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| Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes (308448) | |
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| (308594) | |
Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sat Nov 28 22:02:43 2015, in response to Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sat Nov 28 21:49:36 2015. Yes, you and everyone should do that. Leaves the roads and streets and avenues emptier for me to have fun driving on. That would rock. It's not hard to avoid getting traffic tickets in NYC. Just follow the laws. |
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| (308595) | |
Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sat Nov 28 22:19:48 2015, in response to Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Terrapin Station on Sat Nov 28 22:02:43 2015. I've never gotten an NYC traffic ticket *knock on wood* but there is a lot of extra stress over it compared to driving in North Bumblefuck.The speed limit being 50 on the highways is a good example - I typically go 4-9 over, and everywhere else you're going with the flow of traffic by doing that. But in NYC, at 9 over you are still the slowest car on the road during the off hours. And the cops will still pull people over even though they are going the speed of traffic! So survival is pure luck - you are either the slow guy who gets rear ended by the aggressive driver who's not paying attention, or the unlucky sod who the cop decided should have a bad day. They need to build that bridge from CT to LI so I never need to enter NYC's borders again. TBH I've spent enough time outside of NYC to realize... living in NYC is just plain not worth it. |
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| (308596) | |
Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by italianstallion on Sat Nov 28 23:19:02 2015, in response to Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sat Nov 28 22:19:48 2015. To each his own. |
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| (308597) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by BusMgr on Sat Nov 28 23:46:03 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by BrooklynBus on Sat Nov 28 14:19:21 2015. Let's put to the side the acts of pedestrians who suddenly dart into traffic, and just consider the rights of ordinarily prudent persons. It is axiomatic that there exists a God-given right, a right that is Constitutionally-protected, for people to walk about. There is no such right to operate motor vehicles (and probably not so for bicycles either). Motor vehicles were imposed onto a pedestrian world, are inherently dangerous, and operating them requires special training, licensure, and rules of operation to ensure reasonable safety for others. Such is not the case with walking, and we should, as a society, be very cautious about restricting this natural right. That being said, there are many motorists who are irresponsible (and I will include in this category the bus drivers who believe that operation of public transportation vehicles is a privileged activity for which everyone needs to get out of their way), and given the grave danger imposed by those irresponsible motorists, the wise pedestrian will walk defensively, and take those actions reasonably necessary to avoid a collision and possible death, even though they should not have to do so. |
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| (308598) | |
Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 00:15:40 2015, in response to Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sat Nov 28 22:19:48 2015. I've never gotten an NYC traffic ticket *knock on wood* but there is a lot of extra stress over it compared to driving in North Bumblefuck.I disagree. In NYC you can blend in with traffic. In East Bumblefuck the locals know where the speed traps are but you don't. The cops will get you every time, no problem. So survival is pure luck - you are either the slow guy who gets rear ended by the aggressive driver who's not paying attention, or the unlucky sod who the cop decided should have a bad day.I've never been rear-ended and I have no fear of it happening. I drive the speed I want to drive, the rest of the drivers be damned*. And If I'm rear-ended, then their insurance will pay for the damage and I'll press charges if/as necessary. I don't let some silly fear of being rear-ended dictate how fast I drive. living in NYC is just plain not worth it.That's only true for people who, for whatever reason (I'm not going to [openly] judge), just can't "make it" in NYC. The rest of us, who can "make it" in NYC, are having the time of our lives and loving every second of it (except for dealing with the homeless and beggers on the subway). *Of course, If I'm going slower than others, then I'm always in the far right lane to allow them to pass me. |
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| (308599) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 00:18:50 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by BusMgr on Sat Nov 28 23:46:03 2015. Such is not the case with walkingWhoa, speak for yourself there, stranger. I see a lot of people every day in NYC who have no business being on a sidewalk. They have no idea how to walk normally. Sidewalks are for walking, for getting places, not for standing around or for walking slowly. People should get walking licenses just like they get drivers licenses. If you don't know how to walk, stay off the sidewalks! Stay home!! |
