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(1142854)

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merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Dutchrailnut on Sat Mar 3 20:59:43 2012

Latest Lhota Idea is to merge LIRR and MNCR and NYCTA and Bridge and tunnels and etc all into one disorganized MTA ala NJT or SEPTA !!

(1142855)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by BigBusDriver on Sat Mar 3 21:03:34 2012, in response to merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Dutchrailnut on Sat Mar 3 20:59:43 2012.

So I can drive the bus and then, after lunch, drive a train, too?!?!? SIGN ME UP!!!


STILL
LOL@MTA BUFFOONERY

(1142857)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Mar 3 21:14:41 2012, in response to merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Dutchrailnut on Sat Mar 3 20:59:43 2012.

Now boarding on track 3, Speonk express to Croton North via Brooklyn Battery tunnel and 6th Avenue. Yeah, this'll fly. :)

(1142859)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Andrew Saucci on Sat Mar 3 21:20:09 2012, in response to merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Dutchrailnut on Sat Mar 3 20:59:43 2012.

If he puts enough ideas out there eventually one will take and the rest will be forgotten.

(1142862)

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Re: merging LIRR and MN and ... and ..

Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 3 21:50:43 2012, in response to merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Dutchrailnut on Sat Mar 3 20:59:43 2012.

Again? (at least with LIRR and MN)

OK; this fellow cannot be believed.

(1142863)

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Re: merging LIRR and MN and ... and ..

Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Mar 3 22:09:22 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MN and ... and .., posted by Olog-hai on Sat Mar 3 21:50:43 2012.

Whaddya expect? One of Ghouliani's geniuses ...

(1142886)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Sat Mar 3 23:54:29 2012, in response to merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Dutchrailnut on Sat Mar 3 20:59:43 2012.

merge LIRR and MNCR and NYCTA

NYCTA wages and 4-car OPTO for LIRR and MNRR too?

(1142889)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by italianstallion on Sun Mar 4 00:15:03 2012, in response to merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Dutchrailnut on Sat Mar 3 20:59:43 2012.

What would be the point?

(1142892)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 4 00:29:40 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by BigBusDriver on Sat Mar 3 21:03:34 2012.

maybe a single set of desk jockeys could handle paychecks? Most of which should be computer generated anyway. similarly a single office should be able to handle purchases. There should be many functions which could be merged/streamlined.

(1142893)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 4 00:30:12 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Sat Mar 3 23:54:29 2012.

and why not?

(1142906)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by BigBusDriver on Sun Mar 4 06:33:32 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by italianstallion on Sun Mar 4 00:15:03 2012.

1 boss instead of 6? In MANY departments?

(1142908)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Railman718 on Sun Mar 4 07:19:13 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by BigBusDriver on Sun Mar 4 06:33:32 2012.

EXAcTLY Brother one effing chief instead of a bunch of em and maybe half who don't have a clue...

(1142917)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Dan Lawrence on Sun Mar 4 10:31:34 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Railman718 on Sun Mar 4 07:19:13 2012.

My suspicion is you get a massive agency that can't properly do anything.

(1142919)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Joe V on Sun Mar 4 10:45:43 2012, in response to merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Dutchrailnut on Sat Mar 3 20:59:43 2012.

He doesn't have the authority to do it, he can verbalize his fantasies all he wants.

(1142920)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Railman718 on Sun Mar 4 10:47:05 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Dan Lawrence on Sun Mar 4 10:31:34 2012.

My suspicion is you get a massive agency that can't properly do anything.

You know,nah forget it...




(1142927)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Mar 4 11:20:11 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Railman718 on Sun Mar 4 07:19:13 2012.

What makes you so sure they keep the one Boss that does have a clue?? presedence says they keep the idiot.

(1142928)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by LRG5784 on Sun Mar 4 11:26:11 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by BigBusDriver on Sat Mar 3 21:03:34 2012.

+1

(1142929)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Queens Surface 295 on Sun Mar 4 11:27:31 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Mar 4 11:20:11 2012.

I guess LIRR will be retrofitted with subway signals and loads of timers.

(1142934)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Railman718 on Sun Mar 4 11:40:24 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Mar 4 11:20:11 2012.

What makes you so sure they keep the one Boss that does have a clue?? presedence says they keep the idiot.

I keep forgetting the motto us hourlies share..

"The Bigger the eff up the bigger the title"...



(1142937)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Fisk ave Jim on Sun Mar 4 12:09:08 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Railman718 on Sun Mar 4 10:47:05 2012.

Some folks have too short a memory. This Idea has been kicked around from time to time (MN-LIRR anyway)& shot down as unfeasable.

Huge mergers amongst moneylosers that retain the same inept managment almost always never work. Anyone remember Penn Central??

(1142938)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Kriston Lewis on Sun Mar 4 12:19:30 2012, in response to merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Dutchrailnut on Sat Mar 3 20:59:43 2012.

merge LIRR and MNCR
Again with this?

