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| Usage of Arrow III (973918) | |
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| (973918) | |
Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Sep 1 15:07:06 2010 I would appreciate hearing from some of the Jersey guys about how much usage the Arrow III electrics get on the NJT. I ask because last week I rode down to Long Branch and the consists was Comet coaches and an electric locomotive. Obviously the Arrows are used on the NECL but I don't believe that they can cover all the runs. Are the Hoboken-Dover trains still electric? Thanks in advance for any info.Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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| (973919) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Wed Sep 1 15:08:32 2010, in response to Usage of Arrow III, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Sep 1 15:07:06 2010. I was just at HOB yesterday, and as I left on a HBLR trolley, I could see Jersey arrows all over the yard...quite a few of them on HOB-Dover-Gladstone services. |
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| (973924) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 15:16:25 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by JayZeeBMT on Wed Sep 1 15:08:32 2010. They provide all the service on the Gladstone that does not run to Penn, although a diesel occasionally shows up. They are still quite prevalent on the NEC. They also provide a lot of the Hoboken-MSU service and the weekend service to Bay St. There are at least 2 6-7 car consists that run to/from Dover to Hoboken during peak hours. They also RARELY show up on South Amboy or Matawan locals. And they still run on the dinky.I've seen pictures of them running all the way to Long Branch, but I don't think that's possible now. It's a shame they can't handle dual voltage, they are far more ideal on the Montclair and Summit Midtown Directs than the push-pulls are, due to the close proximity of the stations. |
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| (973927) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Sep 1 15:23:00 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by JayZeeBMT on Wed Sep 1 15:08:32 2010. was just at HOB yesterday, and as I left on a HBLR trolley, I could see Jersey arrows all over the yard...quite a few of them on HOB-Dover-Gladstone services.I was in Hoboken on Monday as I wanted to take a ride out to Hackettstown, something I hadn't done before. The consist was Comet coaches hauled by a diesel as it had to be. We got back to Hoboken about 6PM and like yourself I saw plenty of Arrow III's in the yard. Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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| (973930) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 15:26:33 2010, in response to Usage of Arrow III, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Sep 1 15:07:06 2010. The number of Dover/Hoboken trains has been cut drastically over the last 2.5 years. Many are now just the diesels that come from points west of Dover. There are a couple of push-pull runs which change into Midtown Directs at some point. There are a few which originate at Summit (after the Murray Hill short runs were cut) and these are pretty much the only peak trains which stop at Highland Ave, Mountain Station and East Orange. |
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| (973931) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 15:28:06 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Sep 1 15:23:00 2010. Ah, I bet you took that 2:07 express out to H-town and back. One of my favorite trains. |
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| (973945) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Sep 1 16:12:54 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 15:28:06 2010. Yes I did. I had never been west of Summit and that was back in Conrail days. I am systematically riding all the lines that I never managed to get to. Last week it was the North Jersey Coast between Penn Station and Long Branch. Tomorrow it will be the LIRR to Greenport.Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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| (973974) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Sep 1 17:19:40 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Sep 1 16:12:54 2010. You only went to Long Brach? You gotta make the trip to Bay Head one day when you can. There's literally nothing around Bay Head besides the yard, but the ride there has great views. |
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| (973982) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Sep 1 17:29:30 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Sep 1 17:19:40 2010. I did go all the way. I had to change trains at Long Branch. You're right there were some great views. There isn't much at Bay Head but I did find a McDonalds a short distance away. The layover was about 35 minutes. Instead of changing trains its too bad they don't just change locomotives at Long Branch and give everyone a one seat ride.Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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| (973984) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Jersey Mike on Wed Sep 1 17:31:23 2010, in response to Usage of Arrow III, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Sep 1 15:07:06 2010. Arrow III's are only used on South Amboy trains as NJT changed the voltage south of Matawan to 25Kv. |
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| (973985) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Wed Sep 1 17:32:49 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Jersey Mike on Wed Sep 1 17:31:23 2010. They occasionally use the Arrows on 3441, which terminates at Matawan. |
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| (973987) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Wed Sep 1 17:35:23 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Sep 1 17:19:40 2010. There's literally nothing around Bay Head besides the yardThere's a 7-Eleven a short distance away, on Route 35. Definitely an easy walk from the station, east on Osborne Avenue. |
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| (974000) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 18:13:23 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Sep 1 17:29:30 2010. You're right there were some great views. There isn't much at Bay Head but I did find a McDonalds a short distance away.Did you walk the long way or did you use the shortcut along the tracks? I know you should never, EVER trespass, but this is one exception to that rule. They really should put in a fenced path alongside the ROW from Osbourne and Route 35. |
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| (974001) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 18:13:58 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Wed Sep 1 17:35:23 2010. I've used it. Their coffee is horrible. |
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| (974002) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 18:15:03 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Wed Sep 1 17:32:49 2010. I've seen one do this earlier this year. |
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| (974010) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Wed Sep 1 18:33:49 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 18:13:58 2010. I haven't been there since 1999, so I can't say. |
