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| Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? (489987) | |
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| (490780) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by 33rd Street on Sun Sep 16 20:42:08 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by Eric B on Sun Sep 16 18:52:03 2007. Konwing the way the TA works, the V would terminate at 2nd Avenue except rush hours. |
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| (490791) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Edwards! on Sun Sep 16 20:57:03 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by 33rd Street on Sun Sep 16 18:10:57 2007. Having both the F and V trains past Church Avenue is overkill.The F runs 15 trains per hour..thats more than most lines run all day,period.[the A and E operate about the same but for different reasons].. In any case..the F in and of itself is an extremely long route,and would benefit from a Brooklyn express routing more than an extended V line. The only other way would be for the MTA to go along with the original V/F proposal[V express..F local in Queens Manhattan and Brooklyn.] |
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| (490812) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Sun Sep 16 21:46:07 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by E Line Fan on Sun Sep 16 16:37:38 2007. There will be no express stop at Bergen Street.(V) Continental / 53rd Street to Church Avenue via local Weekdays. (G) Court Street/ Crosstown to Church Avenue via local 24/7. (F) 179th / 63rd Street to Coney Island All Times Express in Brooklyn (Jay Street to Church Street) Weekdays. ROAR (Thus Spake the LION, Thus it Shall Be.) ROAR |
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| (490814) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Sun Sep 16 21:49:30 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by Eric B on Sun Sep 16 19:00:47 2007. Lower Bergen will NOT be reopened. Bergen will be a LOCAL stop only.Thus Spake Broadway Lion! ROAR |
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| (490818) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Sun Sep 16 22:02:23 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by Broadway Lion on Sun Sep 16 21:46:07 2007. >>>There will be no express stop at Bergen Street.<<<Possibly not this time around. But there was the last time the F ran express in Brooklyn. |
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| (490823) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Sun Sep 16 22:14:27 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by Michael549 on Sun Sep 16 15:57:02 2007. >>> 4) Yes, I know that the F-train and V-train are just letters on the front of a train - and both go to Manhattan. However some folks get "invested" in train letters (witness the continued snipping over the B and D trains) this plan asks nobody to give up anything.<<<I agree with your post that the F and G should run local and the V express. But I have to wonder why people would get so "invested" in train letters. |
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| (490824) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Sun Sep 16 22:18:13 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by MATHA531 on Sat Sep 15 08:10:49 2007. >>> Solution..make the V the Express and full time service to CI and terminate the F at Church Avenue...this would easily resolve this problem. <<<That would be like making the B full-time and the D part-time - which had been discussed here in early 2004 when it was made known where the B and D were going to go once they were let back on to the Manhattan Bridge. |
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| (490826) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Sun Sep 16 22:21:08 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Sun Sep 16 22:02:23 2007. Myrtle South.CLOSED! (period) ROAR |
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| (490827) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Sun Sep 16 22:22:49 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by MATHA531 on Sat Sep 15 08:10:49 2007. >>> Solution..make the V the Express and full time service to CI and terminate the F at Church Avenue...this would easily resolve this problem. <<<That would be like making the B full-time and the D part-time - which had been discussed here in early 2004 when it was made known where the B and D were going to go once they were let back on to the Manhattan Bridge. >>>...somehow people might feel demeaned if they get on at Carroll Street and have to take a V train rather than an F train; absurd yes but that's the way some people think. <<< May very well be true. I wouldn't be surprised if it is. But did West End riders think that way when the W replaced the B in July 2001? |
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| (490844) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Grand concourse on Sun Sep 16 22:55:58 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by Edwards! on Sun Sep 16 20:57:03 2007. F is a very long line like the A and the 2, but then again the idea of extending teh V to Brooklyn is really needed for the rush hours. so make the V the express and leave the F as is a local in Brooklyn 24/7.The V doesn't have to be local in every borough and the F being the express in Queens and Brooklyn. |
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| (490854) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by 33rd Street on Sun Sep 16 23:18:06 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Sun Sep 16 22:22:49 2007. >>>...somehow people might feel demeaned if they get on at Carroll Street and have to take a V train rather than an F train; absurd yes but that's the way some people think. <<<May very well be true. I wouldn't be surprised if it is. But did West End riders think that way when the W replaced the B in July 2001? West End riders didn't have a choice. The North Side needed to be shut down for repairs. Even if they wanted to retain their B train service, they were powerless. Besides this led to them having 24/7 Manhattan service. |
