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| Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks (825482) | |
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| (825719) | |
Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 08:56:40 2009, in response to Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks, posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 08:34:14 2009. ok.............. |
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| (825720) | |
Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Wed Aug 26 09:03:26 2009, in response to Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 08:32:26 2009. I did a search using 370 Jay Street and had no results.I'll try 2 Broadway and 130 Livingston and see what turns up. |
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| (825721) | |
Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 09:05:41 2009, in response to Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks, posted by R36 #9346 on Wed Aug 26 09:03:26 2009. No, let him do it himself. He's the one who's wondering. |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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| (825723) | |
Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Wed Aug 26 09:09:27 2009, in response to Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks, posted by R36 #9346 on Wed Aug 26 09:03:26 2009. 130 Livingston Street• POETRY IN MOTION (co-registered with the Poetry Society of America) "2 Broadway" New York [No MTA-related results] |
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| (825724) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by RailBus63 on Wed Aug 26 09:12:12 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by rionOne on Tue Aug 25 23:55:14 2009. Which book is this? |
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| (825731) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 09:47:14 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 08:52:55 2009. Yes it does actually. It goes to the background of NY MTA being aggressive on their supposed trademarks. NY MTA feels that their bullets and logos and stuff should not be displayed on items, etc while SF MUNI does not care. If MUNI went after each person in the manner that NY MTA does there would be an uproar. SF MUNI is more hip in this than NY MTA and should be complimented which is something they do not get often but I will not digress |
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| (825732) | |
Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 09:48:23 2009, in response to Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks, posted by R36 #9346 on Wed Aug 26 09:09:27 2009. Ahh cool, thank you I appreciate the info. |
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| (825733) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 09:57:26 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by RailBus63 on Wed Aug 26 09:12:12 2009. yeah you think he would have outed it already |
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| (825735) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 09:58:22 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 09:47:14 2009. Also of note is that SFMTA is releasing its scheduling information to any developer for use in iPhone applications, etc. New York's MTA wanta a license fee for its schedules. Facts and collections of data cannot be copyrighted or trademarked - this was settled by the Supreme Court several years ago when phone companies tried to stop others from distributing different versions of the Yellow Pages using the same set of data. The MTA is only pushing that issue because they are the 800 lb bully gorilla in the room - they have no legal standing! |
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| (825736) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by BLE-NIMX on Wed Aug 26 09:59:54 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by AMoreira81 on Wed Aug 26 00:27:48 2009. The only bullet on the original link that COULD have been in violation of copyrighted was the K route but is noit listed as syuch in the copyright link. F line bagels on Kings Hway was sued several years back and was ordered in violation and had to change the bullet which according to the copyright status was (white F on orange background). For some reason they copyrighted the 4 but not the 5, I guess they knew they could make money on subway series mugs and memorabilia. |
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| (825738) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 10:02:56 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 09:47:14 2009. no, like i said already, what you wrote has nothing to do with what we are talking about |
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| (825739) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 10:08:49 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 09:58:22 2009. Ok I know of the Station Stops app thing. I agree that they cannot license the data, but at the same time they do not have to make it easy for developers either. Providing a feed or release of the info ahead of time is not something they have to do, it would be nice but not something they can be forced to do. Now, they can charge however for the service but not the data. Providing the info in alternate formats or early release does cost them $ in terms of labor and sure there are soft costs involved to, which is why I think they should provide the service out of courtesy but at a price. Now, they can charge for any use of supposable trademark items thoughs. But you are right either way they are acting as an 800lb gorilla that needs to fall IMHO |
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| (825740) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 10:10:10 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by BLE-NIMX on Wed Aug 26 09:59:54 2009. NY MTA does not have a K route. Yes, I know it did in the past, but at this point why copyright it? |
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| (825741) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 10:10:33 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 10:02:56 2009. Whatever |
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| (825742) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 10:13:15 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by BLE-NIMX on Wed Aug 26 09:59:54 2009. For some reason they copyrighted the 4 but not the 5, I guess they knew they could make money on subway series mugs and memorabilia.This was actually explained in a New York Times article several years ago - trademarking and maintaining trademarks is expensive - the MTA tried to judge which ones sell better and apply limited resources to those. They don't have the money to trademark them all. My objection to all of this is not that they want to prevent others from selling t-shirts that contain the bullet. The problem is that the bullet is also a functioning part of the railroad and the MTA is trying to stop people from selling photographic prints if the picture includes the logo or route bullet even though the train as a whole is the subject of the photograph, not the bullet. Is this what I will have to do to every picture I try to sell at train shows?  Although I do feel this is more appropriate:  |
