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| CSX crossing in Darby, PA (508652) | |
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| (508652) | |
CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Sun Oct 28 12:24:27 2007 From Trolley driver Bill.CSX will start work on Monday on the crossing at 6th and Main, the route 11 trolley will cut back at Island Road. Route 13 will pull out over 58th Street, get some shots while you can. This should last two weeks. Bill Monahan |
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| (508676) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Oct 28 12:54:49 2007, in response to CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by TransitChuckG on Sun Oct 28 12:24:27 2007. Ohh man. While the configuration makes for some good eye candy, it means that no electrification's possible for the former B&O, and that you'll have some kind of speed restriction due to the diamonds. Not to mention, you'll always have some kind of service disruption like this every time the railroad needs trackwork.Guess when I restart the Royal Blue, I'll have to elevate the RR through Darby . . . ain't nuttin' for it now . . . (It is so necessary to re-link Charlie O's photo of the area in question.)  |
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| (508681) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Sun Oct 28 12:59:12 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Oct 28 12:54:49 2007. I hate to see CSX disrupted, but this re-engineered fix has been due for a long while. Nice picture, BTW.Maybe this one will last for a longer time, until it sinks again. |
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| (508686) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Oct 28 13:00:44 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by TransitChuckG on Sun Oct 28 12:59:12 2007. CSX disrupted is one thing. Disrupting the trolleys is another, because it gives fuel to the psychotic anti-rail folk. |
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Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Sun Nov 4 13:21:43 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Oct 28 13:00:44 2007. A LRV was tested over the crossing last Thursday and it went OK. CSX trains are using the crossing too, if I have that information correct.In two weeks , CSX is going to shut it down to pour concrete, So the shuttle buses will be out again. Chuck Greene |
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| (512250) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Mon Nov 5 06:21:49 2007, in response to CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by TransitChuckG on Sun Oct 28 12:24:27 2007. From Yahoo Groups-Philly Traction. (Griffin Tall)Good Evening; > > The kcars have been using the new CSX crossing > without incident. As Mr. Heaton has pointed out many > times, notice details in a scene or an area; as I was > getting some shots of the crossing, I noticed > 'scratch' marks the kcar wheels are leaving on the CSX > tracks. > > Obviously, the high rail the kcars are riding on > is still letting the flanges touch the CSX rail. There > was light weekend kcar traffic going over the > crossing. > > Starting tomorrow, the real story will be told, > with the rte 13 pullins and pullouts, the rte 11 > schedules. It will be interesting to see if a > permanant 'scratch or small groove' will left in CSX > rail. > > Mr. Greene, a weekday is better to get shots of > kcars using the CSX crossing. More action in less time. > Griffin, thanks for the update. I wonder if that scratch thing is going to be a problem. Chuck Greene |
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| (512258) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Nov 5 06:27:42 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by TransitChuckG on Mon Nov 5 06:21:49 2007. thx for the update |
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| (512286) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Mon Nov 5 09:14:27 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by TransitChuckG on Mon Nov 5 06:21:49 2007. I assume kcars mean hyrailer-equipped railroad owned trucks? |
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| (512289) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Nov 5 09:20:29 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by TransitChuckG on Mon Nov 5 06:21:49 2007. I wish I had a "kcar" photo there. But I don't. This combination will have to do.  Gotta love riding those kcars, ay Chuck? |
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Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Mon Nov 5 09:26:37 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Nov 5 09:20:29 2007. They are smooth riding, better than the PCC-II's. |
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| (512301) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Mon Nov 5 09:30:33 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by TransitChuckG on Mon Nov 5 09:26:37 2007. More from Philly Traction. Possible near future problems.> > > Griffin, thanks for the update. I wonder if that scratch thing is > going to be a problem. > > Chuck Greene > > > Chuck and Griffin,this is not good.You have to think in three dimensions to understand.The flat portion of the trolley wheel is supposed to ride the flat portion of the rail and the flange is designed to guide and keep it there in the grove.At the crossing the space in the trolley rail is designed to allow the CSX wheel to clear.What is happening is the space is allowing the trolley wheel to drop onto its flange and onto the CSX rail forcing the flange to carry the entire weight of the car.This is the scratch you are seeing.The flange is not designed for this load.Eventually this stress is going to chip the trolley wheel flange.This will cause problems especially at the switches.Possibly a chipped flange will allow the car to go the wrong way and derail.The only solution I see is to "grove" the thru rail of the CSX.Looks like someone got a bad set of spec's for the diameter of the "K" wheels and flange depth.Maybe it's that NASA problem of converting metrics to inches.A close up of the K going thru the crossing will probably tell the story.I'm sure what was designed there was for the flat surface of the trolley wheel to lie on both sides of the space and keep the flang high enough off the CSX rail.It's only going to get worse over time as the trolleys wear away at the rise.Any solution seems to cause problems from the transportation board. Jack |
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| (512349) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by chuchubob on Mon Nov 5 11:31:56 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by RonInBayside on Mon Nov 5 09:14:27 2007. I assume kcars mean hyrailer-equipped railroad owned trucks?K cars are Kawasaki trolleys. 