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| (308600) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Kevin from Midwood on Sun Nov 29 01:28:11 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 00:18:50 2015. Sidewalks are for walking, for getting places, not for standing around or for walking slowly.I don't do those things. As BusMgr alluded to, a key problem is this: Because they don't always obey the law, it can be impossible to predict what drivers are going to do. The cloud of uncertainty this creates causes me, as a pedestrian, not to know what to do. For example, what do you do when you're crossing a street governed by a stop sign as a car is approaching the intersection? I posted this before, and I'm sorry for repeating myself, but too often I end up feeling like an idiot in this situation through no fault of my own. I keep going, assuming the driver is going to stop as he is supposed to, and I end up with a pounding heart after getting honked at and yelled at as the vehicle passes within inches of me without even slowing down. Or instead I wait, the car stops, and then I cross, in which case the time of everyone involved has been wasted (because I waited for her to stop, and she then had to wait for me to cross). Or I wait and feel like even more of a massive dunce wasting time as several cars go through without stopping. How is a pedestrian to know what to do here? |
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| (308601) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by BusMgr on Sun Nov 29 01:50:08 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 00:18:50 2015. The issue of sidewalk capacity is important (and oftentimes overlooked by NYCDOT, especially in places like Flushing), as is the issue of civility and courtesy in walking on crowded sidewalks; but I don't think it is germane to this issue as to the interaction between pedestrians and motorists. It is the very nature of being a natural right that requires others to modify their behavior in order to protect these rights. For example, it may mean that motorists have to drive slower. If the right to walk is inherently in conflict with the privilege to drive, then the privilege needs to give way to the right. A "license" to exercise such right is oxymoronic because it would effectively transform a right into a privilege. |
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| (308602) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by fdtutf on Sun Nov 29 02:17:51 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by BrooklynBus on Sat Nov 28 10:42:42 2015. I have seen double parking tickets written by police cars that stop in front of the car preventing it from leaving in order so a ticket to be written. I remember when before a ticket was written the police would actually search for te owner in nearby stores before writing a ticket. The emphasis is only on revenue, not keeping traffic moving. If someone double parking is delaying traffic, the prudent thing would be to first ask the driver to move in order to keep traffic flowing, not to block an additional lane for three minutes so a summons can be written.First of all, I can't believe that it would take the police less time to find the owner of a car and ask him or her to move the car than it takes to write a summons. Second, you just don't seem, here or elsewhere, to grasp the concept of deterrence. Contrary to what you repeatedly assert, the point of issuing tickets is not simply to raise revenue -- it is to teach people not to break the law. Having the police scurry around trying to warn lawbreakers to hurry and get away before the police get them (!) makes absolutely no sense. |
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| (308603) | |
Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sun Nov 29 03:08:24 2015, in response to Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 00:15:40 2015. I disagree. In NYC you can blend in with traffic. In East Bumblefuck the locals know where the speed traps are but you don't. The cops will get you every time, no problem.My GPS helps with the speed traps... kinda like cab signalling. Anyway as a resident of Bumblefuck I already know where the ones relevant to me are :). I've never been rear-ended and I have no fear of it happening. I drive the speed I want to drive, the rest of the drivers be damned*. And If I'm rear-ended, then their insurance will pay for the damage and I'll press charges if/as necessary. I don't let some silly fear of being rear-ended dictate how fast I drive. Getting into an accident of any kind sucks, even if it wasn't your fault and eventually you'll be paid. As for sticking right when slow, NYC also has a lot of left entrances/exits, or parts where the highway splits and the left two lanes go where you want to go, adding to the stress. That's only true for people who, for whatever reason (I'm not going to [openly] judge), just can't "make it" in NYC. The rest of us, who can "make it" in NYC, are having the time of our lives and loving every second of it (except for dealing with the homeless and beggers on the subway). Not so, I meant financially as well as stress-wise. I live in a 1500 sq/ft apartment built in the '80s and have a 10 minute commute (which almost never has traffic). I have 4 bus lines at the front door, but never need them because within 5 minutes walking distance are over 10 restaurants, 2 bars, and a major grocery store. Expand to 10 minutes and I have Crossgates Mall. When flying somewhere, I can leave my apartment and be through security and at the airline gate in 30 minutes. I determined that in order to keep my lifestyle while living in NYC, I would need more than double my salary. I also determined with the money saved by living up here, I could stay in a 4 star NYC area hotel 6 nights a month... and at that point why NYC? In addition to visiting random New England and Canadian cities on weekends, I pretty much travel the world with the money I save by living in Northeast Bumblefuck (last year Japan and Singapore, this year Australia), having the time of my life and loving every second of it :). |
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| (308604) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Nov 29 05:44:40 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by fdtutf on Sun Nov 29 02:17:51 2015. Maybe the police can get them in their dreams. |
