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(853721)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sun Nov 8 06:38:28 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Sun Nov 8 00:46:06 2009.

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All mass transit runs with a deficit and is subsidised by the state. So why should the state of New Jersey build something and subsidise something that people in another state would bendfit from?

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(853722)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sun Nov 8 06:40:00 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by LuchAAA on Sat Nov 7 23:39:40 2009.

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I didn't know Lillian Garcia left. What was the story behind that?

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(853723)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sun Nov 8 06:43:21 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Grand Concourse on Sun Nov 8 01:32:05 2009.

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And as I said earlier, the deficit would be reduced!

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(853726)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sun Nov 8 06:52:50 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by daDouce Man on Sun Nov 8 06:16:40 2009.

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Wednesday? The parade was Friday!

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(853733)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 8 07:56:53 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by 9 local on Sun Nov 8 01:42:04 2009.

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No, what I said is true. You talk way too much and you often don't know what you are talking about.

Save John, Jebus!!

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(853734)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 8 07:58:56 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by daDouce Man on Sun Nov 8 05:09:01 2009.

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haha, WRONG! if you get there bright and early, you can most likely get a good viewing spot. I'm sorry your facebook friend and nephew had to get BAD advice from you. You'd think they'd know by now not to listen to you...

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(853735)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 8 08:00:45 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sun Nov 8 06:52:50 2009.

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AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAH!!!!!!

PWN3D!!!

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(853736)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 8 08:01:25 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by daDouce Man on Sun Nov 8 06:16:40 2009.

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Overall Wednesday was a day to stay away from Manhattan.
False. Besides the fact that you hopefully meant to say Friday, no, you should not have stayed out of Manhattan on Friday.

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(853737)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 8 08:01:39 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by daDouce Man on Sun Nov 8 06:16:40 2009.

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Overall Wednesday was a day to stay away from Manhattan.

False. Besides the fact that you hopefully meant to say Friday, no, you should not have stayed out of Manhattan on Friday.

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(853738)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 8 08:02:42 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by daDouce Man on Sun Nov 8 04:58:54 2009.

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In fairness to DOT, it would have been a mess even if they used every ferry they had in use and in mothballs and borrowed boats from ferry services in the city.

100% FALSE. If they used every ferry they had AND borrowed other boats, there likely would have been no problems.

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(853758)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by daDouce Man on Sun Nov 8 09:39:14 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sun Nov 8 06:52:50 2009.

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My bad. The series clincher was wednesday. But the parade was friday.
And I have the Daily News special edition here in front of me.

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(853759)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by daDouce Man on Sun Nov 8 09:45:23 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 8 07:58:56 2009.

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How bright and (especially) early would you have recommended?

Some fans were there on Broadway since tuesday thursday night and they still couldn't get the spot they wanted.

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(853760)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by daDouce Man on Sun Nov 8 09:50:00 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 8 08:01:25 2009.

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And a good morning to you also.

Next time don't forget to use both the and icons.

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(853761)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by daDouce Man on Sun Nov 8 09:53:42 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 8 08:01:39 2009.

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Besides not forget to use both the and icons,
don't correct your mistakes and repost the same message.

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(853763)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by daDouce Man on Sun Nov 8 09:55:00 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 8 08:02:42 2009.

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The extra boats would have been overcrowded anyhow.

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(853783)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Grand Concourse on Sun Nov 8 11:43:31 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Sat Nov 7 23:29:57 2009.

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Agreed about the idea to extend the HBLR into SI.

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(853785)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Grand Concourse on Sun Nov 8 11:45:32 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Nov 8 05:43:17 2009.

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Maybe they can have their version of 'MTA Bus' and runned by the state or something.

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(853786)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Grand Concourse on Sun Nov 8 11:45:45 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sun Nov 8 06:43:21 2009.

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True.

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(853796)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Michael549 on Sun Nov 8 12:06:30 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sun Nov 8 06:34:52 2009.

