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| He was in my class (184007) | |
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| (184007) | |
He was in my class |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Thu Jan 11 17:58:48 2007 link |
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Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by South Brooklyn Railway on Thu Jan 11 18:02:54 2007, in response to He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Thu Jan 11 17:58:48 2007. Oh damn, was he a good kid in your class? |
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| (184009) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by Newkirk Plaza David on Thu Jan 11 18:03:56 2007, in response to He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Thu Jan 11 17:58:48 2007. My condolences to your student!It must be difficult for you to take right now. All I can say it is now in God's hands. |
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| (184010) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Thu Jan 11 18:06:05 2007, in response to He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Thu Jan 11 17:58:48 2007. That's horrible. |
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| (184025) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 11 19:22:30 2007, in response to He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Thu Jan 11 17:58:48 2007. That's awful! Was in your class this past semester, or a while ago? |
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| (184026) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Thu Jan 11 19:29:19 2007, in response to He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Thu Jan 11 17:58:48 2007. That's sad and I hate to say it, but ppl these days don't pay enough attention especially talking on their cell phones. I've seen a few close calls w/buses as they are so busy talking they don't even notice the light changed to red. |
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| (184033) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by Fred G on Thu Jan 11 19:54:52 2007, in response to He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Thu Jan 11 17:58:48 2007. I'm sorry. Hope his mom and family is holding up ok.your pal, Fred |
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| (184035) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Thu Jan 11 20:02:35 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 11 19:22:30 2007. The winter module, which started last week. He was in class yesterday. |
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| (184046) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 11 21:03:17 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Thu Jan 11 20:02:35 2007. Wow, that REALLY sucks! Very sad. |
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| (184047) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jan 11 21:04:51 2007, in response to He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Thu Jan 11 17:58:48 2007. Here today, gone tomorrow...just sad. |
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| (184048) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 11 21:07:24 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 11 21:03:17 2007. Wow, I just realized he was killed a little after 8 walking home from school....last night! I don't know when your class is, but even so, you were one of the last people to see him alive... |
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| (184050) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Thu Jan 11 21:10:36 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by Fred G on Thu Jan 11 19:54:52 2007. I'm sorry ,too. Hope you are OK, David. |
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| (184076) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by Mr Mabstoa on Thu Jan 11 23:26:34 2007, in response to He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Thu Jan 11 17:58:48 2007. I wonder if the Saturn was totaled or will it be able to get salvaged? |
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| (184077) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by PATHman on Thu Jan 11 23:39:46 2007, in response to He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Thu Jan 11 17:58:48 2007. I read about it in the paper. My condolences Dave. |
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| (184082) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 11 23:50:29 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by Mr Mabstoa on Thu Jan 11 23:26:34 2007. Who cares? Isn't that the insurance company's problem? |
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| (184089) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by G1Ravage on Fri Jan 12 01:02:08 2007, in response to He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Thu Jan 11 17:58:48 2007. Did he listen to his MP3 player in class, too? |
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| (184094) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 01:30:05 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by G1Ravage on Fri Jan 12 01:02:08 2007. Not that I ever noticed. |
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| (184096) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Fri Jan 12 01:59:36 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 11 23:50:29 2007. Probably because the person that got hit was at fault and not the driver - that's what i think he means. |
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| (184114) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 09:44:53 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by Grand Concourse on Fri Jan 12 01:59:36 2007. That's an unusual suggestion. Drivers aren't required to watch where they're going anymore? |
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| (184116) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Fri Jan 12 11:13:48 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by Grand Concourse on Thu Jan 11 19:29:19 2007. I've seen lots of women on cell phones in SUV's just rolling through the light. But not when the light just changed, when all the other lanes stopped, they're rolling not even looking.At anyrate it's sad, but go to any sunbelt or suburbian school, ask a class how many have lost a friend in traffic, and almost all hands will go up. It's the #1 killer. |
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| (184117) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Fri Jan 12 11:16:30 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 09:44:53 2007. Nope! There's plenty of laws in place dictating whose at fault where it doesn't matter what happens in reality. Turns, driveways, rear ends. |
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| (184118) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 11:20:49 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 09:44:53 2007. Sure they are, but you must realize it's not always easy to just stop in time when someone darts out in front of you. |
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| (184119) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 11:21:24 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 11:20:49 2007. (Not that I know what happened here, that's just a general statement). |