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| (308609) | |
Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Sun Nov 29 10:12:28 2015, in response to Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 00:15:40 2015. I'm glad you haven't been rear-ended, but note this - other than avoiding sudden stops there's practically nothing you can do to avoid it. And if it happens, you have to hope they stay around for you to be able to press charges as you wish. Or get the license plate number while they take off which is hit or miss depending on how skilled they are at getting away. |
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| (308610) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Nov 29 10:14:01 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by fdtutf on Sun Nov 29 02:17:51 2015. I didn't say t would take less time for the police to locate someone than to write a summons. Neither did I advocate that police should take the time to locate the owner. I was merely stating what used to occur as to what occurs now tat the emphasis is solely on revenue.But it certainly does take less time to get the person to move than it takes to write a summons. And if moving traffic were the real priority, summonses would only be written when there is no one in the car who can move the car. They also would not be given in cases when double parking were not causing any traffic delays. There are enough places where double parking actually causes delays that if summonses were only given in those cases no revenue would be lost. Police would also not double park themselves to go and buy a coffee if they cared about traffic delays. You want to teach people not to break the law? What would you say to the proposal police give every jaywalker they see a summons? Bet you would not be in favor of that because you believe it is safer to jaywalk sometimes than cross at the corner with turning vehicles. Quit being the hypocrite you are where you want to penalize motorists and give pedestrians and cyclists a free pass. |
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| (308612) | |
Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Sun Nov 29 10:19:51 2015, in response to Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sat Nov 28 22:19:48 2015. 9 over is good for not setting off speed cameras though you have to be sure you don't get much faster. |
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| (308613) | |
Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 11:04:09 2015, in response to Re: UPDATE: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by New Flyer #857 on Sun Nov 29 10:12:28 2015. Thanks. Yes, I understand all that. But as I said, I'm not worried. I don't let it dictate how fast I drive, except of course when I'm merging onto the highway. |
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| (308616) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 11:08:18 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by BusMgr on Sun Nov 29 01:50:08 2015. The issue of sidewalk capacity is important (and oftentimes overlooked by NYCDOT, especially in places like Flushing)I've never seen NYCDOT overlook the issue during the CEQR/ULURP/Discretionary Approval process. but I don't think it is germane to this issue as to the interaction between pedestrians and motorists.I was trying to funny, even though it's still a serious topic. |
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| (308617) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 11:08:58 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by fdtutf on Sun Nov 29 02:17:51 2015. owned |
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| (308625) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Kevin from Midwood on Sun Nov 29 12:05:41 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Kevin from Midwood on Sun Nov 29 01:28:11 2015. Bump. What do you do when you're crossing a street governed by a stop sign as a car is approaching the intersection? |
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| (308626) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by pragmatist on Sun Nov 29 12:11:26 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Kevin from Midwood on Sun Nov 29 12:05:41 2015. Under the law, you should be able to cross in the crosswalk, since the car is approaching, it is under the obligation to stop and wait for you to cross before advancing. I don't trust people, I will generally use extra caution both as a pedestrian and a driver. |
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| (308627) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by pragmatist on Sun Nov 29 12:25:26 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by BusMgr on Sat Nov 28 23:46:03 2015. We don't have a constitutional right to walk about wherever we want, reasonable restrictions have always been upheld. God given rights exist in our minds, they mean nothing (sadly, some might reasonably argue) in our system of government. I agree that we should be very cautious in permitting the restriction of anything so basic ( what good would the constitutional right to assemble be if you couldn't get there?) I can't agree with the term "natural" right. So I sort of agree with your notion, but not totally with how you arrived at it. |
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| (308628) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 12:31:52 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Kevin from Midwood on Sun Nov 29 12:05:41 2015. I wasn't commenting on the larger issue being discussed. I was only commenting on the text I quoted. |