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| (490872) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Michael549 on Mon Sep 17 00:29:43 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by 33rd Street on Sun Sep 16 23:18:06 2007. From a previous message:"May very well be true. I wouldn't be surprised if it is. But did West End riders think that way when the W replaced the B in July 2001?" For a good period of time, the B train when traveling on the Broadway line during part of the repair period for the Manhattan Bridge, the B train ran to Astoria. The W train also ran to Astoria, and both lines ran on the West End route to Coney Island. At same time - there was also a "B" train that traveled along the Sixth AVenue line to 34th Street, until the Manhattan Bridge was repaired. The W train traveling along the West End line ran 24/7 which was a needed improvement, the D train that replaced it continued the 24/7 pattern. The current incornation of the W train also supplements service to/from Astoria. Mike |
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| (490878) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Grand concourse on Mon Sep 17 01:07:53 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by 33rd Street on Sun Sep 16 20:42:08 2007. But the V would be empty outside of the rush hours, that is why it is best if it ran to Brooklyn only during the rush hours. |
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| (490879) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Grand concourse on Mon Sep 17 01:10:12 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Sun Sep 16 22:14:27 2007. What they do know is the V runs on weekdays 18/5. So perhaps that is why they would be reluctant to give up the F service which serves them predictibly 24/7.Perhaps if they just swapped the letters but left service the same they would like the V. |
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| (490885) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by E Line Fan on Mon Sep 17 02:14:48 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by 33rd Street on Sun Sep 16 23:18:06 2007. This would be a wild possibility but if the (F) ran express rush hours only, Park Slope would be getting the same service in the (V) as far as 47th-50th Streets. Both (F) and (V) make the same stops to that point. It might work. |
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| (490886) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by E Line Fan on Mon Sep 17 02:27:09 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Sun Sep 16 22:22:49 2007. Actually, since 2004 I've come to think the (B) is perfect as the Brighton Express and that The West End has 24/7 service for the first time in ages. |
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| (490942) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Rail Blue on Mon Sep 17 10:20:18 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by Grand concourse on Mon Sep 17 01:10:12 2007. What they do know is the V runs on weekdays 18/5. So perhaps that is why they would be reluctant to give up the F service which serves them predictibly 24/7.Perhaps if they just swapped the letters but left service the same they would like the V. Why confuse people gratuitously? |
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| (490949) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Pk Slope F on Mon Sep 17 10:40:11 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by Grand concourse on Sun Sep 16 22:55:58 2007. The V doesn't have to be local in every borough and the F being the express in Queens and Brooklyn.Why not? The R runs local everywhere. |
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| (490951) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Rail Blue on Mon Sep 17 10:42:22 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by Pk Slope F on Mon Sep 17 10:40:11 2007. "The V doesn't have to be local in every borough and the F being the express in Queens and Brooklyn."Why not? The R runs local everywhere. That proves nothing. The B train doesn't. Neither does the E. Nor does the F. Nor does the N. Nor does the Q. |
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| (490966) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Pk Slope F on Mon Sep 17 10:57:57 2007, in response to F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by Chipper10 on Fri Sep 14 07:14:44 2007. I think this is such a simple solution. Having lived on the F-line my entire life (at various stations in Brooklyn), most recently now at 7th ave, I'm on this line all the time. The idea is simple:F goes express from Jay to Church. V is extended local to Church. G is extended local to Church. Headways, tph, weekday/rush hour, etc... is all moot. The MTA can figure that out anyway it wants. But from pure daily observation, I think this arrangement would benefit both park slope and carroll gardens riders, and everyone south of Church won't have to deal much with either crowd. And that's it. All the people who get on at my stop at 7th ave get one stop for their transfer at Jay. This would be most helpful when the train sometimes already arrives at 7th ave crush-loaded. Right now, it becomes a mad house as people try to squeeze on through Carroll Gardens, which ends up backing the line up anyway. An express F, that crush-loaded train breezes by straight to Jay St, and Carroll Gardens riders get a nice empty V. Lower Bergen should not be reopened. I don't think they would benefit from any express service as there are no stations to skip during the commute. They would get a nice empty V and their commute would take the same amount of time as it does now. And the PM rush would benefit too. I know for myself, waiting for my train going home after work, I would love to be able to get on either a V or an F. I don't really care what comes first, as long as it is taking me home. I know I can't stand having to let a V go by and wait more for my F because that's the only line going to Brooklyn. I'm sure people would be happy to get on either one as well, and added plus if the F goes express (I'd get home 10 minutes faster). |