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The majority of folks using the SIR ride between the ferry and their destination, so the "free rides" myth is not as much as some folk like to make it. Yes, there are some (a small number) of riders who ride free between the stations, but often those folks use the buses, and their fare is captured that way. At the Tompkinsville station, they are building a brand new fare building to collect the fares of those entering and leaving the station. So the nearest station where this supposed myth takes will soon be out of the equation. Those folks who were claiming that there are plenty of "free rides to the ferry" will now have to come up with a different myth. The next nearest station, Stapleton is a great distance away from the ferry, and in no way is desirable for a free trip to the ferry.

Since Manhattan is an island, Long Island (containing Brooklyn, Queens, Nassau and Suffolk) is an island, and of course, Staten Island is an island - that leaves only the Bronx as a part of the MAINLAND. There is a myth that persists that Staten Island is some far off mystical place somehow not really a part of New York City. Stop it - we pay New York City taxes just like everyone else, and therefore deserve the services just like everyone else in NYC.

Plenty of the buses have riders not only to and from the ferry and their destination, but also riders along the route who get on and off between the end points. There is a degree of turnover of riders on the buses, because (a) I have seen it, and (b) I'm a part of it.

During the discussion on Staten Island separating itself from NYC during the early 1990's, there was the discredited suggestion that Staten Island could not make it on its own financially. That suggestion was disproved in major ways, but the myth of it shows up every now and then. Not that Staten Island should separate - it would not change much, except bring in a new cast of cronies.

What the transportation situation on Staten Island shows, and it can be said for the city as a whole - if a rail transit facility was not built and operated during the hey-day of transit building 1900-1930's it would not be built later. Witness the problems with the building of the Second Avenue subway and other facilities. Add in the shrinkage of transit over the decades as a factor, plus the love affair with the car.

Mike




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(853805)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Michael549 on Sun Nov 8 12:34:54 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by daDouce Man on Sun Nov 8 04:58:54 2009.

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From a previous message: "In fairness to DOT, it would have been a mess even if they used every ferry they had in use and in mothballs and borrowed boats from ferry services in the city."

There are 3 Molinari class boats holding 4,400 riders - needing a crew of 17 each, 2 Barberi class boats holding 6,000 riders needing a crew of 16 each, 2 Austen class boats holding 1,280 riders - needing a crew of 10 each; and 1 Kennedy class boat holding 3,500 riders -needing a crew of 14 each boat. These are the boats of the ferry fleet, and at any one time one or more of these boats are out of service - repairs at the docks, maintenance, testing, the dry-dock work, etc.

In recent months there have been problems with one or more of the Molinari class boats and Barberi class boats where the John F. Kennedy boat was used as a replacement. Often I am told that usually only one of the Austen class boats is in service, and the other one is used for parts. The repair and in service picture changes on a regular basis

At the height of the rush hour schedule, 4 boats are used, usually the largest of boats: Molinari and Barberi type boats. During the periods when the boats run every 30 minutes - 2 boats are used, and when the hourly schedule is in effect - 1 boat is used.

My point is that the DOT may have had at best 4 or 5 boats of the largest boats available between the Molinari-Barberi-Kennedy classes - in running condition. It is very rare for an Austen type boat to be used during the day times, but it has been done when paired with a Kennedy class boat to substitute for a Barberi type boat.

Another point should be made, even if the DOT physically had the boats available in working condition, it may not have had the sufficient number of crew-men for each of the boats. These days there's more attention to the crews and the fitness of the crews for the boats - so less corner cutting. Corner cutting over time is what got them in trouble before. There may have been manpower issues in dealing with this day.

Just a few thoughts.
Mike


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(853813)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Nov 8 13:01:27 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sat Nov 7 21:23:56 2009.

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Why do the county executives each get to appoint 1 representative to the board and the Mayor gets to appoint only 4? It should be 5!

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(853815)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Nov 8 13:02:36 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by BrooklynBus on Sat Nov 7 19:42:50 2009.

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You mean let's have the first boat race? There was never a boat race.

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(853817)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Nov 8 13:03:42 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Nov 8 05:42:16 2009.

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Not most likely. Absolutely certainly.

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(853822)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sun Nov 8 13:09:30 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Nov 8 13:01:27 2009.

