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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 09:33:05 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 09:14:13 2011. Not always; in a lot of cases, the service reduction is from every 5 minutes to every 8, or where two buses are scheduled at an interval it's cut to one. It's usually not a significant increase to wait times, like going fro 15 minute service to 20 minute. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 10:24:03 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by dkupf on Wed Jun 8 01:33:28 2011. Just like people know that the Q35 doesn't make all the same stops as the B41 Limited south of Nostrand Avenue, or the S66 diverts through Grymes Hill, or that not all St. George-bound Limited buses stop at Borough Place, I think that people can accustomed to the new pattern after a while. |
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| (235643) | |
Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 10:27:18 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 09:14:13 2011. Plus ironically, my routing of the S48 would be the only way it could get artics because certain streets in Arlington are too narrow for articulated buses. |
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| (235644) | |
Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 10:31:36 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 08:46:07 2011. They would fight for it, just like Bricktown fought for their service despite how car-dependent the South Shore is. I'm planning on inconveniencing a select few in the minority (Bradley) to convenience the majority (Manor), and the two busiest stops along Bradley at Harold and Holden would continue to be served, leaving only a few who live near the expressway to complain. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Wed Jun 8 10:44:30 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by dkupf on Wed Jun 8 01:49:32 2011. Off-peak, it isn't though. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Wed Jun 8 10:45:43 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 10:31:36 2011. And they are in the same sitation (distance-wise) as the Todt Hill Houses. |
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| (235649) | |
Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Wed Jun 8 10:48:02 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 09:08:48 2011. So what are did you grow up in, and what area do you live in now? |
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| (235651) | |
Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 11:23:11 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 10:31:36 2011. To this day I still think the way they re-worked the S74 and S78 in Charleston and Tottenville was a bad idea. |
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| (235652) | |
Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 11:36:20 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 11:23:11 2011. It was the only cost-neutral way to get both routes to serve the mall. |
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| (235654) | |
Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Wed Jun 8 12:03:46 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 08:57:16 2011. Well it's clear then that we live on different sides of the boro, because I disagree by and large.History has repeatedly shown that if the MTA offers frequent service on Staten Island the riders will use it. Off-peak service on my local routes has only been increasing for as long as I can remember. I can pull up the WayBack Machine and we can compare schedules from the past and present if you like! You have to look at the facts and not your opinion for once! |
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| (235655) | |
Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Wed Jun 8 12:09:19 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 09:18:07 2011. More air than passengers..what? I'm not talking about the S54, S55 or S56, I'm talking about the S40, S46, S48, S62 & S79. They are able to reduce service slightly on the local routes to make way for limited buses and I'm certain the ridership will be more than there for those buses. How do you think all the limited lines in other boros became so busy? Because they added service over time and eventually it pays for itself. |
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| (235656) | |
Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 12:14:15 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Wed Jun 8 12:03:46 2011. That's why you and Hank viewed my ideas differently. My ideas are more centered towards improving service in the more transit-dependent North Shore than the South Shore . |
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| (235657) | |
Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 12:14:49 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 12:14:15 2011. At first at least. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 12:24:10 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Wed Jun 8 12:09:19 2011. But the extra bus service doesn't get added unless a spark in ridership proves it necessary to increase the service in the first place. You're making it seem like the extra service should just be put there as a luxury. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 12:38:49 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 12:24:10 2011. I don't know what route SIR is talking about, but service on the S46 and S48 for most of the day is simply inadequate, those buses are packed long before they get to the ferry. The S46 also takes much longer to get to the ferry than it should, it's a wonder why so many people on Brabant Street take it to the ferry instead of just walking to South Avenue and getting a seat on the faster S40. It's one of the reasons why I wanted to swap the S44 with the S46. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 12:40:15 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 10:27:18 2011. That's untrue, as it's been poted ot before that attics have a smaller turning radius than a standard bus. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 12:41:31 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 10:31:36 2011. Brick town didn't fight for anything. The politicians said "Why aren't you serving here?" and transit came up with an incredibly simple plan. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 12:46:07 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 11:36:20 2011. It wasn't cost-neutral, but a cost savings; it only happened that way because Charleston Depot has recently opened, and both routes come out of it, so it saves a lot on deadhead costs, as opposed to both routes going back to Yukon from Tottenville. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 12:49:30 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by checkmatechamp13 on Wed Jun 8 10:48:02 2011. Annadale, and New Springville with brief stays in Tottenville an Mariners Harbor. Also work in Port Richmond, Grasmere, and New Dorp. I went to high school in St. George, and CSI. All by transit or bicycle, weather permitting. I didn't get a car until I was well into my 20s. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 12:51:48 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 12:38:49 2011. It's a difference of less than 10 minutes running time, as I've poted elsewhere, between Port Richmond and St. George. |
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| (235665) | |
Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Wed Jun 8 12:54:00 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 12:24:10 2011. They are able to reduce service slightly on the local routes to make way for limited buses and I'm certain the ridership will be more than there for those buses.I don't know what routes you are talking about but the SI local routes I mentioned have always had dismal service since the early 2000s. Now that the bus routes no longer have abandoned intervals and frequent breakdowns, the service was able to be brought to the inadequate level which is not enough. Staten Island's population is only expected to rise from this point on, so it's good to invest for the future rather than keep looking at the current numbers. The MTA does this rather often yet you guys are denying that they do. It's only because of the recession why they went into "cost-neutral mode" because right before the recession they had big plans for new routes and expansions and the lack of limited service for the SI routes has not gone unnoticed. |
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| (235666) | |
Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 12:56:31 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 12:46:07 2011. The S78 was based out of Castleton. |
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| (235667) | |
Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 12:59:14 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Wed Jun 8 12:54:00 2011. I'd like to see these lists of new routes they had planned. |
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| (235668) | |
Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 13:01:51 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 12:59:14 2011. Me too. I'm only aware of the north shore study, which was more about restoring the rail line than reorganizing the buses.I think the era of meaningful SI transit improvements ended with the opening of Charleston depot. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 13:04:03 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 12:56:31 2011. Either way, it's still a significant savings as far as deadheading. And since both routes run 24/7, there's little need to deadhead to St George, though I don't doubt it happens. Ideally, there would be a depot closer to the ferry terminal, and drivers could go on duty and off duty at different terminals. |
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| (235671) | |
Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Wed Jun 8 13:08:08 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 12:59:14 2011. The Q94, Bx50 (LGA-Fordham), X22 Super Express, 24/7 N & R trains and subway/bus improvements across the board were planned for the summer of 2008. None of those plans came to fruition because of the recession. |
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| (235672) | |
Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 13:16:24 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Wed Jun 8 13:08:08 2011. I do remember hearing about 24/7 (R) service and weekend (M) service to Manhattan. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 13:16:27 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 12:40:15 2011. Running an articulated bus down a two-way street that doesn't allow room for a car and a bus to pass each other is a safety hazard. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 13:17:45 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 13:16:24 2011. By (M) service, the Brown (M) to Chambers Street.What would the Q94 and X22 super express have looked like? |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 13:19:11 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 12:41:31 2011. Public transportation is close to the bottom of a politician's priority list, especially in an area like southern Staten Island, someone brought that situation to the politician's attention. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 13:19:44 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 13:16:27 2011. The bays in which an articulated bus has to pull into need to be long enough to provide ample space for the bus to pull into without blocking traffic. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 13:22:50 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 12:51:48 2011. The time savings would increase beyond that because there would be less turnover along Cary Avenue. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 13:25:11 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Wed Jun 8 13:08:08 2011. I did come across this link: http://www.mta.info/mta/news/newsroom/initiatives.htm.But it doesn't discuss a lot about the extra bus routes. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 13:38:35 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 13:25:11 2011. I found something else!http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/03/24/mta-postpones-subway-and-bus-service-upgrades/ They would have created an M13 and extend the B71 and B77 to South Ferry. Well that can't be done because the B71 was completely wiped out and the B77 was absorbed by the B61. I could see the B61 extended to Manhattan but I'm not sure about CNG buses operating over the bridges or in the Battery Tunnel. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 13:59:50 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Wed Jun 8 13:08:08 2011. Only the x22 applies to Staten Island... |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 14:03:28 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 13:38:35 2011. CNG buses operated over bridgesand through tunnels all the time, until all the ex-private express buses were replaced with MCIs. I'm sure a few still do. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 14:06:02 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 13:16:27 2011. They do it frequently in other boros. And it's no more difficult than with standard buses. Bus stops would need to be extended, but that's not a big issue. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 14:07:57 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 13:22:50 2011. How so? People will still need to get on and off the bus. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 14:19:15 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 14:03:28 2011. I know the Q50 operates CNG buses over the Whitestone, and in Manhattan some bus lines that use the Harlem River crossings north of 125th Street use CNG buses sporadlically, such as the Bx6, Bx15 and Bx19. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 14:56:25 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 14:07:57 2011. There will be less people headed towards Mariners Harbor than there are to the Mall. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Wed Jun 8 14:59:19 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 13:19:11 2011. Lol, that's not true at all. Traffic & Transit is the #1 priority that SI politicians have been addressing as of late and have been for a couple of decades now.From the potholes to having to pay to enter SI, or taking so long to reach the ferry, or getting stuck in traffic on the SIE, or the West Shore Expressway having only 2 lanes, the S89, the bus lanes on Victory, traffic signal priority, the new SIE exits, the new station entrances being built on the railroad, the outbridge having only 1 cash tollbooth open on mother's day fiasco, not enough express buses, the X1 and S48 receiving more service in April for the loss of other express buses, the Verrazono toll plaza removal, getting the MTA to finally plan out the North Shore rail, etc. ,etc. The politicians are actually doing something you just have to follow the news. Did you know that they want to have the 3 or 4-lane Staten Island Expressway take over the West Shore Expressway and have the Gothaels Bridge portion as an exit from the highway? |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 14:59:36 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 14:06:02 2011. No they don't. The narrowest street that an articulated route runs on that I can think of (Harding Avenue on the Bx40) has a no parking restriction so buses can pass each other. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 15:01:12 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 14:19:15 2011. Not the Bx19, but the other two, plus the Bx11, Bx35, and Bx36, yes. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 15:08:37 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Wed Jun 8 14:59:19 2011. I said public transit, and you're talking politicians all over the island while I'm talking politicians at the bottom of the island where most people drive. Local buses are even a lower priority down there. There are bigger things politicians in the other 4 even more transit-dependent boroughs have to worry about besides public transit, and some politicians personally don't even care and let their staff handle those types of issues, kind of unfortunate, but understandable and true. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 15:34:44 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 15:01:12 2011. Thanks. I forgot the Bx19 is heavily dependent on articulateds. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Wed Jun 8 15:36:24 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Wed Jun 8 14:59:19 2011. The S89 Limited is a joke. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 16:40:28 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 15:08:37 2011. Staten island politicians work on island-wide issues together; even the transit dependent north shore population suffers due to the numerous traffic issues. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 16:45:38 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 14:59:36 2011. Attics are no wider than standard buses. There's no problem with them passing each other. I can't think of any streets where buses run in bothe directions that isn't wide enough for them to pass each other. Forest hill rd between Travis ave and rock land ave comes close, but it's still wide enough for two MCIs to pass. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 17:38:00 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 16:40:28 2011. Traffic discussions on improving things for personal vehicle users primarily, not public transit users. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jun 8 17:45:26 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank eisenstein on Wed Jun 8 16:45:38 2011. I'm not talking about allowing other buses to pass I'm talking about allowing other vehicles to pass on a single lane two-way street. Pulling an artic to the curb to allow an oncoming vehicle to pass is like pulling over a tractor-trailer to do the same thing. |
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