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| (490969) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Pk Slope F on Mon Sep 17 11:07:31 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by Rail Blue on Mon Sep 17 10:42:22 2007. "The V doesn't have to be local in every borough and the F being the express in Queens and Brooklyn."Why not? The R runs local everywhere. That proves nothing. The B train doesn't. Neither does the E. Nor does the F. Nor does the N. Nor does the Q. I think grand's point was that the V doesn't have to be local in every borough justifies it as the route to run express in Brooklyn, instead of the F. I'm only pointing out that there are lines that do run local everywhere, like the R. |
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| (490989) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Michael549 on Mon Sep 17 11:37:31 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by E Line Fan on Mon Sep 17 02:14:48 2007. From a previous message:"This would be a wild possibility but if the (F) ran express rush hours only, Park Slope would be getting the same service in the (V) as far as 47th-50th Streets. Both (F) and (V) make the same stops to that point. It might work." The F-train runs 15 trains per hour, each stopping at the local stations once every 4 minutes during the rush hours. Since the Brooklyn segment has fewer riders than the Queens segment the trains have breathing room during the rush hours. A very quick frequent service that most riders would like to have. The V-train runs 9 trains which turns into a train about every 6 or 7 minutes. A slower service compared to the F-train, but still nice. Here's a question. Would the average rider choose a situation where all things being equal (since in Manhattan the stops are the same until 47h Street) they could either wait 4 minutes for a train, or 7 minutes for a train? If those riders for years have had service at the 4-minute mark between trains, just why would they CHOOSE a situation where the trains now come every 7 minutes? For such riders there is no greater benefit with the fewer trains option, they "get nothing in return". Since the folks we are talking about are politically connected, they can tell time, and they have quashed plans to reduce their service before, why create a situation where they will do it again? That is why I suggest that the F-train remain local in its current state, with its current amount of trains, and the wait time between trains. The folks won't get upset. The ideas that result in a reduction of service (usually billed as making the V-train local along Culver) will find the riders waiting longer for their trains. While those folks are waiting for their trains they will find the time to write letters to their political allies who will put a stop to the hare-brained schemes of us transit geeks now matter how many pretty maps we show them. The bottom line is simple - the riders get no benefit when their service is reduced. Mike |
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| (491314) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by R30A on Mon Sep 17 22:10:18 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by Pk Slope F on Mon Sep 17 10:57:57 2007. Youd get home 4 minutes faster at best.Likely 2-3 would be more accurate IMHO. |
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| (491319) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Pk Slope F on Mon Sep 17 22:46:13 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by R30A on Mon Sep 17 22:10:18 2007. Well, 10 minutes, 4 minutes, 2-3, regardless I'd get home faster... and maybe even get a seat or at least some breathing room instead of dealing with an F that has to be sent express (Bwy-Lafayette to Delancey to Jay) because of crowded trains delaying service during the PM rush. |
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| (491640) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Grand concourse on Tue Sep 18 20:13:04 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by Pk Slope F on Mon Sep 17 11:07:31 2007. Well like you said just because the R is local in all 3 boroughs doesn't mean the V has to be local in all three like the B being express In Brooklyn while the Q is the local. Point is that the Q and F are 24/7 lines and it would be better off for the part time lines like the B and V respectively to run express.Also the V may or may not be needed outside of the rush hours meaning the MTA would likely cut the V back to 2nd Av. |
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| (491642) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by Grand concourse on Tue Sep 18 20:15:41 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by Rail Blue on Mon Sep 17 10:20:18 2007. it was meant as a hypothetical question on 'is it the service or the letter Park Slope residents are attached to'. |
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| (491698) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Tue Sep 18 21:31:15 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by Michael549 on Mon Sep 17 00:29:43 2007. >>> The W train traveling along the West End line ran 24/7 which was a needed improvement, the D train that replaced it continued the 24/7 pattern. <<<Which is is why if I rode the West End line regularly, I would want the 24/7 D train to stay there. |
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| (491703) | |
Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility? |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Tue Sep 18 21:35:53 2007, in response to Re: F train express in Brooklyn in 2008 a possibility?, posted by E Line Fan on Mon Sep 17 02:27:09 2007. So do I. The current B and D services in Brooklyn are fine, but according to some Subchatters, there are people who apparently want the B and D to go back to the way they were before July 2001 (B on West End, D on Brighton). |
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