|
|
| 75 Years Ago Today (1758052) | |
 |
|
| Home > OTChat | |
[ Post a New Response | Return to the Index ]
|
|
Page 1 of 2 |
|
|
| (1758052) | |
75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 11:32:34 2020 The US Army dropped Little Boy, the world's first operational atomic bomb (the Trinity prototype had been successfully detonated in the New Mexico desert three weeks before) on the Japanese city of Hiroshima, leveling the metropolis and killing tens of thousands. Three days later, Fat Man destroyed Nagasaki, leading to the unconditional surrender of Japan the following week, ending World War II. Debate over the use of these then-new weapons persists to this day, and the United States remains the only country ever to use nuclear weapons in anger. |
|
|
| (1758066) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Train Dude on Thu Aug 6 11:54:56 2020, in response to 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 11:32:34 2020. As my father served in the 7th Air Force in the pacific, I applaud the decision. |
|
|
| (1758071) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Dave on Thu Aug 6 12:06:30 2020, in response to 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 11:32:34 2020. Here's an interesting factoid. The yield of Little Boy was 13 - 18 kilotons. The yield of the GBU-43/MOAB, which is non-nuclear, is 11 KT. That's what we dropped on ISIS targets in Afghanistan in 2017. |
|
|
| (1758074) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Thu Aug 6 12:10:05 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Dave on Thu Aug 6 12:06:30 2020. The yield of the GBU-43/MOAB, which is non-nuclear, is 11 KT.You are exaggerating by a factor of 1,000. You need to remove the "K." |
|
|
| (1758077) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 12:17:03 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Dave on Thu Aug 6 12:06:30 2020. The GBU-43 has a yield of only 11 tons, not kilotons. |
|
|
| (1758084) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Orange Blossom Special on Thu Aug 6 12:37:42 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Train Dude on Thu Aug 6 11:54:56 2020. JayzeeBMT thinks we ended the war "in anger". Should've kept it going for 10 more years and killed millions more so that the Soviets can turn Japan into a client state. A couple more bombings of Tokyo would make him giddy with joy we can infer. |
|
|
| (1758085) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Aug 6 12:41:46 2020, in response to 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 11:32:34 2020. the United States remains the only country ever to use nuclear weapons in angerIn combat. You really are a sicko. Are you waiting for Iran to actually use them in hate and anger? Those bombs made Hirohito realize he was not a god, and he was prompted to publicly declare that. Otherwise, he would have forced the USA to a Pyrrhic victory, since he would have ordered his citizens to fight to the death with the authority of a "god". |
|
|
| (1758086) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 12:42:26 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Orange Blossom Special on Thu Aug 6 12:37:42 2020. "In anger" refers to dropping the bombs during a state of war. Of course, you are so hell-bent on smearing me in any way possible, that you ignored this fact. |
|
|
| (1758087) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 12:42:58 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Olog-hai on Thu Aug 6 12:41:46 2020. In anger = in combat. Nice try, though. |
|
|
| (1758088) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Thu Aug 6 12:50:32 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 12:42:58 2020. In anger = in combat.An awkward definition, to say the least. |
|
|
| (1758089) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 12:53:38 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by AlM on Thu Aug 6 12:50:32 2020. But accurate. |
|
|
| (1758094) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Orange Blossom Special on Thu Aug 6 13:24:49 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 12:42:26 2020. Only in your mind. In all of your sentences there.One friendly hint. No one in the world respects someone who finds any way possible to smear their own nation, no matter how many smears may be valid. You become a depersonalized commodity to them. |
|
|
| (1758095) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 13:30:15 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Orange Blossom Special on Thu Aug 6 13:24:49 2020. "Historian Dallek says, "The United States bears the historical burden of having used atomic bombs, used them in anger." And there are so many more nuclear nations today that the concerns about the use of nuclear weapons remains strong. "The nuclear issue won't go away," Dallek says. "It is a threat that hangs over humankind because of the power of those weapons." |
|
|
| (1758096) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Thu Aug 6 13:34:01 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 12:53:38 2020. No. |
|
|
| (1758098) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Catfish 44 on Thu Aug 6 13:44:39 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 12:42:26 2020. You smear yourself. Nobody here has to assist you. |
|
|
| (1758099) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Catfish 44 on Thu Aug 6 13:45:12 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 12:42:58 2020. Probably should have just written in combat then. |
|
|
