getting less frequent service that skips some stations, where the folks at the heavily used stations have to wait longer for their trains, even if the trains are less full? Exactly just how time is saved by the "F-express" in Brooklyn, considering that the journey to Manhattan involves local tracks between the Sixth Avenue stations and Jay Street? Have there really been "huge" traffic and train delay problems lately on the Brooklyn segment of the F-train? Or is that just rhetoric? Is this one of those "easy political band-wagon issues" that the local political folk can pile upon to "get something done", even if later on they will complain that the "wrong thing was done"? Just some thoughts. Mike |
|
(1313453) | |
Culver Express |
|
Posted by Wallyhorse on Tue Sep 16 18:33:04 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Tue Sep 16 15:33:42 2014. The express in this scenario WOULD be run with the (F). In this case, the (C) would be running with the (F) between Jay and West 4th via Rutgers at all times its running. Yes, you would have the C/F/M all on the local track at Broadway-Lafayette, but express riders on the Culver who are looking for 6th Avenue can switch to the B/D/F/M there.And I would think the rider who lives in lower Manhattan where the (6) runs who is looking for Penn Station would appreciate having the (C) stop at Broadway-Lafayette and not having to either go out of the way to 51st and the long underpass to get the (E) or having to take a 6th Avenue or Broadway train and walk a block west to Penn Station, especially since the Moynahan portion would be open by the time this happened. |
|
(1313462) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/S.I. |
|
Posted by JAzumah on Tue Sep 16 19:30:05 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/S.I., posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Tue Sep 16 13:28:26 2014. The F is fine as is because you will lose the time you save merging the expresses back in. |
|
(1313469) | |
Re: Rockaway Beach Branch |
|
Posted by Nilet on Tue Sep 16 19:39:06 2014, in response to Re: Rockaway Beach Branch, posted by Wallyhorse on Tue Sep 16 15:21:44 2014. You want to cram all three lines onto the Queens Boulevard local? I'm not sure the capacity exists, unless you're planning to have very limited service on the W and maybe some cutbacks on the M and G.Also, does Rockaway Park really need such extensive service overnight? Does Queens Boulevard? |
|
(1313519) | |
Re: Rockaway Beach Branch |
|
Posted by Wallyhorse on Wed Sep 17 00:03:13 2014, in response to Re: Rockaway Beach Branch, posted by Nilet on Tue Sep 16 19:39:06 2014. The idea is two of the three lines (G/M) would terminate off-peak at 71st-Continental while the other (W) would turn off for the Rockaway Beach Branch after 63rd Street. To avoid a conga line at 71st during rush hours, at those times (and when warranted otherwise) those two lines (G/M) would terminate at 179th Street while the (F) would be express all the way to 179th then.The (W) going to Rockaway Park also eliminates the Rockaway Park (S). The new line would likely be a game changer for The Rockaways, especially if 24/7. |
|
(1313526) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Edwards! on Wed Sep 17 02:09:38 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Michael549 on Tue Sep 16 17:44:44 2014. Damn...what a jerk. |
|
(1313527) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by AlM on Wed Sep 17 02:34:18 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Michael549 on Tue Sep 16 17:44:44 2014. Exactly "what folks" along the F-train might accept fewer trains in return for those trains being express?There are 14 tph on the F line in rush hour. So if trains are evenly spaced you wait little more than 2 minutes for a train on average. Is it worth reducing that to 7 expresses per hour (and waiting 4+ minutes) in return for skipping a bunch of stops? Yes. Is there a feasible way to implement this? Quite possibly not. But it's not an inherently bad idea. It might just be an idea that can't be made to work. Or maybe it can be made to work. |
|
(1313532) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Michael549 on Wed Sep 17 03:47:08 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Michael549 on Tue Sep 16 17:44:44 2014. I do not understand how posing questions for debate equates to being called a "jerk"?Yes, the idea of an express train on the Culver line has been discussed on this forum before. And probably such a debate will take place again. Mike |
|
(1313557) | |
Re: Culver Express |
|
Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Wed Sep 17 10:15:19 2014, in response to Culver Express, posted by Wallyhorse on Tue Sep 16 18:33:04 2014. Isn't this Culver express a proposal that's supposed to benefit BROOKLYN riders? The relatively small number of residents of Murray Hill, Gramercy Park and SoHo, in MANHATTAN, who may desire a direct 8th Ave route to Penn Station is irrelevant in this case.In other words by replacing the F with the C south of Church Ave and forcing Culver riders who have direct 6th Ave service for 60 years to transfer at Jay St, you're putting the needs and desires of Manhattan residents over those of Brooklyn residents. The whole point of that AMNY article was to address the problem with doing that. |