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| (308629) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Kevin from Midwood on Sun Nov 29 13:52:47 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 12:31:52 2015. Yes, OK. This is why I miss David of Broadway. He'd have a snappier answer akin to "If you'd like to meet me at the corner of Essex and Delancey, I'll show you how to cross the street." |
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| (308630) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 14:05:16 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Kevin from Midwood on Sun Nov 29 13:52:47 2015. OH SNAP! |
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| (308631) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by BusMgr on Sun Nov 29 14:38:07 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 11:08:18 2015. Perhaps I should separate the acts of "studying" and "doing," for regardless of the amount of study undertaken, the sidewalks of Flushing remain beyond their design capacities. |
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| (308632) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by BusMgr on Sun Nov 29 14:41:19 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by fdtutf on Sun Nov 29 02:17:51 2015. Sometimes it is revenue alone, not deterrence. Any tickets issued to FedEx and UPS are treated by the companies as the cost of doing business, and by the City as a device to raise revenue; neither side views ticket issuance as deterrence. Only when dealing with non-commercial drivers or small businesses do citations work as a deterrence. |
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| (308633) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Kriston Lewis on Sun Nov 29 15:16:25 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by BrooklynBus on Sat Nov 28 14:19:21 2015. Pedestrian advocates also believe it s not necessary for them to wear reflective clothing at nightWhy should I reorganize my wardrobe because someone's eyesight is going to hell or because they misjudge their ability to operate a motor vehicle safely? You shouldn't be behind the wheel of a car if that's the case. |
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| (308634) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by BusMgr on Sun Nov 29 15:17:42 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by pragmatist on Sun Nov 29 12:25:26 2015. True, there are the competing rights that come with private ownership of property, the principal one being the right to exclude others. And even under the common law of established highways, there might well need to be some rules so that one' exercise does not interfere with the same right of others. So like other constitutionally-protected rights, the "details" may to be adjusted (e.g., no shouting "fire" in a crowded theatre) but not in a manner that diminishes one from exercising the purpose of the right.The origin of rights is an interesting subject in and of itself. The Constitution protects certain rights (some of which are enumerated therein, but see also the 9th amendment), but the Constitution does not grant those rights (see also Federalist 84 (Hamilton)). So where do these rights originate? Our Declaration of Independence itself states that "that [all men] are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights . . . ." Whether we call them God-granted, or natural rights," there are a basic set of rights that civilized people recognize that we all possess. If we cannot agree on those axioms, then I suggest a breakdown of civilization. |
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| (308635) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by pragmatist on Sun Nov 29 15:20:13 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by BusMgr on Sun Nov 29 14:41:19 2015. Let's go one step further. NYC has a special discount program for fleets that companies can enroll in. You agree not to plead piles of tickets, you get a fixed percentage deal. Also, there is another special program for certain categories of violations that was beneficial to fleet operators large and small that made the process smoother and (usually) cheaper. When I had "trucks" dumped on me as a responsibility for a few years, finding these programs for my company to use meant big bucks in savings. Towing, that is the real deterrent.My techs could drop off tickets every few days, and sign the affidavit forms for filing with NYC, but retrieving one from the pier was a crusher. |
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| (308636) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Sun Nov 29 15:25:06 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Kriston Lewis on Sun Nov 29 15:16:25 2015. And also good to note that drivers are at some point pedestrians unless one has the luxury of always being able to park in such a way that you never have to cross a street to get to where you're going. |
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| (308637) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by pragmatist on Sun Nov 29 15:39:00 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by BusMgr on Sun Nov 29 15:17:42 2015. Well, the Declaration Of Independence suggested things that have a very different meaning today than at the time it was written. Look at how many things adopted in our Constitution have changed from the common beliefs of that era. Women vote, slavery is illegal, almost every citizen over 18 can vote. We have always agreed that we have certain rights, I don't think our society has every agreed as to what they really are. Capitalists insist Socialism and Communism don't work, Communists and Socialists insist Capitalism doesn't work. I know I've left out Monarchists and Anarchists and others, but what if we someday realize none of it "works" 100%. You might be spot on about the breakdown of what we call civilization. |