| (1758100) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Aug 6 13:50:14 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Catfish 44 on Thu Aug 6 13:44:39 2020. Hate to think what that word could imply.Interesting that Trump didn't have a "fight the smears" website, but Obama simply had to have one. |
|
|
| (1758101) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Aug 6 13:51:18 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Catfish 44 on Thu Aug 6 13:44:39 2020. Perhaps, but this semantic argument is ridiculous and is an attempt at smearing JZ. Maybe he could have used a better word, but who cares? Was the US not justifiably angry at Japan?Olog-hai is someone who believes that everything is a Revelation-style fight between “good” and “evil” and so everyone has to make sure that everyone always uses the words that show that the USA is good. |
|
|
| (1758102) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Aug 6 13:51:47 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Catfish 44 on Thu Aug 6 13:45:12 2020. Just to make note: Japan refused to surrender after Little Boy. They were that hardcore about forcing the USA to a Pyrrhic victory (or even "surrender"), until Fat Man broke their will to fight and they saw that the USA was serious. |
|
|
| (1758103) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 14:03:01 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Aug 6 13:51:18 2020. I am hardly the only person who has used the words "in anger" to describe military actions taken during a time of war. |
|
|
| (1758104) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 14:07:40 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by AlM on Thu Aug 6 13:34:01 2020. Actually, yes"the first nuclear weapon used in anger" "On this day the 6th August 1945 the world’s first Atomic Bomb used in anger was dropped on the Japanese city of Hiroshima by the Enola Gay." |
|
|
| (1758105) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Aug 6 14:08:04 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 14:03:01 2020. I’m not saying you were and I’m not saying you’re wrong. |
|
|
| (1758106) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 14:11:38 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Aug 6 14:08:04 2020. OK. Some people here are just so desperate to smear me on just about anything, that they won't bother to see about usage of certain terms. |
|
|
| (1758107) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Thu Aug 6 14:12:48 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 14:11:38 2020. I disagreed with you but I did not in any way consider it a smear. |
|
|
| (1758110) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Dave on Thu Aug 6 14:22:13 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by AlM on Thu Aug 6 12:10:05 2020. D'Oh! Thanks for the correction. |
|
|
| (1758120) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by FYBklyn1959 on Thu Aug 6 14:44:55 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Olog-hai on Thu Aug 6 13:51:47 2020. Wasn't it also the case that Truman implied that there were more bombs? (which of course was a lie, but apparently Japanese intelligence sucked)The loss of life was unfortunate, but it ultimately saved move lives (on both sides). Pre-WW II, the Japanese were terrorizing much of East Asia, and it took the 2 nukes to make them see the error of their ways. |
|
|
| (1758128) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Train Dude on Thu Aug 6 14:52:55 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 13:30:15 2020. If this was your motive for mentioning the anniversary, then I'm afraid that I'm joining the chorus. |
|
|
| (1758129) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Train Dude on Thu Aug 6 14:54:00 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 14:07:40 2020. in anger means during war. Nothing more. |
|
|
| (1758130) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Aug 6 14:54:20 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by FYBklyn1959 on Thu Aug 6 14:44:55 2020. Japan refused to surrender after Little Boy. It took the second bomb to snap them out of their extremism. |
|
|
| (1758136) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Dyre Dan on Thu Aug 6 14:59:00 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Orange Blossom Special on Thu Aug 6 13:24:49 2020. Who is "them"? A reasonable man evaluates the actions of all countries, including his own, by the same standards. No one respects a jingoistic blowhard who thinks everything his country does is wonderful, just because his country did or does it. |
|
|
| (1758141) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Train Dude on Thu Aug 6 15:03:47 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Olog-hai on Thu Aug 6 14:54:20 2020. actually, after Nagasaki, the Emperor wanted to continue fighting. He was convinced by the military that they couldn't win |
|
|
| (1758146) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 15:06:55 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by FYBklyn1959 on Thu Aug 6 14:44:55 2020. In realistic hindsight, Japan should have been suing for peace after the Battle of Leyte Gulf. The Japanese Navy was no longer an effective fighting force after Leyte, and from that point forward Japan was only trying to stave off the inevitable.That said, had the two A-bombs not been dropped, it's likely that at least Operation Olympic would have been undertaken, resulting in an even greater death toll than that of the two Bombs. I do not believe Japan, having been invaded on their main islands in November 1945, would have held out until Coronet took place in early 1946. The peace party at the Imperial Palace would have prevailed, as they did in actual history after Hiroshima and Nagasaki were destroyed. |
