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| Re: VIDEO: SPECIAL - Scenes from the Abandoned Upper Level of Myrtle Avenue Station (1393914) | |||
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Re: VIDEO: SPECIAL - Scenes from the Abandoned Upper Level of Myrtle Avenue Station |
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Posted by JOE @ NYCMTS - NYCTMG on Fri Apr 29 01:43:39 2016, in response to Re: VIDEO: SPECIAL - Scenes from the Abandoned Upper Level of Myrtle Avenue Station, posted by murray1575 on Wed Apr 27 22:47:20 2016. Hello Randyo and ALL;The MAIN REASONS WHY the BMT Q type cars as used on the Manhattan portion of the 3rd Avenue EL had to have the Composite trucks installed was -- not so much the extra steel weight from the steel enclosed former end open platforms. Remember, the Manhattan EL Gate Cars when made into MUDC Cars, also had steel enclosed ends -- actually a steel end front with 2 glass windows and two steel outside sliding doors and their mechanisms and motors where the platform gates originally were. The wooden storm doors on both Q's and MUDC's were the original (gate car) storm doors moved forward to the new steel shells. (a) -- The Q-type MOTOR (A and C) cars were created from BU Gate MOTOR 1200 and 1400 cars -- which had an operating cab at EACH END and a TWO MOTOR truck at one end, and a trailer truck at opposite end. As you already know. (b) -- The Q-Type Motor cars were designed to have only ONE OPERATING CAB, at the outer most end of the first and 3rd car of a 3 car A-B-C consist. The opposite end, as well as both ends of the B trailer car, having blind end sheets and no cabs, with a 2-passenger single seat in the enclosed platform on each side of the platform. (c) -- In creating a new cab ON the formerly open end, now fully enclosed platform, all the controls, switches, gauges, etc., in the original "in car body from open platform days" cab were moved forward and mounted below the window on the inside of the new steel cab-front wall. The thick wood framed rear original front bulkhead wall with its original cab glass then removed -- became the rear wall of the cab, and the opening where the window once was, became the space for the electrical switch cabinet. (d) -- To simplify the cab control wiring, the NEW CAB and controls were placed over the MOTOR TRUCK END of the new Q-Car Motor A & C Cars. Thus, a 3 car Q consist had trucks in this order (with the "B" trailer car as indicated in the /// .../// middle : MOTOR - TRAILER /// TRAILER - TRAILER /// TRAILER - MOTOR THAT was the main problem and MAIN REASON WHY the Q Types could NOT have their original BU Motor Trucks remain on them in "Manhattan only" trackage 3rd Ave EL service. Which I will explain further below: As you likely know, Randy, when the IRT EL cars were motorized circa 1900-1902, the underside of the open end platform location where the motor truck was installed beneath, received new steel edge of platform I Beams to reinforce the underside existing platform framing, and truck bolster assemblies. The trail truck platform end of the motor cars retained their original wooden trailer-car style platform "knee" beams -- which had a very slight V contour along the bottom line. ALL TRAILER cars retained their original platform support wooden "knee' beams These beams were plainly seen under both IRT EL Gate Cars and later MUDC Doors Converted cars. NOW - PER WEIGHT RESTRICTION MODIFICATIONS TO STRUCTURES: ============================================================== Some small modifications were done to the tops of the old "TRENTON" Style lattice-braced EL columns that flared outward at the tops where they met the cross girders --- the column tops looked like the letter " Y ". Look at photos of any old Manhattan 3rd Ave EL original columns to see this ! These 1877-8 era EL columns were commonly used mainly under the 9th and 3rd Avenue EL's in Manhattan. To handle the weight of the new Motorized EL cars, the TOPS of the Trenton Column open-flared-top " Y " were joined by a bolted on steel cross plate, to reinforce them from spreading or splitting. ADDITIONALLY, a STRICTLY ENFORCED IRT Rule went into place in 1901 regarding making up of these new electric motored train consists. ALL MOTOR TRUCK ENDS of ALL Motor Cars assigned to, used on, the east side 2nd and 3rd Avenue EL lines FACED NORTH. ALL MOTOR TRUCK ENDS of Motor cars used on the west side 6th and 