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| (308638) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Nov 29 15:52:02 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by pragmatist on Sun Nov 29 12:11:26 2015. What I have seen many people do and what I do is you make eye contact with the driver to make sure he sees you. He won't make eye contact with you then run you over. |
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| (308639) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 15:54:55 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Kriston Lewis on Sun Nov 29 15:16:25 2015. Even with great eyes, reflective clothing makes you way more visible. |
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| (308640) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Nov 29 15:57:46 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 15:54:55 2015. For once you are making sense know. And reflective clothing does not have to mean all your clothing is reflective. A simple reflective stripe somewhere on your clothing or shoes is all that is required. |
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| (308641) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Nov 29 15:59:34 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Kriston Lewis on Sun Nov 29 15:16:25 2015. No one is talking about reorganizing your wardrobe. You just have to remember nt to wear solely dark colors at night. Is that so difficult?And I doubt that you have ever been behind the wheel. |
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| (308644) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Kriston Lewis on Sun Nov 29 19:09:08 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Nov 29 15:59:34 2015. Sure. I'll be sure to have a pair of sparklers on as well. |
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| (308645) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by pragmatist on Sun Nov 29 19:18:45 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Kriston Lewis on Sun Nov 29 19:09:08 2015. It shouldn't have to be the law to do something simple to protect ones self. Wear a helmet riding a bike even when not required. Be careful driving, be careful walking. Why not? I'd feel terrible if I hit someone who ran out between 2 parked cars or stepped off the curb against the light with their head in their cellphone. If I got hit by a car while crossing legally and I was wearing all black on a dark street I probably wouldn't feel any better knowing it was the other guy's fault. Maybe we can move away from fixing blame and get back to fixing problems. |
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| (308647) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 19:41:28 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Nov 29 15:57:46 2015. I always make sense. |
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Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 19:44:04 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Kriston Lewis on Sun Nov 29 19:09:08 2015. You're just giving him a hard time. |
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| (308653) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Kriston Lewis on Sun Nov 29 22:49:44 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 19:44:04 2015. But it's fun. |
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| (308656) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 22:55:38 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Kriston Lewis on Sun Nov 29 22:49:44 2015. Yes. But it's not nice. We're only giving him a hard time about things that's he's legitimately wrong about. We're not playing games. |
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| (308658) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sun Nov 29 23:12:52 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Kriston Lewis on Sun Nov 29 15:16:25 2015. Presumably because you don't want to get hit by a car? I was once crossing a street, in the crosswalk with the light in my favor, and someone making a left turn hit me. Not hard enough to do any real damage but knocked me over. Her first response "you're wearing dark!" (which was true, I had a navy blue hoodie on with the hood up as it was raining - also kept me from hearing the car or seeing the car approach in peripheral vision). That said it was Halloween night and I'd like to think that my minor sacrifice may have made her more alert to all of the little ones running around wearing all dark that night...Wear light colored clothing at night, lest you want to be "dead right". |
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| (308659) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Kriston Lewis on Sun Nov 29 23:14:15 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 22:55:38 2015. We're only giving him a hard time about things that's he's legitimately wrong about.I feel he's wrong in this case (or perhaps partially misguided). Maybe people can be a bit more cognizant about what they wear and how visible there are, but I feel that a larger amount of responsibility should lie with someone in a multi-ton vehicle. |
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| (308660) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by italianstallion on Sun Nov 29 23:19:33 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sun Nov 29 23:12:52 2015. Excellent post. |
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| (308661) | |
Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 23:22:24 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Kriston Lewis on Sun Nov 29 23:14:15 2015. a larger amount of responsibility should lie with someone in a multi-ton vehicle.It does. But if you get hit and you die or seriously injured, you're still dead/seriously injured no matter whose fault it was. So to be on the safe side, wearing something reflective is wise. Many backpacks seem to have something reflective. Not sure if many sneakers do. If they require professional construction workers to wear reflective safety vests all the time, even in the daytime, around other professional construction workers, then just think about how much reflective clothing would do for you at night around professional bad drivers. I hardly ever walk around at night in areas without great street lighting or without crowds of people (i.e. midtown Manhattan). But I recently did so a few weeks ago and I instantly became aware of how dark it was and how stupid I was for wearing dark clothes and nothing reflective. And I was ashamed. I was extra extra extra careful when crossing the street. I will try to never let that happen again. |