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| (825743) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by BLE-NIMX on Wed Aug 26 10:14:22 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 10:10:10 2009. I forgot where the copyright link was posted but was the D or 7 also copyrighted as well? If so like I said subway series would make them something on the 4 7 or D |
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| (825744) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by BLE-NIMX on Wed Aug 26 10:17:29 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 10:13:15 2009. When 180 Livingston Street opened and they started moving out of Jay Street, I first got a look at the building by looking at the HUGE MTA flag they put up right next to the American Flag. It stayed in my mind that it sort of overshadowed the Betsy Ross version that I was an employee to the Kremlin and not to public transit. |
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| (825746) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 10:18:47 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by BLE-NIMX on Wed Aug 26 10:14:22 2009. I think they are copyrighted. |
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| (825748) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 10:20:28 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 10:08:49 2009. I agree that they don't have to provide the data or make it easy, however they are trying to stop StationStops even though SS is compiling the data on its own from public sources. That is where they went over the line and may end up losing it all.It appears that they agreed to provide data to Google FREE OF CHARGE - it seems that Google is the 1600 lb gorilla in the room :) |
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| (825752) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 10:31:12 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 10:20:28 2009. IIRC Google is a partner of theirs, so it makes sense they'd do it for free for them as they are in a joint venture. Now, I do agree they went over the line w/StationStops. I also agree Google is a 1600lb gorilla and they better be careful because they are quickly becoming the next Microsoft |
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| (825758) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 11:00:29 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 10:08:49 2009. I agree that they cannot license the dataHuh? They ARE licensing the data. So how can you say that they can not? |
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| (825759) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Aug 26 11:01:02 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by BMTLines on Wed Aug 26 08:46:17 2009. Look, *I* live west of the Hudson, and I can testify THERE IS NOTHING OUT HERE!ROAR |
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| (825760) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 11:01:12 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 10:10:10 2009. Because maybe it was a popular route bullet?????? |
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| (825778) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 11:22:55 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 11:00:29 2009. Sorry I meant to say that they should not be licensing the data (it is in public domain on their site, in stations etc), but can charge for the data in alternate formats or for early release services, etc |
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| (825779) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 11:24:11 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 11:01:12 2009. Ok your right. But, the K bullet in question is not the same color as the NY MTA one. |
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| (825785) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 11:36:11 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 11:22:55 2009. ok |
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| (825786) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 11:36:48 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 11:24:11 2009. that didn't stop them with the N bullet...... |
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| (825787) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 11:38:06 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 11:00:29 2009. But they are also trying to prevent non-licensees from using the data. This is something the Supreme Court ruled inFeist Pubs., Inc. v. Rural Tel. Svc. Co., Inc., 499 U.S. 340 (1991) that no-one has the right to do. Raw data cannot be trademarked or copyrighted. |
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| (825789) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 11:41:23 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 11:38:06 2009. not what i'm talking about. arnine corrected it. |
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| (825790) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 11:47:27 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 11:36:48 2009. No but it should have. |
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| (825791) | |
Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Wed Aug 26 11:50:26 2009, in response to [Long] MTA Trademarks, posted by R36 #9346 on Tue Aug 25 23:48:52 2009. It's also interesting to note that for both 6 and G, the descriptions are almost identical:"White {number 6, letter G} in a green circle" So apparently, it doesn't matter what shade of green is used, as long as it's green. |
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| (825795) | |
Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks |
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Posted by Hank Eisenstein on Wed Aug 26 12:01:19 2009, in response to Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 09:05:41 2009. Why be an ass about it? Someone else has experience with finding the information; that person may even possess 'special powers' when it comes to finding the information. |
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| (825796) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 12:02:45 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 11:47:27 2009. well ask the lawyer then. you have his email. |
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| (825797) | |
Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 12:04:30 2009, in response to Re: [Long] MTA Trademarks, posted by Hank Eisenstein on Wed Aug 26 12:01:19 2009. No. Links were provided. |