|
|
| (1758148) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Train Dude on Thu Aug 6 15:08:06 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 14:11:38 2020. Why do you say that? Although, just because you are paranoid doesn't mean that they are not out to get you. |
|
|
| (1758150) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Train Dude on Thu Aug 6 15:09:50 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 15:06:55 2020. oh so you do not believe..... well that should settle the debate right there |
|
|
| (1758164) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Aug 6 15:53:12 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 15:06:55 2020. Japan anticipated Olympic and Coronet and expected to use all of their remaining reserves to fight Olympic, with nothing left for Coronet. Their expectation was not to reverse the tide of the war, and successfully repel the invasion, but it was to make the invasion so costly for the Allies that the Allies would agree to a negotiated peace instead of forcing unconditional surrender. |
|
|
| (1758166) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by mtk52983 on Thu Aug 6 15:57:46 2020, in response to 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 11:32:34 2020. Without either, Japan wanted to make victory as costly for the allies as possible no matter the effects to Japan. The actions of the United States prevented greater loss of life on all sides and also prevented Japan from destroying their economic base to fight for a Pyrrhic victory. |
|
|
| (1758168) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Dave on Thu Aug 6 16:03:33 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Aug 6 15:53:12 2020. IAWTP. I recall reading that the Allies expected to lose up to 1 million troops in an invasion of Japan. |
|
|
| (1758182) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by BILLBKLYN on Thu Aug 6 16:24:32 2020, in response to 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 11:32:34 2020. "In anger"? GOOD!! We blasted the Japs back to the Stone Age!!! |
|
|
| (1758185) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by BILLBKLYN on Thu Aug 6 16:25:42 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Dave on Thu Aug 6 16:03:33 2020. Yep! |
|
|
| (1758187) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 16:30:29 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by BILLBKLYN on Thu Aug 6 16:24:32 2020. Yes, "in anger". Countries that are at war with each other are legally known as "belligerents", and military actions carried out on the battlefield are considered to be "in anger". |
|
|
| (1758190) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Aug 6 16:47:27 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 16:30:29 2020. IAWTP.Or do the complainers not realize that anger can be justified, sufficiently justified anger is not a vice, and that the US's anger was completely justified? |
|
|
| (1758193) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Aug 6 16:55:06 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Dave on Thu Aug 6 16:03:33 2020. Yes. They made so many purple hearts in anticipation of Operation Downfall that no new purple heart medals have been minted since 1945, all of the ones awarded since were minted then, they only refurbish them due to newer ribbon designs. |
|
|
| (1758197) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by https://salaamallah.com/ on Thu Aug 6 17:12:07 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Train Dude on Thu Aug 6 15:03:47 2020. THEY COULD NOT WIN BEFORE THE BOMBS |
|
|
| (1758207) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Aug 6 17:20:01 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Train Dude on Thu Aug 6 15:03:47 2020. What drove him to the point of agreeing to issue the "Ningen Sengen" (where he publicly declared that he was jus a human being and not a god), then? |
|
|
| (1758218) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Thu Aug 6 18:07:04 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Dave on Thu Aug 6 14:22:13 2020. However the Beirut explosion has been estimated at about 3,000 tons. |
|
|
| (1758233) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Aug 6 19:16:47 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by AlM on Thu Aug 6 18:07:04 2020. 3*10-3 megatons. |
|
|
| (1758237) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Jeff Rosen on Thu Aug 6 20:31:39 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Aug 6 16:47:27 2020. I don't know. I definitely took his post negatively because of the words "in anger". Maybe he didn't mean for it to be negative and he just used the wrong word. |
|
|
| (1758241) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 20:39:14 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Jeff Rosen on Thu Aug 6 20:31:39 2020. Again, "in anger" is commonly used to describe a country's military actions on the battlefield during wartime. |
|
|
| (1758250) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Train Dude on Thu Aug 6 21:07:16 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Aug 6 20:39:14 2020. but that was apparently NOT how you meant it. |
|
|
| (1758265) | |
Re: 75 Years Ago Today |
|
|
Posted by Dave on Thu Aug 6 22:12:29 2020, in response to Re: 75 Years Ago Today, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Aug 6 16:55:06 2020. Really? Wow, I had no idea. |
|
|
|
|
Page 1 of 2 |
|