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Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sun Nov 29 23:23:22 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 23:22:24 2015. Good post. |
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Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 23:27:08 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Henry R32 #3730 on Sun Nov 29 23:23:22 2015. Thanks. |
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Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by BusMgr on Sun Nov 29 23:45:22 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by pragmatist on Sun Nov 29 15:39:00 2015. I think we're at the bottom of the well here, where there are distinct differences between people as how to interpret laws drafted many years ago. Some people believe that our Constitution is "living" and changes to adapt with the times. Others, myself included, believe that our Constitution means what it meant at the time it was adopted, and affirmative action is required by the several states to change that meaning. Likewise with the Declaration of Independence (although it is not something that can be readily "amended"). The foundation of our rebellion is that certain rights do not come from the sovereign, but are inherent to humanity, and that principle should not change, even under a "living" document theory. |
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Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by BusMgr on Sun Nov 29 23:45:45 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 23:22:24 2015. Those of us who live in urbanized areas with street lighting have less to concern ourselves. But a few years ago, returning in the evening from Connecticut, I traveled on the Viking Fleet ferry from New London to Montauk, then the LIRR to Jamaica. It was not a terribly long walk from the ferry dock to the railroad station, but the road was so dark, and devoid of sidewalks, that I was very uncomfortable walking. Did so as one should--on the left side and facing traffic--but whenever a vehicle approached I was completely blinded (do so many motorists not know to dim their high beams when approaching someone?). I had not been anticipating the usefulness of reflective clothing, but I think it would have been helpful at the time. |
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Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 23:59:52 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by BusMgr on Sun Nov 29 23:45:45 2015. Agreed. |
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Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes |
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Posted by Kriston Lewis on Mon Nov 30 00:15:57 2015, in response to Re: Main St traffic and the new Bus Only lanes, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 29 23:22:24 2015. If they require professional construction workers to wear reflective safety vests all the time, even in the daytime, around other professional construction workers, then just think about how much reflective clothing would do for you at night around professional bad drivers.I'm not sure I'd equate the two situations. Construction workers are typically in an environment with lots of heavy machinery. Because of that, there's an elevated risk of injury or death. This is mitigated to some degree by a number of regulations on labor including vests. On most job sites where things are above board, I would safely assume each person has a rigid list of responsibilities and that there's a warm body to supervise. In addition, there's some level of competence and/or intelligence before someone is hired on a job so nobody gets dismembered by a tractor. A street is an uncontrolled environment where regulations are present, but aren't as onerous (or enforced as well, from my observations) as a construction site. A bad professional construction worker has a high chance of being sent home so he doesn't endanger himself or others. A bad professional driver doesn't have a supervisor watching over him, he just has to be unlucky enough to do something stupid within eyeshot of a police officer. That said, I didn't say that it would be unhelpful to wear reflective clothing, but it would only help that pedestrian be seen by a good (or at least a marginal) attentive driver. A professional bad driver is just that, a bad driver who would likely be behaving in a manner where it wouldn't matter if someone had reflective clothes. They'd still be dead (but at least they'll see the corpse). My point is that we should focus on getting unsafe people off the road. I hardly ever walk around at night in areas without great street lighting or without crowds of people (i.e. midtown Manhattan). But I recently did so a few weeks ago and I instantly became aware of how dark it was and how stupid I was for wearing dark clothes and nothing reflective. The block that I live on has poor street lighting. Based on my unscientific observations, people compensate for this by crossing carefully and driving as if someone could dart out at any moment. Maybe both pedestrians and drivers should account for each other's stupidity for lack of a better word. Assume the other guy is going to f'up something. |
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