|
(1313569) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Wed Sep 17 11:48:10 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by AlM on Wed Sep 17 02:34:18 2014. The extra time you may wait is made up with the reduced running time.Where's the advantage? Seems to me it all cancels out. Now we get into the psychological/feel good aspect of riding an express because it makes us feel good........superior as we watch other passengers seethe as we feel entitled! |
|
(1313575) | |
Re: Culver Express |
|
Posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Sep 17 12:28:58 2014, in response to Re: Culver Express, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Wed Sep 17 10:15:19 2014. The (F) train is the Culver LOCAL. Only the Local can operate to and from Coney Island. The tracks do not permit the Coney Island train to run express on the Culver. The LOCAL ttrain on any of the South Brooklyn routes is the 24/7 service, Express service is not 24/7.The Culver Express (whatever you may call it) ends at Kings Highway. Switching possibilities do not allow a local train to teminate there without screwing up the railroad. LION Thinks we should skip the idea of a "Culver Express" and think instead of running the (F) Local on the Culver Tracks and Express north of Church Street. LION Thinks that new local service can be run from Church Street via Smith Street to Manhattan. This can be a (C) or (E) train in which case it would end up on 8th Avenue. It is also possible to run additional (F) trains northbound in the morning, so that commuters along Smith Street may get trains with seats in them. PMs all trains would be local so that you could take the first train home. ROAR |
|
(1313578) | |
Re: Culver Express |
|
Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Wed Sep 17 12:48:15 2014, in response to Re: Culver Express, posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Sep 17 12:28:58 2014. Where did I say anything about express service to/from Kings Highway in my previous post? So the Culver Line ends at Church Ave, then? So what is the name of the 4-track line north of Church, then, if it's not Culver? Does it matter, anyway? You know full well which part of the F route I'm talking about. |
|
(1313601) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by Mark S. Feinman on Wed Sep 17 15:22:18 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Sep 16 15:26:17 2014. Ahhh, I see your point now.--mark |
|
(1313641) | |
Re: Rockaway Beach Branch |
|
Posted by Joe V on Wed Sep 17 19:20:50 2014, in response to Re: Rockaway Beach Branch, posted by Nilet on Tue Sep 16 19:39:06 2014. Just run the R down there, as opposed to the M. 600' long trains are better able to handle the added load of the RBB. |
|
(1313645) | |
Re: Culver Express |
|
Posted by italianstallion on Wed Sep 17 19:39:50 2014, in response to Re: Culver Express, posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Sep 17 12:28:58 2014. "The tracks do not permit the Coney Island train to run express on the Culver. "While this is now true, it was apparently possible in the past, when Coney-Island-originating trains ran express to Manhattan in morning peak. When, and why, did they apparently remove the switch that allowed this move? And how hard would it be to restore it? |
|
(1313650) | |
Re: Culver Express |
|
Posted by Nilet on Wed Sep 17 20:13:07 2014, in response to Re: Culver Express, posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Sep 17 12:28:58 2014. The tracks do not permit the Coney Island train to run express on the Culver.How do they not? |
|
(1313651) | |
Re: Culver Express |
|
Posted by Nilet on Wed Sep 17 20:13:09 2014, in response to Re: Culver Express, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Wed Sep 17 12:48:15 2014. So the Culver Line ends at Church Ave, then?No, the Culver line ends at Ditmas Avenue. The portion between Ditmas and 9th was demolished. :ž |
|
(1313693) | |
Re: Culver Express |
|
Posted by italianstallion on Thu Sep 18 00:41:12 2014, in response to Re: Culver Express, posted by Nilet on Wed Sep 17 20:13:07 2014. He means that they can't switch to the express track at Kings Hwy. if they run local from Coney Is. to there, which they would have to do if the local originated at Kings Hwy. |
|
(1313701) | |
Re: Culver Express |
|