(1142940)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Railman718 on Sun Mar 4 12:25:00 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Fisk ave Jim on Sun Mar 4 12:09:08 2012.

Huge mergers amongst moneylosers that retain the same inept managment almost always never work.

Yeah i now kinda gotten the gist of the idea..

Its not a good one...

(1142941)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Mar 4 12:26:22 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Kriston Lewis on Sun Mar 4 12:19:30 2012.

Not just LIRR or MNCR but merge all of MTA companies in one inept super agency as per Mr Lhota's mission statement.
only thing I hope for is retirement pass that covers all, including bridge and tunnels ;-)


(1142950)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 4 13:29:59 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Fisk ave Jim on Sun Mar 4 12:09:08 2012.

"moneylosers that retain the same inept management almost always never work. " w/or w/out mergers. As I posted earlier, there should be many aspects which could be merged/streamlined. Doing the accounting to make RR Retirement, health care etc, deductions payments is not mode specific. Same for uniform/safety equipment procurement.
On a more abstract note, the level of "the bosses are all morons and scoundrels" rhetoric is obsolete, and counterproductive.

(1142953)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by (4) Lexington Av Exp on Sun Mar 4 14:23:28 2012, in response to merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Dutchrailnut on Sat Mar 3 20:59:43 2012.

The only agencies that MTA could merge could be:

-NYCT RTO/SIRTOA
-NYCT DOB/MABSTOA/MTA Bus (this has kinda already happened)
-LIRR/MNCR
-MTA Police/TBTA Police
-Capital Program (kept as is)

Most of this was basically proposed like 10 years ago, but stalled in Albany.

(1142954)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Mar 4 14:24:11 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by (4) Lexington Av Exp on Sun Mar 4 14:23:28 2012.

Nothing ever gets better by making bureaucracies bigger and more bloated.

(1142957)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by (4) Lexington Av Exp on Sun Mar 4 14:39:03 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Olog-hai on Sun Mar 4 14:24:11 2012.

Save money in one place, lose it out the other...

And that's just for starters...

(1142973)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Mar 4 15:53:23 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Fisk ave Jim on Sun Mar 4 12:09:08 2012.

And you just KNOW, just like back in the Wholly Ronan Empire, it'll be the LIRR that ends up running everything. :(

(1142976)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 4 16:11:24 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Mar 4 15:53:23 2012.

Red (incompetent!) team uber alles.

(1142995)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Joe V on Sun Mar 4 17:29:16 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Fisk ave Jim on Sun Mar 4 12:09:08 2012.

A lot of functions like payroll, police, some equipment orders, probably large spare part orders are combined as it is.

(1142996)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Joe V on Sun Mar 4 17:31:51 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by (4) Lexington Av Exp on Sun Mar 4 14:23:28 2012.

Each RR has its own allies in the Legislature.
Won't happen, especially if the LI delegation see this as a scenario (which it probably is) to take ER tunnel and NYPS slots and give to MN.

(1142997)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Mar 4 17:34:12 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 4 16:11:24 2012.

I was fortunate in my time - the "MTA" had taken over the subway system a couple of years prior but the wigs were so busy with LIRR that we never saw them down there. And when a wiglet DID show up, there were plenty of diversions available to keep them from planting the flag. :)

(1143003)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 4 17:50:58 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Joe V on Sun Mar 4 17:31:51 2012.

what bunch of parochial crap. If there are desk jockeys duplicating each other in the various entities they should be consolidated. As to "defending" LIRR's turf, IINM the MDBF make clear their maintenance forces leave something to be desired. Can anyone show the Dxx30s are as reliable as the GE's over at MN?

(1143010)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Joe V on Sun Mar 4 18:10:20 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 4 17:50:58 2012.

< Can anyone show the Dxx30s are as reliable as the GE's over at MN? >

I can't, but others here said here that choosing between the 2 locos is like picking your Favorite Menendez twin brother - they both suck.

Some of the MN Gennies ones have been back to Erie for heavy overhauls or rebuilding.
Funny I don't remember the FL9's being shunted off to La Grange when they got to be 10 y.o.

LIRR's MDBF on the M-7 fleet is now 431K miles, which is about the same or slightly better than MN's.

LIRR's disdain of the M-3's is obvious. They are spoiled brats. When the MP54's got to be 25, they were just broken in. Some, both rebuilt (in 1956) and non-rebuilds ran from 1908/13 to 1969/70.

(1143011)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Fisk ave Jim on Sun Mar 4 18:11:13 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 4 13:29:59 2012.

"the bosses are all morons and scoundrels" rhetoric is obsolete, and counterproductive"

Never said or meant to imply that. There is no such thing as "all of those are these" when it comes to MTA or for that matter any managment. Having said that, from my observation, its the ones that have proven their incompentence that got their appointments thru politics or a favor returned that stand out rather than ones who get the office due to their merit.