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| (974012) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Wed Sep 1 18:36:42 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by JayZeeBMT on Wed Sep 1 15:08:32 2010. HBLR trolleyIt's a Stadtbahnwagen. :-) |
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| (974013) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Wed Sep 1 18:38:12 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 18:15:03 2010. I used to see that train all the time when I used to work 5749 (the old 5713). 3441 wasn't my connection, but since they usually came in on track 4 about a minute before our leaving time, we had to wait for them to get out of the way before Dock would give us the signal to leave. As a result, we got the extra passengers plus we had to leave late... :-( |
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| (974016) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Sep 1 18:43:26 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 18:13:23 2010. I walked through the parking lot of the housing development there. Since I wasn't on my home turf I figured it was best to obey the rules.Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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| (974024) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Wed Sep 1 18:57:50 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Sep 1 17:29:30 2010. The days of changing locomotives is a thing of the past.Unproductive and very labor intensive. Just like the reason why they don't cut trains in the subway anymore. |
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| (974034) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Sep 1 19:34:38 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Wed Sep 1 18:57:50 2010. Amtrak still does it. |
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| (974037) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Sep 1 19:36:33 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Sep 1 17:29:30 2010. You mean like they used to do? That stopped when they retired the E60s.They've got the implicit promise of its return with the ALP-45DP, but I'll believe it when I see it. |
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| (974041) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 19:56:21 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Wed Sep 1 18:33:49 2010. Oddly enough, the best 7/11 coffee I've ever had was in Greenport. |
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| (974042) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 19:58:42 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Wed Sep 1 18:57:50 2010. It easier to get the geese to change trains. |
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| (974043) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 19:59:19 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Sep 1 19:34:38 2010. Amtrak isn't a high density commuter railroad.They should just electrify to Bay Head. |
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| (974046) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Sep 1 20:00:55 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 19:59:19 2010. I agree. But they still think the ALP-45DP will save them from having to do that. |
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| (974047) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 20:00:56 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Sep 1 19:36:33 2010. I thought they only did that on a few peak runs in South Amboy. |
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| (974049) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by 5301 Fishbowl on Wed Sep 1 20:02:54 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 19:56:21 2010. Mine was on Merrick Road in Rockville Center. Back in the early 90's. |
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| (974050) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 20:03:40 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Sep 1 20:00:55 2010. I hope this white elephant works. A lot is being invested in it.I still do not think a single one of these engines can push an 8 or 9 car multilevel train in diesel mode. |
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| (974051) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Sep 1 20:09:27 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 19:59:19 2010. Was the NJCL ever envisioned to be extended to Atlantic City? |
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| (974054) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 20:32:09 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Sep 1 20:09:27 2010. No, but it once ran as far south as Seaside Heights. It would really be cool to have seen the section on the Barnegat peninsula to Seaside Heights still in service: I am not sure if the section south of Bay Head was part of the NY & LB or the Philadelphia and Long Branch. |
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| (974055) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Sep 1 20:32:17 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Sep 1 20:09:27 2010. No, since they already had the Central Railroad of New Jersey's Southern Division, and funny enough the PRR sent trains to Atlantic City via what is now the "River Line" . . . but the NJCL used to go to Philly via Seaside Heights and Toms River. Have a look at the NJ coastline south of Bay Head. |
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| (974056) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Sep 1 20:32:57 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 20:32:09 2010. It was definitely the P&LB. |
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| (974057) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Sep 1 20:34:50 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 20:03:40 2010. For $12 million per unit, the ALP-45DP better be very miraculous, even cooking a breakfast by itself for every passenger on board. |
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| (974060) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 20:39:47 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Sep 1 20:32:57 2010. Which probably explains why it's now gone south of Bay Head.How different would the Jersey Shore be today if it still was used ... |
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| (974063) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Sep 1 20:45:04 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 20:39:47 2010. Well, there would be an easier way to get to Seaside Heights at least, i.e. in terms of not fighting traffic.That map shows the CNJ's Southern Division there. That ought to answer OJ's question about a train to AC. |
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| (974064) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 20:50:41 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Olog-hai on Wed Sep 1 20:45:04 2010. I still recall plans to extend the NY & LB to Atlantic City, though. The Blue Comet route was a later service. |
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| (974066) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by kp5308 on Wed Sep 1 20:59:20 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Sep 1 15:16:25 2010. They are still quite prevalent on the NEC.The 12 & 14 car sets are AWSOME! 