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Because how those who "constructed" the MTA did it. For your proposal, I suppose a proposal for a new law would have to be established and voted on by both branches of the legislature and signed or vetoed by the governor.

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(853853)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Sun Nov 8 15:02:15 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sun Nov 8 06:38:28 2009.

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So why should the state of New Jersey build something and subsidise something that people in another state would bendfit from?

Actually, I would suspect that if the project goes ahead, it would be a NJT capital project operated by the NJT, with capital and operations funding by the MTA (and potentially from the PANYNJ). For what it's worth, NJT and the MTA work together on the Port Jervis line where the MTA essentially pays line improvement, rolling stock, and operating costs, while NJT runs the service for them.

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(853856)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Sun Nov 8 15:15:06 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Easy on Sun Nov 8 00:44:33 2009.

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They would have more political clout in NJ and would certainly get better transit options quicker.

For what it's worth, if Staten Island ends up being absorbed into New Jersey, it's going to end up being one of the largest municipal jurisdictions in the state, and potentially, the largest city in the state. Given Staten Island's traditional Republican leanings, this may rig politics slightly rightward in the State. Of course, it remains to be seen how property taxes would fare given that NYC property taxes are low, and some homes were built with a ten year tax abatement.

In terms of transit, despite NJT's relatively productive capital programme over the past thirty years, past performance is certainly not indicative of future performance. Even if the project converts from an joint MTA-NJT project, it converts into a fully-funded NJT project that competes with a long list of projects on NJT's capital programme list. The MTA's capital expansion projects other than SAS and the Javits extension are basically capacity increases (ESA, LIRR third track), while NJT's projects are expansionary other than THE Tunnel, and there's the theoretical electrification plans to compete with.

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(853857)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Sun Nov 8 15:20:46 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Sun Nov 8 00:46:06 2009.

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And AFAIK, they've already re-zoned St. George and Tompkinsville to allow for skyscrapers to be built so a future population increase is already on the books.

That area has generally been higher density when compared with most of the island. A real shift to higher density would mean that you'd see apartment buildings on Hylan Boulevard or upzoned areas around existing SIR stations. I'd imagine that locals would freak out about an apartment building at the corner of say, Richmond Ave & Hylan Blvd.

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(853862)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Easy on Sun Nov 8 15:29:50 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Sun Nov 8 15:20:46 2009.

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How about no zoning? Or at least no zoning other than stuff like no adult entertainment near schools, etc. It seems to me that zoning in most cities tends to favor an autocentric model. Low density single family homes with no, or few, businesses except on the major streets. Residents then need cars to get around.

Cities with no zoning or cities that grew before zoning have mixed use built in. Restaurants, stores, bars, churches, etc. are inside the neighborhood. That's a model for a livable city.

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(853868)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Think twice on Sun Nov 8 15:45:28 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sun Nov 8 06:05:15 2009.

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So true.

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(853886)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by LuchAAA on Sun Nov 8 16:31:30 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sun Nov 8 06:40:00 2009.

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She got married to someone outside the wrestling business, so she just quit.

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(853921)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Clayton on Sun Nov 8 17:40:39 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 8 07:56:53 2009.

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Save Brian, Yahweh!

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(853924)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Wado MP73 on Sun Nov 8 18:02:59 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by xtimx on Sat Nov 7 01:10:16 2009.

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Don't mix Yankee fans from SI with Yankee fans from elsewhere.... :)

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(853926)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Wado MP73 on Sun Nov 8 18:05:00 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Michael549 on Sun Nov 8 12:06:30 2009.

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During the discussion on Staten Island separating itself from NYC during the early 1990's, there was the discredited suggestion that Staten Island could not make it on its own financially. That suggestion was disproved in major ways, but the myth of it shows up every now and then.


Hello? They all shut up after it was proved other wise. SI eats more tax money than it contributes.

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(853932)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Nov 8 18:20:53 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Wado MP73 on Sun Nov 8 18:05:00 2009.

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proff?

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(853933)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Nov 8 18:21:40 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Nov 8 13:03:42 2009.

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Yes, if it were to proceed.

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(853935)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Nov 8 18:23:00 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Grand Concourse on Sun Nov 8 11:45:32 2009.

