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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 27 12:09:21 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon Feb 27 11:48:42 2012. Nope, It's only Wyckoff Ave till it hits Gates Ave (right at the Myrtle-Wyckoff station), at that point, it zig zags up to St Nicholas Ave for a couple blocks till it hits Menahan St, at which time it follows Cypress Ave to Flushing Ave. After that it finds Newtown Creek which becomes the border. On the other end it leaves Wyckoff Ave at Covert St and shifts down to Irving Ave till it cuts through the Cemeteries. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Feb 27 12:16:09 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 27 10:24:43 2012. maybe the lesson here is that zip code redlining should be illegal |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon Feb 27 15:45:27 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by MainR3664 on Mon Feb 27 07:48:19 2012. I don`t have any.if I did they would be here. |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 27 18:52:21 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Feb 27 12:16:09 2012. It is. Much of what was going on in the 60's and 70s there is now illegal. It may even have been then, but it happened anyway. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Edwards! on Mon Feb 27 18:54:40 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by MainR3664 on Mon Feb 27 07:51:36 2012. Yes..Family is very important..if they take the "common dysfunction",and turn it into a positive "common function".. More or less..back to the issue at hand..the MTA's wanton abandonment of rail lines in the so called ghettos where no other viable transit options existed only served to isolate the nabs even more than they were..politically speaking..the attempt to keep the "element" where it was..thus tearing the heart a soul right out of it..and it goes far deeper than that.. It was a slow extermination..from economic depression..to denial of basic services..to drugs robing families of their heads of household..to Child Protective Services making it harder to BE PARENTS..to Welfare robbing people of their right to be sustaining[YES I SAID IT!].. It seemed like EVERYTHING..and EVERYBODY was out to "get us" in one way or another.. Today's young people cannot see..or refuse to truly understand how difficult life was before the age of X BOX or PlayStation or Atari 2600..cell phones..walkmans.. imagine,if you will,for just a bit..the BOT's second system routes.. North Brooklyn would have received a rather large chunk of those routes..replacing the Broadway El[at least from Marcy to Myrtle]..Myrtle Ave El[All of it with the Crosstown and its branches] with new routes under Myrtle..Bushwick..Stuyvesant..Broadway..Utica..Fresh Pond rd..Lafayette..and many more! did the depression really stop those routes from being built..? There were plans as far as the 50's for the IND line under East Bway to cross the East River to Driggs avenue..then on to South 4th.. The reason was economics..and of course the other reasons that were layed out.. One cannot focus on what was..BUT..looking at the large holes in the transportation structure as it stands today..one can only wonder Why there hasn't been ANY SUGGESTION by the MTA calling for another look at NEW RAIL POSSIBILITIES through the densest neighborhoods of Brooklyn Queens Bronx and Staten Island lacking services..yet..BILLIONS of TAX PAYER DOLLARS are being POURED WASTEFULLY INTO the SAS,ESA 7 extension and a boondoggle situated on Fulton/Broadway called the FULTON TRANSIT CENTER[ALL FOR MANHATTAN and its real estate interest]..and not ONE PENNY spent on VITAL Connections in the so called outer boro's..YET SBS is pushed as a "solution to the mass transit woe's". If the PORT AUTHORITY can build a brand new rail system from the ground up..why can we? Dysfunction.. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Edwards! on Mon Feb 27 19:05:58 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Feb 27 12:16:09 2012. Perhaps..and it was..but..during those times..[and i can say we have "LIVING EXAMPLES of THOSE TIME here that do not shine in a positive light"] that's truly cannot see the reasoning behind it other than it protected THEIR INTEREST..We see the very same actions be those living on E69th st today..The I'm too good to mix with the common Riff Raff..we don't want them walking on OUR street.. The unmitigated gall of these upper crusted snobs is appalling at most..yet this is the norm..and how society is expected to treat them is akin to royalty.. Ridgewood roll is no exception..they were right in the very thick of it..and tried to distance them selves away from "it"..because they "thought they were better".. Chris is of course going to say Im wrong..cause "he lived there"..but that makes him just as guilty as the rest...a denier of the truth. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 27 19:22:54 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Edwards! on Mon Feb 27 19:05:58 2012. I don't disagree with you, but there's no mistaking what was going on in Bushwick in the 60's and 70's or what it became in the 80's, and Ridgewood was scared the same thing was going to happen to them. My grandparents were from Bushwick, we had ties in the neighborhood too, but no one could stop all the fires and what was going on there. And then the drugs. Ridgewood was right in being scared of the same thing happening, it's not like it couldn't happen, it's really the exact same housing stock. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Feb 27 21:56:29 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Edwards! on Mon Feb 27 18:54:40 2012. basic agreement here. the US in general refuses to spend serious money on large parts of the urban map. the money is mostly spent either on gated communities out "there" or on grossly over priced "marquee" projects designed mostly for ribbon cutting as stepping stones to ever higher office. even leaving aside the necessity to drastically reorient land use so we actually have something to breathe, eat and drink, it is very depressing to watch the billions being burned daily on stupid foreign entanglements and DOD toys while we are starved for useful infrastructure. end rant |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Jeff Rosen on Tue Feb 28 18:25:09 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by tunnelrat on Sun Feb 26 21:10:42 2012. Steve, believe me, you would have hated the 111, 107, & 109. I think I know you well enough to say that. I went to the 111 after 10 years in the 73. I hated it. Couldn't wait to get back to the ghetto. When I made sgt they gave us a dream sheet where we put down our preferances and I put all Bklyn North pcts. That's how I ended up in the 81. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Tue Feb 28 19:03:26 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Jeff Rosen on Tue Feb 28 18:25:09 2012. your`re probably right.in the early `80`s about 50 guys from the 75 transferred to the 105,they would NOT let them ride with the 105 cops.we had our own ghetto way of doing things that the 105 just couldn`t understand.imagine going on jobs where you had to call central for directions.hahaha. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Wed Feb 29 07:15:06 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by tunnelrat on Mon Feb 27 15:45:27 2012. I'm sure you'd post them :) |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Wed Feb 29 07:21:06 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Edwards! on Mon Feb 27 18:54:40 2012. I have to agree with 90% of what you posted. No doubt that today's kids have NO CLUE about growing up without electronics. I also agree that true rail service is needed in Central Brooklyn and Staten Island (my home). I also have a hard time justifying to myself the Fulton Transit Center- and the private businsses that were displaced.However, I think the SAS is a worthwhile project, although it's being built in a probably wasteful way (deep tunneling). |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Wed Feb 29 07:31:47 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 27 12:09:21 2012. Thanks for posting the maps and history- very informative. I've been to Ridgewood and Bushwick for work several times...usually just steps away from the border, so I've explored it a bit. How the railroads and later the subway affected things is also very interesting.I guess in line with things having a Brooklyn origin would be the Q58 bus, which until 1988 was the B58, although I don't believe it ever entered Brooklyn in revenue service (it certainly doesn't now, although it comes within inches of doing so) - it runs on the north side of Wyckoff Ave). But since it starts out from Wyckoff Terminal, I'm guessing the predecessor trolley service was provided by the B&QT, and the bus route was orginally named after its Brooklyn corporate orgins.. Certainly, running the border along streets made more sense than an aribritrary diagonal line, which ran through houses. Actually, I've heard that there are places where the USA-Canada border runs through houses!!! |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 10:20:19 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by SLRT on Fri Feb 24 14:54:21 2012. It sounds to me like a misinterpretation of the 1968 proposal to relocate the outer end of the L onto the Bay Ridge Line. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Feb 29 11:06:20 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Wed Feb 29 10:20:19 2012. Ah yes, good thinking! That's exactly what it probably was. That was a real plan to abandon the end of the Canarsie line, but it was so it could be rerouted onto the Bay Ridge. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by SLRT on Thu Mar 1 07:17:51 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Feb 29 11:06:20 2012. There were also plans (or maybe just scare tactics) at the time to eliminate a lot of overnight service. That might also have been a factor. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Fri Mar 2 14:10:08 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by SLRT on Thu Mar 1 07:17:51 2012. And replace it with bus service. Imagine going from East NY to 14th/8th on a bus! |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Dan Lawrence on Wed Mar 7 16:32:15 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by MainR3664 on Wed Feb 29 07:21:06 2012. Agreed. It's taken too many years of wasted money (70 years or so) and none of us who post here will never get to ride on it. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Dan Lawrence on Wed Mar 7 16:38:58 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Dupont Circle Station on Sun Feb 26 12:53:05 2012. O. Roy Chalk didn't want to get rid of the streetcars (Remember the Silver Sightseer, he wanted to convert 100 more PCC cars) but Congress was swayed by the auto/bus outfits so the last two lines died on January 28, 1962. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Edwards! on Wed Mar 7 21:13:58 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Feb 27 21:56:29 2012. true indeed...it IS a sad thing to watch..which begs the question..After the "projects" the MTA has on the table NOW are completed[one can wish,right?]..will there be ANY funding available for FUTURE project that will have a greater impact overall? SAS will be totally finished in our lifetime,MAYBE. BUT are we looking at the end of any real subway expansion in NYC AFTER THAT? |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Edwards! on Wed Mar 7 21:20:03 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by MainR3664 on Wed Feb 29 07:21:06 2012. BELIEVE me..the SAS is a project that I WANT to see finished..but NOT as proposed..they are seriously downgrading its potential as a MAJOR TRUNK ROUTE serving 4 out of five boro's on its own. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Edwards! on Wed Mar 7 21:22:45 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Dan Lawrence on Wed Mar 7 16:32:15 2012. not so..some of us WILL use the opening segment I suppose.. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Mar 7 22:01:04 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by MainR3664 on Wed Feb 29 07:21:06 2012. No doubt that 90% of today's old fogies have NO CLUE about growing up without electricity or indoor plumbing.Electronics improve life. PERIOD. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Edwards! on Wed Mar 7 22:09:00 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Mar 7 22:01:04 2012. As usual..you have a unique "shill" of jackassery...not seeing the point we were reaching..yet chiming in without a clue.while they may have improved life..they also turned people into walking zombies.PERIOD. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Edwards! on Wed Mar 7 22:10:02 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Mar 7 22:01:04 2012. As usual..you have a unique "shill" of jackassery...not seeing the point we were reaching..yet chiming in without a clue.while they may have improved life..they also turned people into walking zombies.PERIOD...And created dickheads like you. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Mar 7 22:13:06 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Edwards! on Wed Mar 7 22:09:00 2012. Luddites are worthless fools. PERIOD.And technology had nothing whatsoever to do with this thread. Technology didn't destroy those neighborhoods nor did it restore them. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Mar 7 22:14:08 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Edwards! on Wed Mar 7 22:10:02 2012. LOL. It took you an extra minute to come up with that crowning achievement. |
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Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated? |
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Posted by Edwards! on Wed Mar 7 22:48:05 2012, in response to Re: NY Post: L train almost eliminated?, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Mar 7 22:14:08 2012. my "crowning achievement"..Of course..you are..after all,an after thought..barely worth the time it took. Never the less..it does NOT take away the foolishness you interjected into the topic at hand. Your doing an excellent job of being our replacement jackass. keep up the great work. |
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