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| Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem (1768892) | |
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Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Dave on Wed Sep 16 07:30:04 2020 'If you can't respect this country, get the hell out of it' |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 09:48:47 2020, in response to Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Dave on Wed Sep 16 07:30:04 2020. Good for him |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 10:48:17 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 09:48:47 2020. I don't care for compulsory patriotism. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 10:56:25 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 10:48:17 2020. I know you don’t. And you’re from a different mindset and generation and I wouldn’t expect you to feel the same way he does or anybody else that agrees with Ditka. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 11:26:50 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 10:56:25 2020. That's not the point. It's not so much that they're kneeling or not, but why are people being FORCED as a condition of their employment to participate in patriotic activities? I'd kneel for the anthem just to protest being forced to stand for the anthem, while I'd proudly stand for the anthem if it were optional. Same with the Pledge of Allegiance (I omit "under God").But if you're saying it's generational, are you saying that older generations were more likely to participate in mindless* rituals just to fit in? I agree, but it's an affront to the principles of this country. Countries should earn the love of their citizens and the USA has earned mine. I have to keep making this argument because no one seems to recognize that using the national anthem at football games is itself political, so it's the league, not the players, who are "politicizing" the game. *It's mindless when you do it because you're told and not because you know its meaning and want to do it. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 11:44:46 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 11:26:50 2020. Mindless rituals?Wow |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 11:49:16 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 11:26:50 2020. And as far as being forced as a condition of their employment Id say they are employed in a rarified position of extreme compensation. If they don’t like standing they can find an office job with their degree and have their roster spot filled in from someone on the practice squad. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 12:09:02 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 11:26:50 2020. And as far as being forced as a condition of their employment Id say they are employed in a rarified position of extreme compensation. If they don’t like standing they can find an office job with their degree and have their roster spot filled in from someone on the practice squad. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by AlM on Wed Sep 16 12:17:04 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 10:56:25 2020. I'm from an older generation than S-P and I don't care for compulsory patriotism either. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 12:20:43 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 11:44:46 2020. Did you not read my explanation? It absolutely is mindless when you are doing it because you’re forced. Like when I was a kid and participated in prayer. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Chicagomotorman on Wed Sep 16 12:20:43 2020, in response to Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Dave on Wed Sep 16 07:30:04 2020. G-d bless the greatest coach in Bears history. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 12:23:37 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 12:09:02 2020. Which is stupid because all you’re doing is removing talented employees because of something that’s entirely collateral to what you employ them for. In other words, you have a less competent football team because you would rather have patriotism performers. I don’t need to watch people pretend to be patriots for entertainment. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 12:28:52 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by AlM on Wed Sep 16 12:17:04 2020. It’s not generational at all. Conservatives have been decrying the younger generation (whoever they are) for years, even when the criticism is nonsensical.The mentality is different. I place a premium on thought and action, and disdain ritual. Rituals are fine when they serve a purpose but are at best worthless and at worse harmful if done for their own sake. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 13:00:46 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by AlM on Wed Sep 16 12:17:04 2020. Yeah you’re right about that. And I know you have contemporaries that feel like you too. And you and SP have a certain feeling and background in terms of life experiences that make you feel the way you do. And because it’s America that’s fine. I look at the salute of the flag as a way to honor the supreme sacrifices others have made so you can maintain your thoughts and feelings towards rituals that salute the flag and so called compulsory patriotism. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 13:01:53 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 12:20:43 2020. Yeah I read it and I don’t agree with you. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 13:05:44 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 12:23:37 2020. Talented players replacing talented players happens all season as rosters shuffle. It’s not a major difference. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Sep 16 13:07:37 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 12:20:43 2020. I don't agree. It's not the same as "being forced into prayer".It's respect for the thousands, uncountable, that gave the ultimate sacrifice. We wouldn't be here to have this conversation if not for them. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Sep 16 13:08:37 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 12:23:37 2020. And I don't need to watch people being paid hundreds of millions to play throw a ball around, and have to listen to their political views like they mean anything. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 13:12:14 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 13:00:46 2020. You're not getting it. Saluting the flag isn't some kind of magic trick. You think of it as a way of honoring people who've served this country, and so do I. But for someone who doesn't see it that way, what is gained from them going through the motions? |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 13:38:34 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Sep 16 13:07:37 2020. That makes it as much of a ritual as prayer. If the person DOESN’T respect people’s sacrifice, then making them pretend to do so isn’t going to do anything. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 13:39:18 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 13:12:14 2020. No I get it just fine. Having someone stand for 2 minutes a week out of 168 hours is not asking too much. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 13:40:15 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Sep 16 13:08:37 2020. If you don’t like football then don’t watch it. And as for their politics, it’s the NFL that brought politics to the field. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 13:41:57 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 13:05:44 2020. Yeah, but if you don’t like players expressing their politics on the field, why do you like it when the management expresses politics through their roster decisions? |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Sep 16 14:00:11 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 13:38:34 2020. Prayer isn't tangible. What people did for our freedoms is. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 14:01:48 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 13:41:57 2020. Management signs the checks and waivers. They dont need to entertain any players that want to march to the best of their own drum. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Sep 16 14:01:52 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 13:40:15 2020. I won't....and I used to love it. Have absolutely no interest in watching it right now.And my comment still stands. As someone said, players are replaceable. If they don't like standing there, get another job. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 14:06:16 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 13:39:18 2020. But asking them to do that serves no purpose. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 14:07:41 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Sep 16 14:00:11 2020. Huh? It's the ceremony that's analogous to prayer, not "what people did for our freedoms." |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by AlM on Wed Sep 16 14:10:06 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 13:00:46 2020. I am totally fine with saluting the flag, standing for the national anthem, and singing it, just to give some examples. But if for some reason I don't do one of those things, I strongly object to be called unpatriotic. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Sep 16 14:10:44 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 14:07:41 2020. There's no proving religion, God and prayer. It's historical fact that people died for us to be here. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Sep 16 14:11:34 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by AlM on Wed Sep 16 14:10:06 2020. That's wonderful, and you don't need your millions of dollars to do your job either. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by AlM on Wed Sep 16 14:17:33 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Sep 16 14:11:34 2020. If my job contract called for me to do those things, I'd do them. If it didn't, it would be up to me. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 14:56:25 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 14:06:16 2020. That’s is your opinion. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 14:57:20 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by AlM on Wed Sep 16 14:10:06 2020. Hell, it's not even that. I'm not even objecting to being called unpatriotic for not doing those things. What I am objecting to is placing rituals over thoughts and meaningful actions. A person is not honoring anyone by saluting the flag while inside his mind he resents doing so. People seem to believe that the very ritual itself is what is necessary, and not the thoughts and mentality associated with it. Rituals are only meaningful when the participants are willing. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 15:01:45 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Sep 16 14:11:34 2020. I don't want the patriotic rituals that I personally find meaningful to be done by claques. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 15:05:15 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by AlM on Wed Sep 16 14:10:06 2020. Not standing is akin to aggression if not outright. The optics of not standing or kneeling is a direct eff you to many people.Whether or not that is fair is up for debate obviously. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 15:07:04 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 15:05:15 2020. I agree with you completely. That's why I don't think the anthem should be part of the pre-game ceremony. Let them stand or kneel on their own time. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Sep 16 15:20:08 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 15:07:04 2020. It used to be a way to unite all of us. No matter who we were, there we all were gathered for this game. Forget all our differences for a moment, and play ball, and enjoy.The Democrats even FUCKED that up. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 15:33:37 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Sep 16 15:20:08 2020. No, they didn't. It used to be that the players did not come onto the field until after the anthem was played. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Sep 16 15:43:13 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 15:33:37 2020. Sure, but then stay inside, like some of the teams mercifully did.AGAIN, it was something that UNITED us. It didn't matter who you were. Now the left has made it something to divide us. They LOVE dividing us. In any event... https://www.axios.com/the-history-of-singing-the-national-anthem-before-nfl-games-1513305769-97a4edd0-6748-432d-b1cc-2b377848e712.html |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Sep 16 16:03:51 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Sep 16 15:20:08 2020. The NBA is much worse off. Not that they don't deserve it . . . |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by BILLBKLYN on Wed Sep 16 16:04:07 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 13:12:14 2020. WWABD? |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Wed Sep 16 20:26:07 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Sep 16 16:03:51 2020. Well, I haven't watched nba in years.They even had racist phrases grafittied right on the floor. Baseball was out this year too....way to political.... Hockey is the only sport I am watching right now. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 20:33:41 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by gp38/r42 chris on Wed Sep 16 20:26:07 2020. I gave up on watching live 2020 baseball one Sunday night after watching highlights from around the league and saw something in an American League park that made me immediately reach for the remote and turn it off.I did watch the Yankees in Buffalo last week just for the novelty of a big league game in Buffalo. I couldn’t care less about the results of the leagues. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 20:37:19 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 20:33:41 2020. What was it that you saw? Political or related to gameplay? |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Wed Sep 16 20:40:59 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Sep 16 20:37:19 2020. PoliticalBut I’m glad you asked because the gameplay stinks as well. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Dyre Dan on Thu Sep 17 09:39:37 2020, in response to Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Dave on Wed Sep 16 07:30:04 2020. I think our founders would be appalled by that attitude. But people keep proclaiming it anyway. We didn't even have a National Anthem until 1931. |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Catfish 44 on Thu Sep 17 10:04:09 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Dyre Dan on Thu Sep 17 09:39:37 2020. Interesting |
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Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Sep 17 10:28:12 2020, in response to Re: Mike Ditka again addresses players protesting national anthem, posted by Dyre Dan on Thu Sep 17 09:39:37 2020. National anthems were only invented in the 19th century anyway, along with nationalism. Nationalism is a romantic philosophy, while the USA was founded on enlightenment principles. |
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