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Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Scrabbleship on Wed Dec 5 08:36:58 2007 Post, written by someone who immigrated from Eastern Europe as a child, from a blog I readOlog and SURF, no snarkee please. Reply only if you have something intelligent to say. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by AlM on Wed Dec 5 09:11:00 2007, in response to Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Scrabbleship on Wed Dec 5 08:36:58 2007. Working class non-whites don't have it any easier. Civil rights laws only protect them against the most egregious forms of discrimination. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Mitch45 on Wed Dec 5 11:34:49 2007, in response to Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Scrabbleship on Wed Dec 5 08:36:58 2007. Define "working class." |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Wed Dec 5 11:59:10 2007, in response to Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Scrabbleship on Wed Dec 5 08:36:58 2007. What kind of "intelligent response" are you looking for?You linked to diatribe written by a racially prejudiced moron. Is there some reason you chose to post it other than maybe you feel sorry for the asshole who wrote it? |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Wed Dec 5 15:30:59 2007, in response to Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Scrabbleship on Wed Dec 5 08:36:58 2007. You're not allowed to say such things. That's part of the discrimination. If you have to suffer through this, you share it with co-workers only. Uppity liberal whites don't want to hear any such thing at all.I like how the eastern europeans and legal immigrants pick up on this almost instantly on arrival. And sometimes when I hear all this immigration bullshit, I notice how they're excluded in everything. Over 80% of LEGAL immigrants are opposed to our immigration policies, but if I don't want to give a free pass, I'm a "racist". But he's going to get nowhere with this. I wonder how many "minorities" get this. Seems a lot of comedians have routines based on it. Carlos mencia does a really good one. I hope he's not blonde/haired or blue eyed. Then he's really screwed. People just assume you got wads of cash if that's your look. I notice it's not racists to try to bum money off me and not believe me if I'm broke just based on that. At least Jeb! fixed one of the problems dealing with his during his term. You know what's the worst, but it's not based on race as far as I know? Service industry companies, like Marriot who force you to fill out welfare-to-work credit forms WITH your application. Not post-interview, not during hiring. So it doesn't matter if you're a housekeeper or a supervisor, they know which applicants will subsidize their operation. I bet they got quota's at some properties. I think that includes people released from prison too, but it's been years since I bothered with them. That's it, good luck to him, I don't care if anyone responds as I won't. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 5 15:39:37 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by RonInBayside on Wed Dec 5 11:59:10 2007. You linked to diatribe written by a racially prejudiced moronHe wasn't racially prejudiced. Read it again. You need to lose your job. Your arrogance is stinking up the board again. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 5 15:41:31 2007, in response to Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Scrabbleship on Wed Dec 5 08:36:58 2007. Reply only if you have something intelligent to sayYou ignore me on threads I start in that regard, so frankly, you don't deserve the courtesy—why should you get anything "intelligent" in response to your incessant baloney? By comparison to you, anything we post is on Einstein's level. Notwithstanding, I'm surprised that you posted something that relates to one of the issues I'm quite concerned about. "Civil rights" has to do with parity and equal fair treatment for all, not turning the tables on "whitey". |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 5 15:42:04 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by AlM on Wed Dec 5 09:11:00 2007. Working class non-whites don't have it any easierNobody was trying to imply that they did. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 5 15:42:34 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Mitch45 on Wed Dec 5 11:34:49 2007. Good question. In today's USA, you've got to be part of the "consuming class" or you don't exist. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Scrabbleship on Wed Dec 5 16:13:34 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 5 15:41:31 2007. "Civil rights" has to do with parity and equal fair treatment for all, not turning the tables on "whitey".This is one of the few times I will say this, but... TRUTH!!!! |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Wed Dec 5 16:37:44 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Dec 5 15:42:34 2007. *you've got to be part of the "consuming class" or you don't exist. *I would think just having money would be it. Like I thought it probably always has been. Even if I never buy anything, just having money means potential sales. Man I gotta get rich someday. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Edwards! on Wed Dec 5 16:38:11 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by orange blossom special on Wed Dec 5 15:30:59 2007. Hummmm...These are strange days..and thats more than enough. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by BMTLines on Wed Dec 5 17:58:34 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by RonInBayside on Wed Dec 5 11:59:10 2007. You linked to diatribe written by a racially prejudiced moron.Calling people "racist" is the easy way to stifle debate on the real issue of reverse discrimination. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Easy on Wed Dec 5 18:07:50 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by BMTLines on Wed Dec 5 17:58:34 2007. I wonder if anyone here has been the victim of reverse discrimination? It'd be interesting to hear their story. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Dec 5 18:16:47 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by BMTLines on Wed Dec 5 17:58:34 2007. Calling people "racist" is the easy way to stifle debate on the real issue of reverse discrimination. Calling bias against whites "reverse discrimination" improperly implies that only minorities are victims of "discrimination" to begin with. Anyone can be a victim of "discrimination", be it white, black or whatever. There's no such thing as reverse discrimination. |
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| (267346) | |
Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Wed Dec 5 18:18:39 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by BMTLines on Wed Dec 5 17:58:34 2007. The article was not about "reverse discrimination." I'm not sure the writer even knew what he was whining about. All he knew is that, goddammit he's white and proud of it. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Dec 5 18:20:03 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by AlM on Wed Dec 5 09:11:00 2007. There's no affirmative action program anywhere which is specifically designed to benefit economically disadvantaged whites. While I agree that as a whole, whites are better off than minorities, poor whites have fewer options than poor minorities. White America is not a monolith, it doesn't even consider itself a unified entity. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Dec 5 18:24:19 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by orange blossom special on Wed Dec 5 15:30:59 2007. Don't fear the racist label. I've found that if I remain sincere, I can usually say "racist" things to my black/latino friends and family without anyone getting upset. It's usually those scared, uppity "whites" you mention who scream the loudest. If you need to see any example of how ridiculous and irrelevant the label of "racist" is nowadays, look no further than this NFL official/Ravens "boy" controversy. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Dec 5 18:27:21 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Easy on Wed Dec 5 18:07:50 2007. What is reverse discrimination? If you mean a white person being a victim of discrimination by a minority, then I can say yes. Back in 1989, while in East New York, I was in a car with three other white males which was pulled over by 2 black cops. I was convinced they were doing so because we obviously "didn't belong" and we might be looking to buy drugs. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Easy on Wed Dec 5 18:27:27 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Dec 5 18:20:03 2007. Most of the business programs are for minorities and women so I don't think that you can just say "white". More accurate to say white males. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Dec 5 18:28:19 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Easy on Wed Dec 5 18:27:27 2007. Good point. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Easy on Wed Dec 5 18:31:33 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Dec 5 18:27:21 2007. I was thinking more of employment, school, housing, financial, etc., where someone was at a disadvantage because they were white, but that works too. Was there anymore to it than that? Did they say why they pulled you over? |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Dec 5 18:45:28 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Easy on Wed Dec 5 18:31:33 2007. Of course there are plenty of examples. Here's a list. Many institutions do so in defiance of the law. Few have the balls to fight it. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Wed Dec 5 18:56:09 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Dec 5 18:45:28 2007. You love bullshit whiner sites like this, don't you? |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Dec 5 19:46:24 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by RonInBayside on Wed Dec 5 18:56:09 2007. The only whiner here is you, since you haven't offered a substantive rebuttal. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Easy on Wed Dec 5 21:34:58 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Dec 5 18:45:28 2007. Well I was really looking for the more personal experiences of subchatters, but aside from your experience there don't seem to be any other incidents so far.As far as that site goes for an organization who's stated goal is "to promote fair and equal treatment under the law without regard to race, gender or ethnicity" it seems pretty one-sided. The cases that they cite are all regarding reverse discrimination. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by BMT Guy on Wed Dec 5 21:47:40 2007, in response to Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Scrabbleship on Wed Dec 5 08:36:58 2007. The person is exaggerating. Working class whites can at least OWN a home while lots of working class minorities don't have the collateral to do so. Who do you think is living in all the apartment buildings and tenements in the five boroughs??? It's not working class whites.... |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by BMTLines on Wed Dec 5 21:54:40 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Dec 5 19:46:24 2007. Typical Ron - hurl epithets at a site or poster when he can't offer a factual rebuttal!! |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by BMT Guy on Wed Dec 5 21:59:48 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Dec 5 18:45:28 2007. I'd prefer Minorty-owned firms getting construction contracts instead of companies with 'minority quotas' which is BS....most companies hire some token person to do a lame job like direct traffic instead of hiring them for a meaningful job and HIGHER paying job just like the other workers are getting. Firms that hire for qutoa reasons only are just hiding their own racism. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Easy on Wed Dec 5 22:07:21 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by BMT Guy on Wed Dec 5 21:59:48 2007. Local, state, and federal positions aside, the only companies that I've known to have minority hiring quotas were forced to do so by the federal government after an investigation into their hiring practices.Are there companies that voluntarily have quotas? Isn't that illegal? |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by BMT Guy on Wed Dec 5 22:10:42 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Easy on Wed Dec 5 22:07:21 2007. I didn't mention that it was voluntary....the quotas ARE forced on them by the government, but it's the jobs given to those minorities are B.S. positions as I mentioned. Rarely does a minority member get a descent paying gig from any of these 'quotas'. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Peter Rosa on Wed Dec 5 22:16:44 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Mitch45 on Wed Dec 5 11:34:49 2007. Define "working class."The sort of people who are constantly being shat upon by our society and economy. My LIRR/NYCT blog |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Train Dude on Wed Dec 5 22:29:30 2007, in response to Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Scrabbleship on Wed Dec 5 08:36:58 2007. Surf - intelligent? Surely you jest! |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Mitch45 on Wed Dec 5 22:33:18 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by orange blossom special on Wed Dec 5 16:37:44 2007. You think being rich will cure all your problems? I once saw a documentary about the lives of lottery winners. Many of them end up broke, either because they blew the money or their accountants stole from them. Others who managed to hold on to their money were estranged from their families because they refused to hand out cash, and suffered divorces. Also, charities beat paths to their doors.Everything has a cost, even being wealthy. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Easy on Wed Dec 5 22:38:05 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Mitch45 on Wed Dec 5 22:33:18 2007. If I won the lottery I wouldn't tell anybody! Of course having never in my life bought a lottery ticket my chances are pretty slim. ;) |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Orange Blossom Special on Wed Dec 5 23:09:24 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Easy on Wed Dec 5 22:38:05 2007. Yea, I already thought that part out in my head. Hopefully no one will find me. Our state has a twice yearly thing they started last year. The raffle ticket. 20 bucks, limited tickets. Biggest disappointment in the world. Especially as freaks who buy dozens or so end up winning! You can stack the deck.Famous people blow all their money too. Never had a problem not doing what everyone else does or thinks, never will. Heck, money grows itself. The lowest roll-over at low interest will still pay me a decent middle-class salary without doing anything. I love it. Give me 2million, and I'll show you guys how to do it. Assuming there's any investments left that the sheiks didn't get to already. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Dec 6 05:02:19 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by orange blossom special on Wed Dec 5 16:37:44 2007. Just having money does contribute to the economy because even if that money is in a simple savings account, it's being invested and used by someone else. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Dec 6 05:03:11 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Mitch45 on Wed Dec 5 22:33:18 2007. That's only because those lottery winners cited in this documentary you saw were idiots. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Dec 6 05:04:45 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Mitch45 on Wed Dec 5 22:33:18 2007. You think being rich will cure all your problems?The only thing you gotta do after that is die, right? |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Dec 6 05:05:26 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by RonInBayside on Wed Dec 5 18:18:39 2007. The article was not about "reverse discrimination."Yes it was. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Fred G on Thu Dec 6 05:05:50 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Dec 6 05:03:11 2007. I agree, the winners they didn't show were too smart to be featured on some show publicizing the fact that they won the lottery.your pal, Fred |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Dec 6 05:09:49 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by BMT Guy on Wed Dec 5 21:47:40 2007. Not all working class whites have collateral. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Dec 6 05:13:55 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Dec 6 05:09:49 2007. True! |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Fred G on Thu Dec 6 05:21:07 2007, in response to Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Scrabbleship on Wed Dec 5 08:36:58 2007. Don't matter what color you are, "working class" and "poor" are the "kick me" stickers in society.your pal, Fred |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Thu Dec 6 07:10:07 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Dec 6 05:03:11 2007. i agree. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Clayton on Thu Dec 6 11:08:49 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by BMT Guy on Wed Dec 5 22:10:42 2007. Well let me ask you a question then Sir BMT Guy...In my time during the summer at a City agency, we needed a shitload more toner for the printers we supported. Part of the purchasing rules implemented said that we HAD to choose a minority owned business to supply our toner (ended up being close to a $20k order) AND had to get three different quotes from three different businesses. What do you think about being FORCED to choose minority owned businesses? Isn't that reverse discrimination? We should be able to choose as we wish, and if a M.O.B. has higher prices than a non-M.O.B. and has proven to be reputable in the past, then I think it should be allowed for us to choose them over the M.O.B.! |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Orange Blossom Special on Thu Dec 6 11:13:33 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Easy on Wed Dec 5 21:34:58 2007. I would ask how you can prove something like that? It's not like people openly tell you anything. I can't even find a pen in a HR department their usually so uptight about just talking to anyone.The only ones who outwardly say anything or have obvious policies are government. Police hiring quotas, and my favorite the Philadelphia school district, which I don't know how they get away with everything they do. I could talk about taking the bus, and experiences of being the only white guy on 'em. But aside from the driver being afraid something might start, is sudden silence and staring, is that discrimination? And you know what's funny about that one? I got on at the train station in the ritzy suburbs and that bus was coming from the most hood part of the city. So I guess if there actually was a problem, the appropriate response would be, "wtf are YOU doing here?". |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Thu Dec 6 11:39:06 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by BMT Guy on Wed Dec 5 21:59:48 2007. I'd prefer Minorty-owned firms getting construction contracts instead of companies with 'minority quotas' which is BS "Set-asides" are the same thing as quotas, and are equally unfair and self-defeating. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Thu Dec 6 11:40:38 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by Easy on Wed Dec 5 22:07:21 2007. Quotas are never labelled as such. "Commitment to diversity" is usually the code for it. Diversity for diversity's sake is stupid and un-American. |
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Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens? |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Thu Dec 6 11:41:56 2007, in response to Re: Working-class Whites: The real second-class citizens?, posted by BMT Guy on Wed Dec 5 22:10:42 2007. Exactly, which is why they are self-defeating. |
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