Posted by Michael549 on Thu Sep 18 01:28:28 2014, in response to Re: Culver Express, posted by Nilet on Wed Sep 17 20:13:07 2014. "The tracks do not permit the Coney Island train to run express on the Culver." "How do they not?"Long Winded Explanation: Years ago in the 1970's, there was rush hour express service on the Culver Line provided by "Coney Island" F-trains, and the G-train was extended rush hours to Church Avenue. F-trains that originated at Coney Island on their way to Manhattan during the am-rush-hours, upon reaching the switches near the Kings Highway station could switched from the Manhattan-bound local track to the center middle express track. Those "Coney Island" F-trains would then run express on the middle track portion of the line, and upon reaching Church Avenue continue running as an express on the original IND portion of the F-train route. Over time, the last vestiges of that express run has been eliminated. F-trains that originated at the Kings Highway or Avenue-X stations during the am-rush-hours could simply continue making all local stops on the journey to Manhattan. Then the Kings Highway station was a fairly versatile station, a kind of enhanced Parkchester-type setup, with track switches both fore and aft of the station platforms. At some point in the 1990's, a track switch leading from the Manhattan-bound local track to the center middle-track was removed. This meant that the Kings Highway station still could "terminate and relay" Kings Highway local trains using the center track at the platform, and/or aft of the station, however it could not steer trains from Coney Island to the center-middle track. Trains from Coney Island have to remain on the Manhattan-bound local track. Please note - that the Brooklyn-bound section of the Kings Highway station is still capable of steering Coney Island bound trains running on the center-middle track to the outside Coney Island bound local track. This can still be done both fore and aft of the station platforms. In essence, there is a track movement operation that can not be done in the am-rush hour direction, but that can be accomplished in the pm-rush-hour direction. Usually most folks involved in the discussion are concerned about the am-rush-hour pathways. "Express on the Culver line" then becomes an interesting debate point, since it depends upon which section of the line one is talking about. There is the original IND portion of the F & G train route that has 4 tracks that has gained the name "Culver". Then there is the original 3-track Culver line that was created as part of the BRT/BMT system traveling over McDonald Avenue, that was joined to the IND in the 1950's allowing D-trains, and later F-trains to reach Coney Island. Using the old configuration of the Kings Highway Station, the entire of F route from York Street to Coney Island (including the G-train portion) by the tracks is a rather capable pathway. By the tracks it was very easy to create an operation where all F-trains use the express tracks between Jay Street and Church Avenue, where in the AM-Rush Hours - trains toward Manhattan from Coney Island use the center-middle track between Church Avenue and Kings Highway (old configuration), while trains that originate at Kings Highway make all local stops between Church Avenue and Kings Highway. In the pm-rush-hours, Coney Island bound F-trains would use the center-middle track to Kings Highway. (This could easily be called the "Culver Express".) By the tracks it is very easy to create an operation where all F-trains use the express tracks between Jay Street and Church Avenue, with all trains making local stops from Church Avenue to either Coney Island or Kings Highway. (This could also easily be called the "Culver Express".) By the tracks it is very easy to create an operation where only F-trains that travel to/from Coney Island use the express tracks between Jay Street and Church Avenue. Trains that originate or end at Kings Highway make all local stops between Jay Street and Kings Highway. (This could also easily be called the "Culver Express".) Except for the current track switch issue at Kings Highway (the in-ability to steer Manhattan-bound trains from Coney Island to the center-middle track at the Kings Highway station) a variety of configurations could be created. Mike |
|
(1313702) | |
Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/ |
|
Posted by MTA T on Thu Sep 18 01:42:52 2014, in response to Re: Rider's Wish List: (F) Brooklyn Express; Metro-North in Co-Op City; More rail service to Queens/, posted by Wallyhorse on Tue Sep 16 01:25:14 2014. Fucking of course you comment with a proposal on a news article about possible service changes. |
|
(1313718) | |
Re: Culver Express |
|
Posted by Edwards! on Thu Sep 18 02:23:58 2014, in response to Re: Culver Express, posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Sep 17 12:28:58 2014. Culver express trains can operate short turn service to Kings Hwy, in the same manner Brighton Exp trains do at B.B. |
|
(1313719) | |
Re: Culver Express |
|
Posted by Wallyhorse on Thu Sep 18 04:38:48 2014, in response to Re: Culver Express, posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Sep 17 12:28:58 2014. I would think they would do whatever track switches were necessary so express trains on the Culver line would then switch to or from the Local track south of Church Avenue. This would allow the (C) in my version to then continue to Coney Island as a local after (or from Coney Island before) Church Avenue. |
|
|
Page 1 of 6 |