on Tue Jun 26 22:11:21 2012, in response to Re: 76th Street Station - Photos?, posted by Dupont Circle Station on Tue Jun 26 19:28:59 2012.
" This happened with the 108th Street "spur" "
How do you know?
"As far as I'm concerned, unless and until someone goes and does either or both of these things AND posts their findings *INCLUDING* clear scans of the specific documentation, anyone bringing up the subject should be instructed how to use Google to find the old threads about it and advised to undertake a verification effort if they want to contribute something new."
This is, in my opinion, an excellent and logical post. I checked the 1933 and 1934 editions of the PSC Reports (the latest dates I could find for the moment) and there is very little information of any sort about the IND system. In fact, many of the pages have spaces for such information with IND titles, but they're blank. But I have many other official reports which, when I have the time, I'll try to check out to see if any other IND information might appear.
At some point, I bought at an ERA auction a very superficial set of plans from circa 1928 for IND development in Bkln's Eastern District and it showed the Fulton St subway continuing along Fulton St out past the Bway Jct area although I forget how far east the subway was to have continued. That would have placed the subway directly under the Fulton St portion of the BMT Jamaica Line rather than under the Pitkin Av portion of the Fulton St El. I also saw a reference somewhere (I can't recall where) that showed as a part of that routing, a connection was to have been made to the Liberty Av portion of the Fulton El as is the present case, but the connection would have been made from north of the el structure rather than from the south as is the present case. It seems, as I have mentioned in several posts on this topic, that the city had not finalized plans for the IND east of Rocky Av until very close to the time of unification in 1940. From the Hagstrom map that appeared on this forum, it seems that the routing along Pitkin was pretty much finalized by 1939 which is the supposed date of the map. In any event it seems that the reason that the 1933 and 34 PSC reports contained little or no info about the Bkln IND is that at that time no firm decision had been made as to what route(s) the IND would ultimately take.
good post.you basically said just about everything that I have posted here since I joined up.there was no conspiracy,people read brennan`s post and read it like it was the very word of god himself.as for the water problem,don`t they build pump stations for that.it happened on the irt ext.to flatbush&nostrand.ALL work stopped on the pitkin ave ext.in may of 1942,5 months into WW 2.this is documented in "building the IND" in the last few pages.the yard leads true west to east into pitkin yd.were built apx.1941.I,ve seen the photos.several years ago I spent the entire winter going to every musuem in NYC.as you stated there is very little written about the ind & very few construction photos.library time is up ,talk at a future date.
Not only did the PSC Reports contain no information about the IND system's Brooklyn lines, they contained very little information about the IND itself, whereas there was much information about the BMT or IND. If you're ever in my area on Long Island, let me know, stop in and take a look at these reports. I'll only show them to someone with a head on their shoulders, such as yourself.
No, but even into the 1960's there was an man-built inlet of Jamaica Bay coming pretty close. It ran down what is now 79th St and crossed under Linden Blvd. The 1924 photos should show it going further north.
That could be the reason why the subway infrastructure is described as ending at 79 St. The inlet may have been presumed to have been dried up and when the contractors attempted to dig past that point they may have discovered that it wasn't . Water problems in the area have been cited in several sources as the reason why construction was halted past that point.
That area, has had it's level, raised several times. If one were to go to the three Jewish Cemeteries, On Liberty Ave, the one on the western edge will reveal the depth and various levels down to the original level.
Consider the turn off of Pitkin Ave of the Old Fulton Line taking it to Liberty ave. Ask yourself "Why?"
Answer, to get to more customers, and avoid subsoil problems.
Back in the day, had the Fulton El continued on Pitkin Ave. that area was farm land. The population was north.