9th Avenue EL lines FACED SOUTH. This arrangement was kept and maintained via the single track connection north of the South Ferry Junction Terminal Station....where west side trains could be re-assigned to east side lines, and vice versa. This arrangement was STRICTLY ENFORCED to prevent the coupling together of any two MOTOR CARS with the "2 TRACTION MOTOR" MOTOR TRUCKS facing directly across from each other --the 4 closely coupled traction motors creating too much concentrated weight on the TRENTON EL Columns....especially when their cars were loaded with passengers. BACK TO THE Q TYPES: =============================== As BMT-rebuilt in 1938-39, as I described in much detail further above, the IRT in very late 1949 settled on the plan to run SIX CAR Consists of Q types in express service (NOTE: They had planned on using some QX units to make 7 car consists, but then rejected that plan) The problem with the SIX car Consists (as opposed to 3 Car consists, as commonly used off-peak-hours on Myrtle EL years later) -- was that to couple together any TWO 3-car-Q-Type sets together, BOTH MOTOR TRUCKS would ALWAYS be facing, coupled to, each other....by pure design of their 3-car consist re-construction by the BMT. THAT WEIGHT PROBLEM WITH LOADED PASSENGERS -- was the problem, and why the IRT Composite Trucks, CREATED BY THE IRT, had to be placed under the Q Motor Cars -- each truck have One Traction Motor on the inboard (larger) wheelset. Thus when two Q Type motor A or C car CAB ENDS were coupled together (as had to be per the 3-car set design) -- only the weight of TWO TRACTION MOTORS (one in each truck) were at that coupled end...rather than FOUR TRACTION MOTORS. The fact that the Composite traction Motors had a bit lower horsepower than the BU Traction Motors, was the problem with slowness of the Q-Types with them, as the COMPOSITES consists (6 or 7 car consists) operated ONLY with all MOTOR CARS. Being the COMPOSITES were all Motor cars -- to solve the motor truck coupled to motor truck WEIGHT RESTRICTION problem on the Manhattan EL's -- the Composites, whose original motor & Trail trucks went to a new order of Steel Hi-V Subway cars, were given those IRT shop fabricated Maximum traction trucks, with ONE traction motor installed in each truck. Thus Composite cars could be coupled regardless of which end of the car was coupled to any other composite car. The Q TYPES, like the Composites they replaced in 1950, and whose trucks they operated on, were still deemed too heavy to run on the Manhattan 3rd Ave EL LOCAL TRACKS with passengers - again DUE TO those 1877-8 Trenton EL "flared top" Columns. However, the Composites and Q Cars could run WITH PASSENGERS (and did) on the LOCAL TRACKS of the Bronx 3rd Ave EL from E.149th Street north, where and when LCL-EXP route-assigned. The Composites did express only service on the Manhattan 2nd and 3rd Ave EL's. However, I don't know of any Composites that express-revenue-operated over the Queensboro Bridge to either Astoria or Flushing, although they actually could have. Composites were shopped at E.99th St (3rd Ave) Shops, yards, as well as E. 179th Street (3rd Ave) and E.239th St Shops, Yards. However, the Composites could run on local tracks with passengers on the much heavier built 2nd Avenue EL. I don't know if they ever did, as such, in normal revenue service -- except in 1903-04 when they were BRAND NEW with their factory new ORIGINAL TRUCKS -- when they were tested WITH PASSENGERS daily for 6 or so months on that EL which then had ONLY LOCAL TRACKS ! The Composites were NOT ALLOWED on ANY TRACKS in passenger service on the 9th Avenue EL which had at its portions below W. 60th Street, some of the oldest EL columns and track girders dating from 1875-6. They could not run on the South Ferry Branch of the 2nd-3rd Avenue EL below Chatham Square either, nor could nor did the Q Types. As YOU and some others here know, a number of Composites did the one time and RARE "Transfer" RUNS EMPTY south down the 3rd Ave EL South Ferry Branch, and "around the horn" single bypass track at South Ferry Terminal, and north up the 9th Avenue EL - in June 1940, to get them up to the Polo Grounds W.155th Street Station and yards for starting new service on the POLO GROUNDS Shuttle after the 9th Ave EL shut down below W.158th Street in June 1940. That's basically all of it ! regards - Joe F |
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