In my 38 yrs of employment in the railroad industry, I've seen good quailty folks get promoted. Men & women that I was happy to work for & go the extra mile if asked. But after a while as they excelled and were liked, they got burnt out or just had to move on a/c they get sick of the bullshit. Seems from my expierience, the more you were liked, you were thought of as losing your "effectiveness".

And theres the empty suit ass kissers that could'nt run a set of Lionel trains around a christmas tree that stick around, make enemys & eventually get kicked upstairs.

Those are the "morons & scoundrels". If you stick around long enough, you'll see what I saw.

(1143018)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Mar 4 18:34:09 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Joe V on Sun Mar 4 18:10:20 2012.

The FL-9's were rebuild several times first inhouse, second at contractors like Chrome crankshaft, Morrison Knudson, Easter railcar, GE.

(1143019)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Mar 4 18:35:18 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Fisk ave Jim on Sun Mar 4 18:11:13 2012.

I agree with poster.

(1143028)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Mar 4 18:43:43 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Mar 4 18:34:09 2012.

"Chrome crankshaft" ... I like that one. I'd be giggling as I wrote the acceptance papers. :)

(1143035)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Mar 4 18:59:53 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Mar 4 18:43:43 2012.

their still in business, but not as locomotive rebuilders. the engines in the original CDOT FL-9's sucked.
http://chromecrankshaft.com/

(1143041)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 4 19:06:35 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Joe V on Sun Mar 4 18:10:20 2012.

FL 9s were rebuilt several times AFTER brutal non maintenance by bankrupt NH.

(1143046)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Mar 4 19:25:12 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Mar 4 18:59:53 2012.

I've heard SO many war stories over the years about those POS' ... especially in winter and in summer, not to mention your ears. But I absolutely LOVE that brand name. :)

(1143050)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Mar 4 19:36:15 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 4 19:06:35 2012.

not NH but no maintenance by Penn Central or Conrail.

(1143056)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 4 19:47:59 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Dutchrailnut on Sun Mar 4 19:36:15 2012.

excuse me, but I rode NH before it was forced into PC. Believe it or not PC actually improved passenger service. They put a few coaches through the shops, and ran the GG1s through sidelining the vacuum cleaners.

(1143061)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Fisk ave Jim on Sun Mar 4 20:03:45 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Joe V on Sun Mar 4 17:29:16 2012.

That much is true. In an administrative level, clerical & procurement functions can be unified. But in the nuts & bolts day to day operations on the LIRR & MN, complete unification as one true entity is a long Way off.
They are two seperate railroads, with two seperate plants, operating rules, equiptment, attitudes, (you'd be suprised how much Pennsy attitude is maintained over there after all these years), and lest we forget, union rules which include pay scales, bennys & the like.
You'll see the IRT running together with the BMT/IND faster than you'll see the LIRR/MN having the same payroll stock.

(1143063)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 4 20:11:30 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Fisk ave Jim on Sun Mar 4 20:03:45 2012.

While you may well be correct, this is exemplary of obsolete culture in both instances. Long past time to smarten up. After all, various previously independent Class 1s have been absorbed. Much as I love the B&O, I agree w/CSX' program of moving to a single signal system so engineers don't have to learn multiple displays on a single route. I firmly believe the over/under third rail silliness has to be cleaned up.

(1143067)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Joe V on Sun Mar 4 20:25:10 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 4 20:11:30 2012.

Yet they are getting more different all the time. The cab signalling & speed control on the 2 RR's are very different. You can't even run an Amtrak diesel on the LIRR without some trouble: there are things like pulse code differences, one being 270 the other 410 (or something like that).

The 2 RR's are only connected via the Amtrak-only Hell Gate and West Side lines.

(1143069)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Joe V on Sun Mar 4 20:34:52 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Fisk ave Jim on Sun Mar 4 20:03:45 2012.

I am not trying to be a smartass, but what is meant by "Pennsy attitude " ?

(1143081)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 4 20:53:19 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Joe V on Sun Mar 4 20:34:52 2012.

we are the Standard RR Of The World some times expressed as we'll bring you that empty when we feel like it and you'll be grateful.

(1143083)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 4 20:56:34 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by Joe V on Sun Mar 4 20:25:10 2012.

Well, I think that is wasteful and stupid. To me the fleets should be completely interoperable since unlike IRT v BMT/IND there is AFAIK no clearance/platform discrepancy.

(1143094)

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Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and ..

Posted by randyo on Sun Mar 4 21:21:11 2012, in response to Re: merging LIRR and MNCR and ... and .., posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Mar 4 15:53:23 2012.

Not necessarily. Don't forget back in Ronan's day the MNCR was the new boy on the block. N/N may well end up being the gorilla on the block now if not the NYCTA.

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