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| (184121) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Fri Jan 12 11:39:13 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 11:21:24 2007. Re-reading it, it doesn't give an detailed accident discription. But in a class I learned if a pedestrian darts out of nowhere, inbetween cars, or not from the curb(even though jaywalking is usually safest), the ped is at fault. I assume this is universal. NY is a no-fault state right?There's a detail missing in this story. How fast was this street? Why's it sound as if the car was going fast? Did the car come out of nowhere speeding around a corner or something? Even if he wasn't paying attention and stepped into traffic, it sounds like there was a lot of force there. Sorry for playing detective, I assume life-long pedestrians will at least give a glance at traffic, and it sounds like there was a lot of airtime at impact from the quotes. And cars like to speed. but it's possible both could've made a mistake too. |
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| (184129) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 12:04:06 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 11:20:49 2007. Of course. But this is a city street, not a freeway. Perhaps the pedestrian shares some of the blame (like you, I wasn't there), but a driver on a city street must always be prepared for the possibility of a pedestrian darting out into the street.A car is a useful transportation device but, as we see here, also a lethal weapon. People using it for the former purpose must be exceptionally careful not to allow it to act in the latter purpose. |
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| (184130) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 12:05:17 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by orange blossom special on Fri Jan 12 11:39:13 2007. The speed limit on NYC streets, with a handful of exceptions, is 30 mph.I can't answer any of your questions about the specifics of the case. I'm curious too. |
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| (184131) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 12:23:19 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 12:05:17 2007. Right, and 30 mph is pretty fast to stop short in time. Even 10 mph is hard to stop when someone darts out in front of you. |
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| (184135) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 12:28:32 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by orange blossom special on Fri Jan 12 11:39:13 2007. It's probabably a combination of both. People's minds do tned to wonder when walking, especially when listening to music on an MP3 player...and driver's minds also wonder when driving...that's human. He may have been going too fast, but he may not of either. Since none of us were there, it's hard to say. I know that while thankfully, I have never been close to hitting a human, I have had some run ins with animals running in front of the car, and it's hard to stop even if you are going 20 miles an hour. You can't blame the driver if the poor kid walked in front of his car. Even if the car was speeding, the kid "should" have looked before walking into the street...so I am going to say it's at least partially the own kid's fault. However, usually both are mutually to blame.Either way, it's an extremely sad story, as a very young guy's life was wiped out. |
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| (184136) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by Future Motorman on Fri Jan 12 12:29:18 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by Grand Concourse on Fri Jan 12 01:59:36 2007. When you drive for a living, especially a bus, where you are pulling in and out of stops, and have to get close to sidewalks, and you see the people carelessly walking in the streets without even looking, not paying attention, or walking dangerously along the curb instead, of on the sidewalk, you kind of turn cold hearted when you hear these things happening. Why? You see this for a living, everyday, every hour, every minute, every second. Pedestrians have come to the notion that they have the right of way at all times, and they love to jaywalk. If I have a green light, and they are on the sidewalk, I start to move, they give me and the other driver the look of , yeah, I dare you to run me over, I am walking here, right now.I do not know the attitude of David's classmate. It is a mother had to lose her son. It is sad society lost someone, who was doing something with himself. But when you drive for a living, and see the risks inattentive pedestrians take, you become kind of cold hearted to the situation. You know it is eventually going to happen. The probability is very high. Alot of motor vehicles on a road + inattentive pedestrians = accident waiting, and going to happen. |
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| (184137) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by Future Motorman on Fri Jan 12 12:30:48 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by Future Motorman on Fri Jan 12 12:29:18 2007. I meant it is sad a mother had to lose her son. |
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| (184138) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 12:31:51 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 12:28:32 2007. Either way, it's an extremely sad story, as a very young guy's life was wiped out....not to mention the driver's life too. For the rest of his life he will have to live with accidentally killing a young guy's life...whether it was his fault or not. That's a terrible havy thing to have to live with. |
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| (184150) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 13:13:40 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 12:23:19 2007. Why are you only looking directly in front of you? |
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| (184151) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 13:32:44 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 12:28:32 2007. How dare you say that "it's at least partially the own kid's fault" when you have no idea what happened!Maybe he was partially at fault, maybe not. I wasn't there. Neither were you. The article doesn't give the full story. But a driver on a city street is operating a potentially lethal weapon and has the absolute responsibility to keep it under control. Sean didn't suddenly pop out of thin air; he stepped off the sidewalk, a sidewalk which the driver should have been scanning for that very possibility. Anybody unwilling or unable to live up to that responsibility should not drive. |
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| (184152) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 13:33:42 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 12:31:51 2007. At least the driver still has a life. Sean doesn't.There's no comparison. At all. |
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| (184161) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Fri Jan 12 14:29:45 2007, in response to He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Thu Jan 11 17:58:48 2007. Sorry to hear that. My condolences to you on the loss of your student. I hope and surmise from what few details are offered that he did not suffer. |
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| (184184) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 15:11:21 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 13:33:42 2007. No, but I am just trying to say it's a tragedy on both sides (not that it's an equal tragedy). There are many train operators that also have a very hard time living with the fact that they killed someone at a grade crossing or in front of their train, even if it was totally out of their control. This guy DOES have to live with this, no matter if it was his fault or not. It's a lot to have to bear.I know a LIRR operator that hit a car on a grade crossing many years ago. He says he still sees the car pull in front of his train when he closes his eyes. |