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| (974350) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by hhp664 on Thu Sep 2 18:24:23 2010, in response to Usage of Arrow III, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Sep 1 15:07:06 2010. Those damn arrows 3's are wire pulling down junk. i have seen several rip wire with those sorry pans. they arc ridiculously, and at nite can be seen for miles. one set ripped the wire in penn station and you could smell it burning forever nyfd showed up for that one. Every thanksgiving someone gets stuck with a set to Dc and back and hates life. although you do make overtime from 80mph running.i will be glad when they are gone. |
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| (974352) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Sep 2 18:27:34 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by kp5308 on Wed Sep 1 20:59:20 2010. I've never seen a 14 car train in passenger service outside of the Cannonball. |
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| (974356) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Sep 2 18:35:21 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by hhp664 on Thu Sep 2 18:24:23 2010. Blame ABB for messing up the rebuild. |
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| (974374) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Thu Sep 2 19:28:48 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by hhp664 on Thu Sep 2 18:24:23 2010. I always wondered why push pulls aren't used to D.C. instead of the Arrow III's. |
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| (974379) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Thu Sep 2 19:35:17 2010, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Thu Sep 2 19:28:48 2010. They used multilevels for the Obama inauguration.I think Arrow III's are used because NJT has limitations on where they can run, wheras the push-pulls can run anywhere. It leaves NJT with the more flexible equipment. |
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| (1113431) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Sun Oct 30 16:54:22 2011, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Jersey Mike on Wed Sep 1 17:31:23 2010. Why though? No Dand124/Olog-Hai, |
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| (1113433) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Sun Oct 30 16:57:32 2011, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Osmosis Jones on Sun Oct 30 16:54:22 2011. BTW, if anyone's interested, here are two videos of Arrow IIIs making a rare appearance at Aberdeen-Matawan: |
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| (1113437) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun Oct 30 17:06:08 2011, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Osmosis Jones on Sun Oct 30 16:57:32 2011. Yes, Arrow III's also run to Matawan, but they no longer can run all the way to Long Branch. |
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| (1113439) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun Oct 30 17:08:18 2011, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Sep 2 18:27:34 2010. Me neither. 12 seems to be the cap on the NEC A-III consists, 10 on the South Amboy/ Matawan trains. |
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| (1113441) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Sun Oct 30 17:09:29 2011, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun Oct 30 17:06:08 2011. True. I read about the catenary between Matawan and Long Branch, and I read that it's constant tension catenary that can handle speeds up to 180mph or so, seems like a waste for a line that has no express running past South Amboy. |
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| (1113447) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Sun Oct 30 17:20:07 2011, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Osmosis Jones on Sun Oct 30 17:09:29 2011. and I read that it's constant tension catenary that can handle speeds up to 180mph or soNever mind, I read that it's variable tension from what I think is a more credible source. |
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| (1113453) | |
Re: Usage of Arrow III |
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Posted by WillD on Sun Oct 30 17:34:32 2011, in response to Re: Usage of Arrow III, posted by Osmosis Jones on Sun Oct 30 17:20:07 2011. It's constant tension:View Larger Map |
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