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NJT is already "runned" by the state. (Thought you meant to say "ruined".) NJT Bus has an all-numeric database, but it's more important to that state to keep their bloated welfare system going than to convert it to alphanumeric . . .

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(853937)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Easy on Sun Nov 8 18:24:42 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Wado MP73 on Sun Nov 8 18:05:00 2009.

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That's hard to believe.

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(853938)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Grand Concourse on Sun Nov 8 18:24:52 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Nov 8 18:23:00 2009.

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ok.

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(853942)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 8 18:32:36 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by daDouce Man on Sun Nov 8 09:45:23 2009.

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5-6am maybe

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(853960)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Nov 8 19:33:40 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Nov 8 13:02:36 2009.

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I thought that's how New York Got Staten Island in the first place when New Jersey lost the boat race back in the 1600's.

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(853963)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Nov 8 19:37:32 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sun Nov 8 06:05:15 2009.

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How come during the weekends when 18 out of 24 subways had construction reroutes or were not operating, no station said, "Use your car."

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(853964)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Nov 8 19:38:14 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Nov 8 19:33:40 2009.

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A myth.

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(854001)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Edwards! on Sun Nov 8 20:41:32 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by xtimx on Sun Nov 8 02:00:12 2009.

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NO..it's not.

It's EXPECTED BEHAVIOR,to an extent.

I EXPLAINED that FACT to YOU..it's CLEAR that you don't understand..which you should have admitted to..instead of trying to come off as being superior to everyone else.

Also..since I am ALL SO MUCH SMARTER THAN YOU...IF I would have gone to the affair..which I didn't..I would have waited for another ferry..AND waited outside..AND BOARDED from the lower level..like anyone with COMMON SENSE would have done...

So NO..I would NOT have been trampled AT ANYTIME.

Since I AM THE BIGGER PERSON HERE,little man..I chose not to insult you in my USUAL MANOR,taking into consideration your mental handicap.
Be of good cheer,though...your not the first to be blessed with my good graces..nor will you be the last.



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(854006)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Alex L. on Sun Nov 8 20:48:45 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Osmosis Jones on Sun Nov 8 00:29:11 2009.

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You couldn't even agree to that. When Staten Island offered to leave back in the '90s, you all said no.

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(854007)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Edwards! on Sun Nov 8 20:50:41 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by daDouce Man on Sat Nov 7 16:46:36 2009.

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You CAN BLAME HIM...

You can place the blame SQUARELY ON HIM...

He caused most if not all subway expansion in the city to either come to a halt..or to a crawl DURING the construction of the IND,AND after..

The ripple affect can be felt until this very day,under SECOND AVENUE and PARK AVENUE...efforts that should have been completed 30 years ago.

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(854009)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by straphanger9 on Sun Nov 8 20:59:38 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Clayton on Sat Nov 7 16:45:30 2009.

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if he'd done that before the election, Bill Thompson would have been introducing the team for the parade instead. I LOVED being at the parade and 70% of the people booing Bloomberg, and booing even more when Michael Kay made the "4 more years" comment. My question is where the hell these people were on election day.

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(854011)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by daDouce Man on Sun Nov 8 21:00:38 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sun Nov 8 06:43:21 2009.

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If there is a deficit, it would be transfered to NJT. Away from the MTA.

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(854020)

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster.

Posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Nov 8 21:09:52 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster., posted by daDouce Man on Sat Nov 7 22:51:13 2009.

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His influence began during the Smith Administration in Albany, so it was contemporaneous to the IND building. Remember that the Interborough Parkway at Union Turnpike is one of the rare cases of the highway predating the subway.

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by Edwards! on Sun Nov 8 21:21:11 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Bill From Maspeth on Sat Nov 7 21:15:00 2009.

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True...if it wasn't for him..there would have many more subway lines..Airport lines...whatever the case maybe...

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Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster

Posted by daDouce Man on Sun Nov 8 21:24:55 2009, in response to Re: Yankees Parade = Staten Island Transit Disaster, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Nov 8 18:32:36 2009.

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Some people were there since 12:30am the night before and still weren't able to get the spot they wanted.

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