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| (184186) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 15:17:05 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 13:32:44 2007. I already said I have no idea what happened. But often times, people DO walk into traffic. I never said that's what happened here.Let's see how fast you stop next time you are driving and something or someone walks infront of the car. It's not as simple as saying "You should have stopped". That's NOT an irresponsible driver if you can't stop. There is no evidence that the driver was speeding (he may have, he may not have), just as their's no evidence that the kid was paying full attention either. And how do you know that the driver had full sight of the sidewalk, many things such as vans, etc can block the view. How do you know that Sean didn't "pop out of thin air". He may have, or he may not have, or he could have been standing there, and then suddenly decided to move without realizing the car was coming. You can't draw that conclusion any more that I can draw any conclusions with the information given. I am not taking any position on this (and haven't). Usually in accidents, there are two people to blame (even if it's a 10/90 split instead of a 50/50 split). Without more info, it's hard to say either way. |
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| (184187) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 15:19:06 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 13:13:40 2007. Who said I was? Someone can be standing perfectly still, and then suddenly move as you approach. That may still not give you enough time to stop, even if you are only going 15 mph, or the legal limit. I have no idea what happened, but neither do you. |
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| (184190) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by Easy on Fri Jan 12 15:24:35 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 12:28:32 2007. You make a lot of assumptions. |
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| (184194) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by Easy on Fri Jan 12 15:26:29 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 12:31:51 2007. Another assumption. Some people would not care, especially if they perceived that the accident wasn't their fault. |
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| (184201) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Fri Jan 12 15:37:23 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 13:32:44 2007. The driver stopped at the scene after the accident. NYPD investigated the accident and did not issue a summons to the driver. We can, therefore, conclude that the driver is not criminally liable in this accident. |
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| (184202) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Fri Jan 12 15:38:13 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 12:23:19 2007. I'd have to look, and find where I have it(don't ask why I have these things), but 35mph had the same force as being shot out of a cannon I believe. 25mph an object in the backseat will go through you.And so on and so forth. 15mph was a sledgehammer to the leg like Misery. Still think in regards to the article, the impact seemed harsh for 25-30. |
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| (184203) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Fri Jan 12 15:41:10 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by Easy on Fri Jan 12 15:26:29 2007. Was about to say that. Seems that too many of them have no remorse. Especially the old people who always try to drive off and curse everyone out for holding them up. I'm in a car that hits a bird I'm traumatized. The pyshchology of people in a car are pretty messed up. |
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| (184204) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by BIE on Fri Jan 12 15:42:17 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by RonInBayside on Fri Jan 12 15:37:23 2007. A simple case of an mp3 player destroying the situational awareness of a pedestrian, resulting in the death of that pedestrian. |
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| (184207) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 15:56:03 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 15:11:21 2007. But that's a different scenario. Railroad tracks are controlled environments, specifically because it takes a long time to stop a train (and a train can't swerve out of the way, either). Except at authorized grade crossings, where pedestrians and motorists are permitted to cross the tracks under limited circumstances, only trains belong on tracks. A train operator has no reason to expect that anything other than another train will be on the track in front of him.City streets are uncontrolled environments. Pedestrians are to be expected. Drivers have to watch out for them. |
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| (184209) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 15:59:33 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by RonInBayside on Fri Jan 12 15:37:23 2007. If we assume that the NYPD invariably issues summonses to all drivers who they see violating the law.Which is plainly not the case. It's amazing how much you're willing to read into one sentence in a brief newspaper article. |
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| (184210) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by BIE on Fri Jan 12 16:09:53 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 15:59:33 2007. If an officer investigating an accident had reasonable cause to believe a violation took place, a ticket WOULD be issued. |
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| (184212) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Fri Jan 12 16:22:52 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by BIE on Fri Jan 12 15:42:17 2007. That's one possibility. |
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| (184213) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Fri Jan 12 16:25:55 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 15:59:33 2007. "If we assume that the NYPD invariably issues summonses to all drivers who they see violating the law."The purpose of an accident investigation is to determine its cause and assign responsibility. The investigators were on scene specifically to do that. You have often been childish in discussions here. I've come to learn from certain people that you are that way in person as well. At least you are consistent. :0) |
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| (184214) | |
Re: He was in my class |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Fri Jan 12 16:26:25 2007, in response to Re: He was in my class, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jan 12 15:17:05 2007. Wrong. A driver on a city street should always expect a pedestrian to step into the street and should always be prepared to take corrective action.I don't think Sean had the power to disappear and reappear at will. I don't know if the driver was completely at fault or only partly at fault. But he was at the very least partly at fault, since he was behind the wheel of the car. |
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