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Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Mon Nov 5 11:36:00 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by chuchubob on Mon Nov 5 11:31:56 2007. Thanks for posting that picture, Bob. |
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Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Mon Nov 5 11:42:17 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by TransitChuckG on Mon Nov 5 11:36:00 2007. Here's a "K" car and a PCC-II. Quite a bit of difference.
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| (512389) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Nov 5 12:41:50 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by chuchubob on Mon Nov 5 11:31:56 2007. Off-topic, but the H&M/PATH's MP51 also bore the name "K-Car". |
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| (512391) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Nov 5 12:43:50 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Nov 5 12:41:50 2007. but the H&M/PATH's MP51 also bore the name "K-Car".That's not a "but" in the context of this thread. |
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| (512418) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Mon Nov 5 14:08:22 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Nov 5 12:43:50 2007. but the H&M/PATH's MP51 also bore the name "K-Car".That tends to get a bit confusing. That is why I'm not a big fan of abbreviations and catch words. I remember those old Hudson/Manhattan cars. They were neat. |
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Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Nov 5 14:21:13 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by TransitChuckG on Mon Nov 5 14:08:22 2007. That is why I'm not a big fan of abbreviations and catch wordsIndeed. A big example is the mutilated abbreviation "F40"—now what did I just refer to, a plain old F40PH, or an F40PHR, F40PHM, F40PH-2M, F40PHM-2, F40PH-2, F40PH-2CAT, or the related-by-name-only F40C? |
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| (512687) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Tue Nov 6 06:29:38 2007, in response to CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by TransitChuckG on Sun Oct 28 12:24:27 2007. More interesting information. We will watch , observe , check with the experts, and find out.From Yahoo Groups- Philly Traction. Re: CSX Followup on the flanges Most trolley special work, including in Philadelphia, is designed to be flange bearing, that is, the trolley rides on its flanges, instead of dropping into the groove at every frog. Now, at a railroad crossing,where the cross traffic has bigger and taller flanges, we have a problem. It is often traditional that the expenses of a crossing are the liability of the junior road. Is this the case here in Darby, where the horse car line is about 25 years older (1859 vs 1884) than the railroad? |
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| (512688) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue Nov 6 06:32:53 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by TransitChuckG on Tue Nov 6 06:29:38 2007. Answer there, according to MANY courts in decisions of class 1's versus their "cheapskate partners" is ... "that's WHY there's class warfare. Feds DICTATED it. PAY UP and MAINTAIN your equipment properly." Philly loses. :(Specs are specs ... "flange-bearing means PRECISELY that." |
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| (513032) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Tue Nov 6 19:03:22 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue Nov 6 06:32:53 2007. Some more information from Philly Traction.The track being described is fully within traditional RR/trolley crossing construction. Streetcar wheels ride across the head of the RR rail on their flanges. Eventually there will be a groove made by the repeated passing of the streetcars. What is the problem? The best special work construction practice is to have ramped grooves at frogs and switch mates to eliminate hammering. If the wheel treads had full contact with each break in the rail the cacophony would and is deafening. Flange bearing special work is standard for streetcars. Now what is wrong with doing the same on a railroad crossing? Perhaps I am missing something here. Are the frogs built up or castings? |
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| (513233) | |
Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue Nov 6 21:49:18 2007, in response to Re: CSX crossing in Darby, PA, posted by TransitChuckG on Tue Nov 6 19:03:22 2007. Yep ... apparently whatever was built there wasn't done properly. But the onus is still on the streetcar rails ... they should be able to weld down an insert perhaps ... |
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