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| (825801) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by metropod on Wed Aug 26 12:23:23 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 06:28:52 2009. MUNI is not a for profit business. the MTA steped in because they hold the copyright/trademark on the N in a bullet logo (reguardless of color) and the guy is in this to make money. An argument can be made as to if this is really what the law would consider a parody, reguardless of what the guy selling the shirts might say.A simliar example; Pat Riley, coach of the Lakers in the 1980s, has a completely legel trademark on the word "three-peat" when used on mercehndise. when the Bulls and the Yankees both won thier third titles in a row, they had to pay Mr. Riley to put "three-peat" on shirts and mugs and those sorts of things. in 2005, someone involed with the USC football team tried to get a trademark on "Three-pete"(note spelling) inrefence to the the team's coach, Pete Carroll. the Patent office said no becuase it was too close to Three-peat. The MTA has a trademark on the colorless designs of some of these bullets, in this case the N, that says they are the only ones who can go and make shirts and other stuff with that design. I'm sorry, but this time, the MTA is right. |
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| (825806) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 12:35:29 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by metropod on Wed Aug 26 12:23:23 2009. Nope. Like MUNI NY MTA is also not a for profit business. If the NY MTA is right here well then I guess transit agencies around the world should be expecting cease and desist letters from NY MTA because they are using the bullets, some of whom may have used the bullets before NY MTA ever did. MUNI & NY MTA are public agencies whereas the teams are private for profit companies, therefore they have a trademark/copyright claim issue. NY MTA should not have an issue (Neither does MUNI for that matter) |
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| (825820) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 15:10:00 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 12:35:29 2009. No, I believe he's saying that NY MTA, the trademark holder, is ok with MUNI using the trademarked bullet because MUNI is not-for-profit. However NY MTA does have a problem with t-shirt man using the bullet because t-shirt man is for-profit. |
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| (825823) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 15:15:21 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by metropod on Wed Aug 26 12:23:23 2009. So what you are saying is that anyone who encloses a letter inside a circle is in violation of the MTA trademark?By the way did you actually look it up or are you ASSUMING the trademark applies to a colorless version? According to TESS the N is trademarked as follows: Description of Mark The mark consists of a black letter "N" within a yellow circle. The Number 1 is trademarked as follows: Description of Mark The color(s) red and white is/are claimed as a feature of the mark. The mark consists of a white stylized number 1 within a red circle. Color is a claimed feature of the mark. As for the MTA being able to trademark its bullets - don't even get me started on the fact that AFAIAC it is a government agency and anything that government produces should not be subject to copyright or trademark. It isn't on the federal level, nor should it be on the state or local level. Unfortunately the law thinks otherwise. |
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| (825825) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 15:17:42 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 15:10:00 2009. It doesn't matter - color is a feature of the mark - metropod is wrong. |
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| (825828) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 15:18:53 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 15:10:00 2009. Ok, my apologies now I understand what he was saying. Either way, the bullets in question are still not the same as NY MTA. It is a parody which is what the law determines as fair use. I have sent e-mail to a few press outlets so I am hopeful that one picks up the story and gives the MTA a much needed embarassment. I have also alerted some outlets in SF as well. |
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| (825829) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 15:20:37 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 15:15:21 2009. Thank you. I totally agree! |
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| (825830) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by metropod on Wed Aug 26 15:20:37 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 15:15:21 2009. Color doesnt make a diffrence is what I'm saying. |
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| (825831) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by metropod on Wed Aug 26 15:20:37 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 15:15:21 2009. Color doesnt make a diffrence is what I'm saying. |
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| (825833) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 15:22:09 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by metropod on Wed Aug 26 15:20:37 2009. did you learn that at the museum? and aren't you color-blind, or is that someone else? |
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| (825834) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by metropod on Wed Aug 26 15:22:46 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 15:22:09 2009. No, civil law classes at school. |
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| (825835) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Aug 26 15:23:55 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by metropod on Wed Aug 26 15:20:37 2009. double post |
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| (825836) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 15:24:11 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by metropod on Wed Aug 26 15:20:37 2009. Read the trademark registration - color is SPECIFICALLY MENTIONED!! |
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| (825837) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 15:25:20 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by metropod on Wed Aug 26 15:20:37 2009. Read the trademark registration - color is SPECIFICALLY MENTIONED!! |
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| (825839) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Aug 26 15:25:52 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 15:24:11 2009. If we listen to Metropod I gues part of unicode is going to cost folks $$ |
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| (825840) | |
Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks |
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Posted by metropod on Wed Aug 26 15:26:13 2009, in response to Re: NY MTA Claims SFMTA Parody Infringes on Trademarks, posted by bmtlines on Wed Aug 26 15:17:42 2009. the cut off point is not "just this design". the MTA's mark protects from similar designs which could be interprited as coming from the mark holder. that is why it's colorless becuase the color is meaningless if the design is sufficently similar to the orginal. It could be pink or rainbow, it doesn't make a diffrence. |
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